Who Watches the Watchmen (Our Chit Chat Thread)

banie01

Time wrote: »

It's just plastic with a fancy name, albeit hard wearing shiny plastic. I find the biggest benefit of mine (MB Starwalker) is that is very comfortable to write with for hours on end, my hand never gets sore. I believe you can fit the MB refills (i use fineliners) to other pens and half the comfort comes from the fact the ink just glides onto the page so you can get the same experience for a fraction of the price i'd say.




Thanks, it was tough going at times especially at the end when college closed in March and we moved online, found that unfulfilling myself but at least i'd all my friends in the same position for support. I actually studied law myself, and i'd agree it's not a great course to learn by watching a lecture and without access to books.

Are you full time or how are you finding the work life balance.

I'm full time, it's going well but I'm into my 3rd semester of online and it's starting to really, really grate.

My main issue with it is that most of the course is delivered so poorly. It's as if the internet and teleconferencing and remote work was brand new.
There is no consistent means of presentation or delivery, the Uni could ideally use a style guide to at least get the presentation of their message having some degree of homogeneity.

I'm doing a lot of peer tutoring for 1st and 2nd yr students who are being crushed emotionally by the complete lack of any upside to their college experience.
Glad at least the 1st time round we had no pandemic

I'm a fan of ebooks and other productivity tools but to see a university just hope that "some" e-book access will help?
They've obviously not tried to track down ebooks of Irish constitutional law books :pac:

Wibbs

Just on Fitz' numbers produced by GP above. I knew I had this somewhere. the file is dated 2015, so I don't know ho much has changed in the interim. Can't recall where I got it from, some Swiss industry report. With some brands they're estimates as they keep production numbers close to their chests and we don't have the Japanese or German boyos in the mix, or smart watches like Apple. I seem to recall in 17 I think Apple sold 8 million watches.

Entry level brands.

Swatch: 12,000,000
Tissot: 4,200,000
CK watches: 1,000,000
Mondaine: 500,000
Certina: 500,000
Victorinox: 400,000
Balmain: 100,000
Movado: 60,000
Aerowatch: 25,000

Mid level brands.

Longines: 1,300,000
TAG Heuer: 650,000
Rado: 300,000
Tudor: 220,000
Frederique Constant: 140,000
Mido: 140,000
Titoni: 140,000
Hamilton: 120,000
Raymond Weil: 110,000
Hermes: 100,000
Maurice Lacroix: 90,000
Montblanc: 90,000
Baume & Mercier: 80,000
Bell & Ross: 60,000
Ebel: 30,000
Louis Vuitton: 23,500
Dior: 22,000

High end brands.

Rolex: 780,000
Omega: 720,000
Cartier: 620,000
Breitling: 165,000
IWC: 100,000
Chopard: 80,000
Jaeger le Coultre: 75,000
Panerai: 70,000
Patek Philippe: 58,000
Hublot: 40,000
Audemars Piguet: 37,000
Franck Muller: 37,000
Breguet: 35,000
Zenith: 35,000
Piaget; 28,000
Blancpain: 25,000
Bulgari: 25,000
Ulysse Nardin: 25,000
Vacheron Constantin: 23,000
Corum: 16,000
Girard Perregaux: 15,000

Some of the rankings are confusing, or more likely me being confused. I would have had Zenith as more mid range?

What surprised me at the time was how many watches Swatch(surely that's across the whole group??) and Tissot produced and in the mid tier that Longines were over double the production figures of their nearest rival and had the third biggest production run overall. Not far off double their stablemate Omega. I'd expect the margins with Omega to be significantly higher though. Higher retail prices for Omega to start with and with Longines being the Swatch group's "vintage reissue" brand, lots more extra tooling up across different production models.

893bet

Lolled hard at the “mid” level brands. Some dodgy inclusions for “mid level”.

These “levels” always amuse me. So many variables.

cnocbui

redlead wrote: »

For those of you that have Montblancs, what's the story with the "resin' that the Mesisterstucks are made from? Is this essentially just plastic? Kind of like the Breitling endurance Pro and "Britelight". What exactly is "precious resin"?

In my teens, I was given a watch I have tried to find info on, but have failed. It had a deep blue dial and the case was a white resin. It was made by Edox. It came with 4-5 plastic swappable snap on bezels, I think the balck one had a divers watch markings, the red one was for measuring heart rate, the yellow one was a tachymeter and the white one was possibly citys time zones? There was also a blue one which I forget the supposed function of.

It was a great introduction to the lack of quality of Swiss manufacturers. It leaked and then the strap pin lug broke, or the pin pulled out, when climbing back into a dinghy while swimming in a river and it ended up on the bottom, where it lies to this day i would imagine.

redlead

The one big change to the above Wibbs is that Rolex mania has moved Tudor into the opposite bracket in terms of perception and in terms of sales. I'd say sales are considerably higher.

I like GP. They are close to high horology at massively discounted prices used. Their 1945 range appeals to me as a dress watch. They get a lot more slack for the lauretto than Patek do for the Nautilus but I think the general design on the modern versions is very similar to the Royal Oak, especially with the waffle dials.

redlead

893bet wrote: »

Lolled hard at the “mid” level brands. Some dodgy inclusions for “mid level”.

These “levels” always amuse me. So many variables.

Funnily enough, my dad who isn't into watches has a Raymond Weil quartz SS tank watch and has worn it day in day out for at least 25 years now. Its still in great condition and has worked flawlessly. My assumption is that it would be regarded as suspect in that list but my view would be that they are very well built watches.

blue5000

banie01 wrote: »

Congratulations!
Well done.

I'm finding the online experience very unfulfilling tbh.
Total lack of collegiate in the college experience this time around.
Makes the law modules in particular a slog without the motivation of mooting.

Stick at it, not much fun I know but it will be worth it in the end. Son of a friend of mine is studying in UL and stays in the travelodge a few nights a week, not much fun in that either.

banie01

blue5000 wrote: »

Stick at it, not much fun I know but it will be worth it in the end. Son of a friend of mine is studying in UL and stays in the travelodge a few nights a week, not much fun in that either.

I know, it's a field that interests me, it ties in nicely with my 1st degree and previous experience too.

That said, it's really an exercise in sanity preservation.
I'm medically retired and far too young to stop working, learning or being aggressively curious.

I've already had a few employment offers out of it too which is quite interesting.
I don't have to do a co-op so I have the added bonus of getting a couple of commercial and media law modules in the autumn Semester too.

blue5000

I actually enjoyed Co-op, totally new experience after being self employed for so long, but I suppose places are limited now.

banie01

blue5000 wrote: »

I actually enjoyed Co-op, totally new experience after being self employed for so long, but I suppose places are limited now.

I'm now under the "care" and attention of the Student Disability team so I have an exemption for it.
Would rather do additional modules than take a semester off.

My own thinking on co-op is that is really a great way to develop practical and professional experience for students.
I've got 20yrs of that across a range of orgs aswell as some self employment, so I'd hate to take a place from a "proper" student, if that makes any sense?

Might try some volunteer work or something if I can't take 5 modules rather than 3 during the autumn Semester tho.

Can use up the hours I'd have put towards the additional 2 modules towards getting a PVA or something

Fitz II

893bet wrote: »

Lolled hard at the “mid” level brands. Some dodgy inclusions for “mid level”.

These “levels” always amuse me. So many variables.

I would never think that JLC are producing 75k watches a year....maybe 75k movements but they dont have the market for that many new watches.

Fitz II

I do a bit of lecturing in Trinity and the students driven demented with the total lack of any crack in college at the moment. I feel very sorry for them, those are precious years. At least once they are in the hospital there is some interaction, but there is something I cant put my finger on that is missing with online lectures and courses.

I would defo go back to college when I retire, looking forward to it.

blue5000

Fitz II wrote: »

I would never think that JLC are producing 75k watches a year....maybe 75k movements but they dont have the market for that many new watches.

It would be interesting to see a further breakdown as to where they sell as well, Longines are big sellers in China/Asia. Perhaps JLC are big sellers there too?

Thirdfox

blue5000 wrote: »

It would be interesting to see a further breakdown as to where they sell as well, Longines are big sellers in China/Asia. Perhaps JLC are big sellers there too?

Colloquially, I won't say so. Rolex for nouveau riche and Longines for middle class would be the main ones that stand out. Omega constellation too.

Lots of gold pieces. Cartier too.

When a Chinese associate saw I had an Omega on the wrist he checked it out, saw it was a speedy and commented "oh that's the cheaper one" - I guess gold Constellation pieces go down better there.

Though…to be fair - dress watches make more sense in the office than dive watches :P

Homer

Thirdfox wrote: »

When a Chinese associate saw I had an Omega on the wrist he checked it out, saw it was a speedy and commented "oh that's the cheaper one" - I guess gold Constellation pieces go down better

Like a LOT of people with new money they can’t help but show it off and look down their nose at those with less than them.

Wibbs

Homer wrote: »

Like a LOT of people with new money they can’t help but show it off and look down their nose at those with less than them.

It can be cultural too. Gold is just seen as nicer. IIRC gold is the top colour in Chinese culture?

Gold used to be the top banana in the West too. The vast majority of dress watches of the 20th century are gold or gold plated. Same for women's jewellery until around the 70's/80's when jewellers realised it was much better to sell people on silver being better, because there was far more repeat business and bigger margins. Diamonds are another obvious one. Not rare, except when large, would be cheap as chips really if their supply wasn't so constrained and they weren't popular as gifts or jewellery for the average person. Marketing changed all that. Personally I always though diamonds insipid bloodless gems. Much prefer rubies. Arguably something like a ruby engagement ring would look far nicer, but it won't sell.

It's like white gold? I could never get that at all. It's literally a contradiction in terms in the very title. OK it looks a little different if you squint and is certainly heavier than steel, but... Silver used to be a mainstay of watch casings, much of it because it was much easier to work than steel or nickel etc*, but does anybody have silver cased watches any more? It does take on a lustre of it's own when worn, warmer than white gold too. Electrum would be an interesting material.





*further on the AP Royal Oak, the prototypes were made from white gold, because of the pain in the arse of working in steel and they could prototype and refine the design before tooling up for steel.

redlead

https://youtu.be/26v_6_0GWtE

This is another golden oldie Archie Gem I just stumbled across. Some of these must be wind ups. Some guy from Birmingham claiming he got gifted a solid gold Breguet (masterpiece) but has never heard of them and should he swap it for a two tone sub? Archie is triggered ...

James Bond Junior

Omega lady constellation in steel and gold for the average wealthy arab lady as far as I can see around these parts.

Wibbs

James Bond Junior wrote: »

Omega lady constellation in steel and gold for the average wealthy arab lady as far as I can see around these parts.

Muslim cultures can have an impact on materials too. Devout Muslim men are prohibited from wearing gold or platinum, fine for the ladies. IIRC silver is OK and steel of course.

Wibbs

redlead wrote: »

https://youtu.be/26v_6_0GWtE

This is another golden oldie Archie Gem I just stumbled across. Some of these must be wind ups. Some guy from Birmingham claiming he got gifted a solid gold Breguet (masterpiece) but has never heard of them and should he swap it for a two tone sub? Archie is triggered ...

Could be legit. Vanishingly few normal people would have heard of Breguet, but most would have heard of Rolex. Then again a quick google search back in 12 or today would educate you quick. It's written right there on the dial. Then again I've snagged auctions on ebay listed as "Lomgines" and "Logines", only bidder. For the craic since I've two ebay searches for those two and I'd reckon at least once a month one or both come up. Mostly crap, but... There was the guy who had a vintage WW2 IWC pilot's watch listed on the bay as "Watch. Black dial".

Thirdfox

Wibbs wrote: »

It can be cultural too. Gold is just seen as nicer. IIRC gold is the top colour in Chinese culture?

Silver used to be a mainstay of watch casings, much of it because it was much easier to work than steel or nickel etc*, but does anybody have silver cased watches any more? It does take on a lustre of it's own when worn, warmer than white gold too. Electrum would be an interesting material.

24kt gold baby - or if you're slumming it then 22kt perhaps. It's hard enough to find 18kt gold in China and 9kt isn't even gold (nor is it gold in the US where 10(?)kt is the minimum for something to be legally called gold iirc).

And Wibbs - you heard it here first - currently the Lir model is planned to be cased in silver - both for aesthetic qualities, and also aural qualities for the repeater function - apparently rose gold is best tonally but we're not going to be able to make a gold cased repeater watch and keep the price in the X thousands of euro I imagine

Titanium too would be a consideration for aural qualities and still be a relatively cheap material to work with.

Wibbs wrote: »

Muslim cultures can have an impact on materials too. Devout Muslim men are prohibited from wearing gold or platinum, fine for the ladies. IIRC silver is OK and steel of course.

Is platinum banned too? I thought it was just gold that was forbidden for devout Muslims - I remember seeing tut tut comments on some Saudi prince rocking solid gold APs on the wrist on Instagram a while back.

James Bond Junior

Gold is haram on men. I have a 6mm 18k gold wedding band so I definitely stand out. Even amongst men in Ireland in their 30s, it's all white/plain metal these days but I was adamant on getting gold. Kind of regret going for 18k though, it's quite soft.

James Bond Junior

Speaking of Mont Blanc, I was asked by a relative to check out the Mont Blanc summit 2 here in Sandland, we have a boutique in our local mall so I popped in. 25% cheaper than EU prices with a discount given without asking/haggling.

I thought the leather strap felt very cheap, his Huawei smartwatch was half the price yet felt twice as premium (with a steel bracelet in fairness)

Surprised at the quality seeing as they are base Longine money.

redlead

Generally in even the most expensive of haute horology pieces, the gold is usually 18k and not 24k. I am presuming that this is not down to the cost and it might help strengthen the metal a bit?

Wibbs

Thirdfox wrote: »

And Wibbs - you heard it here first - currently the Lir model is planned to be cased in silver - both for aesthetic qualities, and also aural qualities for the repeater function -

Sweet. Silver is a lovely metal for casing. It develops a patina over time too. Not just tarnishing, but it seems to get warmer with the wearing. Given bronze is a thing these days for developing patina, maybe silver will make a comeback? though it is a soft metal. I suppose it depends on the grade/alloy? I have noticed on my silver Trench watches the colour and lustre is ever so slightly different depending on the case maker.

Is platinum banned too? I thought it was just gold that was forbidden for devout Muslims - I remember seeing tut tut comments on some Saudi prince rocking solid gold APs on the wrist on Instagram a while back.

Again IIRC from what I was told by a Muslim chap I know, platinum is out too and technically only silver is allowed on men, even down to the amount of it in a ring. With some very devout folks even steel is dubious as iron is banned in jewellery and steel is an iron alloy. In practice though, it seems only obvious gold stuff is looked down upon.

Wibbs

redlead wrote: »

Generally in even the most expensive of haute horology pieces, the gold is usually 18k and not 24k. I am presuming that this is not down to the cost and it might help strengthen the metal a bit?

24kt is very soft. I have a 22kt ring and it doesn't take that much force to bend it out of shape.

Cienciano

BTW, might be worth a look here for pens, seems to be great customer service.

https://thepenplace.ie/

Thirdfox

I use them a bit for refills at least - cheaper can be had elsewhere of course but it's a bricks and mortar store that specialises in pens - very cool and the people inside have been pretty nice whenever I had a query.

Cienciano

I just saw them on bargain alerts, few people said they have great customer service.

OldRio

Cienciano wrote: »

BTW, might be worth a look here for pens, seems to be great customer service.

https://thepenplace.ie/

I bought refills and a pen last year and they phoned me up regarding the order. I think it was a query on the refills. Excellent customer service.