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Out sick in probationary period

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13

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    #62
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Lillianna Microscopic Gnu wrote:
    Yes the boss is an arsehole. Dishonest as the OP was, it doesn't change that the boss is an arsehole - putting it kindly.


    So the OP has shown themselves to be dishonest, yet based on the OPs claim it's the employer who is at fault?. Awesome logic.


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    #63
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    I'm out, last advice OP. Start a job search you have shown after 5 weeks you can't be trusted. Good luck.


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    #64
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Lillianna Microscopic Gnu wrote: »
    Yes the boss is an arsehole. Dishonest as the OP was, it doesn't change that the boss is an arsehole - putting it kindly.

    When is sickness not terrible misconduct? Cancer?

    Sickness isn’t terrible misconduct. How you deal with it is the issue. The OP shot herself in the foot by ringing her boss saying that her child was sick then handing in a Cert saying that SHE was sick. Showing oneself to be dishonest so soon into a job is a recipe for disaster.
    Being a working parent is tough, especially when there doesn’t seem to be any family close by.


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    #65
    spockety
    Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 5,471 Mod ✭✭✭✭spockety


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    You miss the part where the OP rang and said the child was sick throughout the night but produced a cert to claim it was the OP who was sick. Dishonest behaviour not a concern for you in a new employee?

    I have enough experience to take into account the stress, anxiety, and panic the employee would have been feeling, so no it would not be a concern. I'd make sure the employee knew I was the type of boss who would react with compassion and understanding when it comes to things like sick kids, so they knew that in future there was no need to be anything other than completely straight. In this case anyway, the doctor sounds like the one who has put her in an awful spot.


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    #66
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    spockety wrote:
    I have enough experience to take into account the stress, anxiety, and panic the employee would have been feeling, so no it would not be a concern. I'd make sure the employee knew I was the type of boss who would react with compassion and understanding when it comes to things like sick kids, so they knew that in future there was no need to be anything other than completely straight. In this case anyway, the doctor sounds like the one who has put her in an awful spot.


    That's great, but the OP doesn't work for you and by her/his admission the employer is not happy with their behaviour. The OP is an adult and is solely responsible for the position they find themselves in. Passing the blame to a third party is ridiculous. Anyway as I said I'm finished with this.


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    #67
    spockety
    Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 5,471 Mod ✭✭✭✭spockety


    BTW, the OP hasn't actually said that the employer knows anything about the child's illness, only that she called in sick and has a note for gastric flu?

    In that case as an employer blissfully unaware of the real situation, I'd still be thinking "Jesus, sorry to hear you got gastric flu, can't be helped don't stress about it. Take care of yourself and come back to us when you're up to it".

    Trust shouldn't need to be earned in these situations. It is a given. Yes it's annoying for an employer when someone is out sick unexpectedly. Things can't get done, things get delayed, etc. Tough titty, that's what happens when you employ humans. As an employer that's the risk you take on and the environment you work in, it's up to you to deal with it without lashing out at your employees.


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    #68
    spockety
    Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 5,471 Mod ✭✭✭✭spockety


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    The OP is an adult and is solely responsible for the position they find themselves in.

    Indeed, but it's not black and white. Applying a shred of empathy to your relationship with people who work for you puts things in a different light in many situations.


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    #69
    Tikki Wang Wang
    Closed Accounts Posts: 332 ✭✭Tikki Wang Wang


    tatsplat wrote: »
    I rang to say my child was sick as he had thrown up during the night then when he was continuously sick throughout the day and showing signs of dehydration I took him to doctor who produced the sick cert in my name since as he put it when I asked for a note for the baby I would not be allowed time off for him being sick and better to say I was. Further questions your honour?

    I think you’ve been caught out in your lies and dishonesty to your employer. They are putting two and two together and know you are not sick and your sick cert is de facto fraud.


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    #70
    irelandrover
    Registered Users Posts: 3,771 ✭✭✭irelandrover


    tatsplat wrote: »
    I rang to say my child was sick as he had thrown up during the night then when he was continuously sick throughout the day and showing signs of dehydration I took him to doctor who produced the sick cert in my name since as he put it when I asked for a note for the baby I would not be allowed time off for him being sick and better to say I was. Further questions your honour?
    spockety wrote: »
    BTW, the OP hasn't actually said that the employer knows anything about the child's illness, only that she called in sick and has a note for gastric flu?

    In that case as an employer blissfully unaware of the real situation, I'd still be thinking "Jesus, sorry to hear you got gastric flu, can't be helped don't stress about it. Take care of yourself and come back to us when you're up to it".

    Trust shouldn't need to be earned in these situations. It is a given. Yes it's annoying for an employer when someone is out sick unexpectedly. Things can't get done, things get delayed, etc. Tough titty, that's what happens when you employ humans. As an employer that's the risk you take on and the environment you work in, it's up to you to deal with it without lashing out at your employees.

    The OP originally rang in saying their child was sick. And then handed in a cert for themselves.

    It does sound like its not a great place to work. Any boss that would give abuse for having to stay at home with a sick child isn't really going to be a great boss to work for. If i was you i wouldn't be expecting to be kept past my probation and would start looking for another job immediately as they don't sound like a good company to work for anyway.


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    #71
    spockety
    Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 5,471 Mod ✭✭✭✭spockety


    OP what exactly did your boss say when you subsequently rang in to say you had a cert for gastric flu for yourself?


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    #72
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    tatsplat wrote:
    Actually the note says that I have gastric flu, I didn't explain very well

    tatsplat wrote:
    I asked the doctor for a note to say the baby was sick but he said it would not allow me time off work and he would write one in my name instead. Since no creche or childminder will take a sick child and I haven't family that can care for him not sure what else I could have done tbh.

    tatsplat wrote:
    That's because I asked the doctor for a note to say my child was unwell but he said it would not be accepted by boss to allow me time off and he would write one in my name. Since no creche or childminder will take a child who is ill and I don't have family to care for him not sure what else I was supposed to do. My fault for needing to work but also wanting to be a mother I suppose

    tatsplat wrote:
    I rang to say my child was sick as he had thrown up during the night then when he was continuously sick throughout the day and showing signs of dehydration I took him to doctor who produced the sick cert in my name since as he put it when I asked for a note for the baby I would not be allowed time off for him being sick and better to say I was. Further questions your honour?

    spockety wrote:
    BTW, the OP hasn't actually said that the employer knows anything about the child's illness, only that she called in sick and has a note for gastric flu?

    You read any of the OP's posts? The fourth quote answers your question and prehaps explains the employers annoyance with the OP.


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    #73
    tatsplat
    Registered Users Posts: 55 ✭✭tatsplat


    spockety wrote: »
    OP what exactly did your boss say when you subsequently rang in to say you had a cert for gastric flu for yourself?
    He just said that another employee was off on leave they had requested 3 weeks ago, and that it wasn't very good as I had only just started. When I said that I didn't know that this was going to happen and that I had no one else I could leave my baby with (he is under 2) he backtracked a bit.


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    #74
    spockety
    Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 5,471 Mod ✭✭✭✭spockety


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    You read any of the OP's posts? The fourth quote answers your question and prehaps explains the employers annoyance with the OP.

    Aye. In which case, the OP may need to come clean with her employer and explain what happened without leaving anything out. Apologise, and explain. There was obviously no malicious intent. This is not someone calling in sick when they have a hangover, or skiving off for a few days.

    It will tell her employer a lot about her, and the reaction of her employer should also tell her a lot about what kind of place she has started working in, or what kind of boss she has signed up to. I still maintain that presented with all the facts even now, as her boss I would have sympathy towards the OPs position. At the heart of this is a sick child that needs to be cared for.


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    #75
    Gimme A Pound
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,482 ✭✭✭Gimme A Pound


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    So the OP has shown themselves to be dishonest, yet based on the OPs claim it's the employer who is at fault?. Awesome logic.
    The boss doesn't know that the OP was lying with the note; why are you pretending that they do?

    The only information they have is that the OP was out sick - they told the OP that being out sick is on a par with misconduct. Yes the boss is at fault for such an appalling outlook.

    The OP did have to stay at home because of a sick child - so their absence was very much legit. Badly handled but still absolutely necessary for them to be off. The reason they lied is due to fear that their child being sick would be considered misconduct. A damning indictment in and of itself.

    Of course it's a nuisance when people are absent but what's the alternative? Coming in actually sick? Or coming in when their child is sick and therefore unable to be brought to the creche or childminder?


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    #76
    spockety
    Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 5,471 Mod ✭✭✭✭spockety


    tatsplat wrote: »
    He just said that another employee was off on leave they had requested 3 weeks ago, and that it wasn't very good as I had only just started. When I said that I didn't know that this was going to happen and that I had no one else I could leave my baby with (he is under 2) he backtracked a bit.

    But when you told him you had a note that said you had gastric flu specifically, how did he react to that news? As in, have you told your boss that you actually DO have gastric flu, or have you told him that's what was put on a note by the doctor?


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    #77
    Kimbot
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 18,583 Mod ✭✭✭✭Kimbot


    spockety wrote: »
    Aye. In which case, the OP may need to come clean with her employer and explain what happened without leaving anything out. Apologise, and explain. There was obviously no malicious intent. This is not someone calling in sick when they have a hangover, or skiving off for a few days.

    It will tell her employer a lot about her, and the reaction of her employer should also tell her a lot about what kind of place she has started working in, or what kind of boss she has signed up to. I still maintain that presented with all the facts even now, I would have sympathy towards the OPs position. At the heart of this is a sick child that needs to be cared for.

    Well I for one wouldnt be impressed with an employee ringing me saying they had to mind their sick child and couldnt come into work but then return to work and hand a cert in for themselves.

    I have no objection to my staff needing time to look after sick kids etc but once they are honest about it. The OP could easily put in Certs for other absences when they werent genuinly sick.


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    #78
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Lillianna Microscopic Gnu wrote:
    The boss doesn't know that the OP was lying with the note; why are you pretending that they do?


    Post #72


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    #79
    tatsplat
    Registered Users Posts: 55 ✭✭tatsplat


    He didn't accuse me of skiving off if that's the issue.

    Feel like I need to state I'm not after Paid sick leave since my company doesn't offer that. I just didn't have any option as no one else to watch the baby. Since my job is only part time and my husband is full time and earns more it was more feasible we miss out on my pay than his.


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    #80
    Gimme A Pound
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,482 ✭✭✭Gimme A Pound


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    I'm out, last advice OP. Start a job search you have shown after 5 weeks you can't be trusted. Good luck.
    It appears you're not out. Have they shown to their boss they can't be trusted? People in this thread are not their boss.
    Deleted User wrote: »
    Sickness isn’t terrible misconduct. How you deal with it is the issue. The OP shot herself in the foot by ringing her boss saying that her child was sick then handing in a Cert saying that SHE was sick. Showing oneself to be dishonest so soon into a job is a recipe for disaster.
    Being a working parent is tough, especially when there doesn’t seem to be any family close by.
    Sickness IS terrible misconduct according to many.

    And the boss doesn't know about the dishonesty so that's moot.


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    #81
    spockety
    Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 5,471 Mod ✭✭✭✭spockety


    tatsplat wrote: »
    He didn't accuse me of skiving off if that's the issue.

    Feel like I need to state I'm not after Paid sick leave since my company doesn't offer that. I just didn't have any option as no one else to watch the baby. Since my job is only part time and my husband is full time and earns more it was more feasible we miss out on my pay than his.

    The company doesn't even have to pay you for the days you are taking off?? In that case my disdain for your boss has gone slightly higher.


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    #82
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Lillianna Microscopic Gnu wrote:
    It appears you're not out. Have they shown to their boss they can't be trusted? People in this thread are not their boss.


    It appears I decided to answer people who responded to me after I said I was out. Again you can read post #72 from me no pretence.


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    #83
    iamwhoiam
    Registered Users Posts: 16,138 ✭✭✭✭iamwhoiam


    tatsplat wrote: »
    He didn't accuse me of skiving off if that's the issue.

    Feel like I need to state I'm not after Paid sick leave since my company doesn't offer that. I just didn't have any option as no one else to watch the baby. Since my job is only part time and my husband is full time and earns more it was more feasible we miss out on my pay than his.

    Is your husband longer in his job and not on probation ? If that is the case he could take a Force Majure leave


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    #84
    Gimme A Pound
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,482 ✭✭✭Gimme A Pound


    spockety wrote: »
    The company doesn't even have to pay you for the days you are taking off?? In that case my disdain for your boss has gone slightly higher.
    A vile person - and of course all the bad-asses here thinking he's great. Imagine my shock. :rolleyes:


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    #85
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Lillianna Microscopic Gnu wrote:
    And the boss doesn't know about the dishonesty so that's moot.

    tatsplat wrote:
    I asked the doctor for a note to say the baby was sick but he said it would not allow me time off work and he would write one in my name instead. Since no creche or childminder will take a sick child and I haven't family that can care for him not sure what else I could have done tbh.

    tatsplat wrote:
    I rang to say my child was sick as he had thrown up during the night then when he was continuously sick throughout the day and showing signs of dehydration I took him to doctor who produced the sick cert in my name since as he put it when I asked for a note for the baby I would not be allowed time off for him being sick and better to say I was. Further questions your honour?


    Thoughts?


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    #86
    iamwhoiam
    Registered Users Posts: 16,138 ✭✭✭✭iamwhoiam


    spockety wrote: »
    The company doesn't even have to pay you for the days you are taking off?? In that case my disdain for your boss has gone slightly higher.

    There are many companies who don't pay for sick leave .


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    #87
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Lillianna Microscopic Gnu wrote:
    A vile person - and of course all the bad-asses here thinking he's great. Imagine my shock.


    An employer being right is not the same as an employer being great. Childish response tbh .


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    #88
    spockety
    Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 5,471 Mod ✭✭✭✭spockety


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    An employer being right is not the same as an employer being great. Childish response tbh .

    This is true, and while it wasn't my response I'll just pick up on something.

    In a wider sense, the OP finds herself in this position because there are too many old fashioned views, old fashioned companies, and old fashioned bosses still out there who cannot for the life of them see the link between the health and satisfaction of their employees, and the health of their business. It is crazy that people are scared to get sick, stressed about the work implications of major issues at home etc. Progressive companies, and progressive leaders handle this kind of stuff with ease, and if they were more widespread then people wouldn't have the kind of worries that puts them in these situations.


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    #89
    WinnyThePoo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,417 ✭✭✭WinnyThePoo


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    I'm out, last advice OP. Start a job search you have shown after 5 weeks you can't be trusted. Good luck.
    Wow that's a horrible contribution.


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    #90
    tatsplat
    Registered Users Posts: 55 ✭✭tatsplat


    How do I go about closing the thread since I've had plenty of feedback both good and bad?


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    #91
    iamwhoiam
    Registered Users Posts: 16,138 ✭✭✭✭iamwhoiam


    spockety wrote: »
    This is true, and while it wasn't my response I'll just pick up on something.

    In a wider sense, the OP finds herself in this position because there are too many old fashioned views, old fashioned companies, and old fashioned bosses still out there who cannot for the life of them see the link between the health and satisfaction of their employees, and the health of their business. It is crazy that people are scared to get sick, stressed about the work implications of major issues at home etc. Progressive companies, and progressive leaders handle this kind of stuff with ease, and if they were more widespread then people wouldn't have the kind of worries that puts them in these situations.

    We also must consider that their are employees that take the piss . I am a woman and had three kids and worked
    I was lucky to have a support system and am aware not all do
    But imagine a place of employment where many have kids and some take the piss calling in sick when kids have a cold


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