Tesla Model 3 thread - V2.0

ELM327

ELM327 wrote: »

In the US where it was promised.
It was never promised here.

Yes but we got 5 K VRT relief here + 5 K Grant which should have made it around 38 K here.

ELM327

you forget that the US dollar has increased in value vs both the euro and the pound, by about 20% in the interim.

hatrack

Can’t believe we’re still talking about the $35,000 car not being available here.

Email out to a lot of UK customers today saying they’ve delivered about 200 cars between last week and this week. Purpose of these deliveries was to test logistics. Next batch (which they say will be larger) will be delivered end of next month. Remains to be seen whether that is just the mythical 1,000 that no one knows what has happened to or a larger batch. Either way, if it’s end of July the ships need to be setting sail in the next few days. Suspect it will be 1,000 a month as they will struggle to deal with logistics.

Looking more like it will be well into August by the time we see any in this country. Ridiculously the order page is still saying July though.

smokybacon

hatrack wrote: »

Can’t believe we’re still talking about the $35,000 car not being available here.

Email out to a lot of UK customers today saying they’ve delivered about 200 cars between last week and this week. Purpose of these deliveries was to test logistics. Next batch (which they say will be larger) will be delivered end of next month. Remains to be seen whether that is just the mythical 1,000 that no one knows what has happened to or a larger batch. Either way, if it’s end of July the ships need to be setting sail in the next few days. Suspect it will be 1,000 a month as they will struggle to deal with logistics.

Looking more like it will be well into August by the time we see any in this country. Ridiculously the order page is still saying July though.

I expressed interest ages ago. Got call maybe March/apr from Dublin saying sep oct!
Funny latest in uk they were predicting grand mark would have 1000rhd. Turns out only a few hundred. They went to Norway.

copeyhagen

smokybacon wrote: »

Have been putting in info for basic model s - it’s about €600-€700. Kept the quote. There is a link for insurance on Tesla site. Not thousands I’d think. Heard talk bout difficulty on performance model though.

got a quote from work yesterday on a 45k model s, 2016. 450 euro.. nice.

that's with Allianz through a broker for work

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Yes but we got 5 K VRT relief here + 5 K Grant which should have made it around 38 K here.

VAT rate is 23 percent so that adds a bit. 35k is about 8k and I suspect the VAT also applies to the VRT.

AmberGold

After much deliberation between standard and performance I've just ordered, standard, blue, black interior and tow bar, number 250....

jfk75

samih wrote: »

VAT rate is 23 percent so that adds a bit. 35k is about 8k and I suspect the VAT also applies to the VRT.

Yep, add EU 10% import tariff then add VRT then top that with VAT top that with whatever it cost Tesla to transport the car too.

Partridge9

So folks - is the general view that the tesla model 3 base model doesn't fall into the BIK 0% window of 50k ?
So if you put some extras and the cost is say 59, the BIK is on the 59 and not the 9 over 50.

But the ACA is still good .. correct ?? So you can buy it, write off the capital year one - pay the BIK and then take personal ownership year two - avoiding further BIK..

Is that correct ??

Partridge9

Sorry - to add - my insurance company said that its 713 (80 euro more) for me to change my insurance from E300 to model 3 59k and they dont mind the vecihle is changing from personal to business as long as im 100% owner of business

Old diesel

Partridge9 wrote: »

Sorry - to add - my insurance company said that its 713 (80 euro more) for me to change my insurance from E300 to model 3 59k and they dont mind the vecihle is changing from personal to business as long as im 100% owner of business

Is that 713 for 12 months or for the remaining time on policy.

Partridge9

I was getting my policy renewed (starts July 1st) - so its 713 for the year - and she changed it from the 49k to 59k model... cause - lets face it.. your gonna press that button. Current policy is 629 or so for a E300 Sport Premium Plus with Allianz

Partridge9

Although - insurance was the least of my worries... was really hoping to get the car 1/2 price on that tax fiddle ... oh sorry 'Government Incentive'

Was there a definitive (accountant like) reply on the BIK ? I know a lad who bought the Kona - at around 38/39 - that must be close to the 50 mark with the incentives removed.

catharsis

Partridge9 wrote: »

So folks - is the general view that the tesla model 3 base model doesn't fall into the BIK 0% window of 50k ?
So if you put some extras and the cost is say 59, the BIK is on the 59 and not the 9 over 50.

But the ACA is still good .. correct ?? So you can buy it, write off the capital year one - pay the BIK and then take personal ownership year two - avoiding further BIK..

Is that correct ??

Partridge9 wrote: »

Although - insurance was the least of my worries... was really hoping to get the car 1/2 price on that tax fiddle ... oh sorry 'Government Incentive'

sorry but I'm afraid you have a few assumptions you need to check....


1. The BIK on the "49K Car" is actually based on the 'full price' of the car, so is based upon 59K

Then you take off the 5OK meaning that for the SR+ model you pay BIK on 9-10K (assuming you have paint etc)

... similarly for the AWD model, the 'price' upon which you pay BIK is actually 69K+ meaning that you pay BIK on ~20K for the AWD model


2. The ACA has a number of restrictions you need to check out
a) it's limited to something like 24K in the first year?
b) there is so-called 'clawback' meaning that if you do exactly what you describe the ACA does not apply, if I understand correctly.

3. There is no 49K and 59K car if buying through a company, the grant is reduced by 1200 making them 50K and 60K cars cash price

Partridge9

On reading all the posts... god lord there is a lot - I got that a bit wrong - it is the bit above 50k but you dont include the grants etc etc ..
Anyone picking up on the ACA ? Am I right in thinking you can write the asset off against tax over 12 months and not 8 years as normal.
And then
Cant you just transfer the ownership ??

Sounds like a great way to buy a Tesla out of your pre-tax money and pay an incey weeny bit of BIK and then BOOM - take the car from yourself and move it from Corporate to personal ownership..

But im not accountant...

Partridge9

catharsis wrote: »

sorry but I'm afraid you have a few assumptions you need to check....


1. The BIK on the "49K Car" is actually based on the 'full price' of the car, so is based upon 59K

Then you take off the 5OK meaning that for the SR+ model you pay BIK on 9-10K (assuming you have paint etc)

... similarly for the AWD model, the 'price' upon which you pay BIK is actually 69K+ meaning that you pay BIK on ~20K for the AWD model


2. The ACA has a number of restrictions you need to check out
a) it's limited to something like 24K in the first year?
b) there is so-called 'clawback' meaning that if you do exactly what you describe the ACA does not apply, if I understand correctly.

3. There is no 49K and 59K car if buying through a company, the grant is reduced by 1200 making them 50K and 60K cars cash price

============================

Great - someone who is knowledgeable on this..

For argument's sake - say you want the performance model..
You paying BIK (on 20k) but using ACA you can deffo write it off over year one.

So you are buying it 1/2 price .. in laymans terms

but whats this 'clawback' that sounds bad... anything with Claws..

So the business owns the car and has written off the value against profits .. you have the car in the business ... how do you get it over into personal ownership ..
And on this Clawback... how much blood money do they want... ruining it !

Partridge9

I was under the impression that people were writing off model X's in the first year using ACA - 150k !
But i'll check out your 24k figure ... that sounds like you didnt make it up.


Looks like your correct - so it would take 3 years to write off the vehicle, 3 years of BIK on 20k.

but then what ?

The vehicle is a zero value asset in your company... can you just nudge it over the fence ?? (I am presuming thats a no)

hatrack

Capital allowances are capped at €24,000. So 12.5% write off in year one saves €3,000.

catharsis

Partridge9 wrote: »

I was under the impression that people were writing off model X's in the first year using ACA - 150k !
But i'll check out your 24k figure ... that sounds like you didnt make it up.


Looks like your correct - so it would take 3 years to write off the vehicle, 3 years of BIK on 20k.

but then what ?

The vehicle is a zero value asset in your company... can you just nudge it over the fence ?? (I am presuming thats a no)

My own assumption is that whatever the PCP value would be on the company is a justifiable market value to use when transferring out of the company to private ownership.

In other words pay BIK for three years and give it to yourself cheap, but not free.

There is definitely a saving, but not as big as you might think... however it's worth noting that tyres, electricity, service,tax, insurance and all other costs associated with the car are also deductible expenses for the company which represent a benefit to the employee taxed at a rate of zero.... so if charges for charging come in that will be paid by the company with no tax implications for the individual.

Partridge9

Thanks for that - I forgot that the servicing was tax deductible.


So the base base model .. in black .. is 47840 + 980 + 2960 = 52840 + 5k BEV = 57840 - So BIK on 7840.

But the car actually only costs the company 57840 - (5 + 3.8) =49040
While the BIK is on the Original purchase price - the ACA is on the actual paid cost (you cant write off more than you paid)

And you can write off 24k a year - so after two years the car is an asset worth twopence-ha-penny.
But I suppose if you do a 3 year deal - its 17/18 a year would easy cover it.

What is PCP value ?? You lost me there... I would be nice to have the car after three years.

With Insurance / Service and bits 'write offable' ... so 3 years .. insurance 2130 / Service 1200 - 3330 euro .. so thats saving 1665 euro (give or take).

Buying the Base model and doing a three year deal looks like a no brainer... but still unclear what happens at the end..

catharsis

Partridge9 wrote: »

So the base base model .. in black .. is 47840 + 980 + 2960 = 52840 - So BIK on 2840.

I'm not sure where the 2960 came from (is that an accessory?), but taking those numbers....

No, your BIK value needs to ALSO add in the 5000 VRT Rebate and the 5000 SEAI Grant you are assuming you get when calculating the numbers above, so assuming you are right on the 2960 you would actually pay BIK on 12840 each year

Assuming 12840 is correct this means you pay tax on an 'income' of 30% of 12840 which is 3,852.

assuming 50% marginal tax rate (not correct but assumed for the illustration) that would be 1926 per year additional tax you have to pay (or 160/month reduction in your take home pay)

hatrack

Partridge9 wrote: »

Thanks for that - I forgot that the servicing was tax deductible.


So the base base model .. in black .. is 47840 + 980 + 2960 = 52840 + 5k BEV = 57840 - So BIK on 7840.

But the car actually only costs the company 57840 - (5 + 3.8) =49040
While the BIK is on the Original purchase price - the ACA is on the actual paid cost (you cant write off more than you paid)

And you can write off 24k a year - so after two years the car is an asset worth twopence-ha-penny.
But I suppose if you do a 3 year deal - its 17/18 a year would easy cover it.

What is PCP value ?? You lost me there... I would be nice to have the car after three years.

With Insurance / Service and bits 'write offable' ... so 3 years .. insurance 2130 / Service 1200 - 3330 euro .. so thats saving 1665 euro (give or take).

Buying the Base model and doing a three year deal looks like a no brainer... but still unclear what happens at the end..

It’s not €24,000 write off every year. It’s €24,000 in year one and that’s it. There’s no capital allowance in year two.

Partridge9

I'm sorry - I corrected it while you were replying..

47840 - Cash Price is .. this is inclusive of doc fee 980 / registration tax of 2960 but SEAI Grant of - 5k and the hidden bit of 5k on BEV

so

its base base base price actually that +10 .. 57840 before grants...

So the BIK Figure is actually 7,840 ..
and the actual grants allowed are 2960 SEAI and 5000 BEV
so you actually pay - 57840 - 7960 = 49,880

So BIK is on 57840 - 50000 = 7840
and ACA is on 49880 - actual cost paid by company.

So tax due on 30% of 'income' of 7840 - 2352 a year - so its 50% of that... or 1176 per year (3528 over 3 years)

Partridge9

It’s not €24,000 write off every year. It’s €24,000 in year one and that’s it. There’s no capital allowance in year two.

Gulp... are you sure? Sounds like I need to ring the SEAI

What doesnt make sense there is - there are lots of people buying electric cars in the 35-45 region... writing off 24k in year one isn't great if it still takes 8 years to finish

slave1

AmberGold wrote: »

After much deliberation between standard and performance I've just ordered, standard, blue, black interior and tow bar, number 250....

You had me until.....towbar:p

hatrack

Partridge9 wrote: »

It’s not €24,000 write off every year. It’s €24,000 in year one and that’s it. There’s no capital allowance in year two.

Gulp... are you sure? Sounds like I need to ring the SEAI

What doesnt make sense there is - there are lots of people buying electric cars in the 35-45 region... writing off 24k in year one isn't great if it still takes 8 years to finish

https://www.revenue.ie/en/companies-and-charities/corporation-tax-for-companies/corporation-tax/capital-allowances-and-deductions.aspx

It’s an *accelerated* capital allowance - that’s all. In the ordinary course of business you can write off 12.5% a year over 8 years. For an electric car it’s 100% in year one. It’s a timing thing, that’s all.

Don’t ask me how it works if you see the vehicle. Best to talk to an accountant anyway.

samih

samih wrote: »

VAT rate is 23 percent so that adds a bit. 35k is about 8k and I suspect the VAT also applies to the VRT.

35 K USD is 30,700 Euro + 23% + 14 % VRT = 50,058 Euro's - 10 K grant + VRT relief = 48K , I see......

Shame we're screwed in tax so much here even with the 10 K off it still shows how much we're screwed.

Shame there is also no PCP on the Model 3.

AmberGold

slave1 wrote: »

You had me until.....towbar:p

Need it for the kids bikes....

smokybacon

Partridge9 wrote: »

So folks - is the general view that the tesla model 3 base model doesn't fall into the BIK 0% window of 50k ?
So if you put some extras and the cost is say 59, the BIK is on the 59 and not the 9 over 50.

But the ACA is still good .. correct ?? So you can buy it, write off the capital year one - pay the BIK and then take personal ownership year two - avoiding further BIK..

Is that correct ??

Need to look at maybe market value / reasonable value / some kind of value of the transfer. Also clawback may be if not kept in business for 3 years. So might have to be transferred at mkt value at yr 3 plus 1 day. Or it may be at yr 1 plus 1 day. They take number of days into account. Need to get in writing / email from revenue to sleep at night. Revenue tend to do what they want.

AmberGold

Had a quick look at the Norwegian Tesla site, difference in price is significant. LR available and a P3 coming in at 53K or thereabouts with the performance pack.

The 19" wheels are availabe on the standard for 1.5K or so.

unkel

So I drove the Model 3 today. LR AWD, 19", Midnight Silver, AP, black interior, no FSD



Paintwork was perfect. The detailer had spotted some minor imperfections that had already been "fixed" by Tesla after the pre-delivery inspection, but OCD as detailers are, he fixed them properly. Then the car got treated to a full ceramic coating (two layers, Modesta on body and wheels)

Build quality - there were noticable panel gaps, but nothing extreme. This car was January 2019 built (VIN 261k). Delivered to the Netherlands end of March. It looks like quality control is improving on these cars all the time if you take into account the comments Bob Lutz made about a newly produced model 3 in recent weeks (if you don't know who that is, you need to Google him. Seriously.)

Linky

Also a few finishing details (door rubber) not perfect. Owner had already wrapped centre console and added screen protector on centre display. He'd also wrapped the door handles and added aftermarket performance aluminium covers for foot rest and pedals

I was pleasantly surprised with the interior, the vegan Alcantara door panels were very nice and the seats were very good, albeit with leg support slightly on the short side. The only animal killed for this car was a cow (for the steering wheel). I got used almost instantly to the minimalist interior. Bit of a revelation. Glass roof was magnificent

I only drove the car for about 20 minutes, not in anger apart from a few 0-100km/h accelerations. Handling felt fine. There was a clear RWD bias. I'm no particular fan of AWD myself. Grip was excellent. Cornering was like on rails. We timed it at 4.5s 0-100km/h (GPS). Unlike some other EVs I've driven, it did not relent, acceleration was still very strong well over 100km/h

Driving comfort was excellent, no knocks or rattles. Car was pretty quiet, even at speed. Regen is either low or strong. I drove in strong mode. It is almost one pedal drive, but the car does not come to a full stop. There are also 3 steering modes, I used normal

It's hot over here, car heats up very quickly with the glass roof and black interior, but of course it can be remotely set to cool itself before you get to it

At nearly 6'2, I could sit behind myself, but it was pushing it leg space wise. Head space is fine. Not so sure about having 3 people in the back

Luggage space was pretty decent with class average boot space (back seats fold down), but also a very usable frunk, with curry hooks.

LED lights all around. Auto high beam. Auto lights, auto wipers, all around parking sensors. Very decent (premium) audio. Car has user profiles that store all your preferences, from seating, language, heating, regen, AP settings, a bit like logging onto a PC as yourself. Picture quality of the reversing camera was excellent. 15" touchscreen works great, won't take long to get used to handling almost all functions through the screen rather than old skool manual controls. Played Beach Buggy and played with the emission test (whoopy cushion)

OTA is not really OTA. Most of the time. The car prefers to be connected to wifi and you'll get your updates quicker if regularly connected to home (or mobile phone AP) wifi. If you never connect to wifi you will get your updates though, just later. And who doesn't like a car that sometimes gets an update that gives it more range? More power? Or other enhanced features, like sentry mode?

AP does work in city traffic, but there are issues with recognising lanes. You will need to pay attention at all times. That said, a big plus point is that the car starts driving again by itself after having come to a complete stop

AP performance on motorways or national roads is solid, stays on for about 20s, but then nags (visual and later audio) will start and if you're bold, you will be put in AP jail until the next stop. This can easily be circumvented with a little trick like a bottle of water or a bag of coins on the steering wheel though

Anyone still reading this? Go test drive one. It's free. Make up your own mind.

jprboy

Good review, Unkel.

Thanks for taking the time to do it.

unkel wrote: »

Anyone still reading this? Go test drive one. It's free. Make up your own mind.

Where though?
No test drives available in Ireland.

Good review , so you liked it then ?

You thinking about getting one ?

Kicha

I did some research with Company purchase

Few things

1. Price does not include SEBi and VRT greants. In other words it is the price before all the incentives kick in.

2. ACA - accelerated capital allowance - maximum 24000 (pre tax). once off only claimed in first year. So you are effectively reducing the purchase price of the car but not the value that will be taken in to account for BIK calculations.

3. Following can be claimed pre tax-yearly - vehicle Insurance cost, motor tax, electricity charge (used for work only - home to normal place of work not considered as business miles), electricity installation charges(claimed once obviously)

4. Inspite of all this Tesla will still be expensive to own via company for people doing less than 15000 kms per year for work purposes. You will be paying BIK in the the range 1500 to 4000 per year till you own the car-. So if you are considering owning it for 10 years you will be paying 15000 - 40000 in big

5. if you sell the car, you have to return to the revenue the proportion of ACA claimed by the company on the car sale.

e.g you buy it for 50,000 (get a ACA of 24000).
sell it 5 years later for 25000, you have to return the government 12000 (50% of original ACA) back.


So at the end you are better of purchasing it as your personal car.

Best value for company car is e-golf or leaf or one of those 35000 electric cars where you pay no BIK but can claim a lot back.
So for company car it doesn't make sense to buy Tesla.

Markjsca1

The order website just updated the estimated delivery dates for new Model 3 orders to August. From what I’ve read, these estimated delivery dates are manually updated.

Partridge9

Good Work Kicha ..

1. Price does not include SEBi and VRT greants. In other words it is the price before all the incentives kick in.

If you use the configurator and get a cash price of 53k, BIK Price is actually 63k (SEAI 5k + 5k BEV) However - you are entitled as a company to the 5k BEV and 3.8k SEAI - so for purposes of BIK its 63k, for ACA and actual purchase its 54.2k as that was the actual cost to the company for the asset.

2. ACA - accelerated capital allowance - maximum 24000 (pre tax). once off only claimed in first year. So you are effectively reducing the purchase price of the car but not the value that will be taken in to account for BIK calculations.

My reading is you can deduct 24k year one (the acceleration!) and then 12.5% of actual cost yearly (as normal)

3: Spot on.

4. Inspite of all this Tesla will still be expensive to own via company for people doing less than 15000 kms per year for work purposes. You will be paying BIK in the the range 1500 to 4000 per year till you own the car-. So if you are considering owning it for 10 years you will be paying 15000 - 40000 in big

BIK is a killer of company cars for personal use. but work it out... its 30% and then 50% of that ... yearly, so if you can keep the BIK <10k, it is very doable.

5. if you sell the car, you have to return to the revenue the proportion of ACA claimed by the company on the car sale.
jeasus - really... I suppose you can just trade in a tesla every two-three years and keep as company car...
Lots of maths to be worked out there.

As long as the BIK payments are only a little above your savings on 3, then surely its saving you almost 50%

Partridge9

Gonna try to do up a spreadsheet of private ownership V company ownership over 4 years.

hatrack

Markjsca1 wrote: »

The order website just updated the estimated delivery dates for new Model 3 orders to August. From what I’ve read, these estimated delivery dates are manually updated.

I’d classify that as good news, means those of us who ordered early should be getting cars in August. Had been fearing it might be worse after hearing about timeline for UK deliveries.

One would hope the update is reasonably accurate.

Partridge9

Interesting sums..

Private Company
4 Yr - TCO 4 Yr - TCO Saving
+ Base € 54,080 € 32,344 € 21,736
+ Paint € 55,180 € 33,554 € 21,626
+ Interior € 56,580 € 35,094 € 21,486
+perfor € 70,301 € 50,187 € 20,114
+Per UPG € 75,301 € 55,687 € 19,614

For clarification - BIK is calculated as everything above 50 of the GROSS cost.
Then 30% of that is 'taxable' and 50% of that is due to Mr Tax Man.
Running costs are 1560 per year - so Private pays 100% and Company pays 50% - this is conservative .. eg. id imagine tesla tyres arent cheap.
I dont really understand/see the benefit of the ACA so I haven't factored that in at all


I really thought it would get very punitive as you went over 50... doesn't really - savings seem to be very linear.

But the elephant in the room is ... what happens at the start of year 5 - the company owns the car or with private you own the car - which is a lot better!

I suppose you could trade it in and keep it all in the company...but really not sure how that works.

rduggy

Hi All

I myself have been tormented on whether to buy as a company car or privately. For me, the main saving was the ability to have the company owe me all the money I contributed to payments of the car. SO essentially i would be able to take back the 50K tax-free saving myself 25k eventually that is.

I looked at the figures provided by @Partrigde9 and I'm confused. Why is the company TCO halved? Also in terms of the ACA, i don't understand why this would be paid back as mentioned by @kicha. Isn't this essentially just allowing you to depreciate it by up to 24k in year one. So essentially if you were profitable you would save 12.5% of 24,000 = 3000.

My main reason to buy privately and I'm still doubting myself is the fact that I would end up losing my own NCB insurance wise. My plan is to pay for all the cost personally but claim back as much as possible via travel expenses. Am i missing something



Below is what i found on ACA website (https://www.seai.ie/energy-in-business/accelerated-capital-allowance/):

The ACA scheme allows a sole trader, farmer or company that pays corporation tax in Ireland to deduct the full cost of the equipment from their profits in the year of purchase. As a result, the reduction in tax paid by the organisation in that year is currently 12.5% of the value of capital expenditure. By contrast, the Wear and Tear Allowance provides the same tax reduction, but this is spread evenly over an eight-year period.

Partridge9

I looked at the figures provided by @Partrigde9 and I'm confused. Why is the company TCO halved?

Because - if your company buys is - its before tax - so cost to you in 'real' terms is 50% (give or take)


My main reason to buy privately and I'm still doubting myself is the fact that I would end up losing my own NCB insurance wise

I contacted my insurance - and good news - I dont lose anything- my policy is the same - as long as I own 100% of the company i.e Im the only employee / im a contractor.
They did state - that if it was 80/20 ( if I only owned 80%), then they wouldnt honour the above.

On the 'what happens in the end' - I get the imperssion - people keep company cars rolling the whole time - as in - there is no transfer at the end.

JPA

unkel wrote: »

Anyone still reading this? Go test drive one. It's free. Make up your own mind.

But did you like it? Are you getting one?!

rduggy

Because - if your company buys is - its before tax - so cost to you in 'real' terms is 50% (give or take)

@Partridge - by your 50% you really mean what it would take you to pay personally vs taxable income?

Also glad to hear your insurance works that way. I have a business partner so wont work for me

catharsis

rduggy wrote: »

Hi All

I myself have been tormented on whether to buy as a company car or privately. For me, the main saving was the ability to have the company owe me all the money I contributed to payments of the car. SO essentially i would be able to take back the 50K tax-free saving myself 25k eventually that is. [/I]

I look at it pretty simply - the company pays for the depreciation, meaning that you save effectively half the cost of depreciation over the first 3 years, less the BIK payments you make.

1176/year is what the government penalises you (3528 over 3 years)
in addition the company loses 1200 SEAI grant + 600 SEAI grant for a charger.

So 'downside' of purchasing through a company is 5328 in total over 3 years.

Upside is that the company and not the person pays for the depreciation (a saving of 50%, so let's assume 15,000 based upon a loss of value of 30000 over 3 years)
In addition the company pays for tax, tyres etc ( lets assume 1000 total cost for these over 3 years, representing a personal benefit of 500)
Finally the company pays for insurance, but given that company car insurance is more expensive, lets just call that a wash for the sake of argument.

Based upon the assumptions above there's a benefit of about 10K to purchasing through a company as I see it.

caster

Partridge9 wrote: »

I contacted my insurance - and good news - I dont lose anything- my policy is the same - as long as I own 100% of the company i.e Im the only employee / im a contractor.
They did state - that if it was 80/20 ( if I only owned 80%), then they wouldnt honour the above.

On the 'what happens in the end' - I get the imperssion - people keep company cars rolling the whole time - as in - there is no transfer at the end.

Does the policy stay in your name ? Or does it go in to the company ? Also, is there an increase in premium ?

caster

Partridge9 wrote: »

Good Work Kicha ..

1. Price does not include SEBi and VRT greants. In other words it is the price before all the incentives kick in.

If you use the configurator and get a cash price of 53k, BIK Price is actually 63k (SEAI 5k + 5k BEV) However - you are entitled as a company to the 5k BEV and 3.8k SEAI - so for purposes of BIK its 63k, for ACA and actual purchase its 54.2k as that was the actual cost to the company for the asset.

2. ACA - accelerated capital allowance - maximum 24000 (pre tax). once off only claimed in first year. So you are effectively reducing the purchase price of the car but not the value that will be taken in to account for BIK calculations.

My reading is you can deduct 24k year one (the acceleration!) and then 12.5% of actual cost yearly (as normal)

3: Spot on.

4. Inspite of all this Tesla will still be expensive to own via company for people doing less than 15000 kms per year for work purposes. You will be paying BIK in the the range 1500 to 4000 per year till you own the car-. So if you are considering owning it for 10 years you will be paying 15000 - 40000 in big

BIK is a killer of company cars for personal use. but work it out... its 30% and then 50% of that ... yearly, so if you can keep the BIK <10k, it is very doable.

5. if you sell the car, you have to return to the revenue the proportion of ACA claimed by the company on the car sale.
jeasus - really... I suppose you can just trade in a tesla every two-three years and keep as company car...
Lots of maths to be worked out there.

As long as the BIK payments are only a little above your savings on 3, then surely its saving you almost 50%

On the ACA, my understanding is that 24K is the maximum capital allowance that can be claimed for a car in total. So you write off the 24K in Year 1 (with no Corp Tax liable on the 24K) *but* you will you owe back a proportion when you sell on e.g you buy for 50K and sell a few years later for 25K, you will owe them back 50% (25K/50K) of the savings the company claimed. This calculation applies regardless of the timing of selling on the car I believe.

To me, it looks like the main advantages of a company purchase are the BIK exemption (up to 50K) and the fact that the company takes the hit on the depreciation. Regarding buying it yourself personally after say 3 years, I believe you need to have an independent valuation to support your purchase price.

bf

ACA capped at €24k - so year 1 CT (cash equivalent) saving for a company is €3k (€24k x 12.5%)

Also worth noting for companies if 60% of total mileage is business mileage, 20% of the VAT element of purchase price can be claimed in next VAT return after purchase. My understanding is this would be clawed back if the vehicle is sold in first 2 years

rduggy

Partridge9 wrote: »

I looked at the figures provided by @Partrigde9 and I'm confused. Why is the company TCO halved?

Because - if your company buys is - its before tax - so cost to you in 'real' terms is 50% (give or take)


My main reason to buy privately and I'm still doubting myself is the fact that I would end up losing my own NCB insurance wise

I contacted my insurance - and good news - I dont lose anything- my policy is the same - as long as I own 100% of the company i.e Im the only employee / im a contractor.
They did state - that if it was 80/20 ( if I only owned 80%), then they wouldn't honour the above.

On the 'what happens in the end' - I get the impression - people keep company cars rolling the whole time - as in - there is no transfer at the end.

Hi Partridge i called Axa just now and they explained to me that its not possible to insure a company car personally (cannot insure something you don't own). If you do switch it you're No claims can never be taken back out of the business even as a sole trader. I explained what you mentioned and they told me to be very very wary as some insurance companies don't highlight the risks of moving a personal No Claims into a business.

Just double check for yourself

jfk75

I see the configurator has changed from "July Delivery" to "August Delivery". :-( I wonder does this confirm the rumours of delayed deliveries for Irish Model 3's?

maclek

jfk75 wrote: »

I see the configurator has changed from "July Delivery" to "August Delivery". :-( I wonder does this confirm the rumours of delayed deliveries for Irish Model 3's?

That's for new orders, existing orders are still considered July, so they'll be here on Monday.

(/s in case you missed it, no one, and that includes Tesla themselves, has any idea when they will arrive)