How long before Irish reunification?

Stop moaning ffs

10-15 years

Matt Barrett wrote: »

That's 100% true IMO.
Yes Republicans are. And yes everyone should re-evaluate for modern times.
One major difference is one side was borne out of seeking equality while the other was borne out of maintaining in-equality.

And while you have comments like these and people like Sammy Wilson not just claiming to represent unionism but the whole of NI, you would have to despair and then realise people like Him, and thinking like this is the reason NI is where it is and that mindset cannot and will not be tolerated much longer by any rational voter up north.

https://twitter.com/newschambers/status/1145948939247599616

Dammo

Ulster Says No. It will never happen

Matt Barrett wrote: »

That's 100% true IMO.
Yes Republicans are. And yes everyone should re-evaluate for modern times.
One major difference is one side was borne out of seeking equality while the other was borne out of maintaining in-equality.

I'm not sure if you're trying to be ironic Matt, but your third line there is part the problem. Why not just agree with the point that republicans need to adapt as well? Why the add-on about the origins of the need for change?



For the record, I think major changes are needed on both sides.

feargale

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Unionism's main goal at the moment is try as they may to disrupt Irish unity that has forced them into a cul de sac.

Hard to dispute that. Now here's the rub: try moving them out of it.

FrancieBrady

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

And while you have comments like these and people like Sammy Wilson not just claiming to represent unionism but the whole of NI, you would have to despair and then realise people like Him, and thinking like this is the reason NI is where it is and that mindset cannot and will not be tolerated much longer by any rational voter up north.

https://twitter.com/newschambers/status/1145948939247599616

Sammy just rattling because he knows he hasn't got a sabre about the place. :rolleyes:

FrancieBrady

feargale wrote: »

Hard to dispute that. Now here's the rub: try moving them out of it.

Why interrupt them when they are doing a fine job themselves?

RobMc59

10-15 years

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Why interrupt them when they are doing a fine job themselves?

I think he meant have some meaningful dialogue with them-would you agree with that as a good way forward?

Stop moaning ffs

10-15 years

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Sammy just rattling because he knows he hasn't got a sabre about the place. :rolleyes:

Just on that. Hehas a history of racist homophobic anti Irish bile.

Can anyone point me to similar comments from anyone in SF at any point?

FrancieBrady

RobMc59 wrote: »

I think he meant have some meaningful dialogue with them-would you agree with that as a good way forward?

Let him talk to the EU. Stop his divisive sniping and realise who he is dealing with maybe?

James Brown

10-15 years

Dammo wrote: »

I'm not sure if you're trying to be ironic Matt, but your third line there is part the problem. Why not just agree with the point that republicans need to adapt as well? Why the add-on about the origins of the need for change?



For the record, I think major changes are needed on both sides.

I'm not being ironic.
I can say everyone needs to re-evaluate and still believe what I said. The problems are when does equality become in-equality? When does improving rights for one side start to infringe on others, (see parades commission)?
The way I look at it is we need what's equal and fair for all concerned. The big difference, for me is one side, the DUP, is actively fighting change because they see power, traditional power, slipping away if they make too many concessions.
The real irony is when you look at how NI was born and that a democratic vote is needed if it is to be undone, IMO.

IAMAMORON

I can't see nearly a million unionists taking it lying down in fairness, they never have before....

Not in the next 200 years, no one reading this will ever see it.

We are all lucky we all have peace at the moment. The best thing to happen to this country in the last 1000 years is the peace process, long may it continue.

Stop moaning ffs

10-15 years

IAMAMORON wrote: »

I can't see nearly a million unionists taking it lying down in fairness, they never have before....

Not in the next 200 years, no one reading this will ever see it.

We are all lucky we all have peace at the moment. The best thing to happen to this country in the last 1000 years is the peace process, long may it continue.

There’s a million unionists?

Dammo

Ulster Says No. It will never happen

Matt Barrett wrote: »

I'm not being ironic.
I can say everyone needs to re-evaluate and still believe what I said. The problems are when does equality become in-equality? When does improving rights for one side start to infringe on others, (see parades commission)?
The way I look at it is we need what's equal and fair for all concerned. The big difference, for me is one side, the DUP, is actively fighting change because they see power, traditional power, slipping away if they make too many concessions.
The real irony is when you look at how NI was born and that a democratic vote is needed if it is to be undone, IMO.

Fair enough. I suppose I'm jumping the gun and thinking about what a UI might look like and the need to leave the past behind. Any discussion about it quickly descends into 'but your side ......' stuff, which all sides will have to move on from imo.


Personally I think a UI might not be as great for the nationalists as they think/hope, nor as bad for the unionists as they imagine.

Dammo

Ulster Says No. It will never happen

As far as I'm aware, and I'm absolutely open to correction, the protestant population of the south don't appear to have any more problems than anyone else, What do the northern unionists think of these people and their circumstances?

Stop moaning ffs

10-15 years

Dammo wrote: »

Fair enough. I suppose I'm jumping the gun and thinking about what a UI might look like and the need to leave the past behind. Any discussion about it quickly descends into 'but your side ......' stuff, which all sides will have to move on from imo.


Personally I think a UI might not be as great for the nationalists as they think/hope, nor as bad for the unionists as they imagine.

I asked this yesterday and none of those opposed had any answers

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

What would actually change post United ireland? We have two hugely interdependent economies. Massive cross border(effectively no border) bodies and cooperations.
It wouldn’t change the day to day for the vast majority of us I don’t think? The gardai and PSNI would merge that sort of thing.
Anyone any ideas what else could or might change?

It feel like it would be marriage equality passing. A truly monumentous event recognised on the global stage and a credit to us and something we can all be proud of, then life just went on after. Think about that aspect and the repeal aspect and how welcome that would be up north too. Two profound issues that you would see people on all sides up there voting in favour of a UI for. Both affect young people especially.

IAMAMORON

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

There’s a million unionists?

Give or take. They live in London too etc.

I would imagine they could get the numbers together if it was on like.

_blaaz

10-15 years

IAMAMORON wrote: »

I can't see nearly a million unionists taking it lying down in fairness, they never have before....

Not in the next 200 years, no one reading this will ever see it.

We are all lucky we all have peace at the moment. The best thing to happen to this country in the last 1000 years is the peace process, long may it continue.

The flip side of this being....a million and one nationlists wont take reunification being blocked lying down neither??

IAMAMORON

_blaaz wrote: »

The flip side of this being....a million and one nationlists wont take reunification being blocked lying down neither??

Doing what exactly?

Stop moaning ffs

10-15 years

IAMAMORON wrote: »

Give or take. They live in London too etc.

I would imagine they could get the numbers together if it was on like.

You’re forgetting there would have to be a referendum here too. On the same day as the one in NI

I think we outnumber the unionists. By about 4 million.

ohnonotgmail

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

You’re forgetting there would have to be a referendum here too. On the same day as the one in NI

I think we outnumber the unionists. By about 4 million.

yeah, they wont be taking the totals from both jurisdictions and adding them together. Any decision would require a majority in the north and the majority down here as well.

IAMAMORON

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

You’re forgetting there would have to be a referendum here too. On the same day as the one in NI

I think we outnumber the unionists. By about 4 million.

You obviously don't understand the terms of the GF Agreement so....

There can only be a vote if it is agreed by the citizens of Northern Ireland alone. Free Staters only get to vote if it is passed in the six counties.

Stop moaning ffs

10-15 years

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

yeah, they wont be taking the totals from both jurisdictions and adding them together. Any decision would require a majority in the north and the majority down here as well.

I know. There isn’t a million unionists in NI though. Don’t know where that number was pulled from.

FrancieBrady

IAMAMORON wrote: »

Give or take. They live in London too etc.

I would imagine they could get the numbers together if it was on like.

If there's one thing we know about Unionism it is that they know when the game is up and get on with it.
From the Anglo Irish Agreement to the GFA to Flegs to parades, it has been 'Never Never Never' to 'Never Never ah sure go on'.

somofagun

Some on here would need to go and read up on the history of this place. This Island has had numerous periods of peace some lasting a couple of hundred years to a couple of years. Make no mistake it will all erupt again unless there is a united Ireland and Britian get out. Problem is now that with the major gold find in Greencastle in Tyrone the brits will not be giving that up to handy. If Brexit doesn't bring about a border referendum and a united Ireland then we will never get it without a war.

ohnonotgmail

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

I know. There isn’t a million unionists in NI though. Don’t know where that number was pulled from.

if you knew that then what is the relevance of this?

I think we outnumber the unionists. By about 4 million.

IAMAMORON

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

I know. There isn’t a million unionists in NI though. Don’t know where that number was pulled from.

You can get as pedantic over it as you like, but don't let it interfere with the actual argument. Go check the census if you want to. It mightn't be a million, but that figure is not far off. Especially if they got technical with getting their cousins to come home for a vote etc.

Throw that in with the unholy shít storm they would start if they thought they were going to be part of a United Ireland..... Get real please.

Stop moaning ffs

10-15 years

somofagun wrote: »

Some on here would need to go and read up on the history of this place. This Island has had numerous periods of peace some lasting a couple of hundred years to a couple of years. Make no mistake it will all erupt again unless there is a united Ireland and Britian get out. Problem is now that with the major gold find in Greencastle in Tyrone the brits will not be giving that up to handy. If Brexit doesn't bring about a border referendum and a united Ireland then we will never get it without a war.

So the democratic will of the people should be denied cos imaginary threats of terrorism from a faction that has no money competence or support

FrancieBrady

IAMAMORON wrote: »

Throw that in with the unholy shít storm they would start if they thought they were going to be part of a United Ireland..... Get real please.

That battle is over as per the GFA.

If you said there was 5000 unionists prepared to start anymore of 'a ****storm' than complaining I would say you are having a laugh.

ohnonotgmail

IAMAMORON wrote: »

You can get as pedantic over it as you like, but don't let it interfere with the actual argument. Go check the census if you want to. It mightn't be a million, but that figure is not far off. Especially if they got technical with getting their cousins to come home for a vote etc.

Throw that in with the unholy shít storm they would start if they thought they were going to be part of a United Ireland..... Get real please.

it is very hard to give a definitive as they dont ask that directly on the census in Northern Ireland. They do ask about national identity however. In the 2011 census they responded as follows:


British 876,577
Northern Irish 533,085
Irish 513,390

make of that what you will.

Stop moaning ffs

10-15 years

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

if you knew that then what is the relevance of this?

There are more people both regions combined likely to vote for UI than it being decided by unionists alone. Poster doesn’t seem to realise that it’s nit just their call

ohnonotgmail

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

There are more people both regions combined likely to vote for UI than it being decided by unionists alone. Poster doesn’t seem to realise that it’s nit just their call

the total number of non-unionists in both jurisdictions is irrelevant. each vote will be separate.