Ulster Team Talk Thread IV... Go On My Henderson...

launish116

Sad truth is anyone with any ambition in the other provinces and maybe further down pecking order. Should look at Ulster and see pretty much the whole backrow is up for grabs. It worked for the likes of Cooney, approaching us. Maybe that’s what we need rather than IRFU influencing movement.

Wegians89

launish116 wrote: »

Sad truth is anyone with any ambition in the other provinces and maybe further down pecking order. Should look at Ulster and see pretty much the whole backrow is up for grabs. It worked for the likes of Cooney, approaching us. Maybe that’s what we need rather than IRFU influencing movement.

Did it really work for cooney? He got a token few caps before being dumped from the squad again

Locke_Lamora

Wegians89 wrote: »

Did it really work for cooney? He got a token few caps before being dumped from the squad again

Wasn't he behind Marmion at Connacht, and sharing minutes with Blade? I don't think too much of my club but surely starting for Ulster is a better career choice than riding a bench out west?

Wegians89

Locke_Lamora wrote: »

Wasn't he behind Marmion at Connacht, and sharing minutes with Blade? I don't think too much of my club but surely starting for Ulster is a better career choice than riding a bench out west?

To be honest in his last season with connacht, I was convinced he’d over take Marmion and take that first choice spot. It was blade who really shook things up in my eyes, feel he’ll similarly over take Marmion

bilston

I'd happily take Deegan and/or Penny...both players have huge competition at Leinster...BUT...the point remains...we cant beat Leinster if we keep signing their cast offs.

We need to produce our own talent...we're doing it in the backa...let's do it in the forwards...O'Toole, McCann and hopefully Stewart are the guys that will drag Ulster forward in the years to come...not 3rd choice Leinster back rows. I know they will help us compete with Munster to be the best of the rest...but to compete with Leinster and Toulouse and Racing etc we need to produce our own talent and have the ability to sign the odd top level NIQ.

bilston

Actually...and I've just thought of this, so it isn't that well thought out...

I would argue our three best ex Leinster players are Eric O'Sullivan, Marty Moore and of course John Cooney.

Moore and Cooney didn't sign from Leinster and O'Sullivan was never picked up by Leinster...I'm not sure if that is significant or not or completely irrelevant, but just thought I'd point it out. Obviously it is subjective on who you think our best three ex Leinster players are!

Edit - Moore, Cooney and O'Sullivan probably saw Ulster as a step up from where they were...the others maybe saw Ulster as a step down from Leinster...not sure if there is anything in that

launish116

Wegians89 wrote: »

Did it really work for cooney? He got a token few caps before being dumped from the squad again

Harsh, would he even been in contention if he was still with Connacht. Can’t fathom. How anyone can say Cooney moving to Ulster hasn’t worked for him! Just look at the exposure he’s had!

bilston

One reason why a signing like Max Deegan might work is that he is still pretty young...(same U20 side as Stockdale), so he has more rugby in front of him than behind, he has it all to do in his career to get to where he surely wants, therefore he might have more hunger about him, should he move...think Conway to Munster or Cronin to Leinster back in the day...so I know I'm contradicting a lot of what I was saying above, but ai can see how Deegan would be a good fit for Ulster should he want to move.

Still a downgrade on Coetzee, but that is out of our control.

launish116

bilston wrote: »

One reason why a signing like Max Deegan might work is that he is still pretty young...(same U20 side as Stockdale), so he has more rugby in front of him than behind, he has it all to do in his career to get to where he surely wants, therefore he might have more hunger about him, should he move...think Conway to Munster or Cronin to Leinster back in the day...so I know I'm contradicting a lot of what I was saying above, but ai can see how Deegan would be a good fit for Ulster should he want to move.

Still a downgrade on Coetzee, but that is out of our control.

Deegan would be behind:
No8 - Conan & Doris
blindside - Ruddock & Leavy

He would walk into No8 & challenging if not taking blindside at Ulster as well if no other backrowers signed.

Personally I’d have him, but still think we could do with more ballast as well.

Currently (excluding academy)
We have 1 blindside and 3 opensides that can’t carry or win turnovers.

awec

bilston wrote: »

I'd happily take Deegan and/or Penny...both players have huge competition at Leinster...BUT...the point remains...we cant beat Leinster if we keep signing their cast offs.

We need to produce our own talent...we're doing it in the backa...let's do it in the forwards...O'Toole, McCann and hopefully Stewart are the guys that will drag Ulster forward in the years to come...not 3rd choice Leinster back rows. I know they will help us compete with Munster to be the best of the rest...but to compete with Leinster and Toulouse and Racing etc we need to produce our own talent and have the ability to sign the odd top level NIQ.

Sign and keep top level NIQs...

bilston

Reading UAFC it looks like Ulster may have a player lined up already. No hints as to who....or if there are they have gone way over my head as is often the case on that MB!

Coetzee will play out the Rainbow Cup with us.

launish116

bilston wrote: »

Reading UAFC it looks like Ulster may have a player lined up already. No hints as to who....or if there are they have gone way over my head as is often the case on that MB!

Coetzee will play out the Rainbow Cup with us.

I know KOTH loves a puzzle/riddle. Only thing I can take from his sentence and with a lot of assumption is a Highlanders player. Maybe:

Marino Kilaele Tu’u though he is on the fringe of All Black stardom.

Shannon Frizzel - blindside also on the fringe of All Black squad.

Seem a little unrealistic with current financial climate and All Blacks calling.

Scythica

Teariki Ben-Nicholas
Shannon Frizell
Billy Harmon
Kazuki Himeno
James Lentjes
Marino Mikaele-Tu’u
Sione Misiloi
Liam Squire

Out of the options, i'd probably guess it's Squire given the age profiles..?

launish116

Ulster team to play Connacht, Guinness PRO14 Round 9, Sunday 27 December at the Sportsground (kick-off 7.35pm, live on Premier Sports):

(15-9) Michael Lowry, Craig Gilroy, James Hume, Stewart Moore, Ethan McIlroy, Ian Madigan, Alby Mathewson;

(1-8) Kyle McCall, John Andrew, Tom O’Toole, Alan O’Connor (Capt.), Kieran Treadwell, Greg Jones, Jordi Murphy, Nick Timoney.

Replacements: Bradley Roberts, Andrew Warwick, Marty Moore, David O’Connor, Matty Rea, David Shanahan, Ben Moxham, Matt Faddes.

Connacht have gone full strength.

sydthebeat

FFS

have ye not got enough highlanders already

bilston

launish116 wrote: »

Ulster team to play Connacht, Guinness PRO14 Round 9, Sunday 27 December at the Sportsground (kick-off 7.35pm, live on Premier Sports):

(15-9) Michael Lowry, Craig Gilroy, James Hume, Stewart Moore, Ethan McIlroy, Ian Madigan, Alby Mathewson;

(1-8) Kyle McCall, John Andrew, Tom O’Toole, Alan O’Connor (Capt.), Kieran Treadwell, Greg Jones, Jordi Murphy, Nick Timoney.

Replacements: Bradley Roberts, Andrew Warwick, Marty Moore, David O’Connor, Matty Rea, David Shanahan, Ben Moxham, Matt Faddes.

Connacht have gone full strength.

That pack could get eaten alive.

Moxham is an interesting one...he played for the Ireland 20s once last season (as an U19), he has come through fairly unheralded, be interesting to see how he does.

launish116

bilston wrote: »

That pack could get eaten alive

*will get eaten alive.

Good to see the academy backrowers getting involved.

bilston

launish116 wrote: »

*will get eaten alive.

Good to see the academy backrowers getting involved.

Beginning to get annoying isn't it. I'll be really disappointed if McCann doesn't feature in one of the next two games.

Presumably we go full strength against Munster, which means lambs to the slaughter in Dublin again as part of our annual sacrifice to the D4 Gods.

launish116

bilston wrote: »

Beginning to get annoying isn't it. I'll be really disappointed if McCann doesn't feature in one of the next two games.

Presumably we go full strength against Munster, which means lambs to the slaughter in Dublin again as part of our annual sacrifice to the D4 Gods.

It is indeed, it’s like Groundhog Day we keep seeing the elephant in the room and no one else acknowledges it! Obviously management may have their reasons. But right now, is the likes of Timoney really that far ahead.

Then there’s the argument of what benefit is one cap and a thrashing in Leinster.

Locke_Lamora

bilston wrote: »

That pack could get eaten alive.

Moxham is an interesting one...he played for the Ireland 20s once last season (as an U19), he has come through fairly unheralded, be interesting to see how he does.

That backrow is not quite up to standard, is it?

Moxham played u20 as an u19 last year and was somewhere between poor and average tbh, but I have seen him play much better at u18 level. I've said before that I thought he might struggle to get back in this year, but this is a huge opportunity for him so stake a claim for an academy place with so little rugby being played this year.

It's a vote of confidence in him from the coaches, but Conor Rankin must not be impressing if he's not injured. McIlroy leapfrogged him despite going into the academy a year later, and now Moxham (who's not in the academy) is winning valuable minutes at Christmas that a young player like him might have been targeting.

launish116

Locke_Lamora wrote: »

Moxham played u20 as an u19 last year and was somewhere between poor and average tbh, but I have seen him play much better at u18 level. I've said before that I thought he might struggle to get back in this year, but this is a huge opportunity for him so stake a claim for an academy place with so little rugby being played this year.

Moxhamleapfrogging Hyde?

bilston

Locke_Lamora wrote: »

That backrow is not quite up to standard, is it?

Moxham played u20 as an u19 last year and was somewhere between poor and average tbh, but I have seen him play much better at u18 level. I've said before that I thought he might struggle to get back in this year, but this is a huge opportunity for him so stake a claim for an academy place with so little rugby being played this year.

It's a vote of confidence in him from the coaches, but Conor Rankin must not be impressing if he's not injured. McIlroy leapfrogged him despite going into the academy a year later, and now Moxham (who's not in the academy) is winning valuable minutes at Christmas that a young player like him might have been targeting.

Not a back three player...but I wonder if Hyde will get a shot in these games...with McCloskey likely to play just once you'd think there was a chance he could get 20 minutes somewhere. I can only reference what I saw for the Irelamd U20s, but he looks a decent prospect, better than Moxham or Rankin I'd have thought (again I know he is a centre).

Locke_Lamora

launish116 wrote: »

Boxham leapfrogging Hyde?

Hmm..I'm not sure they're in direct competition. As Bilston said, Hyde looks more like a 12/13, don't think he's even appeared for the A's in the back three. Moxham is a 13/wing and we have Moore, Hume and Faddes all covering 13 for this game.

launish116

Locke_Lamora wrote: »

Hmm..I'm not sure they're in direct competition. As Bilston said, Hyde looks more like a 12/13, don't think he's even appeared for the A's in the back three. Moxham is a 13/wing and we have Moore, Hume and Faddes all covering 13 for this game.

Ah thought Moxham was a centre, utility wing. Didn’t realise wing was preference.

Locke_Lamora

launish116 wrote: »

Ah thought Moxham was a centre, utility wing. Didn’t realise wing was preference.

Played a lot of centre for Ulster u18/u19 but he's played wing for Ireland u19 and Ulster A, not sure where he's best at yet. I think he's covering wing in this match though, which is what I meant by him not being in competition with Hyde.

RuPi

Surely Faddes covers wing and full back and Moxham is there as centre cover? Faddes is probably first Backline injury replacement as he can cover 13 as well. Presume Hyde is injured and Moxham showed up well during the A games, he is primarily a centre but he is quick which is why he has played the odd game on the wing.

Serious ask of that squad to go to Galway in a storm and win, forecast is dire.

launish116

RuPi wrote: »

Surely Faddes covers wing and full back and Moxham is there as centre cover? Faddes is probably first Backline injury replacement as he can cover 13 as well. Presume Hyde is injured and Moxham showed up well during the A games, he is primarily a centre but he is quick which is why he has played the odd game on the wing.

Serious ask of that squad to go to Galway in a storm and win, forecast is dire.

That was my initial thought. Moxham as centre cover. Guess it makes sense if he covers centre/wing with no 10 cover.

Got to feel for Marty Moore, man can’t get a week off! Where is Milasinovich?

Locke_Lamora

RuPi wrote: »

Surely Faddes covers wing and full back and Moxham is there as centre cover? Faddes is probably first Backline injury replacement as he can cover 13 as well. Presume Hyde is injured and Moxham showed up well during the A games, he is primarily a centre but he is quick which is why he has played the odd game on the wing.

Serious ask of that squad to go to Galway in a storm and win, forecast is dire.

I was thinking Faddes would cover the back three initially then if Moore or Hume go down then he moves into 13 and Moxham plays wing and Gilroy/Mcilory overs fullback. You might be right though, would be a horrible time for Hyde then.

Connacht have a strong team named, the penalties conceded at scrum time will lose it for us I reckon.

jacothelad

launish116 wrote: »

Deegan would be behind:
No8 - Conan & Doris
blindside - Ruddock & Leavy

He would walk into No8 & challenging if not taking blindside at Ulster as well if no other backrowers signed.

Personally I’d have him, but still think we could do with more ballast as well.

Currently (excluding academy)
We have 1 blindside and 3 opensides that can’t carry or win turnovers.

Personally I have always thought Ruddock would be a great signing for Ulster and for him. We'd get a great player, a great leader and a great captain. I wouldn't care which position he played but he'd be such an asset.

jacothelad

launish116 wrote: »

I know KOTH loves a puzzle/riddle. Only thing I can take from his sentence and with a lot of assumption is a Highlanders player. Maybe:

Marino Kilaele Tu’u though he is on the fringe of All Black stardom.

Shannon Frizzel - blindside also on the fringe of All Black squad.

Seem a little unrealistic with current financial climate and All Blacks calling.

Frizzel is not an uncommon name in N.I. I wonder if he has any ancestry there.