Ulster Team Talk Thread IV... Go On My Henderson...

Paul Smeenus

"When asked about what his young players will take from playing in a final and how they will use this to go on and win silverware, McFarland’s message is simple.

“We just have to keep improving. [Playing in a final] will be valuable experience for this young squad. I thought James Hume had his best game of the season so far and Tom O’Toole was excellent. For those guys, they’re the green shoots in our organisation. We’ve got a number of other guys coming through and I’d hope at the start of the next season – due to the nature of it that games are so dense – we’ll see some more guys coming through.” "

https://www.ulsterrugby.com/2020/09/im-proud-of-the-effort-put-in-mcfarland/

Sounds like some of those young bucks will feature.

Locke_Lamora

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

"When asked about what his young players will take from playing in a final and how they will use this to go on and win silverware, McFarland’s message is simple.

“We just have to keep improving. [Playing in a final] will be valuable experience for this young squad. I thought James Hume had his best game of the season so far and Tom O’Toole was excellent. For those guys, they’re the green shoots in our organisation. We’ve got a number of other guys coming through and I’d hope at the start of the next season – due to the nature of it that games are so dense – we’ll see some more guys coming through.” "

https://www.ulsterrugby.com/2020/09/im-proud-of-the-effort-put-in-mcfarland/

Sounds like some of those young bucks will feature.

Thought Tom O'Toole's scummaging has come along nicely, don't remember him taking a backwards step against an international front row. Looks heavier as well which looks to have been a focus for the squad over the break.

Hope to see Stewart Moore get an injury free run next season. Hume has looked very good in fairness, but I'd love for them to rotate or for Hume to move in and give McCloskey a break. We have quite a few options in the back three so not sure how many minutes McIlroy can get, although Addison and Lyttle are injury prone, Baloucoune is out, and Stockdale with spend time with Ireland.

Not sure which young forwards are actually ready tbh. McCann maybe the best bet, and they gave Allison a game this season already. Maybe too soon for Tom Stewart, still u20 next year.

bilston

Anyone know how Aaron Sexton is progressing?

Are there any A games coming up soon?

bilston

Locke_Lamora wrote: »

Thought Tom O'Toole's scummaging has come along nicely, don't remember him taking a backwards step against an international front row. Looks heavier as well which looks to have been a focus for the squad over the break.

Hope to see Stewart Moore get an injury free run next season. Hume has looked very good in fairness, but I'd love for them to rotate or for Hume to move in and give McCloskey a break. We have quite a few options in the back three so not sure how many minutes McIlroy can get, although Addison and Lyttle are injury prone, Baloucoune is out, and Stockdale with spend time with Ireland.

Not sure which young forwards are actually ready tbh. McCann maybe the best bet, and they gave Allison a game this season already. Maybe too soon for Tom Stewart, still u20 next year.

It would be good to see a few forwards emerge. You've named the three most likely to break through (now or a but further down the line), Callum Reid would be another I'd like to see.

It would be great to see Marcus Rea get a chance too.

Paul Smeenus

I'd hope Rea Jr features. He and Allison have both won their first caps.

If indeed our first game is at home against Treviso, who I think shed a load of players at the end of the season just gone, I'd hope one of them can start in lieu of Coetzee. Keep Reidy/Timoney/Murphy in for some experience, ad start blooding the next raft of youngsters.

The Lost Sheep

bilston wrote: »

Anyone know how Aaron Sexton is progressing?

Are there any A games coming up soon?

Original plan posted in academies thread etc had A games/A 7s series through september and into october but not much has been mentioned since.

ionadnapokot

Locke_Lamora wrote: »

Thought Tom O'Toole's scummaging has come along nicely, don't remember him taking a backwards step against an international front row. Looks heavier as well which looks to have been a focus for the squad over the break.

Hope to see Stewart Moore get an injury free run next season. Hume has looked very good in fairness, but I'd love for them to rotate or for Hume to move in and give McCloskey a break. We have quite a few options in the back three so not sure how many minutes McIlroy can get, although Addison and Lyttle are injury prone, Baloucoune is out, and Stockdale with spend time with Ireland.

Not sure which young forwards are actually ready tbh. McCann maybe the best bet, and they gave Allison a game this season already. Maybe too soon for Tom Stewart, still u20 next year.

Was just thinking the very same thing!
I would love to see Hume have a few runs a 12.
Stu is vital for Ulster at 12 but im selfishly thinking of Ireland!
Potential to develop into a very nice passing option at 12. Still wondering if he can kick.

Hands Like Flippers

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Original plan posted in academies thread etc had A games/A 7s series through september and into october but not much has been mentioned since.

I heard some of those games have been shelved unfortunately

launish116

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

I'd hope Rea Jr features. He and Allison have both won their first caps.

If indeed our first game is at home against Treviso, who I think shed a load of players at the end of the season just gone, I'd hope one of them can start in lieu of Coetzee. Keep Reidy/Timoney/Murphy in for some experience, ad start blooding the next raft of youngsters.

Likewise would be keen to see them both start to integrate. Also McCann was very good during 6N, but younger again. Would potentially let them play with Coetzee initially and as you say build to in lieu of him. If I was Allison/McCann I’d be targeting blindside/no8.

Hoping Dan can start influencing them like he has from O’Toole. O’Toole really has been a sensational find.

Paul Smeenus

Missed this at the time - March this year. It's patently a bit of facile nonsense... but...

43. Hayden Hyde
39. David McCann


https://www.rugbypass.com/news/the-top-50-u20-rugby-players-in-the-world/

ionadnapokot

https://twitter.com/UlsterRugby/status/1305783692456071169?s=20

Paul Smeenus

Eight years. Bloody hell.

ionadnapokot

Very difficult day for their family. Unimaginable loss.
I'll light a candle for them all today.

RedRaider0

Hands Like Flippers wrote: »

I heard some of those games have been shelved unfortunately

due to the positive covid tests presumably?

Munster & Connacht play this weekend and next.

Clegg

This would be disastrous.

https://twitter.com/Murray_Kinsella/status/1305904269351059460?s=19

Paul Smeenus

THROW DAVID McCANN IN

RedRaider0

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

THROW DAVID McCANN IN

isnt the academy in isolation from the senior squad due to the 8 players testing positive with covid?

Paul Smeenus

RedRaider0 wrote: »

isnt the academy in isolation from the senior squad due to the 8 players testing positive with covid?

I didn't actually mean it, but that was from more than two weeks ago, I think?

Utah_Saint

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

THROW DAVID McCANN IN

What is the story with McCann, Allison & Rea Jr? Really thought we would have seen them filter through.

RedRaider0

McCann is a level above the other two.. maybe two levels above Rea Jr.

bilston

Utah_Saint wrote: »

What is the story with McCann, Allison & Rea Jr? Really thought we would have seen them filter through.

McCann is only 20, his time will come. Allison has had a game or two from the bench and looked good with the ball. Not sure what the hold up on Rea Jnr is though. Id worry that it is passing him by a bit

bilston

https://www.the42.ie/dan-mcfarland-ulster-identity-5205734-Sep2020/

Interesting article...and Dan makes some good points...

However as someone in the comments section points out, can Ulster realistically expect to close the gap on Leinster if 4 or 5 of our team are players who left Leinster because they were second or third choice there?

We HAVE to produce our own players. It is the only way of getting to the very top. Those players also have to be better or at least equal to their Leinster counterparts.

Therefore we can make whatever signings we want, but if we are ever going to be European champions then we have to have a world class Academy. It is improving all the time, but we need to bringing through 4 or 5 guys who can step into the first team every single season.

awec

bilston wrote: »

https://www.the42.ie/dan-mcfarland-ulster-identity-5205734-Sep2020/

Interesting article...and Dan makes some good points...

However as someone in the comments section points out, can Ulster realistically expect to close the gap on Leinster if 4 or 5 of our team are players who left Leinster because they were second or third choice there?

We HAVE to produce our own players. It is the only way of getting to the very top. Those players also have to be better or at least equal to their Leinster counterparts.

Therefore we can make whatever signings we want, but if we are ever going to be European champions then we have to have a world class Academy. It is improving all the time, but we need to bringing through 4 or 5 guys who can step into the first team every single season.

Does any team do this outside of Leinster? Anywhere?

This is an insane benchmark to try and meet IMO. Ulster will be doing exceptionally well if they produce 1 new senior player a year who is good enough to be more than a ProX dirt tracker.

Teams like Ulster will never win europe by relying on academies. It is pure wishful thinking. "When our academy is better we'll challenge for it". We'll be saying the same thing in 10 years time, having won nothing in the mean time. We are not big enough and there is not enough money floating about Ulster for us to compete on this front.

bilston

awec wrote: »

Does any team do this outside of Leinster? Anywhere?

This is an insane benchmark to try and meet IMO. Ulster will be doing exceptionally well if they produce 1 new senior player a year who is good enough to be more than a ProX dirt tracker.

Teams like Ulster will never win europe by relying on academies. It is pure wishful thinking. "When our academy is better we'll challenge for it". We'll be saying the same thing in 10 years time, having won nothing in the mean time. We are not big enough and there is not enough money floating about Ulster for us to compete on this front.

Well unless Leinster let us sign Garry Ringrose and James Ryan I don't see what the alternative is. We will never be better than Leinster if we just continue to sign Leinster's bench players.

Sure we can add the odd NIQ player, but we can't afford more than 1 or 2 big names at any one time.

I dont see any other way than producing our own of being in top 4 or 5 in Europe.

RedRaider0

awec wrote: »

Does any team do this outside of Leinster? Anywhere?

This is an insane benchmark to try and meet IMO. Ulster will be doing exceptionally well if they produce 1 new senior player a year who is good enough to be more than a ProX dirt tracker.

Teams like Ulster will never win europe by relying on academies. It is pure wishful thinking. "When our academy is better we'll challenge for it". We'll be saying the same thing in 10 years time, having won nothing in the mean time. We are not big enough and there is not enough money floating about Ulster for us to compete on this front.

well you certainly wont win europe relying on leinster's academy.

Utah_Saint

awec wrote: »

Does any team do this outside of Leinster? Anywhere?

This is an insane benchmark to try and meet IMO. Ulster will be doing exceptionally well if they produce 1 new senior player a year who is good enough to be more than a ProX dirt tracker.

Teams like Ulster will never win europe by relying on academies. It is pure wishful thinking. "When our academy is better we'll challenge for it". We'll be saying the same thing in 10 years time, having won nothing in the mean time. We are not big enough and there is not enough money floating about Ulster for us to compete on this front.

We need to look at the reasons why Leinsters academy is better than everyone else. Yes, shear numbers plays a big part; you have more chances of finding talented players in a larger pool. But - the Academy structure, coaches, training methods etc is where other provinces can close the gap.

launish116

bilston wrote: »

Well unless Leinster let us sign Garry Ringrose and James Ryan I don't see what the alternative is. We will never be better than Leinster if we just continue to sign Leinster's bench players.

Sure we can add the odd NIQ player, but we can't afford more than 1 or 2 big names at any one time.

I dont see any other way than producing our own of being in top 4 or 5 in Europe.

Agree with Bilston

Until we become sustainable using the academy. We will always be just one of the other teams behind Leinster. Only so much we can do with NIQ signings. This isn’t just an Ulster issue though.

Utah_Saint

bilston wrote: »

McCann is only 20, his time will come. Allison has had a game or two from the bench and looked good with the ball. Not sure what the hold up on Rea Jnr is though. Id worry that it is passing him by a bit

Yeah thinking that about Rea Jr too. He's 23 and it been over a year since his 1 and only senior appearance.
This seems to be the recurring theme for Ulster academy forwards (particularly back-row) over the past 5 years. Make good progress in Academy/Ulster A games, Make one or two senior appearances, disappear, then join jersey reds....

Paul Smeenus

Money in private schools.

RedRaider0

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

Money in private schools.

Ulster u18 schools side are generally very competitive with leinster u18 schools.