Ulster Team Talk Thread IV... Go On My Henderson...

https://www.the42.ie/john-cooney-switch-to-scotland-5934223-Nov2022/

John Cooney seems to be genuinely debating the long speculated / debated switch to Scotland, to potentially play in next year's RWC.

stephen_n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119943135#Comment_119943135

Comments section as always good for a laugh. Not entirely sure he would make it into the Scottish squad. Certainly wouldn’t be a lock to start.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119945424#Comment_119945424

I saw Chris Cusiter was tweeting saying he'd be pissed off if he was a younger Scottish scrum half who was losing out to a guy who is 32, which I do get, but if you're Gregor Townsend you probably don't care?

Yeah, the comments section is generally a joke on the 42. Big Bad Johnny Sexton to blame as usual for Cooney's lack of caps.

John Cooney there is what Stephen Ireland or Andy Reid used to be to Eamon Dunphy and Irish football fans - someone they actually prefer isn't selected because it gives them something to whinge and hypothesize about.

I would rate him more highly than any of their current scrum halves (George Horne, Ali Price, Ben White), especially because he's also a potential kicker for them who would take some pressure off relying at Russell.

stephen_n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119945452#Comment_119945452

Yes but from a Scottish perspective he has no knowledge or understanding of their players. You can justify that lack of cohesion for someone who is significantly better but I just don’t think he is. Also the last thing Townsend needs is another player in camp with attitude problems.

Former Former Former

Fair play to him if Scotland would be interested, I think it would be a very unpopular move among the Scotland squad, which might not be the best thing for a squad that already has some interpersonal issues going on.

Surprising to see him actually come out and say he wants it though.

CIARAN_BOYLE

One of the best arguments that Scotland need Cooney would be to save Blair Kinghorn's blushes as a goalkicker.

Kinghorn for some reason seems to be first choice 10 but his goal kicking isn't upto international standards.

If you are picking him to save Kinghorn that would imply that he would be first choice scrumhalf.

If you are picking Cooney on his merits as a scrumhalf he probably sneaks into the squad.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119945479#Comment_119945479

Agreed on the cohesion point. He got his last cap against England on 23 Feb 2020, so based on that, he wouldn't even be eligible till Round 3 of next year's 6 Nations, and you'd imagine he'd need to play those last three rounds to have any hope of going to the RWC in a position as pivotal as scrum half.

Attitude problem is probably a bit strong to describe him, but I do think Cooney is an especially sensitive individual (I knew the guy when we were teenagers and this would have been said about him then even), who seems to have handled the Sexton stuff particularly badly. I don't think he's anything close to the attitude / issues of a guy like Finn Russell obviously.

stephen_n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119945510#Comment_119945510

Long before the issues with Sexton were brought up. There were suggestions of him having attitude problems. Particularly around training. Which was why Schmidt supposedly wasn’t a fan.

I think Russell is in a class of his own when it comes to attitude.

awec

Hendo at 6. Rea at 7. DV on bench. Moore on the wing.

It's different...

CIARAN_BOYLE

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119948269#Comment_119948269

For a second I thought you meant Marty Moore on the wing. I was trying to figure out how that was supposed to work. That would certainly be different.

Locke_Lamora

I've consulted the augurs, read the tea leaves and stole no less than 6 fortune cookies from the chinese restaurant down town, and I've seen nothing to suggest that it won't be a comprehensive ulster victory at the weekend.

ulsteru20s

Henderson at 6 is very interesting. Love the pack build. We went with what i’d consider the best scrummaging front row bar herring. I would have expected him to be in there. Different strategy from last time though maybe.

I think the plan is to attack the scrum early, try to win penalties and then maul. Then more of the ball carrying threats come on at 55/60. That doesnt totally jive with selection though so who knows.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119945424#Comment_119945424

I reckon he'd be looking to start as a Scum half to be honest.

stephen_n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119950220#Comment_119950220

What he’d be looking for and what would happen, may wildly differ. As much as we big up our own players and knock other countries. I don’t see anyway on this earth he walks into a starting jersey.

sydthebeat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119950312#Comment_119950312

If they are insisting on starting with longhorn, it certainly opens that starting spot to a scrum half with cooneys kicking record

stephen_n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119950460#Comment_119950460

I’d imagine unless Russell has another meltdown, always possible. Kinghorn will only start the minor games. Bringing in a SH who has never played in your system at any level. Then making him first choice would be an incredibly strange decision. Even by Scottish standards.

sydthebeat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119950720#Comment_119950720

I dunno. They were quick enough to get Ben vellacott and Ben white capped.

White got capped against England in the six nations this year, and vellacott against England

So while he may not go in first choice immediately, Scotland won't be slow to give him a chance

stephen_n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119950767#Comment_119950767

If he does make it into their World Cup squad, fair play to him. Don’t really see it happening though.

sydthebeat

^ the second mention of England above should say Italy.

i suppose the question would be..... of Price, White, Vellacotte, Horne, Dobbie and Cooney..... would Cooney be in the top 2? probably is my answer.

it would be very interesting to see if hes called into scottish training squads pre 6N '23 even if he cannot qualify until Round 3 of the competition.

stephen_n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119955257#Comment_119955257

I would say given the options, he would be probably second choice. Though he has no familiarity with their systems or players at any level. It’s such a pivotal position, that’s a big risk. Not to mention the affect of bringing in a 32 year old ahead of the available options.

Given the lack of options outside of Russell at 10. You could certainly see the attraction of having a 9 that can run the show.

Has there actually been any interest shown by Scotland though. Or is the just a question some Journo asked based on internet speculation.

Former Former Former

Maybe it's harsh but my read of Cooney is that he'll go if he's given assurances of gametime, I think he's done slogging it out for gametime

And of course Scotland can't give him any such assurance so my bet is nothing comes of it.

CIARAN_BOYLE

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119955789#Comment_119955789

There were reports from a Scotland fan fan in November that Ben Healy (of Munster) and John Cooney were seen at Oriam (Scotland's training base).

Dubinusa

I wouldn't be shocked if Ben Healy went. He'd be a good pick up for Ulster or Connacht. I wouldn't mind him at Leinster either.

Lost Ormond

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119956084#Comment_119956084

Why would he go to or Leinster want him? If Ben leaves Munster it wont be to anywhere in Ireland

Former Former Former

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119955860#Comment_119955860

This sounds like the sort of thing that would have made the news?

CIARAN_BOYLE

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119956162#Comment_119956162

Probably depends. Sometimes a cup of coffee can be a news worthy item.

I presume if either or both of them were there that they weren't there training with the Scottish team. Merely having a meeting to discuss possibilities.

Meetings can be hit or miss whether they are reported.

bilston

Ben Healy is absolutely someone Ulster should be looking at.

The thing about the Scotland link is that there will shortly be a chasm at 10 for Ireland, and while Healy is probably a bit down the pecking order, what he really needs is to be first choice at a province and he would have a decent shot at being first choice at either Connacht or Ulster. Ultimately if he can't get ahead of Carty or Burns he wouldn't be playing test rugby for either Ireland or Scotland anyway.

As for Cooney, last night proved Ulster still need him and while he may get a season in a Scotland Jersey (which would encompass a world cup) it would be a very short term move. He still has at least another couple of years of good rugby at URC/European rugby in him, I hope he doesn't do it. Also he has no guarantees of being Scotland's scrum half. I mean they have the Lions test 9 from last summer at their disposal.

Dubinusa

Rumors on another forum that Connors is off up to Belfast!

CIARAN_BOYLE

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119959930#Comment_119959930

Source is Brent Pope on off the ball.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119960021#Comment_119960021

Who himself says a "guy in the street" said it to him.

I really hope he's wrong. Connors signed a new contract just last May. I guess it wouldn't be beyond the realms of possibility for that to have been a 1 year deal given his injury history, but would have expected it to be a 2 year deal.

He would be a great signing for Ulster if it's true.