Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread XI (The Finals Countdown)

bayern

Podge_irl wrote: »

Someone too slow to attack the line from 10 is not going to be a serviceable 13.

Tell that to Ulster.

irishbucsfan

Podge_irl wrote: »

Someone too slow to attack the line from 10 is not going to be a serviceable 13.

I don't think he's quick, but I absolutely don't think for a second he's 'too slow to attack the line at 10' either

Did you see the game he played at 13? Was definitely focusing on being a second playmaker and not trying to make breaks on the outside anyway.

Podge_irl

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I don't think he's quick, but I absolutely don't think for a second he's 'too slow to attack the line at 10' either

Did you see the game he played at 13? Was definitely focusing on being a second playmaker and not trying to make breaks on the outside anyway.

Fair enough on the former, I think he is. He is trying more, so fair play to him, but he doesn't have the athletic ability for it.

I did see it, though like most Leinster Pro12/14 games it doesn't sit very well in my memory. I think having a second playmaker in the backline is great, but I don't have much interest in a 13 who can't make outside (or any) breaks.

irishbucsfan

Podge_irl wrote: »

Fair enough on the former, I think he is. He is trying more, so fair play to him, but he doesn't have the athletic ability for it.

I did see it, though like most Leinster Pro12/14 games it doesn't sit very well in my memory. I think having a second playmaker in the backline is great, but I don't have much interest in a 13 who can't make outside (or any) breaks.

I think his pace isn't the problem, its the fact he stands so deep and his timing/reading often leaves him almost static taking the ball from the 9. Dan Biggar is hardly quicker, he's a top class 10 at his best.

I don't really care who is wearing which jersey so long as the back line has the ability to break the line as a group. Midfielders extremely rarely play in the full stack backline on any phases. If your back 3 are all athletic and your 13 is someone who can then put them through you're losing very little in comparison to a situation where your 15 was playing the same role. 15s who have that skillset are pretty rare at the moment in Ireland, meaning we really need more midfielders who have it to balance it.

The most important thing by far is that the 13 can defend their space. No idea if he can do that, and I'd say it'd be very rare we see him in the 13 jersey, but he seems someone who could definitely become a useful option at 12 for a while if his brother ousts him at 10. Pace is far less important at 12, lets not forget Brad Barritt had a pretty useful international career.

Richie_Rich89

arsebiscuits1 wrote: »

Who said Murphy should have played at openside over Penny? I think you're having a bit of selective memory there Rich. Penny was obviously prodigious and came with a lot of hype and excitement around him and most everyone was excited to get a look at him.

Most people - myself included - would like to see Murphy at 8 given that was a more problematic position for us prior to Conan getting released by Ireland.

I think it would be excellent for SOB to get his first start but at this point it's an unknown quantity whether or not the coaches think he's ready. If they select him, he's ready.

Also, with full respect to Dragons etc. for me the minimum standard a Leinster academy player should be at any stage of their academy tenure is being ready to play against Dragons, Zebre, Benetton etc.

If a player isn't ready for that, their time with Leinster is quite limited

I remember people suggesting Murphy at openside because I commented on it at the time.

On this page three weeks before Penny debuted: https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=108481267

and here before the game he debuted in: https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057895346&page=254

In the posts leading up to my comments there are people suggesting Murphy be picked at 7.

arsebiscuits1

Podge_irl wrote: »

Fair enough on the former, I think he is. He is trying more, so fair play to him, but he doesn't have the athletic ability for it.

I did see it, though like most Leinster Pro12/14 games it doesn't sit very well in my memory. I think having a second playmaker in the backline is great, but I don't have much interest in a 13 who can't make outside (or any) breaks.

Forms an opinion...

Admits this is not an informed opinion...

Also. Ross did make a break at 13 against Ulster.

Podge_irl

arsebiscuits1 wrote: »

Forms an opinion...

Admits this is not an informed opinion...

Also. Ross did make a break at 13 against Ulster.

I've seen Ross Byrne play dozens of times...

arsebiscuits1

Richie_Rich89 wrote: »

I remember people suggesting Murphy at openside because I commented on it at the time.

On this page three weeks before Penny debuted: https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=108481267

and here before the game he debuted in: https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057895346&page=254

In the posts leading up to my comments there are people suggesting Murphy be picked at 7.

Wow. You actually went back and checked. Fair play.

Looking at those posts it appears about 3 posters suggested Murphy at 7? Hardly a need for a rousing call for everyone to ask him be picked over Penny lol

arsebiscuits1

Podge_irl wrote: »

I've seen Ross Byrne play dozens of times...

Congratulations?

aloooof

arsebiscuits1 wrote: »

Congratulations?

Ah c'mon.... you don't have to have one game burnt into your memory to form an opinion on a player.

arsebiscuits1

aloooof wrote: »

Ah c'mon.... you don't have to have one game burnt into your memory to form an opinion on a player.

Haha.

Certain threads in this place would be much more bearable if people adhered to that logic

irishbucsfan

aloooof wrote: »

Ah c'mon.... you don't have to have one game burnt into your memory to form an opinion on a player.

That is definitely true. But at the same time if you’re going to talk about a players ability to play a position, it’s help to specifically remember the only game where they played that position!

aloooof

irishbucsfan wrote: »

That is definitely true. But at the same time if you’re going to talk about a players ability to play a position, it’s help to specifically remember the only game where they played that position!

I think that's fair enough. But we don't need to solely base his potential at 13 to that 1 game either.

Must love hardship

Does anyone know if Frawley is out of contract this year?
Read somewhere of Luke Fitz championing him to go to France.

Looks like he was promoted to senior squad along with keenan kelleher the 2 o'Briens and Scott penny for the 19-20 season. Would all those contracts be 2 or 3 year contracts?

bayern

Must love hardship wrote: »

Does anyone know if Frawley is out of contract this year?
Read somewhere of Luke Fitz championing him to go to France.

Looks like he was promoted to senior squad along with keenan kelleher the 2 o'Briens and Scott penny for the 19-20 season. Would all those contracts be 2 or 3 year contracts?

He is out of contract. He looks to be staying with Leinster despite Luke Fitz's instance he has to leave leinster to reach potential.

2 year deals most likely, 3 year deals out of academy very rare.

molloyjh

arsebiscuits1 wrote: »

Wow. You actually went back and checked. Fair play.

Looking at those posts it appears about 3 posters suggested Murphy at 7? Hardly a need for a rousing call for everyone to ask him be picked over Penny lol

That 1 of those posts was before Penny made his debut says it all really. It is likely that the poster had never seen Penny play so couldn't possibly comment on his ability to start a game. Not suggesting that a guy you've never seen before should start is hardly outlandish.

Also, I suggested Murphy at 7 because I didn't know if Penny was going to be fit. Given the update earlier in the week it sounded like it may have been the classic "week too soon".

There really is nothing at all to see here. Storm in a very small teacup.

Squidgy Black

molloyjh wrote: »

That 1 of those posts was before Penny made his debut says it all really. It is likely that the poster had never seen Penny play so couldn't possibly comment on his ability to start a game. Not suggesting that a guy you've never seen before should start is hardly outlandish.

Also, I suggested Murphy at 7 because I didn't know if Penny was going to be fit. Given the update earlier in the week it sounded like it may have been the classic "week too soon".

There really is nothing at all to see here. Storm in a very small teacup.

The funny thing is, on the one he shows where I said maybe Murphy would start at 7, Penny didn't even make the bench despite travelling to SA.

bayern

Penny was 19 and just out of school too.. thinking he may not be ready to play pro rugby was hardly controversial

Clegg

Bent has pulled out of the squad for personal reasons. Tom Clarkson moves from the bench to the starting team. Greg McGrath moves up to the bench.

https://twitter.com/leinsterrugby/status/1362801620048838659?s=09

arsebiscuits1

Clegg wrote: »

Bent has pulled out of the squad for personal reasons. Tom Clarkson moves from the bench to the starting team. Greg McGrath moves up to the bench.

https://twitter.com/leinsterrugby/status/1362801620048838659?s=09

"Personal reasons" is never a comforting thing to read.

Hope all is ok Benty!!

molloyjh

I'm a little worried about next week. If Ross needed a HIA and isn't available as backup for Ireland then Harry will likely be called up. That leaves us with Hawkshaw as the only fit 10. Fardy could be missing too. I wouldn't be surprised to see Conan called up as back up either. We could be absolute bare bones.

Squidgy Black

molloyjh wrote: »

I'm a little worried about next week. If Ross needed a HIA and isn't available as backup for Ireland then Harry will likely be called up. That leaves us with Hawkshaw as the only fit 10. Fardy could be missing too. I wouldn't be surprised to see Conan called up as back up either. We could be absolute bare bones.

Hopefully Frawley should be back fit next week, was said to be a 'minor' shoulder injury, could really do with him for either inside centre or cover for 10 if Hawkshaw gets the nod.

Our backline is really getting stretched thin now.

arsebiscuits1

Also I don't think Baird will be involved against Italy.

He can go to 6 and Dunne can come in to the bench if Fardy is gone

Clegg

Baird is a freakish talent in an Irish context. It's not often that we develop second rows with such carrying ability. Thought he had a decent game at the weekend all things considered. The two missed clear outs are big minuses, but he contributed a lot around the pitch.

https://twitter.com/Murray_Kinsella/status/1363900587163717632?s=09

Dubinusa

Was good to see Clarkson get a start. He's 21 this week! Sometimes, I forget how young these lads are. Same thing with Milne, still very young and has done quite well up to now.
Josh Murphy is a beast of a man. Very good player, when I have seen him. I also have thought that Cian Kelleher has been a good pick up. I was concerned about his defensive capabilities, he has been fine so far. I think Adam Byrne will be hard pressed to get ahead of him.
Has there been any updates on contracts? Rumors etc.

Clegg

Leinster looking to sign a tight head prop from New Zealand as a back up to Furlong. Done with the idea of swapping Porter back to loose head and having him start alongside Furlong.

https://m.independent.ie/sport/rugby/leinster-rugby/crusader-isileli-tuungafasi-tops-list-as-leinster-go-in-search-of-an-overseas-tighthead-prop-40121376.html

thomond2006

Notwithstanding the possible departure/retirement of Bent, you'd hope that isn't a bad sign for Abdaladze's future. There's been no news of a return for him right?

theVersatile

Would they not look at Oli Jager since he's Irish qualified?

Squidgy Black

theVersatile wrote: »

Would they not look at Oli Jager since he's Irish qualified?

Only signed a new 2 year deal last summer and from all accounts he's fairly happy out where he is.

Buer

theVersatile wrote: »

Would they not look at Oli Jager since he's Irish qualified?

I've no doubt that provinces (and not only Leinster) have been in touch with him. The fact is that Jager is ahead of Tu’ungafasi in the pecking order so it's going to be trickier to tempt him to leave the Crusaders on a purely rugby basis.