Patrick Quirke -Guilty

up for anything

jmreire wrote: »

Hint: Google Sharia Law in Saudi Arabia, or the latest one in the news, Sultan of Brunei and Extreme version of Sharia Law..........especially the section dealing with Adultery.
,

,

Hint? Why on earth are you giving me a hint and for what?


ETA: I see. I have a pile of large stones. You seem the type that would be interested in them.

KikiLaRue

jmreire wrote: »

Kiki hereunder copy of post by Sayjid Javid:

Originally Posted by Sajid Javid View Post
Some of the points raised by the Prime Directive are valid.
Abnormal behavior in itself is not a crime but when taken in its entirety may assist in one forming a view point that maybe Mary has and never had whats called empathy this could be used as evidence in Quirkes Appeal.
In reality murder or assisting in a murder/cover up is abnormal as is shagging your best friends Husband not once not twice but loads of times without any concern for the emotional catastrophe that would eventually ensue for all concerned. Had Mary been resident in another country well
.............................................
This post was queried by " Up for anything". and I attempted to answer it.And that's what it has to do with anything. Read some of the recent posts ( last 10 or so ) and everything will become clear, OK? If you still don't understand, let me know and I will explain further what it has to do with anything, no problem.

The idea that anyone who participates in an affair has no empathy is ridiculous.

The reference to Sharia is still unfathomable. (And no, please don't bother explaining further, it's not that I don't understand your point, it's that I think it's bonkers)

jmreire

up for anything wrote: »

,

Hint? Why on earth are you giving me a hint and for what?

Sajid Javid mentioned in his post " if it happened in another Country..." and you asked what it had to do with this case. So I will tell you what Sajid meant. In Muslim Country's ( read Other Country's ) under Sharia Law,,,, Adultery is punishabe by death by stoning, the Sultan of Brunei recently hit the headlines by activating a really extreme version of this law...Adultery- Death by stoning. Theft: chopping off hands or feet, Homosexuality Male-male or Female-Female...Lashing and or prison. Under a world wide backlash, he later rowed back a bit on these laws, but refused to remove them from the state laws.
The bottom line ( literally ) in Sajids post ( the one you are querying ) is that had this happened in one of these Countrys.....the outcome would have been far different,,, for everyone. Quirke because he committed murder, ( would lose his head) and Mary because she committed adultery.

jmreire

jmreire wrote: »

Sajid Javid mentioned in his post " if it happened in another Country..." and you asked what it had to do with this case. So I will tell you what Sajid meant. In Muslim Country's ( read Other Country's ) under Sharia Law,,,, Adultery is punishabe by death by stoning, the Sultan of Brunei recently hit the headlines by activating a really extreme version of this law...Adultery- Death by stoning. Theft: chopping off hands or feet, Homosexuality Male-male or Female-Female...Lashing and or prison. Under a world wide backlash, he later rowed back a bit on these laws, but refused to remove them from the state laws.
The bottom line ( literally ) in Sajids post ( the one you are querying ) is that had this happened in one of these Countrys.....the outcome would have been far different,,, for everyone. Quirke because he committed murder, ( would lose his head) and Mary because she committed adultery.

Dafuq has this to do with the price of milk? Apart from being the obligatory AH rant against Islam, what's this getting at?

Minnie Snuggles

the_pen_turner wrote: »

When did Mary Lowry install the CCTV. Was is before or after Bobby Ryan's disappearance.

Does that show why Bobby Ryan was delayed leaving that morning

It is reported that was after - in 2012 after a series of breakins.
https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/specialreports/quirke-murder-trial-agony-aunts-underwear-hotels-and-an-affair-in-which-lines-were-crossed-921445.html

jmreire

KikiLaRue wrote: »

The idea that anyone who participates in an affair has no empathy is ridiculous.

The reference to Sharia is still unfathomable. (And no, please don't bother explaining further, it's not that I don't understand your point, it's that I think it's bonkers)

Sajid made the point, " Other Countrys" not me.

KikiLaRue

jmreire wrote: »

Sajid Javid mentioned in his post " if it happened in another Country..." and you asked what it had to do with this case. So I will tell you what Sajid meant. In Muslim Country's ( read Other Country's ) under Sharia Law,,,, Adultery is punishabe by death by stoning, the Sultan of Brunei recently hit the headlines by activating a really extreme version of this law...Adultery- Death by stoning. Theft: chopping off hands or feet, Homosexuality Male-male or Female-Female...Lashing and or prison. Under a world wide backlash, he later rowed back a bit on these laws, but refused to remove them from the state laws.
The bottom line ( literally ) in Sajids post ( the one you are querying ) is that had this happened in one of these Countrys.....the outcome would have been far different,,, for everyone. Quirke because he committed murder, ( would lose his head) and Mary because she committed adultery.

Please, please learn to punctuate better so we deciphering your ramblings is less effort. Paragraphs would be good too.

Your main point seems to be, "if we lived in a country with Sharia law, Mary Lowry would have been punished for adultery". While that is true, it is still a bizarre contribution with no relevance to this discussion.

g6fdyotp5nj2l7

the_pen_turner wrote:

Does that show why Bobby Ryan was delayed leaving that morning

Bobby Ryan parked in the farm yard because he didn't want Mary Lowrys mother in law to see his van.
I'm guessing the CCTV only covered around the house.

Amina Old-fashioned Voter

Amina Old-fashioned Voter wrote: »

Bobby Ryan parked in the farm yard because he didn't want Mary Lowrys mother in law to see his van.
I'm guessing the CCTV only covered around the house.

But it would have covered Ryan leaving the house. Anyway this is irrelevant, as another poster has pointed out that the installation of CCTV media postdated Ryan's disappearance.

jmreire

up for anything wrote: »

,

Hint? Why on earth are you giving me a hint and for what?


ETA: I see. I have a pile of large stones. You seem the type that would be interested in them.

Not in the slightest am I interested in stone's or stoning etc., but I do try to keep up up with what is happening in the world at this point in time. Google "Brunei", and you will see what I mean. You asked a question, and I attempted to answer it. With hind sight, I should have let Sajid answer it for you.

up for anything

jmreire wrote: »

Sajid Javid mentioned in his post " if it happened in another Country..." and you asked what it had to do with this case. So I will tell you what Sajid meant. In Muslim Country's ( read Other Country's ) under Sharia Law,,,, Adultery is punishabe by death by stoning, the Sultan of Brunei recently hit the headlines by activating a really extreme version of this law...Adultery- Death by stoning. Theft: chopping off hands or feet, Homosexuality Male-male or Female-Female...Lashing and or prison. Under a world wide backlash, he later rowed back a bit on these laws, but refused to remove them from the state laws.
The bottom line ( literally ) in Sajids post ( the one you are querying ) is that had this happened in one of these Countrys.....the outcome would have been far different,,, for everyone. Quirke because he committed murder, ( would lose his head) and Mary because she committed adultery.

Ah, I see the problem? I originally wrote "And she isn't resident in a different country so why should you even mention that." and you mistook rhetorical for literal despite my lack of a question mark. I didn't require an answer but, I suppose, at least I gave you fapping fantasy material.

Vicarious Function

up for anything wrote: »

From the Margaret Cash thread - https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=109239418

What happened in the last four months to cause you to do an about face on what seem to have been strongly held views in the Margaret Cash case? You are doing to Mary Lowry what the posters were doing to Margaret Cash and which you strenously objected. I smell a rat.

So you smell a rat, up for anything! Maybe you need to clean up your act. Call in the exterminators if you need to.

My post re Mary Lowry has no relationship whatsoecver to my posts in the Margaret Cash thread. Get your head straight. It's totally out of place and counter-productive that you would feel the need to quote that thread here.

up for anything wrote: »

Why even bother to ask the question? This posts sounds like someone would like to bring back the days of stocks and scarlet letters for women. Perhaps you'd like a knife to carve a big A into her forehead with your own hand? Would that satisfy a certain something in you?

What's the "certain something in you", up for anything, that makes you come out with such vile, preposterous trash?

Are you done? Do you think by now you have annihilated me? If so - then start to think - I won't say "again" - because you haven't been thinking straight in the first place. Save your energy. There's no need for you to go to such rounds resurrecting past things I've written. I stand by what I write because it comes from the heart. Instead of striking out at me, go take a look at yourself. Time better spent, IMO!

Vicarious Function

Pictured: Wife of convicted murderer Patrick Quirke seen for first time visiting husband in Mountjoy


https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/pictured-wife-of-convicted-murderer-patrick-quirke-seen-for-first-time-visiting-husband-in-mountjoy-38085427.html

Independent.ie

SouthDublin6w

The daughter seems to be pointing out the glaringly obvious herself was involved.

Vicarious Function

SouthDublin6w wrote: »

The daughter seems to be pointing out the glaringly obvious herself was involved.

Explain, please.

the.red.baron

SouthDublin6w wrote: »

The daughter seems to be pointing out the glaringly obvious herself was involved.

who is herself?

the.red.baron

the.red.baron wrote: »

who is herself?

Mary Lowry, I assume.

It's so big an accusation, it's really very unfair. I'm sure Mrs Lowry was once a suspect, but the Gardaí clearly haven't chosen to pursue that route, and it seems unfair to fling that kind of mud at her on the basis of gossip and wild speculation.

I get the feeling there is no love lost between Mrs Lowry and Bobby Ryan's daughter based on the latter's recent radio interview with Marian Finucane. But accusing someone of complicity to murder is an awful thing to do.

BarryD2

Just out of curiosity, does anyone know if there are independent witnesses or records or other evidence that verify that Bobby Ryan stayed at Fawnagowan the night before he disappeared? I seem to recall there were some text messages but that's hardly proof? Maybe someone else saw him arrive/ leave but I don't think so?

jmreire

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Dafuq has this to do with the price of milk? Apart from being the obligatory AH rant against Islam, what's this getting at?

Maybe you should read Sajid's post, and ask him what he meant by " If she lived in another Country.......and it's not an anti-islamic rant from me....it's taken from the Guardian, are they anti-islamic do you think?

the.red.baron

BarryD2 wrote: »

Just out of curiosity, does anyone know if there are independent witnesses or records or other evidence that verify that Bobby Ryan stayed at Fawnagowan the night before he disappeared? I seem to recall there were some text messages but that's hardly proof? Maybe someone else saw him arrive/ leave but I don't think so?

his phone was in the vicinity, connected to masts a few fields away from the house


good old mobile phones

up for anything

Vicarious Function wrote: »

So you smell a rat, up for anything! Maybe you need to clean up your act. Call in the exterminators if you need to.

My post re Mary Lowry has no relationship whatsoecver to my posts in the Margaret Cash thread. Get your head straight. It's totally out of place and counter-productive that you would feel the need to quote that thread here.




What's the "certain something in you", up for anything, that makes you come out with such vile, preposterous trash?

Are you done? Do you think by now you have annihilated me? If so - then start to think - I won't say "again" - because you haven't been thinking straight in the first place. Save your energy. There's no need for you to go to such rounds resurrecting past things I've written. I stand by what I write because it comes from the heart. Instead of striking out at me, go take a look at yourself. Time better spent, IMO!

Cry me a river, sweetheart. You are so very touchy about your volte-face on how people should be treated. Do explain then instead of flinging plaster saint at me why would you like to hang an innocent Mary Lawlor out to dry and have her repent à la Cersei in Game of Thrones and yet you stand up for a convicted thief like Margaret Cash?

freshpopcorn

Mod NoteThis is a discussion about Patrick Quirke murdering Bobby Ryan.
Stop bring up other threads and previous disagreements/fights!

Vicarious Function

up for anything wrote: »

Cry me a river, sweetheart. You are so very touchy about your volte-face on how people should be treated. Do explain then instead of flinging plaster saint at me why would you like to hang an innocent Mary Lawlor out to dry and have her repent à la Cersei in Game of Thrones and yet you stand up for a convicted thief like Margaret Cash?

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

jmreire

KikiLaRue wrote: »

Please, please learn to punctuate better so we deciphering your ramblings is less effort. Paragraphs would be good too.

Your main point seems to be, "if we lived in a country with Sharia law, Mary Lowry would have been punished for adultery". While that is true, it is still a bizarre contribution with no relevance to this discussion.

Kiki, any time you feel like it, just re-write it, as you feel it should have been written, OK? Waiting to see how it will look after your correction.
And again Kiki, I did not introduce it. Sajid did when he made the comment " If Mary lived in a different Country" I just commented on it. So maybe it would be better if you asked him ( Sajid ) about it's relevance, Ok? Personally, I can't see the relvance either, but obviously Sajid does, as he wrote it.

brooke 2

the_pen_turner wrote: »

When did Mary Lowry install the CCTV. Was is before or after Bobby Ryan's disappearance.

Does that show why Bobby Ryan was delayed leaving that morning

She installed the CCTV, unknown to Quirke, around Christmas 2012, which was eighteen months after Bobby Ryan's disappearance.

BarryD2

the.red.baron wrote: »

his phone was in the vicinity, connected to masts a few fields away from the house


good old mobile phones

Ah, that's verification I guess. Though you could be separated from your mobile.

Vicarious Function

BarryD2 wrote: »

Ah, that's verification I guess. Though you could be separated from your mobile.

Apparently, the mobile was never found.

the.red.baron

yeah, but combine that with the texts, the word of Mary Lowry and his body being on the farm for years after, it is safe to say he was there on the night

Vicarious Function

Vicarious Function wrote: »

Pictured: Wife of convicted murderer Patrick Quirke seen for first time visiting husband in Mountjoy

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/pictured-wife-of-convicted-murderer-patrick-quirke-seen-for-first-time-visiting-husband-in-mountjoy-38085427.html

Independent.ie

Hard to believe that she still has any time for him after all that's happened.

the.red.baron

Vicarious Function wrote: »

Apparently, the mobile was never found.

Yes but it was there on the night and morning


before it was likely destroyed

freshpopcorn

Deleted User wrote: »

Hard to believe that she still has any time for him after all that's happened.

It's very hard to know what anybody in this case are like unless we knew them.
They are loads of reasons why she could be visiting him.

the.red.baron

Deleted User wrote: »

Hard to believe that she still has any time for him after all that's happened.

It might not be a conjugal visit right?


She has kids with him, they joint own a farm and business, might be easier to stay on his good side, especially as he was out on bail

Electric Sheep

the.red.baron wrote: »

Deleted User wrote: »

Hard to believe that she still has any time for him after all that's happened.

It might not be a conjugal visit right?


She has kids with him, they joint own a farm and business, might be easier to stay on his good side, especially as he was out on bail

She needs to be very careful in case his appeal is successful. She will be in a holding pattern until that is done.

ohnonotgmail

the.red.baron wrote: »

It might not be a conjugal visit right?


She has kids with him, they joint own a farm and business, might be easier to stay on his good side, especially as he was out on bail

No conjugal visits in ireland.

the.red.baron

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

No conjugal visits in ireland.

I know


As if they were going to give him one the day after he was sentenced

Vicarious Function

I don't know if it came up before the jury, but it was mentioned a couple of times last night on the VM1 Documentary that, when asked by police during the search of the farm, Quirke was asked if there were more than two underground tanks. He said "No!", when there were actually three. That must be extremely damning.

So sad that the specialist search team were not asked to search the farm, but were sent only to the woods. They are convinced they would have found the body, had they been sent to the farm. What were the GS thinking of? The Ryan family would have been saved all of that heartbreak.

freshpopcorn

Vicarious Function wrote: »

I don't know if it came up before the jury, but it was mentioned a couple of times last night on the VM1 Documentary that, when asked by police during the search of the farm, Quirke was asked if there were more than two underground tanks. He said "No!", when there were actually three. That must be extremely damning.

So sad that the specialist search team were not asked to search the farm, but were sent only to the woods. They are convinced they would have found the body, had they been sent to the farm. What were the GS thinking of? The Ryan family would have been saved all of that heartbreak.

I don't know what the Gardai were thinking but it's hard to know. They are so many things you could say.
Bobby's sister told the Gardai that he suffered from depression in the past and in most of these cases when a person goes missing there body is generally found near where the car was parked.
It's also very easy in hindsight for them to say they'd have found the tank.

Vicarious Function

freshpopcorn wrote: »

I don't know what the Gardai were thinking but it's hard to know. They are so many things you could say.
Bobby's sister told the Gardai that he suffered from depression in the past and in most of these cases when a person goes missing there body is generally found near where the car was parked.
It's also very easy in hindsight for them to say they'd have found the tank.

I know it's easy to say, but these guys seemed very confident they woud have found all the tanks and hence the body - no problem! They are very used to that kind of thing, so it seems.

Also, they were indeed looking for a suicide. The were looking "Up and Down" in the woods, for a possible hanging?

freshpopcorn

Vicarious Function wrote: »

I know it's easy to say, but these guys seemed very confident they woud have found all the tanks and hence the body - no problem! They are very used to that kind of thing, so it seems.

Yes, I totally understand where you coming from.
It's still easier said that tough if you know what I mean.

Vicarious Function

freshpopcorn wrote: »

Yes, I totally understand where you coming from.
It's still easier said that tough if you know what I mean.

Agreed!

blackcard

freshpopcorn wrote: »

blackcard wrote: »

Did Bobby Ryan spend many nights at Mary Lowry's? Would Quirke have known he was spending that night there?

Well he was meant to have being obsessed with her but he rented the farm he'd have known easily enough if she had visitors.

I read an account in the newspapers where Bobby Ryan's daughter stated that she was with him the night before he disappeared. She stated that he was bombarded with texts from Mary Lowry and said that he had better go over to see what the story was. I think that they had a bit of a tiff a few days previously. Would Bobby Ryan have stayed at Mary Lowry's without getting these texts? Had he a pattern of which nights he stayed?
What am trying to get at is would Patrick Quirke have known Bobby was spending that night there and what time he was going to be leaving in the morning or was he just hanging around hoping to bump into him? There seemed to be a big danger that Bobby Ryan's screams would have been heard. Also as a vehicle was heard leaving within 10 minutes of Bobby Ryan leaving the house, there was very little time to hide his body. Or was there an accomplice? There are a whole pile of unanswered questions and I don't think I could say beyond a reasonable doubt what happened.

blackcard

The other curious thing is that a member of the search party for Bobby Ryan after his disappearance stated that they would have found him if they had been allowed to search the farm. Why were they not allowed?

the.red.baron

blackcard wrote: »

I read an account in the newspapers where Bobby Ryan's daughter stated that she was with him the night before he disappeared. She stated that he was bombarded with texts from Mary Lowry and said that he had better go over to see what the story was. I think that they had a bit of a tiff a few days previously. Would Bobby Ryan have stayed at Mary Lowry's without getting these texts? Had he a pattern of which nights he stayed?
What am trying to get at is would Patrick Quirke have known Bobby was spending that night there and what time he was going to be leaving in the morning or was he just hanging around hoping to bump into him? There seemed to be a big danger that Bobby Ryan's screams would have been heard. Also as a vehicle was heard leaving within 10 minutes of Bobby Ryan leaving the house, there was very little time to hide his body. Or was there an accomplice? There are a whole pile of unanswered questions and I don't think I could say beyond a reasonable doubt what happened.

All this was already covered, most have been answered


There were 2 texts, so the daughters evidence doesn't seem to be correct

There's a massive danger when you try to beat someone to death that it will go pear shaped and you could end up taking a hiding

But in this case he seems to have taken him by surprise

This is not unreasonable

All he had to do was move the body and leave, come back later to sort it, so 10 mins is not an unrealistic timeframe for this

How many murders like this involve an accomplice, not many as that it just to risky.. hey John Joe, when you've finished feeding the cattle would you be up for a bitta murder? No! You ain't going to the gardai now are you, oh you are oops

the.red.baron

blackcard wrote: »

The other curious thing is that a member of the search party for Bobby Ryan after his disappearance stated that they would have found him if they had been allowed to search the farm. Why were they not allowed?

The ruse to move the car appears to have worked in this case

I mean why would he have gone missing on the farm in the first place?

They did say they searched the farm subsequently

freshpopcorn

blackcard wrote: »

The other curious thing is that a member of the search party for Bobby Ryan after his disappearance stated that they would have found him if they had been allowed to search the farm. Why were they not allowed?

Bobby's sister told the Gardai that Bobby suffered from depression.
The Gardai found the van in the woods.
They put 2 and 2 together in the early stages of the investigation and just assumed he may have took his own life in the woods as in most of these cases.


I don't know how these search parties work. Do they need permission from the land owner/etc?

blackcard

the.red.baron wrote: »

blackcard wrote: »

The other curious thing is that a member of the search party for Bobby Ryan after his disappearance stated that they would have found him if they had been allowed to search the farm. Why were they not allowed?

The ruse to move the car appears to have worked in this case

I mean why would he have gone missing on the farm in the first place?

They did say they searched the farm subsequently

But why were they not allowed to search the farm on the day?

blackcard

freshpopcorn wrote: »

blackcard wrote: »

The other curious thing is that a member of the search party for Bobby Ryan after his disappearance stated that they would have found him if they had been allowed to search the farm. Why were they not allowed?

Bobby's sister told the Gardai that Bobby suffered from depression.
The Gardai found the van in the woods.
They put 2 and 2 together in the early stages of the investigation and just assumed he may have took his own life in the woods as in most of these cases.


I don't know how these search parties work. Do they need permission from the land owner/etc?

I would imagine that you might have to get a search warrant if you were refused access

Muahahaha

Was there ever any reports on what Quirke did after Ryans dissappearance? I presume tons of locals volunteered to search the woods with Gardai, did Quirke help in the search?

Electric Sheep

blackcard wrote: »

I read an account in the newspapers where Bobby Ryan's daughter stated that she was with him the night before he disappeared. She stated that he was bombarded with texts from Mary Lowry and said that he had better go over to see what the story was. I think that they had a bit of a tiff a few days previously. Would Bobby Ryan have stayed at Mary Lowry's without getting these texts?

As I posted earlier, the evidence presented at the trial contradicted That story. Only two texts from Mary Lowry were received by Bobby Ryan that night. No bombardment. I suspect that Michelle Ryan's dislike of Mary Lowry distorted her recollection of that night.

freshpopcorn

blackcard wrote: »

I read an account in the newspapers where Bobby Ryan's daughter stated that she was with him the night before he disappeared. She stated that he was bombarded with texts from Mary Lowry and said that he had better go over to see what the story was. I think that they had a bit of a tiff a few days previously. Would Bobby Ryan have stayed at Mary Lowry's without getting these texts? Had he a pattern of which nights he stayed?
What am trying to get at is would Patrick Quirke have known Bobby was spending that night there and what time he was going to be leaving in the morning or was he just hanging around hoping to bump into him? There seemed to be a big danger that Bobby Ryan's screams would have been heard. Also as a vehicle was heard leaving within 10 minutes of Bobby Ryan leaving the house, there was very little time to hide his body. Or was there an accomplice? There are a whole pile of unanswered questions and I don't think I could say beyond a reasonable doubt what happened.

The daughter gave the impression that Mary Lowry texted him a lot or that there was a need for him to go to her house.
I wonder what did texts say?
Did they seem important?
How often did Mary normally text him? 2 times might have being a lot for her.
Perhaps Bobby lied to his daughter. He knew that she didn't like Mary and he might have being trying to get away from her.

They are unanswered questions in my opinion but Lowry/Ryan's kid's/Quirke evidence was a little off in places.