Tesla Model 3 thread - V2.0

bdogg

hatrack wrote: »

So everyone lost the VINs they had in the source code and got the Edit Design button back?

Yep. Mine went and I've an edit button back.

rg_lv

Same here, Edit button came back yesterday.
Decided to stop looking.

eddhorse

Same and also decided to stop looking

Old diesel

Seeing reports that ESB CCS chargers in Northern Ireland are playing up with Model 3 - issue is silly slow charge speeds of 3 kw to 28 kw .

ESB say they are aware.

The units in the North are different to the ones down here though.

Edit - one of the Northern Ireland owners reckoned the Scottish chargers worked fine with Model 3 when he went to pick the car up over there

KCross

Model 3 is having issues with Ionity in Norway too with charge sessions randomly stopping midway. Some CCS kinks they need to sort out I’d say.

mouthful

Old diesel wrote: »

Seeing reports that ESB CCS chargers in Northern Ireland are playing up with Model 3 - issue is silly slow charge speeds of 3 kw to 28 kw .

ESB say they are aware.

The units in the North are different to the ones down here though.

Edit - one of the Northern Ireland owners reckoned the Scottish chargers worked fine with Model 3 when he went to pick the car up over there

Do you know if the particular units have been identified and if there are many of them? Anyone taking a Dublin test drive might request the option to check a local ccs ChargePoint to see if this is more than a scare story.

September1

I think if government will proceed with new VRT scheme then then it would reduce price of Performance version and increase SR+ price. Some calculations in other thread https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=110767127&postcount=51

Old diesel

mouthful wrote: »

Do you know if the particular units have been identified and if there are many of them? Anyone taking a Dublin test drive might request the option to check a local ccs ChargePoint to see if this is more than a scare story.

There are 7 CCS units in Northern Ireland and 4 have been identified as having issues.

I suspect the other 3 simply have not being tested yet.

They are DBT and one ABB I think.

Seen all this via a Northern Ireland EV group - a post was shared into the Irish EV owners association facebook.

Munurty

I found a Vin last Friday and still have it in the source code.

ELM327

KCross wrote: »

Model 3 is having issues with Ionity in Norway too with charge sessions randomly stopping midway. Some CCS kinks they need to sort out I’d say.

Bjorn seems to state that the CCS used on the model 3 is not an exact match with the protocol and requires workarounds on the charge unit software side to allow the handshake to proceed. I'd say the bugs are related to this.


Ionity/Tritium chargers and the HPC >50kW chargers in general seem more prone.

September1 wrote: »

I think if government will proceed with new VRT scheme then then it would reduce price of Performance version and increase SR+ price. Some calculations in other thread https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=110767127&postcount=51

Is there a TLDR version as to why the base price goes up but the more expensive models come down?

September1

ELM327 wrote: »

Is there a TLDR version as to why the base price goes up but the more expensive models come down?

1. All Teslas would not longer qualify for VRT reduction of 5k

2. VRT rate is reduced by 50%



So lose from 1) it offset by a massive gain in 2) in more expensive models.

ELM327

Ahhhhh
Makes sense. VRT on the more expensive models can be over 25k or more. I was looking at a CPO model X 90D Ludicrous and the VRT for a 2017 one was listed as 22k after grant.

Dagryl

September1 wrote: »

1. All Teslas would not longer qualify for VRT reduction of 5k

Why?

September1

Dagryl wrote: »

Why?

Because they all have OMSP over 50k.

jarrieta

What do people think about the possibility of tariffs being removed in the next months? Damn, would be dreadful (for the early buyers) if the cars are 10% cheaper for 201 plates

Dagryl

September1 wrote: »

Because they all have OMSP over 50k.

Cash Price
€ 47,840
Includes VAT of approx. € 9,327
Includes destination and documentation fee of € 980
Includes Vehicle Registration Tax of € 2,960
Includes SEAI grant of - € 5,000

47,840 + 5,000 SEAI grant - 2,960 VRT = 49,880
49,880 < 50,000

And I don't think that VRT is calculated on top of destination and documentation fee, which reduces price to 48,900. This price matches the price from the first page of configurator.

kev22185

jarrieta wrote: »

What do people think about the possibility of tariffs being removed in the next months? Damn, would be dreadful (for the early buyers) if the cars are 10% cheaper for 201 plates

What tariffs? Do you mean a deduction in VRT? Or an increase in the SEAI grant?

Sabre Man

kev22185 wrote: »

What tariffs? Do you mean a deduction in VRT? Or an increase in the SEAI grant?

EU import taxes, currently 10%

smokybacon

Dagryl wrote: »

Cash Price
€ 47,840
Includes VAT of approx. € 9,327
Includes destination and documentation fee of € 980
Includes Vehicle Registration Tax of € 2,960
Includes SEAI grant of - € 5,000

47,840 + 5,000 SEAI grant - 2,960 VRT = 49,880
49,880 < 50,000

And I don't think that VRT is calculated on top of destination and documentation fee, which reduces price to 48,900. This price matches the price from the first page of configurator.

It’s calculated on price before grants. That amount is over 50k.

I’m more worried about the bik changes. Any comments welcome please. Or calculations.

Dagryl

smokybacon wrote: »

It’s calculated on price before grants. That amount is over 50k.

I’m more worried about the bik changes. Any comments welcome please. Or calculations.

Do you mean that VRT is calculated on a price that includes VRT?
Could you please prove your thinking with some calculations?

However if we take the amount of Includes Vehicle Registration Tax of € 2,960
(2,960 + 5,000) / 14% = 56,857
I have no clue where this number coming from. Can someone please tell me where I'm wrong?

catharsis

smokybacon wrote: »

It’s calculated on price before grants. That amount is over 50k.

The OMSP is the tesla cash price + 10K (5K VRT Rebate and 5K SEAI grant)

mouthful

jarrieta wrote: »

What do people think about the possibility of tariffs being removed in the next months? Damn, would be dreadful (for the early buyers) if the cars are 10% cheaper for 201 plates

The reality is EVs will continue to reduce in price- over the next two years, at least in my analysis. This will be a combination of increasing competition, incentives and increasing manufacturing efficiency in both batteries and cars.
I have decided I want a Tesla now but no doubt I will wince as I see the real world price of my new baby reduce quicker than I would hope- my relief from this pain will be the joy I have hopefully had in the mean while.

KCross

mouthful wrote: »

The reality is EVs will continue to reduce in price- over the next two years, at least in my analysis.

Why do you say "continue to reduce". They havent been reducing in price in the last 2 years so I wouldnt hold your breath for any significant reductions in the next 2 years from the manufacturers.

mike_2009

The existing models haven't but each new entrant might take a view to introduce at a price tier below their competition hopefully and gain their initial market share. Might force a bit of competition where there really is none today.....hopefully see a few €30K models from the new entrants....

September1

Dagryl wrote: »

Cash Price
€ 47,840
Includes VAT of approx. € 9,327
Includes destination and documentation fee of € 980
Includes Vehicle Registration Tax of € 2,960
Includes SEAI grant of - € 5,000

47,840 + 5,000 SEAI grant - 2,960 VRT = 49,880
49,880 < 50,000

And I don't think that VRT is calculated on top of destination and documentation fee, which reduces price to 48,900. This price matches the price from the first page of configurator.

OMSP does not include 5k SEAI grant and 5k VRT rebate so you have to add 10k or you can reverse calculate from VRT which is 14% of OMSP. VRT for this care is 2960 plus 5000 rebate which make it 7960. This divided by 14% gives 56857.14 which is SR+ OMSP.

mouthful

KCross wrote: »

Why do you say "continue to reduce". They havent been reducing in price in the last 2 years so I wouldnt hold your breath for any significant reductions in the next 2 years from the manufacturers.

You should perhaps review the history of Tesla pricing-

Examine the leaf- battery pack cost with the first and draw at straight line analysis to the new 2019 model- you may be surprised!

actionmo

Hi all, had a test drive of the Model 3 SR+ in Sandyford this afternoon, got some info that may be useful, apologies if it's old news.

The Tesla rep (he was from the UK and seemed to know what he was talking about) told me the following -

VINs will start being assigned in mid August at the earliest.
Once your VIN is assigned they will contact you.
Delivery will be about one month after VIN is assigned.
The VINs in the source code mean nothing.
They ship a batch of randomly configured cars, then match them to people who have ordered that configuration. They don't build to order.
They try to get to reservation holders first if the configurations match.
New orders today will be delivered in 2020 at the earliest.
If you are offered delivery for later in the year and want to hold off until January your VIN will be assigned to someone else and you'll be at the back of the queue.
Prices in your Tesla account are incorrect (due to VRT), the price in your order agreement is what you will pay (in my case it's €58,970 online and €60,810 in the order agreement).
They are driven crazy with people calling them asking for updates on delivery, I felt sorry for the poor guy. He said some people are calling every day asking the same questions.

Apart from that the car was really nice, much bigger inside than I had expected and very nice to drive. The SR+ is pretty powerful, my current car has 220BHP and this was in a different league. I have driven a Model S a good bit and they are quite similar on the road.

For what it's worth I ordered mine on April 1st 2016 and my invoice number is 61, I went for the Long Range AWD in White.

bf

I think it looks likely, unless someone gets a call in the next day or two, that there are no Irish cars on the Triumph Ace. People in the UK have been getting confirmation of August deliveries:

https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/text-message-update.160428/

This seems to suggest these cars are on the Triumph Ace - due in Zebrugge on 1st August & then 2 - 3 weeks to get them to the UK and ready.

Dagryl

September1 wrote: »

OMSP does not include 5k SEAI grant and 5k VRT rebate so you have to add 10k or you can reverse calculate from VRT which is 14% of OMSP. VRT for this care is 2960 plus 5000 rebate which make it 7960. This divided by 14% gives 56857.14 which is SR+ OMSP.

How is OMSP calculated then?

Net price of the car + 10% customs + 23% VAT + ???

jfk75

Dagryl wrote: »

How is OMSP calculated then?

Net price of the car + 10% customs + 23% VAT + ???

As far as I know it's as follows. Convert US dollar price to Euro, add on 10% EU duty, then add on VRT, then add on VAT, then add delivery charges.

Dagryl

jfk75 wrote: »

As far as I know it's as follows. Convert US dollar price to Euro, add on 10% EU duty, then add on VRT, then add on VAT, then add delivery charges.

But to calculate VRT you need to know OMSP, how can VRT be included in OMSP in this case?
To me it looks like VRT is actually higher than 14% since it's based on OMSP which seems to include VRT already. This is crazy guys.
It's like adding VAT to gross amount.

catharsis

Just add 10K !

Dagryl

catharsis wrote: »

Just add 10K !

Why?

jfk75

Dagryl wrote: »

But to calculate VRT you need to know OMSP, how can VRT be included in OMSP in this case?
To me it looks like VRT is actually higher than 14% since it's based on OMSP which seems to include VRT already. This is crazy guys.
It's like adding VAT to gross amount.

$47990 M3 LR converted to Euro is €43,032.63

43032.63 + 10% duty=€47335.90
47335.90 + VRT @14%=€;53962.92
53962.92 + VAT @23.5%=€66644.21
66644.21 - €10000 incentives = €56644.21 that's not a million miles off the €57900 sticker price on Tesla Ireland website. I'm sure SOMEONE! :-P :-P will correct my math.

Dagryl

jfk75 wrote: »

$47990 M3 LR converted to Euro is €43,032.63

43032.63 + 10% duty=€47335.90
47335.90 + VRT @14%=€;53962.92
53962.92 + VAT @23.5%=€66644.21
66644.21 - €10000 incentives = €56644.21 that's not a million miles off the €57900 sticker price on Tesla Ireland website. I'm sure SOMEONE! :-P :-P will correct my math.

From your calculation VRT is 53962.92 - 47335.90 = 6,627.02
Even if you add 23% VAT first it's 66,374.40 - 58,223.16 = 8,151.24
Tesla website for LR AWD: 4,440 + 5,000 = 9,440

How?

My idea is that OMSP is used only when you import car by yourself and dealers are using different method to calculate VRT. Any car dealer here? :>

unkel

jfk75 wrote: »

I'm sure SOMEONE! :-P :-P will correct my math.

Of course

VRT is not calculated over the base price + import duty. It is calculated over the OMSP, which is (a high percentage of) the end price the customer pays (before delivery / admin charges), not taking into account the grant or the VRT reduction. This percentage is set by the importer of the car and is usually around 92-96%, it allows for people negotiating cash discounts, etc. Perhaps in the case of Tesla with only buying online and no discounts, it is 100%

So a simple example: say your Tesla is costing you €56k of which €1k is for delivery / admin. Then the VRT is 14% * 100% * (€55k price before delivery charges + €5k grant + €5k VRT discount) = 14% * €65k = €9.1k

You actually pay only €4.1k VRT as you get the €5k discount

Hope that helps

jfk75

unkel wrote: »

Of course

VRT is not calculated over the base price + import duty. It is calculated over the OMSP, which is (a high percentage of) the end price the customer pays (before delivery / admin charges), not taking into account the grant or the VRT reduction. This percentage is set by the importer of the car and is usually around 92-96%, it allows for people negotiating cash discounts, etc. Perhaps in the case of Tesla with only buying online and no discounts, it is 100%

So a simple example: say your Tesla is costing you €56k of which €1k is for delivery / admin. Then the VRT is 14% * 100% * (€55k price before delivery charges + €5k grant + €5k VRT discount) = 14% * €65k = €9.1k

You actually pay only €4.1k VRT as you get the €5k discount

Hope that helps

SEE!.....I WAS RIGHT....SOMEONE DID CORRECT ME! Be jaybus...I must have "The Gift"!...and for my next premonition here's all your individual delivery dates ..... :-D :-P :-D :-D

KCross

mouthful wrote: »

You should perhaps review the history of Tesla pricing-

Tesla pricing is all over the place... its up and down constantly.

EV pricing in general has not gone down over the last 2 years.

mouthful wrote: »

Examine the leaf- battery pack cost with the first and draw at straight line analysis to the new 2019 model- you may be surprised!

Yea, battery pack prices have dropped but the RRP price has gone up as each new iteration of the Leaf came out and they plan to increase the price again by another €1400 in the next few weeks.... just because they can!

unkel

KCross wrote: »

just because they can!

That's it really. Supply of new EVs is very small but now there is big demand. And so in our capitalist system of free trade, prices go up. That's the way our system works, and should work. No point in giving out about it.

When manufacturers are forced to produce many or most of their cars as full EVs, we will see much increased supply and competition, bringing prices down. But that will be in 2021 at the earliest.

ELM327

Dagryl wrote: »

From your calculation VRT is 53962.92 - 47335.90 = 6,627.02
Even if you add 23% VAT first it's 66,374.40 - 58,223.16 = 8,151.24
Tesla website for LR AWD: 4,440 + 5,000 = 9,440

How?

My idea is that OMSP is used only when you import car by yourself and dealers are using different method to calculate VRT. Any car dealer here? :>

OMSP quoted for new unregistered cars at dealers does not include VRT, private OMSP is for price in Ireland which by default is the price of the new car including VRT already, essentially a tax on a tax, which of course the government loves!

September1

Dagryl wrote: »

How is OMSP calculated then?

Net price of the car + 10% customs + 23% VAT + ???

Dagryl wrote: »

How?

My idea is that OMSP is used only when you import car by yourself and dealers are using different method to calculate VRT. Any car dealer here? :>

VRT for new cars is based on declaration of Tesla source https://www.revenue.ie/en/tax-professionals/tdm/vehicle-registration-tax/vrt-manual-section-01.pdf section 4.1


It also includes all taxes.



So basically there is no way we could know exact value before Tesla shows their Irish pricing. However once pricing is revealed we can reverse calculate OMSP of new car.

jusmeig

Have we any Model 3 news or rumours?
VRT, regardless of how its calculated...will be paid...by us...for our new cars.
I booked a test drive, there seems to be lots of slots available after 2nd August if anyone wants to book in!?

BobbyBingo

jusmeig wrote: »

Have we any Model 3 news or rumours?

On the shipping front, the Triumph Ace is through the Panama Canal and on her way to Europe. The Glovis Champion is apparently currently loading up lovely RHD Model 3's with destination unknown. And finally the Glovis Prime is steaming up the west coast to Pier 80 for another load (presumably). What all this means for Irish deliveries is unfortunately anyone's guess.. Here's the Glovis Champion being loaded:

ainsyjnr

jusmeig wrote: »

Have we any Model 3 news or rumours?
VRT, regardless of how its calculated...will be paid...by us...for our new cars.
I booked a test drive, there seems to be lots of slots available after 2nd August if anyone wants to book in!?

is there somewhere on the website to book a slot? or do it over the phone?

Rowley Birkin QC

I've had an interest in Teslas since driving a Model S in Sandyford a while back. Amazing car but I'm having a few last flings with 6 Cylinder ICE before making the switch.

I have to say this thread is gas with fellas tracking VIN numbers and setting up observation points at shipping ports! Fair play lads and best of luck with yer new motors!

Takes this to whole new level....

smokybacon

ainsyjnr wrote: »

is there somewhere on the website to book a slot? or do it over the phone?

Google it.

hatrack

BobbyBingo wrote: »

On the shipping front, the Triumph Ace is through the Panama Canal and on her way to Europe. The Glovis Champion is apparently currently loading up lovely RHD Model 3's with destination unknown. And finally the Glovis Prime is steaming up the west coast to Pier 80 for another load (presumably). What all this means for Irish deliveries is unfortunately anyone's guess.. Here's the Glovis Champion being loaded:

Glovis Champion has a booking to enter Panama Canal on 1 August so that means it’s definitely for Europe. If we can believe the copy + paste emails we’ve received about deliveries at the end of August our cars should be on Glovis Champion.

Glovis Prime is a slightly smaller ship so expect that to go to China (most of the smaller ships to date have gone there).

Yeah I’m fed up waiting and watching ships too.

ainsyjnr

smokybacon wrote: »

ainsyjnr wrote: »

is there somewhere on the website to book a slot? or do it over the phone?

Google it.

thanks, i had thought that was just an email request for the S. i went ahead and submitted and then the option for the 3 appeared and the available times. unfortunately nothing at the weekend for now...i have no holidays to take for a test drive!

jusmeig

ainsyjnr wrote: »

is there somewhere on the website to book a slot? or do it over the phone?

yeap -> https://www.tesla.com/en_IE/drive

backlashs

Dose the Model 3 in Sandyford have an Irish Reg?
And dose any one have it handy,

Trying to get Insurance Quotes and not having any look with out a Reg,

Axa Wont Insure me as Im under 30