Ulster Team Talk Thread IV... Go On My Henderson...

Squidgy Black

Billy Burns just posted on Instagram, his girlfriend had a still birth. Awful news.

molloyjh

Jesus that's horrendous.

jacothelad

Addison. Moore and Gilroy all back in training. Good news for the season ahead. I imagine Addison's issue will mean a slower return and a great deal of work to strengthen his back before he is really fully fit. Moore will possibly be on the back up ist for the RWC.


I wonder where Gilroy will lie in the pecking order when he is fit again. Stockdale and Baloucoune look to be a seriously high grade pair.



Sexton is an interesting prospect. Pace like that is a rare thing in irish Rugby.

launish116

jacothelad wrote: »

I wonder where Gilroy will lie in the pecking order when he is fit again. Stockdale and Baloucoune look to be a seriously high grade pair.

Forgetting Lyttle as well.

Really don't think Gilroy will have it easy this season and McFarland doesnt seem the guy to use credit when picking a team. Baloucoune/Lyttle are only going to get better.

Throw in potentially Faddes, Addison & Ludik plying for fullback. Going to be a seriously competitive locking down wing/fullback, bar Stockdale.

jacothelad

launish116 wrote: »

Forgetting Lyttle as well.

Really don't think Gilroy will have it easy this season and McFarland doesnt seem the guy to use credit when picking a team. Baloucoune/Lyttle are only going to get better.

Throw in potentially Faddes, Addison & Ludik plying for fullback. Going to be a seriously competitive locking down wing/fullback, bar Stockdale.

Yes I completely forgot about Lyttle. He is such a talented and deceptively strong player. He has great speed and athelticism. A good defender, a great attacker, a really good kicker and a lovely passer of the ball. I keep looking at him when he is playing and think ...'He should be a 9.'...and who knows, maybe a 10.




So,

Ludik,

Addison,

Stockdale,

Baloucoune,

Lyttle,

McCloskey,

Gilroy,

Cooney,

Curtis (A),

Faddes,

Hume,

Johnstone,

Kernohan,

Lowry,

,

Shanahan,

Stewart

Marshall
in the seniors and



Moore, Sexton, Hughes, Houston and Hyde in the Academy backs.




That looks impressive but the weak links are as usual at 9 and 10. Burns is o.k. but I am still to be convinced about Lowry. Not about his talent but about his chances of survival. He certainly isn't really a full back at this level.


Bill Johnstone was a strange move but if he is as good as the reports then maybe he will be the catalyst that gets the backs moving.



Shanners is like Beagle lite and Stewart is....sort of o.k.


It's funny but I almost forgot about Luke Marshall who was really good at the end of last season. It is easy to lose sight of his talents which were blunted by his shoe-horning into 12 by McLaughlin. Here's hoping that he and Ulster get a season free of the injury blight which has hindered the team for about 7 years.

Jump_In_Jack

jacothelad wrote: »

Yes I completely forgot about Lyttle. He is such a talented and deceptively strong player. He has great speed and athelticism. A good defender, a great attacker, a really good kicker and a lovely passer of the ball. I keep looking at him when he is playing and think ...'He should be a 9.'...and who knows, maybe a 10.




So,

Ludik,

Addison,

Stockdale,

Baloucoune,

Lyttle,

McCloskey,

Gilroy,

Cooney,

Curtis (A),

Faddes,

Hume,

Johnstone,

Kernohan,

Lowry,

,

Shanahan,

Stewart

Marshall
in the seniors and



Moore, Sexton, Hughes, Houston and Hyde in the Academy backs.




That looks impressive but the weak links are as usual at 9 and 10. Burns is o.k. but I am still to be convinced about Lowry. Not about his talent but about his chances of survival. He certainly isn't really a full back at this level.


Bill Johnstone was a strange move but if he is as good as the reports then maybe he will be the catalyst that gets the backs moving.



Shanners is like Beagle lite and Stewart is....sort of o.k.


It's funny but I almost forgot about Luke Marshall who was really good at the end of last season. It is easy to lose sight of his talents which were blunted by his shoe-horning into 12 by McLaughlin. Here's hoping that he and Ulster get a season free of the injury blight which has hindered the team for about 7 years.

Strength in depth there for sure, but what would be the starting backline?
Is there enough quality in the starting backline to impose themselves on the likes of Munster/Leinster/Glasgow?

For example, at a guess:
15. Faddes
14. Gilroy
13. Addison
12. McCloskey
11. Stockdale
10. Burns
9. Cooney

How would you rate that back-line against the likes of Munster/Leinster/Glasgow if it came to a knockout match?

RobbieRuns

Jump_In_Jack wrote: »

Strength in depth there for sure, but what would be the starting backline?
Is there enough quality in the starting backline to impose themselves on the likes of Munster/Leinster/Glasgow?

For example, at a guess:
15. Faddes
14. Gilroy
13. Addison
12. McCloskey
11. Stockdale
10. Burns
9. Cooney

How would you rate that back-line against the likes of Munster/Leinster/Glasgow if it came to a knockout match?

Good question..........

For me best backlines in the Country in order

1 Leinster
2 Connacht
3 Munster
4 Ulster

Close which ones to go 2nd and 3rd choice. Burns would be the main reason that I would put Ulster there and they have improved hugely last season.

Sinbad_NI

jacothelad wrote: »

....
Here's hoping that he and Ulster get a season free of the injury blight which has hindered the team for about 7 years.

Don't think we've had it any worse than any other team TBH. It's just we've such a steep drop off in talent after the top 15/23 that we feel it so much more than other teams. Leinster being the prime example of strength in depth.
And obviously that problem was far worse in the pack than the backs.... and that's where the vast majority of matches are won or lost.
Even now (and I think we've recruited very well) when a few key men go down we'll be in a similar boat.
Cannot expect to go injury free in any season. That's exactly what needs to be planned for.

bilston

I think Gilroy still starts when everyone is available. The unknown quantity is Matt Faddes. He seems to be versatile, but what is his preferred position?

Stockdale won't be about for the first two months anyway so if I had to guess I'd say Gilroy and Balacoune on the wings with Faddes or Addison at FB and Lyttle slotting in from time to time.

As Jaco says a lot also depends on how quickly Addison returns. When both Addison and Marshall are fit, does Addison go to FB? Right now I think both Marshall and Addison have to play in the big games if fit.

As for the Johnston signing being strange...it's only strange in that Munster let it happen, or didn't do enough to stop it from happening, but they have other options and a budget that will only go so far. From what I've seen of Johnston it's potentially a great move for us.

bilston

Who are the must picks in our backline?

Cooney is obviously nailed on at 9

I'd say McCloskey, Stockdale and Addison are players who.will always start the European games, is Luke Marshall in that group? Possibly. That only leaves out half and one wing spot.

Squidgy Black

bilston wrote: »

I think Gilroy still starts when everyone is available. The unknown quantity is Matt Faddes. He seems to be versatile, but what is his preferred position?

Stockdale won't be about for the first two months anyway so if I had to guess I'd say Gilroy and Balacoune on the wings with Faddes or Addison at FB and Lyttle slotting in from time to time.

As Jaco says a lot also depends on how quickly Addison returns. When both Addison and Marshall are fit, does Addison go to FB? Right now I think both Marshall and Addison have to play in the big games if fit.

As for the Johnston signing being strange...it's only strange in that Munster let it happen, or didn't do enough to stop it from happening, but they have other options and a budget that will only go so far. From what I've seen of Johnston it's potentially a great move for us.

He's played a good bit at FB when Ben Smith isn't available, but I think his preferred position is right wing.

Paul Smeenus

Squidgy Black wrote: »

He's played a good bit at FB when Ben Smith isn't available, but I think his preferred position is right wing.

Then i'd probably go

Cooney - Burns (at first, anyway)
Stockdale - McCloskey - Marshall - Faddes
Addison

Dubinusa

I reckon Gilroy will see a lot of action. He's just an incredible finisher.
Burns , will probably be better also. His maiden year is behind him. He's a good 10.
McCloskey is imo, undroppable. He's a flanker coming down that channel at speed. Good hands too.
I would love to see Addison at 15. He could be the next international 15.
I know nothing about Faddes.

bilston

Squidgy Black wrote: »

He's played a good bit at FB when Ben Smith isn't available, but I think his preferred position is right wing.

Ah, interesting, in that case he may well put Gilroy under pressure

sydthebeat

Dubinusa wrote: »

I know nothing about Faddes.

faddes is very much a utility back..... adept at all numbers from 13 to 15 where the highlanders have used him over the years....... Though his usual spot would be wing (either) hes actually a very capable 13 and 15.

Squidgy Black

Yeah he's played centre a good bit with Otago.

He's a great option to have at 23, although some would argue it could probably be a downfall to not get a decent run in one position.

It's actually worked out really well for Ulster, with Addison and Faddes you have two great players who can pretty much cover the entire backline in case of emergencies, will allow for a lot of different options if injuries pop up.

RobbieRuns

I would look to play Stockdale at 15 a lot more this season. Great under a high ball and can run good lines.

Paul Smeenus

Plenty more opportunity (hopefully) to rest Big Stu this season then. Maybe too early for Moore, but I liked the cut of Curtis' jib.

Locke_Lamora

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

Plenty more opportunity (hopefully) to rest Big Stu this season then. Maybe too early for Moore, but I liked the cut of Curtis' jib.

I'd like to see Hume get more minutes in the 12 shirt as well. I know he played most of his schools and u20 career further out, but he played really well when called upon at inside centre. He had surgery on his foot/ankle over the summer so I'm not sure what stage of recovery he's at.

bilston

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

Plenty more opportunity (hopefully) to rest Big Stu this season then. Maybe too early for Moore, but I liked the cut of Curtis' jib.

I think Moore will rise to the top pretty quickly...if he stays fit

mogwai81

I would love to see an Ulster backline of
9. J. Cooney, 10. B. Johnston, 11. R. Lyttle, 12. S. McCloskey, 13. W. Addison, 14. R. Baloucoune, 15. J. Stockdale

I realise most people would disagree with Johnson ahead of Burns given how little game time he's had at senior level, but I think he has serious potential and would love to see him get a run of games. I feel Stockdale is stronger under the high compared to the other options and equally if not more dangerous in attack. Rob Lyttle has a fantastic strike rate. Staying injury free is his biggest problem. I really like Addison at 13, great defender and extremely fast. I think he is a more natural 13 then Marshall.
McCloskey and Cooney are hugh players for Ulster and pretty much guaranteed starters. Baloucoune seems to be a bit like Stockdale in that he has a knack for scoring tries. Plus I think he will improve on last year. Addison, Lyttle, Baloucoune and Stockdale is a backline with serious pace and would be lethal on the counter attack.
It will be interesting to see how Matt Faddes goes too. I think initially he might find himself in the 23 jersey due to his versatility. It shows Ulster's strength in depth at the moment that I would leave a fit Gilroy and Lowry struggling for a place on the bench. Of course it's very unlikely all these players would be fit at the same time, but it's an extremely exciting time for Ulster.

RobbieRuns

mogwai81 wrote: »

I would love to see an Ulster backline of
9. J. Cooney, 10. B. Johnston, 11. R. Lyttle, 12. S. McCloskey, 13. W. Addison, 14. R. Baloucoune, 15. J. Stockdale

I realise most people would disagree with Johnson ahead of Burns given how little game time he's had at senior level, but I think he has serious potential and would love to see him get a run of games. I feel Stockdale is stronger under the high compared to the other options and equally if not more dangerous in attack. Rob Lyttle has a fantastic strike rate. Staying injury free is his biggest problem. I really like Addison at 13, great defender and extremely fast. I think he is a more natural 13 then Marshall.
McCloskey and Cooney are hugh players for Ulster and pretty much guaranteed starters. Baloucoune seems to be a bit like Stockdale in that he has a knack for scoring tries. Plus I think he will improve on last year. Addison, Lyttle, Baloucoune and Stockdale is a backline with serious pace and would be lethal on the counter attack.
It will be interesting to see how Matt Faddes goes too. I think initially he might find himself in the 23 jersey due to his versatility. It shows Ulster's strength in depth at the moment that I would leave a fit Gilroy and Lowry struggling for a place on the bench. Of course it's very unlikely all these players would be fit at the same time, but it's an extremely exciting time for Ulster.

That would be close to my first choice of backline as well. I probably would start Gilroy over Baloucoune but other than that I would agree on Bill Johnston, he will start ahead of Burns if given a good run.

The issue will always be keeping lads fit and having enough quality strength in depth.

bilston

RobbieRuns wrote: »

That would be close to my first choice of backline as well. I probably would start Gilroy over Baloucoune but other than that I would agree on Bill Johnston, he will start ahead of Burns if given a good run.

The issue will always be keeping lads fit and having enough quality strength in depth.

Depth is good outside of half back

Here are three backlines...I may have missed someone out.

Cooney.
Burns
Stockdale
McCloskey
Marshall
Gilroy
Addison

Shanahan
Johnston
Lyttle
Curtis
Hume
Balacoune
Faddes

Stewart
Lowry
Kernohan
Curtis
Moore
Sexton
Ludik

Lucas44

bilston wrote: »

Depth is good outside of half back

Here are three backlines...I may have missed someone out.

Cooney.
Burns
Stockdale
McCloskey
Marshall
Gilroy
Addison

Shanahan
Johnston
Lyttle
Curtis
Hume
Balacoune
Faddes

Stewart
Lowry
Kernohan
Curtis
Moore
Sexton
Ludik

Moore is a much better prospect than curtis and Hume

bilston

I think my previous posts show I agree with that. But right now he is behind them both as he has yet to play a single competitive game for Ulster.

Also just realised I picked Curtis twice... Swap out Curtis in the 3rd backline for Hayden Hyde

thomond2006

Awec is going to turn up in his Pienaar Pyjamas for Ulster vs Cheetahs.

molloyjh

thomond2006 wrote: »

Awec is going to turn up in his Pienaar Pyjamas for Ulster vs Cheetahs.

And Leinster vs Cheetahs.

RobbieRuns

bilston wrote: »

Depth is good outside of half back

Here are three backlines...I may have missed someone out.

Cooney.
Burns
Stockdale
McCloskey
Marshall
Gilroy
Addison

Shanahan
Johnston
Lyttle
Curtis
Hume
Balacoune
Faddes

Stewart
Lowry
Kernohan
Curtis
Moore
Sexton
Ludik

So will that third backline be the Ravens or A team for next season? Good young players

Paul Smeenus

RobbieRuns wrote: »

So will that third backline be the Ravens or A team for next season? Good young players

I'd say every member of that third backline, bar Sexton, will start a senior game. Maybe not Stewart.

Lucas44

Good to see Nathan Doak in training with seniors for pre season, should take over from cooney in 2-3 years