Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread XI (The Finals Countdown)

Dwarf.Shortage

Dwarf.Shortage wrote: »

EVERYONE IS OUT TO GET YOU

sydthebeat

sydthebeat wrote: »

Jimmy o brien can fill in

What can this guy not do?

Hype710

Doesn’t look like Hawkshaw is too highly rated not to be at least included amongst the replacements which is unfortunate. Was pictured training during the week.

bayern

Hype710 wrote: »

Doesn’t look like Hawkshaw is too highly rated not to be at least included amongst the replacements which is unfortunate. Was pictured training during the week.

His performance at 10 against munster a left a bit to be desired.

Unsurprising given how little he has played there in the past 2 years.

foxyladyxx

Hype710 wrote: »

Doesn’t look like Hawkshaw is too highly rated not to be at least included amongst the replacements which is unfortunate. Was pictured training during the week.

Apparently Turner is rated more highly because of his reading of the game and his leadership qualities. To be honest I don't see that myself. Perhaps it is something seen in training.

He is tipped to be another Ringrose. I know he is 100% committed and Leo rates
him but to me he is too small. If he was taller he might stand out more. JMO

Dubinusa

I would guess that this is the most stretched Leinster have been in years for player availability.
I love seeing young lads capped. But. I wonder if covid is disrupting the squad. At least to the point that 1st year academy lads are the only option.
As far as Hawkshaw goes, I think he could be a really good player, I may be wrong, but he looked the full package at u20 level.
However, this teamsheet for tomorrow is probably one that nobody envisioned. Sexton included is something I didn't expect.
I hope next week te side has more of a full strength look to it.

Clegg

We've gone with the 6/2 split an awful lot since rugby returned. Suppose we've an abundance of very talented forwards so may as well use them. The injury troubles in the backs makes that decision easier too.

Glad to see Conan back as well. He has his work cut out for him to regain a starting place in Leinsters strongest 15. We played Doris and he in the same backrow for a while but things have changed during his absence. Doris is now Ireland's first choice number 8 and Ruddock is tearing up trees at blindside.

typhoony

not surprised to see Andrew Smith get a chance this early, he was the one i took the most notice of during the Ireland u20's games, crucially he has the ability to create time and space.

foxyladyxx

Dubinusa wrote: »

I would guess that this is the most stretched Leinster have been in years for player availability.
I love seeing young lads capped. But. I wonder if covid is disrupting the squad. At least to the point that 1st year academy lads are the only option.
As far as Hawkshaw goes, I think he could be a really good player, I may be wrong, but he looked the full package at u20 level.
However, this teamsheet for tomorrow is probably one that nobody envisioned. Sexton included is something I didn't expect.
I hope next week te side has more of a full strength look to it.

I was worried when I saw the teamsheet. Connacht are a good side. This is a tough ask of these young guys. . I hope they can rise to the challenge.

I am also in favour of bringing in the new talent but this........

arsebiscuits1

foxyladyxx wrote: »

Apparently Turner is rated more highly because of his reading of the game and his leadership qualities. To be honest I don't see that myself. Perhaps it is something seen in training.

He is tipped to be another Ringrose. I know he is 100% committed and Leo rates
him but to me he is too small. If he was taller he might stand out more. JMO

Who has tipped him to be another ringrose?

bayern

typhoony wrote: »

not surprised to see Andrew Smith get a chance this early, he was the one i took the most notice of during the Ireland u20's games, crucially he has the ability to create time and space.

he was poor against Munster A.

bayern

foxyladyxx wrote: »

Apparently Turner is rated more highly because of his reading of the game and his leadership qualities. To be honest I don't see that myself. Perhaps it is something seen in training.

He is tipped to be another Ringrose. I know he is 100% committed and Leo rates
him but to me he is too small. If he was taller he might stand out more. JMO

Turner has never been that highly rated.

FrannoFan

bayern wrote: »

Turner has never been that highly rated.

He's a good tidy player but at 5'8 hard to see how survives in the midfield

Stout Warrior

foxyladyxx wrote: »

Apparently Turner is rated more highly because of his reading of the game and his leadership qualities. To be honest I don't see that myself. Perhaps it is something seen in training.

He is tipped to be another Ringrose. I know he is 100% committed and Leo rates
him but to me he is too small. If he was taller he might stand out more. JMO

I don’t think he should be written off for his height. He is stocky and well built and has good explosiveness. What height was Gordon Darcy or Jason Robinson or even Cheslin Kolbe. They all prosper in a game dominated by bigger men.

How tall is Hawkshaw? Cant be much taller than Turner. Are people writing him off?

FrannoFan

Stout Warrior wrote: »

I don’t think he should be written off for his height. He is stocky and well built and has good explosiveness. What height was Gordon Darcy or Jason Robinson or even Cheslin Kolbe. They all prosper in a game dominated by bigger men.

How tall is Hawkshaw? Cant be much taller than Turner. Are people writing him off?

Two of your examples have retired so from a different era

Darcy around 5'10 and the other two are back three players

Not many pro midfielders 5'8
Hawkshaw seems to be more a 10 and he's around 5'11

Not writing him off for his height but he would be an outlier for his position at that size. Rugby more than ever a collision sport.

bayern

Stout Warrior wrote: »

I don’t think he should be written off for his height. He is stocky and well built and has good explosiveness. What height was Gordon Darcy or Jason Robinson or even Cheslin Kolbe. They all prosper in a game dominated by bigger men.

How tall is Hawkshaw? Cant be much taller than Turner. Are people writing him off?

Turner not as quick/explosive or frankly as good at rugby as any of the players you listed.

arsebiscuits1

While I'm not sold on turner being the answer I think his height could be a benefit to him.

In the way the high tackle laws are now i can see him getting a lot of change from his carries as opponents have to stoop that much lower to actually get a hold of him.

He's a technically proficient player with a sound tackle technique. He's also incredibly strong and stocky.

It's far too easy to just say "oh he's too small" but he's heavy for his height, has a low center of gravity, is well capable in a footrace and has a good all around skill set. He can use all of these to make a point of difference and actually excel in contact.

But let's caveat this by saying I'd still like to get a proper look at him

Stout Warrior

FrannoFan wrote: »

Two of your examples have retired so from a different era

Darcy around 5'10 and the other two are back three players

Not many pro midfielders 5'8
Hawkshaw seems to be more a 10 and he's around 5'11

Not writing him off for his height but he would be an outlier for his position at that size. Rugby more than ever a collision sport.

All that said I haven’t seen him be dominated physically in his showings so far for Leinster in fact I have seen him dominate the contact when he has played. Albeit against not so great teams. I take your point about midfielders needing to be a minimum height in the professional game but there are examples of smaller men being able to thrive in the modern game at the highest levels.

Clegg

Ulster are really revving up now. They're a better side this season than last. Leinster under a lot of pressure now to win their interpros against Conn and Munster. With there being no playoffs this season, the Ulster game looks like the pool decider.

bayern

Clarkson and Josh Murphy out for leinster.

Hawkshaw and Greg Mcgrath on bench.

Clegg

That first half was probably the worst 40 minutes of rugby I've seen from Leinster against a side that isn't Saracens. Obviously the backline was a mess once Sexton went off, but the forwards were a bigger problem.

I'm more encouraged by the second half performance. Much greater intensity from the pack, but accuracy remained a problem. Ryan Baird is a special talent and Leavy put in another good display.

We've a problem now that all our senior 10's are injured. Our depth across many positions is a tremendous advantage, bit it's useless when none are available

Are the Byrnes injured or could it be something else that keeps people out of games during a global pandemic?

lawrencesummers

Hawkshaw looks a decent rugby player. Very much a utility type player, he has the strength and directness of a 12, the pace of a winger and the kicking game of a 10.

But in a bad way he looks a jack of all trades and a master of none. Be interesting to see how he plays 80 minutes in his preferred position at this level.

Clegg

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Are the Byrnes injured or could it be something else that keeps people out of games during a global pandemic?

Wouldn't want to speculate on that. Harry Byrne was definitely injured as of a few weeks ago however.

lawrencesummers

Deleted User wrote: »

Are the Byrnes injured or could it be something else that keeps people out of games during a global pandemic?

Is it reading to much into it to think that’s why both are missing and sexton started?

If it is hopefully it’s precautionary not necessary.

Uriel.

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Is it reading to much into it to think that’s why both are missing and sexton started?

If it is hopefully it’s precautionary not necessary.

I'd say we should be avoiding speculating on a person's personal health

Clegg

Hard to speculate next week's team. Lots of absentees currently. Backline will hopefully be a lot stronger.

arsebiscuits1

Disappointed after that.

But can't really say I'm surprised. We faced a lot of disruption in the week leading up to the game, disruption in the warm up and then disruption in the game itself.

Full credit to Connacht who were borderline demonic in their determination to win this game. They can take a lot from it.

I think we responded to each set back about as well as we could have in the extremely trying circumstances.

Conor Morris made reference to the face that Leinster could say that missing the players affected it but it's the same for all the provinces. This is quite wide of the mark though. No province has had the disruptions that Leinster had.

Even assuming we played none of our internationals, we could have expected to play Harry Byrne, Ciaran Frawley, Tommy O'Brien, Conor O'Brien, Adam Byrne if we had a full deck to choose from. That's essentially an entire backline who are the go to men when the internationals are away.

Playing our 6th choice 10 for a chunk of that game who wasn't due to be in until the last minute will have an effect. This 6th choice 10 had to replace our (apparently) 5th choice 10 who initially had to fill in 13 due to player shortage there as they are normally a fullback. Something has gotta give.

Shout out to Greg McGrath. 2 solid scrums in a game he wasn't supposed to play in. Great story for him and the AIL pathway. Would like to see him get a few more chances.

The pack by and large were quite good. Leavy, Baird and Penny were all good. As were Dooley and Bent. Strong stubborn carrying and tackling. Far from their best outing of the season.

Backline was unfortunately a total **** show. Luke was head and shoulders the pick of the litter and he didn't even play that well.

Back 3 were just flat out bad. Completely at sea with their positioning and Carty made them pay. O'Reilly didn't kick from hand once. He's a fullback. Disappointing debut from him. Smith also showed inexperience with his positioning at times too.

Kearney was the senior man in that backline. In the circumstances he should be standing up and taking ball on. I feel he was just too quiet. I can't help but feel that someone like James Lowe would have really taken a lot on if he were in Dave's place

Onwards and upwards anyway. They will definitely learn from this and hopefully harness the disappointing into a positive performance against Ulster next week which is looking like the biggest game of the season.

molloyjh

When you look at who we were missing before the game its completely understandable...

Healy
Kelleher
Furlong, Porter, Abdaladze, Clarkson
Fardy, Ryan
Ruddock, Doris, VDF, Murphy, Deegan

JGP
Ross Byrne, Harry Byrne
Henshaw, Frawley, COB
Ringrose, TOB
Lowe, Larmour, Keenan, Kelleher, Adam Byrne, Silvester

And then to lose Penny, Sexton, ROL and JOB during the game. Thats over 30 players in total. Sure we have depth, but thats almost a full senior squad of players. No club has that much depth. Hopefully we get a couple of injured players back as well as a bunch of internationals. But we've already seen the disruption bringing the latter in has caused. We need them to be on the ball next week.

lawrencesummers

Uriel. wrote: »

I'd say we should be avoiding speculating on a person's personal health

Who is speculating? I certainly wasn’t.