"Non book readers" - Season 8 Episode 4 "The Last of the S" - Spoilers post 2 fo

roady rhodes

Deleted User wrote: »

The ambush was a bit ridiculous and Emilia Clark can't act for **** though. Can't see why Tyrion wasn't turned into a pin cushion.

Thought it was one of her better performances.Although she can come across a bit wooden at times.

Sonics2k

Mokuba wrote: »

What show were you watching?

With the exception of the Tarly execution, can you give me 3 other instances where Dany was clearly going crazy, and it was presented to the viewer in a negative way?

1/ I never said she was 'going crazy'. I said the obvious madness and that she's gotten darker and darker.

2/ For years and years Dany was focused on freeing the people of the 7 Kingdoms because it was the right thing to do. Now she's all about power and people bending the knee. She's willing to sacrifice 10's of thousands of people so she can get the Iron Throne. Once again, she only backs down when Tyrion talks her out of it.

3/ She murders anyone who does not stand by her, or at best dismisses them. She crucified the Masters against the advice of her council. The burning of the Tarleys, instead of making them take the black.

Take Meereen as another example. She invades, kills a load of people and when people (including the people she claimed she was freeing) attempt to speak up or fight back, she has them killed.

Hell, here's the actress herself talking about it clouding her views.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=76aJQ8q-sK0

I'm by no means saying the last 2 seasons have been as good as the first 2, but I don't think it's nearly as bad are people making it out to be. I do absolutely wish they weren't rushing to the end.

Penn

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I'd have liked one season that purely dealt with the NK and the final season episode to focus on Cersei and the iron throne.

This season does feel notably rushed compared to previous seasons, and not all for the better

I really don't see how the NK story could have been stretched out any further once they breached the Wall tbh. Once that happened, it was always going to come down to one big battle. We got two episodes fully dedicated to leading up to the battle (which people called boring and filler and complained about how long it was taking them to get to Winterfell), and one 80 minute episode of the battle itself. There was really nothing else they could do to make it even a 6 episode season.

Twenty Grand

expectationlost wrote: »

those were incredibly neat funeral pyres

Plenty of practice at this stage.

TerrorFirmer

I probably did too much talking in the E03 thread, so I'll keep my thoughts brief.

Not a great episode, but not terrible either. It didn't annoy me as much as the previous episode did, though there are certainly some consistent problems. The writing just isn't great and it's still plagued by some completely illogical behavior in favor of establishing iconic moments and shots as we hurtle towards an end that deserves - and needs - far more than just two more episodes to wrap it all up.

It irks me that they're still talking about the surviving Dothraki like we didn't see 95% of them bite the dust; they've yet to establish exactly how much are left of each specific contingent, but the war-room conversation strongly implied that the Dothraki/Unsullied/North-men grand alliance can still meet Cersei in numerical terms, if not necessarily quality.

And that's not including the fact that they specifically mentioned Dorne.

The insane pace the show's been moving at since S7 is also difficult to stomach at times as everything is surface level when it should have layers of depth. Someone got it bang on when they said that the culmination of the NK threat, and the battle for the Iron Throne, really needed to be seperate seasons to really gel with what came before it, and how much care and attention was given to so carefully, slowly, and methodically building it all up.

Even what's happening with Jon/Aegon and Dany is an arc (and it's just one example, but certainly not in isolation) that would really demand an entire season to flesh out. As it is, with such limited time constraints, at this stage characters are going to bed thinking one thing in relation to major plot points and waking up thinking another. Hard to reconcile that with the pace of S1-S6.

However, there are a few pros specific to that episode. For me a major one was a return to some even half-intelligent and relevant dialogue for Varys and Tyrion, rather than the Jay and Silent Bob routine they've been reduced to the past season or two. It had really gotten under my skin how blatantly the writers had neglected them.

Also liked Bronn's appearance, still don't buy that he would've whacked either Lannister but it wasn't quite as sloppy as I had feared, though not fully convinced on that aspect of it all the same...and, speaking of the Lannisters, interested to see how that Jaime angle specifically plays out. I presume he's returning to try and 'save' her rather than inherently just returning to her, but some of the illogical scripting in this/the previous season, you honestly can't quite tell what they're thinking.

After the dark murk of the previous episode, it was also great to get such a visually rich episode in the second half too.

So in a nutshell....a pretty OK episode, still suffering from some weak and two dimensional writing but better than the preceeding episode in that sense and there was a little intrigue at least and a few different threads starting to unravel at once. But ultimately impossible to see how they could be all concluded in even a remotely satisfying manner given we have just the length of a movie left to tie the entire show together.

And of course, good old Cersei still has that manic magic about her. She barely had to say a word in her scenes yet the sheer cold, calculating cruelty was dripping from the screen. I'm not rooting for her, but I'm not sure I want a cruel fate for her either. Perhaps a fate worse than death would be fitting.

Overall yeah, a decent episode all things considered.

The Golden Miller

Ardillaun wrote: »

Agree with the concerns above. Success can really screw with a series. It’s a Lord of the Rings with naughty bits now.

Regarding Dinklage’s decidedly strange posh English accent, like Sean Connery in so many roles (Red October comes to mind) his performance carries the day.

"It's like Lord of the Rings now"? Is that supposed to be criticism, seeing as LOTR's is often/generally regarded the greatest and most enduring fictional story ever told?

ERG89

The Golden Miller wrote:

"It's like Lord of the Rings now"? Is that supposed to be criticism, seeing as LOTR's is often/generally regarded the greatest and most enduring fictional story ever told?

I'm pretty sure George RR Martin wrote it as he wanted it to be a different from the typical medieval fantasy story. Looking at the consequences of war as much as anything.

Fromvert

Jaime is going back to kill her and he knows it's very likely a suicide mission. Like before he is not going to let King's Landing be destroyed and it's people murdered by a crazy person on a throne (there's just two of them this time). He just found out Cersei wants him and his brother murdered and she won't stop if she defeats Dany/Jon etc. Killing her saves everyone and if he can survive it he'll live too.

If he goes back to help her or save her I will be shocked and the last 8 seasons of his good guy arc was for nothing.

The Golden Miller

ERG89 wrote: »

I'm pretty sure George RR Martin wrote it as he wanted it to be a different from the typical medieval fantasy story. Looking at the consequences of war as much as anything.

Ye, but it's the way the comparison is often made dismissively about LOTR's, as if it's rubbish

Twenty Grand

The Golden Miller wrote: »

"It's like Lord of the Rings now"? Is that supposed to be criticism, seeing as LOTR's is often/generally regarded the greatest and most enduring fictional story ever told?

LoTR has plenty of it's own problems.

How Soon Is Now

Actually taught the episode spun off in few different directions there in a way to almost wipe the slate clean from last week.

Really enjoyed the vast majority of it especially the last few scenes real proper tension waiting on the first move to be played.

I'm dying to see where they go now because I can't see Danny coming out of this one way or another and surely Cersi won't either!!

Still two episodes left we could get all kinds going on yet.

Just hope it finishes with things none us except.

golfball37

How in the name of God did Bronn waltz into winterfell with a crossbow you can’t hide and find the exact room the room the 2 brothers happened to be alone in? The scene was poorly thought out and executed imo.

Twenty Grand

golfball37 wrote: »

How in the name of God did Bronn waltz into winterfell with a crossbow you can’t hide and find the exact room the room the 2 brothers happened to be alone in? The scene was poorly thought out and executed imo.

He probably said "hey, where are those two Lannisters I'm good friends with?"

Peatys

shrewdness wrote: »

Dany at the end looking like she's going to go all Mad Queen and burn Kings Landing to the ground. If she can avoid Drogon getting killed too that is.

Think a night-time fire bombing run is in order.

Tired Gardener

J. Marston wrote: »

Gilly, fúcking Gilly, gets a goodbye hug from Jon and all Ghost, who is injured and missing a fúcking ear, gets is a sad look from across the courtyard? He guarded your dead body, you ingrate!

This! That was so jarring to watch. It does show that the writers don't know how to write GoT.
That was very rushed. So Dany's forces got ambushed at sea, swarm to dragon stone... and then somehow managed to get to outside Kings Landing with the remaining Unsullied. How exactly?

Also why was Cersi there to great them, and why didn't they just open fire on the small forces?

I did laugh at the scene where the leaders in the North were at the map and mentioned that they only lost a half of their forces in the previous battle, so a way to yet again. Downplay the significance of the White Walker threat.

Feisar

IAMAMORON wrote: »

I have never seen a long running TV series end to the satisfaction of its's audience. GOT will be no different. For me I am glad it is winding up.

Don't bend your necks and kill yourselves over it, you are allowed watch it for what it is. Yes the writing has been trite since the show passed the books out. What else can they do? In fairness it does look like even GRM is having difficulty concluding all the arcs. It is a massive saga, we are only going to see a summarised version of the main plotlines.

We still don't know how it is going to end however, so everyone will be watching until then.

The most frustrating part of it all is the amount of armchair critiquing from the audience. You would swear they have cancelled holidays the way people are begrudging the conclusion. Get over yourselves, it is a television show, your allowed hate it, love it or like it. It owes you nothing.

As an avid reader of fantasy growing up and still now at 35 I'd like to make comment on the above.

I think there is a limit to how big a series can get, look at The Wheel of Time for example a 13 book mega saga, it's impossible to tie up all stories in a series like that properly/effectively. I think about six books is about the limit in terms of what is deliverable and also what a reader can consume.

As regards the pace of this season I think a season dedicated to the NK and then another season for the Iron Throne would have been good.

Feisar

Deleted User wrote: »

I'd have liked one season that purely dealt with the NK and the final season episode to focus on Cersei and the iron throne.

This season does feel notably rushed compared to previous seasons, and not all for the better

I'm after saying the same after you but hadn't seen yer comment.

Sandor Clegane

6 episodes was never going to be enough to tie up everything to a satisfactory level.

Far too much going on.

sitkaspruce

My head is fried after that episode.

Hoping its Daenerys sitting on throne in 2 weeks!

ED E

Is that shot of the bay Blackwater bay or Bravos?

TerrorFirmer

And what was with Kings Landing, it looked nothing like it, as we know it, at all and the set/CGI walls looked like absolute garbage. There was zero effort put into that scene. You have to wonder did they just blow the money elsewhere and are skimping by in other sections they deem non-critical or less likely to draw ire for being sub-standard.

titan18

TerrorFirmer wrote:

And what was with Kings Landing, it looked nothing like it, as we know it, at all and the set/CGI walls looked like absolute garbage. There was zero effort put into that scene. You have to wonder did they just blow the money elsewhere and are skimping by in other sections they deem non-critical or less likely to draw ire for being sub-standard.

They moved it's locations in the credits. I think they just don't care anymore and are just finishing it out. Only way to explain that and the Starbucks cup.

sitkaspruce

TerrorFirmer wrote: »

And what was with Kings Landing, it looked nothing like it, as we know it, at all and the set/CGI walls looked like absolute garbage. There was zero effort put into that scene. You have to wonder did they just blow the money elsewhere and are skimping by in other sections they deem non-critical or less likely to draw ire for being sub-standard.

Yeah getting the script writers to turn it into a glorified rom com rather than a fantasy adventure series

lawlolawl

TerrorFirmer wrote: »

And what was with Kings Landing, it looked nothing like it, as we know it, at all and the set/CGI walls looked like absolute garbage. There was zero effort put into that scene. You have to wonder did they just blow the money elsewhere and are skimping by in other sections they deem non-critical or less likely to draw ire for being sub-standard.

It's Mereen now.


They don't give a **** any more. The ratings have never been higher, the Funkopops are flying off the shelves and there are spin-offs in the works.


It's the Marvel movies in TV series form.

lawlolawl

https://twitter.com/antisansa/status/1125279091014426625?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1125279091014426625&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fforums.somethingawful.com%2Fshowthread.php%3Fthreadid%3D3821570%26userid%3D0%26perpage%3D40%26pagenumber%3D324

They don't care any more. This may as well be a SyFy Original now.

Mr Crispy

That was disappointing overall. Some really sloppy/lazy story-telling and set-pieces, undermining a few decent low key scenes.

Tired Gardener

We see all the named characters take it in turn to jump an actual shark to reference and hammer home just what the show has done.... this is the full 80 minutes of the last episode.

alchemist33

Is there a reason massive crossbows never caught on in naval warfare?

alchemist33

How Soon Is Now wrote: »

Actually taught the episode spun off in few different directions there in a way to almost wipe the slate clean from last week.

Really enjoyed the vast majority of it especially the last few scenes real proper tension waiting on the first move to be played.

I'm dying to see where they go now because I can't see Danny coming out of this one way or another and surely Cersi won't either!!

Still two episodes left we could get all kinds going on yet.

Just hope it finishes with things none us except.

I kinda don't care who wins, as long as the ending is worthy of what's gone before.

These last seasons have been a major disappointment. They’ve ruined the majority of the big characters.
They’ve nearly all become unlikeable for different reasons.
Lots of interesting stories built up for years and just sort of fizzling out before our eyes.

Tired Gardener

Tired Gardener wrote: »

We see all the named characters take it in turn to jump an actual shark to reference and hammer home just what the show has done.... this is the full 80 minutes of the last episode.

For example?

Tired Gardener

alchemist33 wrote: »

Is there a reason massive crossbows never caught on in naval warfare?

Not an expert, but I'd say the following make them a no go:
waves make targeting hard,
accuracy at hitting a vital part is going to be hard at those distances,
reloading those things is hard,
the bolt will lose force over a long distance.

lawlolawl

alchemist33 wrote: »

Is there a reason massive crossbows never caught on in naval warfare?

Because they would be horribly inaccurate.


You're moving, your target is moving and the wind isn't being diverted by trees/hills/whatever so it would badly effect the flight of the projectile.


/360 no-scopes a dragon through the side of a rocky outcropping


Logic doesn't matter anymore!

IAMAMORON

alchemist33 wrote: »

Is there a reason massive crossbows never caught on in naval warfare?

Medieval Budget constraints. I am not sure if Wyverns were a problem in the middle ages. Hold on just let me google that.

upupup

IAMAMORON wrote: »

Medieval Budget constraints. I am not sure if Wyverns were a problem in the middle ages. Hold on just let me google that.

Thats why we dont have dragons anymore.
We killed them all with crossbows,

lawred2

lawlolawl wrote: »

https://twitter.com/antisansa/status/1125279091014426625?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1125279091014426625&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fforums.somethingawful.com%2Fshowthread.php%3Fthreadid%3D3821570%26userid%3D0%26perpage%3D40%26pagenumber%3D324

They don't care any more. This may as well be a SyFy Original now.

Which scene had the coffee cup?

lawlolawl

lawred2 wrote: »

Which scene had the coffee cup?

Last nights episode during the celebration at Winterfell.


There's a shot of Dany sitting at a table with a Starbucks cup right in front of her.


It's understandable that it got into the final cut of the show because it's not like the showrunners were actually in that very scene themselves or anything........


https://twitter.com/ellievhall/status/1125385230091718656?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1125385230091718656&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fforums.somethingawful.com%2Fshowthread.php%3Fthreadid%3D3821570%26userid%3D0%26perpage%3D40%26pagenumber%3D324

BoJack Horseman

It's nice they get to **** around like that instead of writing better scripts!

gogo

titan18 wrote: »

They moved it's locations in the credits. I think they just don't care anymore and are just finishing it out. Only way to explain that and the Starbucks cup.

Agreed, incredibility of the storyline not bothering me as much as the crappy cgi.. the fleet looked like a bad photoshop at one point.

Also costume dept needs to take a look at themselves .. if Tyrion’s hair gets any redder, Jesus it started out blond.. basically a dirty red now.. Jamie’s too, started out blond, dirty dark brown now. Dani’s hair pieces are getting mixed up too, same scene different hair.

Joe.ie had a good theory about the dire wolfs.. they all have the same fate as their owners.. Rickon’s died been chased. Aryas was released and has gone her own way same as Arya. Rob’s was caged and killed. Suggests there may be more to Jon’s story up North. Though it was a good theory..

When I heard the writers wrote Deadpool as well that was it for me.. it's the same kind of humour that's kind of prevalent now that's ruined the show..

The success definitely went to everyone's head..

lawlolawl

gogo wrote: »

Joe.ie had a good theory about the dire wolfs.. they all have the same fate as their owners.. Rickon’s died been chased. Aryas was released and has gone her own way same as Arya. Rob’s was caged and killed. Suggests there may be more to Jon’s story up North. Though it was a good theory..

The CGI for them cost too much. That's it.

deaglan1

Ardillaun wrote: »

Varys had a very Trekkie outfit tonight.

To boldly go where no eunuch has gone before

gogo

lawred2 wrote: »

Which scene had the coffee cup?

When they are having the banter with john at the feast

gogo

lawlolawl wrote: »

The CGI for them cost too much. That's it.

I get that, GOT have confirmed that, but still liked the theory .. correct up until now, they have all had the same fate.

Augme

I can't think of a show that has taken such a spectacular nose dive in such a short space of time.

How Soon Is Now

At this stage im trying to ignore as much issues as I can. Try and enjoy as much of this as I can!

What I'll say though is I enjoyed the last episode and I'm still very interested in what's left to happen bad writing or not I just wanna try make the most of what we have left.

I still insist the show runners are thinking more about there careers and there star not burning out rather then the quality of the final product especially compared to earlier seasons.

RickBlaine

Deleted User wrote: »

When I heard the writers wrote Deadpool as well that was it for me.. it's the same kind of humour that's kind of prevalent now that's ruined the show..

The success definitely went to everyone's head..

According to the imdb, they had nothing to do with Deadpool.

lawlolawl

Augme wrote: »

I can't think of a show that has taken such a spectacular nose dive in such a short space of time.

Dexter.

titan18

RickBlaine wrote:

According to the imdb, they had nothing to do with Deadpool.

They did. Benioff was cowriter on X-Men Origins Wolverine. There's a terrible Deadpool in that.

Augme

lawlolawl wrote: »

Dexter.

Thankfully I've not seen that, but God, it must have been horrific if it's worse.