How long before Irish reunification?

downcow

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Didn't you read that one either downcow?

(vi) recognise the birthright of all the people of Northern Ireland to
identify themselves and be accepted as Irish or British, or both, as they
may so choose, and accordingly confirm that their right to hold both
British and Irish citizenship is accepted by both Governments and would
not be affected by any future change in the status of Northern Ireland.

A lot softer than claiming jurisdiction over NI

FrancieBrady

downcow wrote: »

Unfortunately for you your bigotry does not change how it is. I am British in every way. British parents and grandparents. Even though some were born in roi, it was even British then, I was born in the UK. I have a British passport. I love to see any team in the world beating your ROI team lol. QE2 is my monarch. I support British football teams, watch British tv. Speak English, if I was an athlete I would compete in the olympics for gb&ni. I use British pound, love the British flag, my roads are marked in miles and if I was joining an army it would be (surprise surprise) the British army. I could go on and on.

I realise that it is a little embarrassing for you that you probably sign up to many of these pro British things and maybe even support a British team like Celtic or Man U.
It might just be you that’s having the identity crisis. Surely not?

And you chose to like/do all of those things downcow.

FrancieBrady

downcow wrote: »

A lot softer than claiming jurisdiction over NI

What that says is, you too have to opt in downcow. The GFA was a solution for the 'people of the island of Ireland' which is you too.

downcow

Matt Barrett wrote: »

I disagree. The average Brit is ignorant on Northern Ireland. Look at Johnston and Bradley. They've no clue about the place. When I lived in London I'd a grown woman ask me 'what's Northern Ireland?' She thought Belfast was next door to Dublin and we were lobbing bombs over at each other.

Correction Ireland was invaded and 26 counties became free while six remain occupied. Slightly different, how ever many 'Hello' magazine covers the Saxe-Coburg-Gothe get on the cover of.

This is that old Irish arrogance. Everyone should be transfixed in us. I have a catholic friend who was stunned recently that I didn’t know where the other 3 provences of Ulster were. Why should I. I also don’t know where many of the states of USA are and even some of the counties of England. Just because she was taught Irish history and geography and I was taught British history and geography she thought it was awful. Why should we not focus are education on our nation. I have tried now and remember conamara as the famine ie the west. I still get mixed up in the other two. Also you guys learn these naturally through gaa comps. I have catholic friends who know where every county of roi and NI are. I wouldnt have a clue. I genuinely don’t know which county Dundalk is in or bristol or Edinburgh for that matter.

downcow

FrancieBrady wrote: »

And you chose to like/do all of those things downcow.

Nonsense again. I would have to actively work against doing them and some that would be next to impossible. Ie money, monarch, etc

James Brown

10-15 years

downcow wrote: »

Unfortunately for you your bigotry does not change how it is. I am British in every way. British parents and grandparents. Even though some were born in roi, it was even British then, I was born in the UK. I have a British passport. I love to see any team in the world beating your ROI team lol. QE2 is my monarch. I support British football teams, watch British tv. Speak English, if I was an athlete I would compete in the olympics for gb&ni. I use British pound, love the British flag, my roads are marked in miles and if I was joining an army it would be (surprise surprise) the British army. I could go on and on.

I realise that it is a little embarrassing for you that you probably sign up to many of these pro British things and maybe even support a British team like Celtic or Man U.
It might just be you that’s having the identity crisis. Surely not?

Everything you say is true as is the fact that if you were born in Ireland you are Irish by sheer geography.
If I called you an Ulster man would that be an insult? If not, do you know where Ulster is? Hint, it's not Wales.

Ah you're letting your own bigotry get to you. I'd a British Grandfather and a number of British cousins I'm very fond of. I don't follow soccer but I love a lot of British music. Get over your preconceived prejudices and don't be putting them on others. It's healthy to enjoy the cultures of others. It's not letting the team down to listen to Thin Lizzy or U2 ffs.

FrancieBrady

downcow wrote: »

This is that old Irish arrogance. Everyone should be transfixed in us. I have a catholic friend who was stunned recently that I didn’t know where the other 3 provences of Ulster were. Why should I. I also don’t know where many of the states of USA are and even some of the counties of England. Just because she was taught Irish history and geography and I was taught British history and geography she thought it was awful. Why should we not focus are education on our nation. I have tried now and remember conamara as the famine ie the west. I still get mixed up in the other two. Also you guys learn these naturally through gaa comps. I have catholic friends who know where every county of roi and NI are. I would have a clue. I genuinely don’t know which county Dundalk is in or bristol or Edinburgh for that matter.

Well Boris apparently could only name one county in NI and he went to Oxford or Cambridge. Lack of awareness is not exclusive to you.

What has it to do about the thread?

James Brown

10-15 years

downcow wrote: »

This is that old Irish arrogance. Everyone should be transfixed in us. I have a catholic friend who was stunned recently that I didn’t know where the other 3 provences of Ulster were. Why should I. I also don’t know where many of the states of USA are and even some of the counties of England. Just because she was taught Irish history and geography and I was taught British history and geography she thought it was awful. Why should we not focus are education on our nation. I have tried now and remember conamara as the famine ie the west. I still get mixed up in the other two. Also you guys learn these naturally through gaa comps. I have catholic friends who know where every county of roi and NI are. I would have a clue. I genuinely don’t know which county Dundalk is in or bristol or Edinburgh for that matter.

The point was how they viewed Northern Ireland. If they are ignorant of it, they can't have much of a view. Your excusing ignorance is a side issue.

jh79

FrancieBrady wrote: »

He/she is correct to say that they chose to identify as British. As somebody would also be equally correct to say they chose to identify as Irish. That is the unique position of NI expressed in the GFA.

They are born on the island of Ireland and they cannot change that simple unerring fact even if people chose to not say it to them for fear of upsetting or goading them.

But you're saying they are not British. Which is factually incorrect.

FrancieBrady

downcow wrote: »

Nonsense again. I would have to actively work against doing them and some that would be next to impossible. Ie money, monarch, etc

Are you saying you were born loving all those things? I don't think so. At some point you chose, whether you were aware you were doing it or not. Every single person on the planet does. Nobody is born with an established 'identity'.
We are born in places. You were born in Ireland and that is never going to change.

munsterlegend

RobMc59 wrote: »

I disagree Tom,imo British people don`t see NI as an occupied part of Ireland,it`s seen as one of the four countries that make up the UK and even as an English person I know there are cultural differences between Ireland and NI.
From a British point of view Ireland was part of Britain and it was Ireland that left the Union whilst the six counties remained.

Most British people I have met and known particularly the English have no clue about Northern Ireland or care. Most had the view it would be great ‘ye’ (Irish people) would sort out those differences. It ties in with British govt policy for the last 30 years - we’ll keep it until we are able to get rid of ye and have no economic or strategic interest in the place.

FrancieBrady

jh79 wrote: »

But you're saying they are not British. Which is factually incorrect.

I am saying they have identified as British in a place that has an internationally binding agreement about 'identity' which allows people to chose what identity they wish to be.

That does not change where they were born. It is rather simple.

RobMc59

10-15 years

Matt Barrett wrote: »

Everything you say is true as is the fact that if you were born in Ireland you are Irish by sheer geography.
If I called you an Ulster man would that be an insult? If not, do you know where Ulster is? Hint, it's not Wales.

Ah you're letting your own bigotry get to you. I'd a British Grandfather and a number of British cousins I'm very fond of. I don't follow soccer but I love a lot of British music. Get over your preconceived prejudices and don't be putting them on others. It's healthy to enjoy the cultures of others.

At the end of the day Matt,if people want to identify as British or Irish does it really matter?It could be said that anyone born in NI is in fact British but may choose to identify as Irish(Jame McClean is an example,born in NI,represented NI up to 21 then changed to Ireland).
It`s actually a privilege to have the choice of British or Irish imo.

RobMc59

10-15 years

downcow wrote: »

Unfortunately for you your bigotry does not change how it is. I am British in every way. British parents and grandparents. Even though some were born in roi, it was even British then, I was born in the UK. I have a British passport. I love to see any team in the world beating your ROI team lol. QE2 is my monarch. I support British football teams, watch British tv. Speak English, if I was an athlete I would compete in the olympics for gb&ni. I use British pound, love the British flag, my roads are marked in miles and if I was joining an army it would be (surprise surprise) the British army. I could go on and on.

I realise that it is a little embarrassing for you that you probably sign up to many of these pro British things and maybe even support a British team like Celtic or Man U.
It might just be you that’s having the identity crisis. Surely not?

Brilliant post Downcow-respect to you.

jh79

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I am saying they have identified as British in a place that has an internationally binding agreement about 'identity' which allows people to chose what identity they wish to be.

That does not change where they were born. It is rather simple.

Would they not be British who identify as Irish given that the still belong to the British.

And in the event of a UI they become Irish who identify as British.

FrancieBrady

jh79 wrote: »

Would they not be British who identify as Irish given that the still belong to the British.

And in the event of a UI they become Irish who identify as British.

What?

munsterlegend

downcow wrote: »

Unfortunately for you your bigotry does not change how it is. I am British in every way. British parents and grandparents. Even though some were born in roi, it was even British then, I was born in the UK. I have a British passport. I love to see any team in the world beating your ROI team lol. QE2 is my monarch. I support British football teams, watch British tv. Speak English, if I was an athlete I would compete in the olympics for gb&ni. I use British pound, love the British flag, my roads are marked in miles and if I was joining an army it would be (surprise surprise) the British army. I could go on and on.

I realise that it is a little embarrassing for you that you probably sign up to many of these pro British things and maybe even support a British team like Celtic or Man U.
It might just be you that’s having the identity crisis. Surely not?

The vast majority in the north represent Ireland in the Olympics. Your greatest athlete in recent times will be representing us next year. Says it all really.

Junkyard Tom

30-40 years

downcow wrote: »

Ask us nicely and I’m sure we’ll let you in

Dream on. You have enough on your plate keeping your neighbours happy or they might just, you know, bounce you into a United Ireland.

RobMc59

10-15 years

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

Dream on. You have enough on your plate keeping your neighbours happy or they might just, you know, bounce you into a United Ireland.

Tom,I respect your military history knowledge but on this occasion you`ve obviously had an all day session on the Guinness as you`re delirious and rambling.. :eek:

FrancieBrady

RobMc59 wrote: »

Tom,I respect your military history knowledge but on this occasion you`ve obviously had an all day session on the Guinness as you`re delirious and rambling.. :eek:

He's right. Dublin could be really ratcheting up the pressure and taking advantage, but they aren't.

Their main concern is for people and how a stupid decision(Brexit) is going to affect us all on this island of Ireland.

Junkyard Tom

30-40 years

downcow wrote: »

I have a catholic friend who was stunned recently that I didn’t know where the other 3 provences of Ulster were. Why should I.

How prevalent is that weird pride some unionists have in their ignorance of the rest of Ireland? It's as if having to acknowledge that you live in Ireland, alongside Irish people, erodes your Britishness.

Newton Emerson wrote before that the south of Ireland was as foreign to him as France - he was either lying or stupid. There's absolutely nowhere on this Earth more similar to Britain than Ireland.

200,000 English people have moved to Ireland in recent years and you'd barely notice it they integrate so well, yet we have people like yourself in the north who describe themselves as 'British only' despite having not lived in Britain for centuries.

Junkyard Tom

30-40 years

RobMc59 wrote: »

Tom,I respect your military history knowledge but on this occasion you`ve obviously had an all day session on the Guinness as you`re delirious and rambling.. :eek:

I'm speaking of his neighbours in the north Rob. British jurisdiction in the north depends on 'the union' appealing to a broader base than just unionists and that means making the place comfortable for everyone.

The DUP have been making an utter balls of that I think we can all agree.

FrancieBrady

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

How prevalent is that weird pride some unionists have in their ignorance of the rest of Ireland? It's as if having to acknowledge that you live in Ireland, alongside Irish people, erodes your Britishness.

Newton Emerson wrote before that the south of Ireland was as foreign to him as France - he was either lying or stupid. There's absolutely nowhere on this Earth more similar to Britain than Ireland.

200,000 English people have moved to Ireland in recent years and you'd barely notice it they integrate so well, yet we have people like yourself in the north who describe themselves as 'British only' despite having not lived in Britain for centuries.

Arlene is still not over 1916 for goodness sake.

cameramonkey

20-30 years

downcow wrote: »

Unfortunately for you your bigotry does not change how it is. I am British in every way. British parents and grandparents. Even though some were born in roi, it was even British then, I was born in the UK. I have a British passport. I love to see any team in the world beating your ROI team lol. QE2 is my monarch. I support British football teams, watch British tv. Speak English, if I was an athlete I would compete in the olympics for gb&ni. I use British pound, love the British flag, my roads are marked in miles and if I was joining an army it would be (surprise surprise) the British army. I could go on and on.

I realise that it is a little embarrassing for you that you probably sign up to many of these pro British things and maybe even support a British team like Celtic or Man U.
It might just be you that’s having the identity crisis. Surely not?

But you come on to an Irish forum to tell us all the things that make you British.

downcow

Matt Barrett wrote: »

Everything you say is true as is the fact that if you were born in Ireland you are Irish by sheer geography.
If I called you an Ulster man would that be an insult? If not, do you know where Ulster is? Hint, it's not Wales.

Ah you're letting your own bigotry get to you. I'd a British Grandfather and a number of British cousins I'm very fond of. I don't follow soccer but I love a lot of British music. Get over your preconceived prejudices and don't be putting them on others. It's healthy to enjoy the cultures of others. It's not letting the team down to listen to Thin Lizzy or U2 ffs.

No idea what you are trying to say so can’t reply

downcow

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Well Boris apparently could only name one county in NI and he went to Oxford or Cambridge. Lack of awareness is not exclusive to you.

What has it to do about the thread?

You make my point. The Irish arrogance somehow thinks Boris should have studied the history a 32 county Ireland. You were irrelevant totally to someone studying in England.

blanch152

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Are you saying you were born loving all those things? I don't think so. At some point you chose, whether you were aware you were doing it or not. Every single person on the planet does. Nobody is born with an established 'identity'.
We are born in places. You were born in Ireland and that is never going to change.

Actually, they were born in the UK as loyal subjects of Her Majesty.

As usual, your twisted logic brings you somewhere you don’t want to go.

FrancieBrady

downcow wrote: »

You make my point. The Irish arrogance somehow thinks Boris should have studied the history a 32 county Ireland. You were irrelevant totally to someone studying in England.

He only knew one county in NI, downcow. He's your PM ffs!

downcow

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Are you saying you were born loving all those things? I don't think so. At some point you chose, whether you were aware you were doing it or not. Every single person on the planet does. Nobody is born with an established 'identity'.
We are born in places. You were born in Ireland and that is never going to change.

We don’t choose those things. It’s who we are

FrancieBrady

downcow wrote: »

We don’t choose those things. It’s who we are

You did actually.