Co-living..Shared kitchen for 42 ?

Graces7

Deleted User wrote: »

These units are aimed at short term lets. Someone moving to the city to start work would be happy to avail of these.

which will automatically take the pressure off more usual rentals stock .

atticu

The_Conductor wrote: »

The developer stated this was his target price as it was competitive with one bed apartments while being interviewed by RTE on the scheme earlier this year. This figure is the one being bandied about by the developer.

So every time this price is posted, the developer is getting free advertising.
And, each time it is posted it becomes more acceptable, a little bit of a self fulfilling prophecy.

The_Conductor

Graces7 wrote: »

which will automatically take the pressure off more usual rentals stock .

Not if the developer has priced them to compete with 1 bed apartments as they have done. Very few people will pay top dollar for one of these units- if its the same price as actually having their own place. Co-living is all well and good- if its structured in an appropriate manner. Tell me who will actively seek out co-living units- if/when they are in a position to rent their own place? This is a glorified hostel- where you self cater- nothing more, and at an extortionate price. If I could afford to live there- you can be damn sure I'd not stay there a moment longer than necessary- I'd be doing my utmost to source accommodation, as opposed to a small bedroom, for myself.

If these were priced as a low cost alternate to renting your own place- they would have merit- they're not- the sales pitch is that you live in one of these bedrooms instead of renting your own place (and at the same price as renting your own place).

As this is a 'hostel' type situation- in addition to paying through the nose for the 'privilege of living here- you can be turfed out at little notice, you have no security of tenure- so if there is a conference in Dublin next weekend and people need accommodation- clear the decks- charge folk 250-300 quid a night and tough titties to the longer term residents- its conference accommodation for the weekend............

I'd call it a glorified hotel- only in a hotel they actually feed you, and the bedrooms tend to be significantly larger (and definitely not fold out beds that are stored in the wall).

Its a blatant attempt to harvest as much cold hard cash from people who have few options- without giving them any rights whatsoever (such as security of tenure).

If there was security of tenure and people could rely on living there for a few weeks uninterupted, and safe from spurious eviction to get higher income tourists for a conference or whatever- I'd say 'yay', bring it on (providing it was at a reasonable price). Its not though. Its not a solution to (anything really)- its a cash grab, pure and simple.

Adamcp898

When did having aspirations to have an adequate living space for oneself, to enjoy an ordinary life, become a luxury?

The young workforce in this country are being kicked from pillar to post with nary a voice to be heard fighting their corner. Go to university, get a degree, and you can enjoy a comfortable standard of living they were told - the pup, they were sold. Nobody expects to be a millionaire in their early twenties, but they should not be painted as unrealistic for thinking that maybe, they should be able to afford to have their own room and to share living spaces with a handful of like-minded others. A room to breathe and room to grow.

The crisis taught the generation of "property investors" nothing. Not only are the young carrying the can for their previous catastrophes, but they'll have to shoulder some more yet it seems. And all while paying for their care in years to come to boot.

The fruits of their labour mean little to society.

The_Conductor

atticu wrote: »

So every time this price is posted, the developer is getting free advertising.
And, each time it is posted it becomes more acceptable, a little bit of a self fulfilling prophecy.

If people read threads like this one- and look at developments like this with their eyes wide open, and aware of the facts of living in a 'co-living' solution such as this- it will be a public service to air the facts of the matter.

The price is scandalous- as is the fact that there is no security of tenure whatsoever. Other than that- its a hostel, albeit one in a good location with a few niceties tossed in- but its a hostel, and trying to dress mutton as lamb, doesn't make it lamb.

atticu

atticu wrote: »

So every time this price is posted, the developer is getting free advertising.
And, each time it is posted it becomes more acceptable, a little bit of a self fulfilling prophecy.

Does that price include heating and utilities?

BaZmO*

Adamcp898 wrote: »

When did having aspirations to have an adequate living space for oneself, to enjoy an ordinary life, become a luxury?

The young workforce in this country are being kicked from pillar to post with nary a voice to be heard fighting their corner. Go to university, get a degree, and you can enjoy a comfortable standard of living they were told - the pup, they were sold. Nobody expects to be a millionaire in their early twenties, but they should not be painted as unrealistic for thinking that maybe, they should be able to afford to have their own room and to share living spaces with a handful of like-minded others. A room to breathe and room to grow.

The crisis taught the generation of "property investors" nothing. Not only are the young carrying the can for their previous catastrophes, but they'll have to shoulder some more yet it seems. And all while paying for their care in years to come to boot.

The fruits of their labour mean little to society.

If only there was some type of system where a certain demographic could elect someone to represent them and fight their corner........

Adamcp898

BaZmO* wrote: »

If only their was some type of system where a certain demographic could elect someone to represent them and fight their corner........

Not going to go down that route because to do so would necessitate turning this into a discussion about broader political culture in this country.


But, the immediate reaction to blame someone for the problems which they encounter, especially the ones which are not of their own creation; rather than to perhaps, say, consider the issue, look at the causes, and have a stab at a potential solution (................) isn't a great look.

Wabbit Ears

Deleted User wrote: »

Does that price include heating and utilities?

im not sure why people think 1300 is insane, its just over 40 quid a night and if that includes heating, water, electricity, common area cleaning etc then that strikes me as very reasonable.

BaZmO*

Adamcp898 wrote: »

Not going to go down that route because to do so would necessitate turning this into a discussion about broader political culture in this country.


But, the immediate reaction to blame someone for the problems which they encounter, especially the ones which are not of their own creation; rather than to perhaps, say, consider the issue, look at the causes, and have a stab at a potential solution (................) isn't a great look.

Yeah, but that's not how politics works in Ireland. If you don't hold politicians accountable at the ballot box in you dont get your voice heard.

I'm not pointing the finger (when I was younger I was as guilty as anyone else of not voting), but you can't sit back and do nothing and then complain when you're not heard.

atticu

Deleted User wrote: »

Does that price include heating and utilities?

I have no idea.
I was only asking where posters got the price from.

alexjp

Deleted User wrote: »

Does that price include heating and utilities?

And probably wifi.
Not having to deal with this kind of things is perfect for short term / student accomodations.

The_Conductor

alexjp wrote: »

And probably wifi.
Not having to deal with this kind of things is perfect for short term / student accomodations.

However- the downside of not having any security of tenure whatsoever, somewhat negates these positives. How would folk feel about being kicked out because there was a big conference in Dublin some weekend- and the owner can make a bomb selling beds to the participants?

BaZmO*

Wabbit Ears wrote: »

im not sure why people think 1300 is insane, its just over 40 quid a night and if that includes heating, water, electricity, common area cleaning etc then that strikes me as very reasonable.

Really?

Average wage in Ireland is €39,000
After tax is €30,462

€1,300 x 12 is €15,600 so essentially half a person's salary going on a shoe box with a pull down bed. Hmmm

When did our expectations get so low?

Adamcp898

Wabbit Ears wrote: »

im not sure why people think 1300 is insane, its just over 40 quid a night and if that includes heating, water, electricity, common area cleaning etc then that strikes me as very reasonable.

Compare it to the average salary after tax of a graduate and the proverbial penny should.........well that saying might be a little too on the nose for this discussion.

alexjp wrote: »

And probably wifi.
Not having to deal with this kind of things is perfect for short term / student accomodations.

Student accommodation......at the price being bandied about?

ste

When I was younger I lived in a shared house in Australia for about 6 months. There were 10-12 of us maybe. It was in major city close to city centre. It was managed through an agency. Bill included all services. There was a cleaner. We all shared a kitchen. It was a great mix, NZ, English, Dutch, Swede, Oz and I'm sure I've forgotten one. Most people worked full time, including me, and it was great. It was pretty expensive but it suited me.



I've also lived in house shares in Dublin.



Now I live in a 3 bed semi-d in Dublin with family.


Different stages in life, different wants/needs.

ste

ste wrote: »

When I was younger I lived in a shared house in Australia for about 6 months. There were 10-12 of us maybe. It was in major city close to city centre. It was managed through an agency. Bill included all services. There was a cleaner. We all shared a kitchen. It was a great mix, NZ, English, Dutch, Swede, Oz and I'm sure I've forgotten one. Most people worked full time, including me, and it was great. It was pretty expensive but it suited me.

I've also lived in house shares in Dublin.

Now I live in a 3 bed semi-d in Dublin with family.

Different stages in life, different wants/needs.

Absolutely. Now we have some wanting a 3 bed semi the minute they turn 18.

Adamcp898

BaZmO* wrote: »

Yeah, but that's not how politics works in Ireland. If you don't hold politicians accountable at the ballot box in you dont get your voice heard.

I'm not pointing the finger (when I was younger I was as guilty as anyone else of not voting), but you can't sit back and do nothing and then complain when you're not heard.

The broader discussion would entail much more than "holding politicians accountable", and like I said, there's not much point going down that route.


But why should the automatic reaction always be to just attribute blame to some politician or other, wipe your hands, and move on without ever actually considering the problem at hand and why should it be left solely to those directly effected?

Presumably the people who are being targeted with this type of accommodation have family, they have friends. They might have parents or someone or other who sacrificed a lot to educate them so that they could have a decent chance at a reasonable quality of life; where are their voices in this? What about broader society showing a bit of empathy and recognising that since they themselves wouldn't like to live like this, that maybe it shouldn't be acceptable to ask somebody else to?


We're told the hours of modern young, working culture are so long that people simply need a place to rest their head until it's time to get up and go again.
But where is the consideration that maybe, placing somebody in a living situation which is only just about bearable if you spend the least amount of time in it possible, after having clocked up 60 hours working already, isn't creating the healthiest life cycle?

Adamcp898

Deleted User wrote: »

Absolutely. Now we have some wanting a 3 bed semi the minute they turn 18.

No, you don't.

Adamcp898

Adamcp898 wrote: »

No, you don't.

Oh, yes, you do n

riclad

Different people have different needs thats true,
the problem i see is many young people who are working full time
are renting and will find it harder to buy a house anywhere near where they work.
Its ok, to rent when you are in your 20,s ,or going to college .
Theres a catch 22 ,if you are paying 1000 per month rent,
it will be hard to save up the deposit to buy a house.
We may see a new generation of young people who are renting in their 30,s .I don,t have a problem with co living if the standards are set
at a reasonable level as regards room size and acess to cooking faciltys .If someone opens a hotel with 40 rooms they would have to have a reception desk, 24 security on duty .
After a certain age most people who are working want to buy a house
or maybe at least a 1 bed apartment .

Adamcp898

Adamcp898 wrote: »

Presumably the people who are being targeted with this type of accommodation have family, they have friends. They might have parents or someone or other who sacrificed a lot to educate them so that they could have a decent chance at a reasonable quality of life; where are their voices in this?


But where is the consideration that maybe, placing somebody in a living situation which is only just about bearable if you spend the least amount of time in it possible, after having clocked up 60 hours working already, isn't creating the healthiest life cycle?

Personally, if my adult kids (on whom I spent a fortune educating) wanted to live in a co-living unit I wouldn't feel I should have a voice. It's a choice, an accommodation option. No-one will be "placed" in them. If it suits your needs you go for it. If not you have the same accommodation options as we have at the moment, except there would be less pressure on them due to the extra availability in the co-living units. People live in them in cities all over the world and they are in high demand.

ncounties

riclad wrote: »

Different people have different needs thats true,
the problem i see is many young people who are working full time
are renting and will find it harder to buy a house anywhere near where they work.
Its ok, to rent when you are in your 20,s ,or going to college .
Theres a catch 22 ,if you are paying 1000 per month rent,
it will be hard to save up the deposit to buy a house.
We may see a new generation of young people who are renting in their 30,s .I don,t have a problem with co living if the standards are set
at a reasonable level as regards room size and acess to cooking faciltys .If someone opens a hotel with 40 rooms they would have to have a reception desk, 24 security on duty .
After a certain age most people who are working want to buy a house
or maybe at least a 1 bed apartment .

I'd love a one bed apartment, but the gross deposit needed for one, is basically the same as would be needed for a two bed apartment since no lender in Ireland offer's 10% deposits for one bed properties.

Caranica

BaZmO* wrote: »

http://bartraeblanashd.com/gallery/

Lots of pictures of the outside of the building. Even a fly through of the communal spaces but other than general floor plans there's no pics/details of the holding pens, sorry "rooms"

€500-600 a month and it would make sense. €1300 is just scandalous.

If you go into the reports section on that site you can download the report which has pictures and details of the rooms

Caranica

Caranica wrote: »

If you go into the reports section on that site you can download the report which has pictures and details of the rooms

http://bartraeblanashd.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Architectural-Design-Statement.pdf

Doesn’t look too bad. Decent size bed.

lainey_d_123

riclad wrote: »

Different people have different needs thats true,
the problem i see is many young people who are working full time
are renting and will find it harder to buy a house anywhere near where they work.
Its ok, to rent when you are in your 20,s ,or going to college .
Theres a catch 22 ,if you are paying 1000 per month rent,
it will be hard to save up the deposit to buy a house.
We may see a new generation of young people who are renting in their 30,s .I don,t have a problem with co living if the standards are set
at a reasonable level as regards room size and acess to cooking faciltys .If someone opens a hotel with 40 rooms they would have to have a reception desk, 24 security on duty .
After a certain age most people who are working want to buy a house
or maybe at least a 1 bed apartment .

Eh, there is already a generation of people renting in their thirties, and has been for quite some time. I'm 34 and still flatsharing, and back when I was 22, I had flatmates in their thirties. This is nothing new. In the future it won't be thirties, but forties. I still have friends in London and some of them have flatmates who are 40+, people with normal, decent jobs in London who simply can't afford to pay rent on a studio/one-bed AND save for a flat deposit.

jimmycrackcorm

Wabbit Ears wrote: »

im not sure why people think 1300 is insane, its just over 40 quid a night and if that includes heating, water, electricity, common area cleaning etc then that strikes me as very reasonable.

A work colleague has just rented a two bed apartment in Grand canal for 2600. There will be three people sharing the apartment to share the costs. Where is the outrage as this is so common?

I don't get the hoopla about the Co living blocks. These will only appeal to a small subset of people who would
prefer that to sharing an apartment.

It's as if we're saying that these are the only blocks that will be built going forward. They're not intended as permanent housing and will only succeed as long as they're is a demand to fill them.

They do fill a need to provide more places for people to live than were the space used for less denser accommodation. This route of accommodation is a symptom and just one piece in the housing crisis problem but not the blame.

For people who come here to work on short term contracts such as in IT they suit very well and free up other routes of accommodation better suited to people with more long term needs.

Is hysterical to suggest that these are slumlord tenements or that this is the only choice of housing that will be built now.

Caranica

[Deleted User] wrote: »

http://bartraeblanashd.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Architectural-Design-Statement.pdf

Doesn’t look too bad. Decent size bed.

If you're ok with walls top and bottom and partial walls at the sides of your bed.

Bed is a double but planning application stipulates single occupancy only so you're not allowed a personal life in one of these cells.

whisky_galore

Co-Living, the latest hip euphemism, the kind of obfuscation that gave us "family hub" and "direct provision".

It looks ok, funky and down with the kids, might be worth half the price they're asking for. It's a hostel in all but name.

lola85

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

A work colleague has just rented a two bed apartment in Grand canal for 2600. There will be three people sharing the apartment to share the costs. Where is the outrage as this is so common?

I don't get the hoopla about the Co living blocks. These will only appeal to a small subset of people who would
prefer that to sharing an apartment.

It's as if we're saying that these are the only blocks that will be built going forward. They're not intended as permanent housing and will only succeed as long as they're is a demand to fill them.

They do fill a need to provide more places for people to live than were the space used for less denser accommodation. This route of accommodation is a symptom and just one piece in the housing crisis problem but not the blame.

For people who come here to work on short term contracts such as in IT they suit very well and free up other routes of accommodation better suited to people with more long term needs.

Is hysterical to suggest that these are slumlord tenements or that this is the only choice of housing that will be built now.

We need to grow up as a nation and realise the world doesn’t owe us anything.