Co-living..Shared kitchen for 42 ?

Muahahaha

Now we have the CEO of another co-living company called Roam criticising Bartra Capital as being in a race to the bottom

Shared-living model here is 'not in interest of tenants'
Roam founder hits out at 'removal of standards' from country's housing market, writes Michael Cogley

The chief executive of one of the world's best-known shared-living companies has criticised the Government's guidelines for the concept. Housing minister Eoghan Murphy last year amended planning guidelines to introduce the model to the Irish market, under which multiple self-catered bedrooms share living spaces and kitchens. Murphy attracted high levels of criticism last week after he said that young people should be "excited" to pay less rent for less space, in reference to the model.

Now shared-living company Roam - which has locations in London, Bali, San Francisco, Tokyo and Miami - said that it was "open" to setting up here, but added that the way it had been implemented in Ireland was wrong.

"Part of why we haven't found a property that's a good match yet is that we haven't seen the quality and thoughtfulness necessary to not only make the trade-off between smaller personal studios and better shared spaces work, but a superior experience," founder and chief executive Bruno Haid said. "A lot of it feels indeed rushed and optimised for the developer's interest, and not the tenant's. So we can relate to the criticism current schemes are facing."


Roam's properties differs to the projects that have been proposed in Ireland in that it offers business travellers access to luxury co-living spaces with maid service across all of its locations for $1,800 (€1,610) a month. This means that clients can travel across the world to its five locations while only having to pay a single fee. Customers are also offered "flexible leases", which give customers a full-furnished bedroom with a desk and an en-suite bathroom. Each facility also has co-working spaces that include a media centre, pool, shared kitchens and event space. "Our legislative preference is to build upon already existing rules for hotels and serviced apartments and open them for long-term stays, if people prefer this topology of buildings," Haid said."But just removing established standards from the bottom of the housing market to address growing inequality is not necessarily a good policy to address more systemic issues."

Roam is not the only company exploring shared living in Ireland. Richard Barrett's Bartra Capital intends to make it a main part of its residential supply stream and has lodged applications for both Castleknock and Dún Laoghaire in Dublin. The group also intends to reapply for another such development in Rathmines in the capital.

https://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/sharedliving-model-here-is-not-in-interest-of-tenants-38146511.html

He is not wrong either. There is a right and wrong way to do co-living and 16sqm plus kitchens for 42 people is certainly not the right way. That doesnt seem to register with Minister for Housing Eoghan Murphy who believes young people should be "excited" to live in these kind of conditions.

Graham

I inderstand Roam is a slightly higher end offering, smaller properties, higher prices.

£2,800/month for London

pinkyeye

Graham wrote: »

I inderstand Roam is a slightly higher end offering, smaller properties, higher prices.

£2,800/month for London

So you just ignore the totality of the article above?

They offer accommodation basically to business travellers, not people who need full time accommodation in the country they live in.

Graham

Ahhh so it's a different product for a different market at a different price point.

It is good to see so many options coming to the market.

Eric Cartman

Graham wrote: »

Ahhh so it's a different product for a different market at a different price point.

It is good to see so many options coming to the market.

who knew that not every house has to cost nothing and be exclusively a 3 bed in dublin with space for a trampoline out the garden.

pinkyeye

Eric Cartman wrote: »

who knew that not every house has to cost nothing and be exclusively a 3 bed in dublin with space for a trampoline out the garden.

What on earth are you on about??

There is literally NO-ONE on this thread saying that a house should cost nothing.

We're talking about hard working professionals here. Don't know what you're talking about. You obviously have an agenda going that has nothing to do with this topic.

Graham

Maybe a run-down 3 bed semi shared by 3 or 4 working professionals 45 minutes bus ride from town isn't ideal either.

Guy:Incognito

Graham wrote: »

I don't see why that's an issue. The chances of all 42 residents deciding to prepare food simultaneously are pretty slim.

I would guess most smaller shared kitchens that you'd typically find in dedicated student developments spend most of their time empty.

But I thought this was all about "young professionals". Theres a good chance a lot of them will be working 9-5 so finishing around the same time, looking to make dinner, no?

Students would be coming and going at various times of the day and night between irregular class times, part time jobs, drinking etc.

Guy:Incognito

Graham wrote: »

Existing co-living developments appear to manage with basic house rules.

When you've finished with it, clean it and put it away. Some levy a charge where this is not done.

Theres a lot less anonymity in a house share with 4 people. Whereas one with 42.........

Guy:Incognito

Graham wrote: »

And yet the existing co-living schemes appear to be doing quite alright and property development companies are prepared to invest millions.

What is this reluctance to actually address the points rather than talk around them.

No one has denied there will be people to fill them. Theres a shortage of rental accommodation at the minute. These will be filled by necessity rather than choice.

AGAIN. Why would anyone choose to live in a 42 room house share for a significant portion (75% or so) of the rental price of a 3 bed semi?

Graham

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

But I thought this was all about "young professionals". Theres a good chance a lot of them will be working 9-5 so finishing around the same time, looking to make dinner, no?

For many young professionals, no. There's every chance the main meal of the day (at least) is taken in the company restaurant/s.

I genuinely suspect some of the posters here have no experience or idea of how some of the (typically young) team members work/live in many of the more modern companies/startups.

Graham

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

AGAIN. Why would anyone choose to live in a 42 room house share for a significant portion (75% or so) of the rental price of a 3 bed semi?

In my 20s, I couldn't think of anything more miserable than living in a shared 3-bed semi in the burbs. I did it, it confirmed it.

I wanted:

Good quality accommodation.
Centrally located.
Least hassle possible.
A clean comfortable room.
En-suite facilities.
Somewhere presentable for the times socialising concluded with an overnight guest.
I wasn't looking for the cheapest option.

I had a good job, worked long hours, and socialised even longer. The kitchen was a place to keep the milk and the mixers.

Evenings were spent with friends, Sunday mornings we all met in a comfortable hotel lounge somewhere, off for lunch, drinks........

That's why I would have chosen co-living had it been an option. It would have suited my lifestyle at the time.


Times have changed, more and more people now, are like I was then. We're no longer finishing Uni, marrying our high-school sweetheart, buying aforementioned 3-bed semi, and popping out a few smallies all before hitting thirty.

SirGerryAdams

I think the living situation and price are two different things.

1300 is a rip off but so would the price for a brand new 2 bed apartment being rented out. If people are renting it for 1300 a month, then that means it's worth 1300 a month. If you don't want to live there, you can choose not to.

It sounds like a great situation to me. I'd get my own room with ensuite and shower.

The price is as a result of market conditions. We need a range of accomodation types and no one is saying this is the only type of accomodation that's going to be built again. People wanted higher density places so here it is.

I mean, is it worse than my current situation of living with 3 other adults in a 3 bed semi D? Living room is cramped for 4 adults, I have to share a bathroom and shower, with the others pubes all over the place and there's 4 adults for a kitchen area that's really only built for one person cooking at a time.

My room is smaller than the proposed one and I'm paying through the nose anyways.

Plus I have to cut crass and look after the garden.

Guy:Incognito

SirGerryAdams wrote: »

. If you don't want to live there, you can choose not to.
.

Yeah, sure just ring up one of the thousands of landlords with spare houses or apartments they just cant get tenants for........................

SirGerryAdams

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Yeah, sure just ring up one of the thousands of landlords with spare houses or apartments they just cant get tenants for........................

So let's not build anything there then?

Graham

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Yeah, sure just ring up one of the thousands of landlords with spare houses or apartments they just cant get tenants for........................

I notice you completely ignored the answer to your question why people might opt for co-living out of choice rather than necessity.

Graces7

Graham wrote: »

For many young professionals, no. There's every chance the main meal of the day (at least) is taken in the company restaurant/s.

I genuinely suspect some of the posters here have no experience or idea of how some of the (typically young) team members work/live in many of the more modern companies/startups.

they are just envious is all.

Referring back to the working co-living in Kllarney now fully occupied...

https://www.killarneytoday.com/killarneys-not-humble-abode/

Guy:Incognito

Graham wrote: »

I notice you completely ignored the answer to your question why people might opt for co-living out of choice rather than necessity.

None of it explains why a 42 room house share for 1300 a month is better than a 2 or 3 room one for less. Houses and apartments can have en suites too. They most likely wont be glorified portaloos in the corner of your bedroom either.

Other than having to cut the grass maybe. If cutting the grass is that bad, pay the local young lads a tenner every so often to do it. Not exactly hardship. Plus you have a garden to go out in rather than sit in a room with anywhere up to 42 other people.


I had a very quick look on Daft.
For the same price, 2 people could rent this and actually be in town.
https://www.daft.ie/dublin/apartments-for-rent/ifsc/20-burton-house-ifsc-dublin-1930712/

4 people could rent this if Dun Laoghaire is where you want to be
https://www.daft.ie/dublin/apartments-for-rent/dun-laoghaire/the-pavilion-marine-road-dun-laoghaire-dublin-1932558/

Graham

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

None of it explains why a 42 room house share for 1300 a month is better than a 2 or 3 room one for less.

Which bit did you struggle with?

A 3 bed semi in Lucan/Clondalkin/Swords just doesn't suit many peoples lifestyle.

Not everyone is trying to do their housing for the lowest amount possible.

Guy:Incognito

Graham wrote: »

Which bit did you struggle with?

A 3 bed semi in Lucan/Clondalkin/Swords just doesn't suit many peoples lifestyle.

Not everyone is trying to do their housing for the lowest amount possible.

You know this place is in Dun Laoghaire, not town, yeah?

So what is the advantage of paying more to live in the same type of area with 42 people instead of 2?

Graham

Dún Laoghaire
Town in the Republic of Ireland

I'd opt for one in Dublin personally but I'm sure there are people living/working in Dun Laoghaire with similar lifestyles.

Guy:Incognito

Graham wrote: »

Dún Laoghaire
Town in the Republic of Ireland

I'd opt for one in Dublin personally.

Dun Laoghaire will do fine then.


I dont think they'll move the whole complex for you btw. So seeing as the subject of the thread is a building in Dun Laoghaire, lets assume thats where its going to stay.

Graham

Topic is co-living and I'm not in my 20s any more.

I can however still remember them quite vividly

worded

Graham wrote: »

I don't see why that's an issue. The chances of all 42 residents deciding to prepare food simultaneously are pretty slim.

I would guess most smaller shared kitchens that you'd typically find in dedicated student developments spend most of their time empty.

I share with one person and we are frequently wanting to cook at the same time and in each other’s way

40 + people queuing up for the one toaster or foreman grill that works. Chaos

If it was city center, maybe, but Dunlaoghaire.
They are having a laugh

CollyFlower

Thats just depressing.... Without all the add-ons, it must be cheaper to live in a Hostel or a B&B.

worded

colm_mcm wrote: »

I would venture to say people of that mindset wouldn’t bother tidying up after themselves in a shared kitchen.
I think you’re overestimating people.

Stayed in a hostel in Spain

In the kitchen it said

“Clean up after yourself.
Your mama don’t work here”

Thought that was a good one

Graham

CollyFlower wrote: »

Thats just depressing.... Without all the add-ons, it must be cheaper to live in a Hostel or a B&B.

I guess if someone is into that sort of thing it might suit them.

MrMusician18

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

None of it explains why a 42 room house share for 1300 a month is better than a 2 or 3 room one for less. Houses and apartments can have en suites too. They most likely wont be glorified portaloos in the corner of your bedroom either.

Other than having to cut the grass maybe. If cutting the grass is that bad, pay the local young lads a tenner every so often to do it. Not exactly hardship. Plus you have a garden to go out in rather than sit in a room with anywhere up to 42 other people.


I had a very quick look on Daft.
For the same price, 2 people could rent this and actually be in town.
https://www.daft.ie/dublin/apartments-for-rent/ifsc/20-burton-house-ifsc-dublin-1930712/

4 people could rent this if Dun Laoghaire is where you want to be
https://www.daft.ie/dublin/apartments-for-rent/dun-laoghaire/the-pavilion-marine-road-dun-laoghaire-dublin-1932558/

A lot of people are missing the market that these co-living spaces are aimed at. They are usually temporary arrangements used when a person moves to a new city and uses it as a base to find something more permanent or cheaper, or the individual is only going to be in the city for a few months which makes them unattractive as a potential housemate in a share. These places generally have high turnover and the general availability and little commitment means they can charge a premium.

the_syco

Eric Cartman wrote: »

I would say the odds of even 24 people wanting to use that kitchen in a day are low, itll be a hell of a lot of takeaway ordered or restaurant eating.

Nandos is literally around the corner :pac:

But yes, I do agree most will eat their main in work. O'Briens Offie down the road would get a huge boost in business, and the neighbours would be issuing almost daily noise complaints to the Gardai about the parties held in the complex.

Graham wrote: »

New Mill was reported up to €1640/month

Luxury' student accommodation with bowling alleys, gyms and cinemas - but it'll cost €410 a week

Looks like someone just wants cheap land;

But GSA Ireland development director Aaron Bailey denied this, stating the market alone was responsible for rents. He argued GSA is adding to supply of accommodation.

As for luxury accommodation, he claimed that "building a more affordable product isn't possible" due to land prices and "strict specifications" imposed by Dublin City Council.

Seems that he's trolling DCC to have them give him cheap land so he can then rent it cheaper.

Graham wrote: »

Roam, The Collective, Node, We Live, all expanding at the moment before you even begin to look at new entrants to the market.

They're not one bed things charging €1,300, though, are they?

Graham wrote: »

I inderstand Roam is a slightly higher end offering, smaller properties, higher prices.

£2,800/month for London

For people that are already paying a high price elsewhere. I'd imagine it's a "penthouse wherever the funk you want to live" scenario.

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Theres a lot less anonymity in a house share with 4 people. Whereas one with 42.........

CCTV in operation for your security. Failure to clean up after yourselves will mean a fine.

SirGerryAdams wrote: »

1300 is a rip off

Well, €1,300 + €154 (rail only) or €180 (rail + LUAS).

CollyFlower wrote: »

Thats just depressing.... Without all the add-ons, it must be cheaper to live in a Hostel or a B&B.

B&B's rate will differ during the holiday seasons. Some may even ask that you GTFO on certain weekends. Hostels in Dublin are either expensive, or full of people who don't work. Having lived with people who don't work, I found my fridge to empty quicker.

MrMusician18

MrMusician18 wrote: »

A lot of people are missing the market that these co-living spaces are aimed at. They are usually temporary arrangements used when a person moves to a new city and uses it as a base to find something more permanent or cheaper, or the individual is only going to be in the city for a few months which makes them unattractive as a potential housemate in a share. These places generally have high turnover and the general availability and little commitment means they can charge a premium.

Agreed. If I moved into a big city as a complete stranger I would much prefer to find a room in a co-living unit rather than a smaller clautrophobic setting with 2/3 others that I don't know.

In time I would probably meet up with people with whom I might like to share an apartment/house.

IMO the co-living option provides a nice mix of sociability and privacy that could work well for a lot of young working people.