DCM 2019 - Mentored Novices Thread

ReeReeG

Wombled wrote: »

Looking for a bit of advise, I may not be able to do Dublin half this year. I really want to do a half to see how my training is going. I am looking at doing a half on the 7 th of September instead ( swooping the Lsr that week to the 21st). I am doing the FD 10 mile as well. Do you think those 2 races will too close together as they are two weeks apart ?. So many decisions and juggling to be made. .

If you were planning on racing both, then yeah too close together in my opinion. You could still do the FD 10 as a long run, or part of one and race the HM then. I think there is more value in racing a HM than a 10 mile to give an idea of endurance and realistic targets.

Wombled

ReeReeG wrote: »

Wombled wrote: »

Looking for a bit of advise, I may not be able to do Dublin half this year. I really want to do a half to see how my training is going. I am looking at doing a half on the 7 th of September instead ( swooping the Lsr that week to the 21st). I am doing the FD 10 mile as well. Do you think those 2 races will too close together as they are two weeks apart ?. So many decisions and juggling to be made. .

If you were planning on racing both, then yeah too close together in my opinion. You could still do the FD 10 as a long run, or part of one and race the HM then. I think there is more value in racing a HM than a 10 mile to give an idea of endurance and realistic targets.

. Thanks ReeRee, ya thats make sense. I am sure its still okay to swop the weeks around as well?

DeepBlue

Have a similar query to Wombled.

I've entered a 10 miler and HM which are a week out of sync with the boards plan. I figured I could just swap the weeks around. However the 10miler is a week later than boards and the HM is a week earlier.

So the boards plan looks like this with a 3 week gap between races:



but after swapping around it now looks like this with just a one week gap:



So can I plough ahead with this or does it throw the plan too far out of whack?

Huzzah!

DeepBlue wrote: »

Have a similar query to Wombled.

I've entered a 10 miler and HM which are a week out of sync with the boards plan. I figured I could just swap the weeks around. However the 10miler is a week later than boards and the HM is a week earlier.

So the boards plan looks like this with a 3 week gap between races:



but after swapping around it now looks like this with just a one week gap:



So can I plough ahead with this or does it throw the plan too far out of whack?

That looks tough, imho. You will be doing: 19m, race, 20miles, race. It also means you'll be doing your 9 mile pace run a couple of days after the half.

kyomi

Treviso wrote: »

I can totally understand this and its why the mentors here keep going on about easy miles being easy. Are you still following the same plan as before without as many midweek sessions? What was your easy pace today?

I had a tough MP long run at the weekend which had my legs feeling tired too. With a stepback week this week, I'm glad of the recovery & easy miles this week - gives my legs a time to recover. I see that you're also on a stepback week so you should hopefully do the same.

Huzzah! wrote:

This is very normal and I think you're ramping up a bit more quickly because you're taking a step back for holidays? I know you're training by HR but don't be afraid to back the pace off even more if required. Also, let's not underestimate how much of an impact the humidity is having on effort levels. I'm just coming back from a lay off but I still think it's tougher than it would ordinarily be.

Thanks for the reassurance Treviso and Huzzah! Still following the same plan as before, without the midweek sessions, but I did swap the weeks around a bit to accommodate the holiday so my step back will be next week. My easy run pace both days would have been around 10:30 min/miles.

I did 5 easy miles this morning and felt much better, more or less back to normal. It's amazing how your body can recover even while you keep running, as long as the runs are at an easy enough pace.

frash wrote:

Another question:
Would I be mad to do a 5 mile race on August 11th?
Have just realised a great local race will be on in West Cork when I'm down there. It's a 5 miler from Goleen to Crookhaven.

Sunday Runner - you might be tempted

That race is in my plan! I do it every year as I go there on holidays around that time. At the moment I'm torn between racing it - I didn't do the 10K last weekend so this would be a sort of substitute - and doing it as part of an easy-paced long run. It's a great race and the problem with the long run option is that I wouldn't get to avail of the lovely spread at the end!

frash

kyomi wrote: »

That race is in my plan! I do it every year as I go there on holidays around that time. At the moment I'm torn between racing it - I didn't do the 10K last weekend so this would be a sort of substitute - and doing it as part of an easy-paced long run. It's a great race and the problem with the long run option is that I wouldn't get to avail of the lovely spread at the end!

If making it a long run then you'd have to go for a run before it really (easily possible with the 11am start) as there's no way you could miss that spread in Crookhaven

Mr. Guappa

Huzzah! wrote: »

That looks tough, imho. You will be doing: 19m, race, 20miles, race. It also means you'll be doing your 9 mile pace run a couple of days after the half.

I agree with Huzzah! on this one. I'd drop the 10 miler.

Mr. Guappa

frash wrote: »

I didn't do the Clondalkin 10km race last weekend and instead did a LSR of 11.5 miles.

Next week on the HHN1 plan it's a 10 mile LSR but I might push that to 12.

The following weekend it's a 7 mile LSR but I'm running the Dun Laoghaire 10km on the Monday so I might just do 3 or 4 miles that Saturday.
Does the above make sense?

Another question:
Would I be mad to do a 5 mile race on August 11th?
Have just realised a great local race will be on in West Cork when I'm down there. It's a 5 miler from Goleen to Crookhaven.

Sunday Runner - you might be tempted

Race either the 10k or the 5 miler - do not race both.

Yes, it does make sense to cut the 7 mile LSR back a touch if you do race the 10k on the Monday - do a mile or so gentle warm-up and cool down before and after the race.

Treviso

Hey everyone, i decided to start a training log of my own to track my progress over the course of my DCM training.

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2058000112

Feel free to follow and contribute if you're interested.

Mr. Guappa

Treviso wrote: »

Hey everyone, i decided to start a training log of my own to track my progress over the course of my DCM training.

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2058000112

Feel free to follow and contribute if you're interested.

Great to see another of you taking the plunge over in logs!

py

What are the thoughts on adding some elevation in to the LSR? Not for reps, purely to get some elevation in to the legs.

Mr. Guappa

py wrote: »

What are the thoughts on adding some elevation in to the LSR? Not for reps, purely to get some elevation in to the legs.

Dublin isn't a particularly hilly marathon, so there's no great requirement to be going out of your way to incorporate lots of hills into your training routes. That said, it's no harm to have a bit of exposure to some undulating terrain from time-to-time - although you won't run too far in this country without encountering an incline of some description! You don't need to be running up mountains, but a route with the odd drag here and there will do nicely. As always, everything in moderation.

Mr. Guappa

Prospector1989 wrote: »

Got back from the honeymoon yesterday. Completed exactly 0 miles in over 3 weeks. Ate and drank terribly for 3 weeks and loved every minute of it!

Before I went to bed last night made the decision to lay out my running gear for a run this morning before work. 4 miles. Was a tough, tough run but glad to get back to it straight away.

Any regrets? None!

Textbook marathon training right there :pac:

Glad to see that you enjoyed the honeymoon anyway.

Take it easy getting back into the training too - don't jump straight into the plan, ease back into it over the course of a week.

Prospector1989

Mr. Guappa wrote: »

Textbook marathon training right there :pac:

Glad to see that you enjoyed the honeymoon anyway.

Take it easy getting back into the training too - don't jump straight into the plan, ease back into it over the course of a week.

That's what I'm thinking. Did the plan for yesterday and 3 miles recovery this morning (and feeling much better after it) but won't be doing the 15 mile LSR tomorrow.

Unsure what to do yet though.

Huzzah!

Prospector1989 wrote: »

That's what I'm thinking. Did the plan for yesterday and 3 miles recovery this morning (and feeling much better after it) but won't be doing the 15 mile LSR tomorrow.

Unsure what to do yet though.

Hi there, would you consider at this point following HHN1? If you do that, you could swap this week's and next week's LSR, so you'll be doing a 7 mile LSR this week and 10 miles next week? I feel at this point trying to jump into the Boards plan is a big ask.

Prospector1989

Huzzah! wrote: »

Hi there, would you consider at this point following HHN1? If you do that, you could swap this week's and next week's LSR, so you'll be doing a 7 mile LSR this week and 10 miles next week? I feel at this point trying to jump into the Boards plan is a big ask.

Might look in to doing that actually yeah. with swapping the 7 and the 10 miles I could probably settle straight into it. Will have a think about that throughout the day.

Cheers!

pd79

Huzzah! wrote: »

Hi there, would you consider at this point following HHN1? If you do that, you could swap this week's and next week's LSR, so you'll be doing a 7 mile LSR this week and 10 miles next week? I feel at this point trying to jump into the Boards plan is a big ask.

Is HHN1 LSR this week not 10 miles ? And 7 week after?

Prospector1989

pd79 wrote: »

Is HHN1 LSR this week not 10 miles ? And 7 week after?

On the plan it is but Huzzah! is saying I should swap those as I'm only back from a 3 week break.

Huzzah!

pd79 wrote: »

Is HHN1 LSR this week not 10 miles ? And 7 week after?

Prospector1989 wrote: »

On the plan it is but Huzzah! is saying I should swap those as I'm only back from a 3 week break.

Correct.

DeepBlue

Huzzah! wrote: »

That looks tough, imho. You will be doing: 19m, race, 20miles, race. It also means you'll be doing your 9 mile pace run a couple of days after the half.

Mr. Guappa wrote: »

I agree with Huzzah! on this one. I'd drop the 10 miler.

Ah bummer, I was looking forward to it. I guess just add more miles to it and make it part of an LSR.

pd79

Ah I get you, thought I'd read it wrong ! Thank you

Doc76

Gel/zero tab question ahead of tomorrow’s 10 mile LSR... it’ll be the first time in a long time I’ve used gels (and the first time ever using High5 aqua gels!) so wondering when I should take one? After 5 miles or after the first hour? And do you recommend 1/2 or a whole tab in my water bottle or not even bother with the tabs at this stage and carry regular water? I’ve never used those before either.

I’d say it’ll take me about 2 hours for the run if I keep the pace slow (which I promise I’ll do!) so would love to know what works for you guys. I should mention I usually don’t run on very much fuel since I run early (will try a banana beforehand) and last half marathon I did I just ran with water (and a sip of lucozade at one of the stations) so I don’t want to overdo it with gels either at this stage. Thanks!

Djoucer

Simple answer is if you didn’t need gels or tabs until now, you don’t need them for a 10 miler.

Big mistake I see every year in novice thread is people messing around with tabs and gels. Last year, people got sucked into using tailwind and wondering how to use sachets during race.

Should only be using gels in training to make sure they’re ok on the stomach.

Doc76

Djoucer wrote: »

Simple answer is if you didn’t need gels or tabs until now, you don’t need them for a 10 miler.

Big mistake I see every year in novice thread is people messing around with tabs and gels. Last year, people got sucked into using tailwind and wondering how to use sachets during race.

Should only be using gels in training to make sure they’re ok on the stomach.

I definitely don’t think I’ll be messing with sachets of tailwind during the marathon but I thought since I’d be out for 2 hours maybe try a gel to see how I stomach it so it isn’t new as the LSRs get longer?

Huzzah!

Doc76 wrote: »

Gel/zero tab question ahead of tomorrow’s 10 mile LSR... it’ll be the first time in a long time I’ve used gels (and the first time ever using High5 aqua gels!) so wondering when I should take one? After 5 miles or after the first hour? And do you recommend 1/2 or a whole tab in my water bottle or not even bother with the tabs at this stage and carry regular water? I’ve never used those before either.

I’d say it’ll take me about 2 hours for the run if I keep the pace slow (which I promise I’ll do!) so would love to know what works for you guys. I should mention I usually don’t run on very much fuel since I run early (will try a banana beforehand) and last half marathon I did I just ran with water (and a sip of lucozade at one of the stations) so I don’t want to overdo it with gels either at this stage. Thanks!

I'd be quite keen for you to start practicing your breakfast. Whatever you plan on eating the morning of the marathon, start practicing now.

Doc76 wrote: »

I definitely don’t think I’ll be messing with sachets of tailwind during the marathon but I thought since I’d be out for 2 hours maybe try a gel to see how I stomach it so it isn’t new as the LSRs get longer?

Yep and it won't do any harm to try gels out and see how you get on. This article suggests between 45minutes to an hour:

https://runnersconnect.net/coach-corner/energy-gels-for-runners/

The article also includes a link to suggested breakfasts.

Doc76

Huzzah! wrote: »

I'd be quite keen for you to start practicing your breakfast. Whatever you plan on eating the morning of the marathon, start practicing now.



Yep and it won't do any harm to try gels out and see how you get on. This article suggests between 45minutes to an hour:

https://runnersconnect.net/coach-corner/energy-gels-for-runners/

The article also includes a link to suggested breakfasts.

Thanks Huzzah! Will report back and work on the breakfast

Mr. Guappa

DeepBlue wrote: »

Ah bummer, I was looking forward to it. I guess just add more miles to it and make it part of an LSR.

That's a good plan. Was it the John Buckley 10 miler? That's one I'd like to do eventually myself but it hasn't fitted in with my marathon preparation this year or last.

Bananaleaf

Should we not be taking gels for LSRs unless we are testing them? For the 15mile tomorrow, should we be doing that without gels? And if so are we supposed to do it without any snacks and just with some water?

I've been taking gels with me on long runs for the past while. Do I need to stop that? No problem if so, just want to check

Mr. Guappa

Bananaleaf wrote: »

Should we not be taking gels for LSRs unless we are testing them? For the 15mile tomorrow, should we be doing that without gels? And if so are we supposed to do it without any snacks and just with some water?

I've been taking gels with me on long runs for the past while. Do I need to stop that? No problem if so, just want to check

I agree with Huzzah! on this one... these long runs should be used to practice your race day routine. So everything from your meal the night before, breakfast that morning, clothing, shoes and fuelling should be practiced. By the time the race comes around you should have everything well practiced.

Tomorrows run is going to be the longest many of you have ever run, and will take yourself approx 3 hours.
I'd definitely be taking a couple of gels to help provide enough energy to complete the 15 miles. Additionally, your body needs to learn to tap into the additional fuel source provided by the gel, and just become accustomed to processing them.

Bananaleaf

Mr. Guappa wrote: »

I agree with Huzzah! on this one... these long runs should be used to practice your race day routine. So everything from your meal the night before, breakfast that morning, clothing, shoes and fuelling should be practiced. By the time the race comes around you should have everything well practiced.

Tomorrows run is going to be the longest many of you have ever run, and will take yourself approx 3 hours.
I'd definitely be taking a couple of gels to help provide enough energy to complete the 15 miles. Additionally, your body needs to learn to tap into the additional fuel source provided by the gel, and just become accustomed to processing them.

Thank you Mr Guappa. I will continue to take gels with me in that case. I have been trying out race clothes too. I will work on the breakfasts - I am going to try my breakfast out tomorrow.

On a more general note, I'm so happy I joined this thread. I can't believe that by the end of this week I will have done over 50km and a 15m run, but more incredible is how manageable it all seems so far. Thanks so much mentors