How long before Irish reunification?

Sinbad_NI

munsterlegend wrote: »

The GAA was founded to prevent Irish culture being eroded and stamped out by British rule. Unionists wouldn’t even consent to an Irish language act until recently. I think Unionist culture to denigrate anything Irish would play a much bigger part in lack of gaa participation.

But let me get this correct... Is not sectarian?
Is that not the very definition.

Listen I like the sport of the GAA, many other unionists I know do as well. But the flags and anthems make it a very polarising proposition.
If you want a UI society that's not divided then you need to get participation from all the community into things like these.
Otherwise what will you end up with, instead of a divided NI, you're going to end up with a divided UI. And all NI's problems become a UI's problems.

If you want to play the blame game on here, it's all their fault etc. Work away, I'll leave you to it.

Sinbad_NI

FrancieBrady wrote: »

And people using GAA flags are not doing it to mark territory or taunt. They are doing something perfectly normal in society...supporting their team. Just like somebody waving a union jack at the Oltmpics.

TBH I'm not talking about the county flags.
Fly away.

Esel

downcow wrote: »

I was n't comparing the two countries. That would be ridiculous. The country I live in is coming to terms with a viscous sectarian conflict where 3,000 people died and 50,000 were injured and some still carrying severe injuries. So obviously the sectarianism is more evident here.

I was challenging your blinkers, you only ever seem to see offense caused by one side.

I know that the decorations put up in loyalist areas are a chill factor and mark territory, just the same as those put up in republican areas for GAA teams etc.
could you ever get some empathy and try to understand

I see only one thick poster on this thread.

FrancieBrady

Sinbad_NI wrote: »

TBH I'm not talking about the county flags.
Fly away.

Yes the tricolour is used to taunt but in no way in the same way as the union jack is. You guys tried to bring the place to a standstill because you were asked to use it normally, like the rest of the UK. Get real here.
The world over knows who are by far and away the most belligerent and insecure about flags and emblems.

Hamsterchops

munsterlegend wrote: »

Are you saying that any border poll where there is a democratic majority for a unified Ireland should be ignored so as to not upset a sectarian minority?

A border poll for sure, (when there's some evidence) that the population of NI wishes to leave the UK in favour of becoming part of the Republic of Ireland.

...alas, so far there is no proof of any great surge for NI to leave the UK. It would be a massive jump to change cultural allegiance from being British & being connected to Britain, to being Irish, with Irish as their 1st language, becoming Gaelic, and part of the Tricolour.

Once the NI population can be persuaded to drop the NHS, the BBC, the pound in their pocket & their connections with next door, then you can have them for yourselves.

jm08

20-30 years

Hamsterchops wrote: »

A border poll for sure, (when there's some evidence) that the population of NI wishes to leave the UK in favour of becoming part of the Republic of Ireland.


...alas, so far there is no proof of any great surge for NI to leave the UK. It would be a massive jump to change cultural allegiance from being British & being connected to Britain, to being Irish, with Irish as their 1st language, becoming Gaelic, and part of the Tricolour.

The only way they are going to find out who wants what is in the secrecy of the ballot box.



They will still be British (if they want to be), just like Polish people living in Ireland are still Polish. I'm sure it won't be an issue if unionists want the English language to have joint status with Irish.

Once the NI population can be persuaded to drop the NHS, the BBC, the pound in their pocket & their connections with next door, then you can have them for yourselves.

The NHS is on its knees, or have you not noticed? The NHS and HSE have exactly the same capacity (which is way behind European countries). You still have the BBC (except you won't have to pay a licence fee like we do down here). What do you mean by connection next door? The ROI has as good a relationship with next door as NI has - at least the ROI can meet with them as equals now and are not bullied by them.

Junkyard Tom

30-40 years

Hamsterchops wrote: »

It would be a massive jump to change cultural allegiance from being British & being connected to Britain, to being Irish, with Irish as their 1st language, becoming Gaelic, and part of the Tricolour.

Once the NI population can be persuaded to drop the NHS, the BBC, the pound in their pocket & their connections with next door, then you can have them for yourselves.

You're funny. Is that in the Good Friday Agreement? :pac:

Or is some mad scene you're playing out in your own head?

eagle eye

Ulster Says No. It will never happen

Was this island ever one country? Like we were under British rule, then we got a 26 county Republic.
Before British rule wasn't it split into four provinces with separate Kings?

Like there are many countries in mainland Europe. You don't hear about them looking to unite into one country, it's the other way it's going where there are splits and more countries. Even in the UK mainland there are three countries and while they are all ruled by the one government presently they still have their own lands.

NI going on its own is the best solution for all I think, that's if there is going to be change.

FrancieBrady

eagle eye wrote: »

Was this island ever one country? Like we were under British rule, then we got a 26 county Republic.
Before British rule wasn't it split into four provinces with separate Kings?

Like there are many countries in mainland Europe. You don't hear about them looking to unite into one country, it's the other way it's going where there are splits and more countries. Even in the UK mainland there are three countries and while they are all ruled by the one government presently they still have their own lands.

NI going on its own is the best solution for all I think, that's if there is going to be change.

No it wouldn't...100 years of partition has shown that tragically it cannot govern itself. Because it is an artificial entity. It would quickly descend into a huge inferno on our doorstep and very much a problem for us. It would totally destabilise this country.

Nobody, politically, is looking for autonomy, and there is a reason why...see above.

Fr D Maugire

eagle eye wrote: »

Was this island ever one country? Like we were under British rule, then we got a 26 county Republic.
Before British rule wasn't it split into four provinces with separate Kings?

Like there are many countries in mainland Europe. You don't hear about them looking to unite into one country, it's the other way it's going where there are splits and more countries. Even in the UK mainland there are three countries and while they are all ruled by the one government presently they still have their own lands.

NI going on its own is the best solution for all I think, that's if there is going to be change.

Most countries today never existed as a single unit throughout time so that is irrelevant, the likes of Germany, Italy only unified in the late 19th century. Before the Normans arrived in Ireland there was a lot on inter-chiefdom rivalry, which again was common throughout Europe including Britain, i mean you had the Saxons, Danes, Celts, Normans all in Britain at similar times.

Whilst there may not have been a notion of a single country, there was a common language, culture & laws in Ireland. That changed with the arrival of the Normans. The King of England might have in theory ruled Ireland, but in reality the Irish Chieftains had little loyalty except when it suited them and the Old English i.e the Normans descendants, may have been loyal to the crown, but more or less ruled themselves. We can see what happened when the Crown started to encroach on the Old English lands, they rebelled. Religion and Plantations were the big game changers in the 17th century which is the most pivotal century in our history. The rest of Britain became Protestant whilst all of Ireland remained Catholic, from then on you had the British crown enforcing their efforts to tame disloyal Catholic Ireland, hence the plantations.

downcow

munsterlegend wrote: »

downcow wrote: »

I mention distasteful and unnecessary flags and banners in carrickfergus. You say you have flags in the south too. I say you can’t compare the sectarian hatred in banners up there with down here. Then you state you weren’t comparing.

The mind boggles.

Your mind likes to boggle.

Let me say this slowly for you

I was not comparing sectarianism levels for obvious reasons. I don't be down there much but if you do the same as nationalist towns and villages up here around bunting and flags for the GAA then I would compare that aspect of cultural displays that are a chill factor to the other community and mark territory - but it is not that relevant down there as yous have basically no unionists left

downcow

munsterlegend wrote: »

The GAA was founded to prevent Irish culture being eroded and stamped out by British rule. Unionists wouldn’t even consent to an Irish language act until recently. I think Unionist culture to denigrate anything Irish would play a much bigger part in lack of gaa participation.

Sounds like the Orange Order for Irishmen that you are describing

downcow

Esel wrote: »

I see only one thick poster on this thread.

LOL, great post

downcow

Fr D Maugire wrote: »

Most countries today never existed as a single unit throughout time so that is irrelevant, the likes of Germany, Italy only unified in the late 19th century. Before the Normans arrived in Ireland there was a lot on inter-chiefdom rivalry, which again was common throughout Europe including Britain, i mean you had the Saxons, Danes, Celts, Normans all in Britain at similar times.

Whilst there may not have been a notion of a single country, there was a common language, culture & laws in Ireland. That changed with the arrival of the Normans. The King of England might have in theory ruled Ireland, but in reality the Irish Chieftains had little loyalty except when it suited them and the Old English i.e the Normans descendants, may have been loyal to the crown, but more or less ruled themselves. We can see what happened when the Crown started to encroach on the Old English lands, they rebelled. Religion and Plantations were the big game changers in the 17th century which is the most pivotal century in our history. The rest of Britain became Protestant whilst all of Ireland remained Catholic, from then on you had the British crown enforcing their efforts to tame disloyal Catholic Ireland, hence the plantations.

Si i think everyone is in agreement then that the island was never one united country except under the Brits

BonnieSituation

20-30 years

downcow wrote: »

Something that would make it even more exciting and may remove any concerns about political motivations would be to develop a Celtic league involving Scotland as well and even wales. Of course it would be helpful if rangers and Celtic would join the English as no doubt Cardiff etc would want to remain in.
It would keep that poisonous extreme sectarian stuff away and make it more competitive for the rest as they could all aspire to the top.
And of course more interesting away trips

If we can't get people to go to Ballinamallard or Longford, what makes you think they're gonna head to Inverness or Perth or Dunfermline?

There's a lot of work to get through before a disaster of a "Celtic League" is workable.

Let's start at home with our current bloc of teams.

eagle eye

Ulster Says No. It will never happen

FrancieBrady wrote:

No it wouldn't...100 years of partition has shown that tragically it cannot govern itself. Because it is an artificial entity. It would quickly descend into a huge inferno on our doorstep and very much a problem for us. It would totally destabilise this country.

100 years of partition? We were all under British rule up to then. It's not like we had our own country then.

BonnieSituation

20-30 years

downcow wrote: »

Whilst I would like a ni specific sporting anthem like at the commonwealth games, it is nonsense to suggest that would solve the issue for all northerners. Some northerners cannot even say ‘northern Ireland’. My interest in changing the anthem is absolutely nothing to do with McLean and his like, it is for our current players and fans who currently have to stand like half the ni population would currently have to at irfu or gaa games, feeling awkward and not included. I want us to be better than that and I want my neighbours to feel absolutely included - if they want to, I am also very happy for them to support roi if that’s where there loyalty lies

I have lots of friends who support roi and we have lots of good rivalry banter and each hates the other teams success in the same was as Man Utd and Man City, but we are all also football fans and can admire the others loyalty to their team.
Some guys on here don’t realise that their suggestion is like saying to a Man City fan ‘I think your team should be absorbed by Man utd’ hahaha

Man City fans don't go to old Trafford and have bile and hare thrown at their "community".

It is nothing at all the same as how 100 years on the IFA representative team is a cold house for Nationalists.

To keep blaming the FAI for your own fúck ups says it all.

Why "should" young Nationalists support the FAI team and not the ROI, the team of their own country as they see it?

Why do you care?

BonnieSituation

20-30 years

downcow wrote: »

I have posted the news reports that the loyalists were not allowed to carry out their civil right because a few republicans through stones at the guards. So I am not going to continue providing endless reports to you. It’s like are mate above who is trying to tell us there was not 100+ at yesterday’s ira funeral even the evidence is starting in his face

"Carry out their civil right"

Do you think the Gardaí should gave left them on O'Connell St to get rocks thrown at them?

You're ridiculous. Anyway, we'll leave it there as you're clearly deluded.

BonnieSituation

20-30 years

downcow wrote: »

There you go.
Count for yourself and then tell us who the plonker is
https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/320xq90/r/923/rsYE40.jpg

Janey, that's a photo that Michael Stone would be proud of.

BonnieSituation

20-30 years

downcow wrote: »

How do you feel about the former their and charlatan bobby sands?

Is there an English sentence in there?

What has Bobby Sands got to do with anything?

You wouldn't be engaging in whataboutery now would you?

munsterlegend

downcow wrote: »

Sounds like the Orange Order for Irishmen that you are describing

Absolutely rediculous. The gaa is the biggest sporting organisation on this island. The most famous cup is named after a Protestant. What catholic trappings have the OO?

FrancieBrady

eagle eye wrote: »

100 years of partition? We were all under British rule up to then. It's not like we had our own country then.

So why did a Fermanagh catholic end up in a different country? Was he/she different to a Cavan catholic?

Your argument such as it is, runs out of rope very quickly.

BonnieSituation

20-30 years

downcow wrote: »

Soo much wrong with this post.
Oh I see them struggling every time. It hurts me every time to see any of my hero’s feeling excluded by the anthem. Hence I want it changed.
Now you tell me do you feel the same when Rory best bows during the ss? Do you want it changed?

There is no ni fan I know who doesn’t want McLean etc to be able to play for roi. We just wish he would come up through the ranks of ni, waving the flag, and posing in his bedroom with the ni shirt, and then jump ship after the investment (mind you we would all have paid him to go)

Try not to speak for all nationalists. I know several who are season ticket holders at Windsor

Unlike you, I don't purport to speak for anyone.

SS? Amhrán na bhFiann isn't that hard to say or spell. Do you want to talk about rugby or soccer?

You're going on about McClean like a jilted lover.

---

Jump ship after investment?

Clearly the statement of s man who has no idea how money in sport works.

Honestly, get over it. This won't end well.

munsterlegend

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Is there an English sentence in there?

What has Bobby Sands got to do with anything?

You wouldn't be engaging in whataboutery now would you?

If going nowhere he diverts to Bobby or Gerry or Martin.

BonnieSituation

20-30 years

downcow wrote: »

Bonnie read what I said I have no problem with people choosing roi.

You clearly do.

You wrap it up in a clause of "wasted investment", but it's clear you just think they shouldn't be able to choose to play for their country. Classic bigotry.

munsterlegend

BonnieSituation wrote: »

You clearly do.

You wrap it up in a clause of "wasted investment", but it's clear you just think they shouldn't be able to choose to play for their country. Classic bigotry.

He has no problem but wants fifa to change the rule. You couldn’t make it up.

BonnieSituation

20-30 years

Edgware wrote: »

They are still willing to take the Queen's shilling though

It's their shilling. Do you expect them to use a parallel currency? Why do you even bother?

BonnieSituation

20-30 years

downcow wrote: »

Jingoistic nonsense. I don’t meet to many nationalists that would want to fight 100,000 troops to unify the island. In fact I don’t meet too many nationalist that have not assigned the whole idea to a nice romantic notion to sing a few songs about in a bar when they’re drunk.

So you've nothing to worry about it seems.

And yet you come in here day after day defending your own sectarianism and the little statelet that you call home.

Funny that.

BonnieSituation

20-30 years

eagle eye wrote: »

Maybe up North but not in the Republic. Most people I know don't want any part of a United Ireland due to the financial cost of it.

Good for them. So we won't worry about trying to convince them otherwise, given they can make their mind up so easily.

BonnieSituation

20-30 years

downcow wrote: »

He’s the PM
Here’s how it works. Your PM has a say in your country
That’s like saying the tsauchtwill never again have a say in roi

My God.

Are you for real? If ever we needed confirmation of your clear objective in this thread then we got it from that misspelling.