Everest

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theballz wrote: »

The French media are reporting he is dead: https://www.france24.com/en/20190517-first-everest-death-2019-irishman-missing

No, they're saying the Indian climber is dead and Seamus is missing.

theballz

tuxy wrote: »

I believe access to altitudes above 8000m is only possible between a small window in May each year so they will have to wait for next year if they wish to attempt to locate the body.
Even at the most optimal time of year It's not possible to carry out such a mission without risking 8 - 10 lives.

Human beings are not built to function at the level of a crushing 747 plane.

As mentioned I have climbed Everest. When you reach camp 4 the shocking reality is there’s really very little you can do up there other than try survive. The air is so thin that even with supplemental oxygen every minute that you spend above 26,000 feet – in what’s known as the Death Zone – you’re basically dying. The human brain becomes confused and even small movements require Herculean efforts.

Recovering a body requires a lot of effort, not to mention risk, and so most of the time they’re just left there.

recedite

Even if no Sherpa lives were put at risk, you'd have to question the ethics of spending €750,000 on getting the frozen corpse of an affluent westerner down from the top of a mountain in an earthquake ravaged third world country, and then flying that corpse back to the other side of the world (probably requiring a specially chartered aircraft).
Its certainly wrong for Coveney to offer to spend the taxpayer's money on this folly.

As a TCD grad i follow the trinity fb page. Interesting that the updates urging people to donate are getting very few likes and shares. 5 likes and 1 share on the last update from earlier today. The silence is deafening re what people are thinking....

Nobelium

NIMAN wrote: »

I think RTe are getting a bit of flak that they don't really deserve here.

They aren't ramping it or promoting it. They are simply reporting what was in the news that day/couple of days.

Its the way the media has gone now, RTe are no different to other channels.

An Irishman went missing on the most famous mountain in the world, leaving behind a wife, 4 yr old and another baby on the way. He was also raising money for charity. It has all the hallmarks of a news story.

If they never mentioned it, you'd be wondering why not.

RTE can be very poor and biased at times, but you are correct, in this instance RTE did what I wish they would do all the time, i.e. just present all the known facts accurately and without any spin or insinuation as to what opinion people should have, and then let people make up their own minds.

If by some chance, unlikely as it may be, it turns out after further investigation, his remains can be retrieved reasonably easily and without too much risk to others . . then fine.

However, I don't believe a difficult and dangerous retrieval is the right course of action.

So lets give the family, the fundraising, and the S&R some time and space to determine what it really involves and the best course of action, and then let them make up their own minds.

tuxy

€220,000 raised in two days from such a small island is a great achievement.

Snow Garden

theballz wrote: »

Human beings are not built to function at the level of a crushing 747 plane.

As mentioned I have climbed Everest. When you reach camp 4 the shocking reality is there’s really very little you can do up there other than try survive. The air is so thin that even with supplemental oxygen every minute that you spend above 26,000 feet – in what’s known as the Death Zone – you’re basically dying. The human brain becomes confused and even small movements require Herculean efforts.

Recovering a body requires a lot of effort, not to mention risk, and so most of the time they’re just left there.

If you climbed Everest, why did you copy&paste the parts in bold above from this website? Word for word.

https://mpora.com/mountaineering-expeditions/the-gruesome-truth-about-the-climbers-who-die-on-mount-everest#LdQ6QOx8p2EMZ87X.97

Actually you copied your entire post. Except you spelled cruising wrong. Probably on purpose.

I think you are a fraud. Sad.

This is it

Snow Garden wrote: »

If you climbed Everest, why did you copy&paste the parts in bold above from this website? Word for word.

https://mpora.com/mountaineering-expeditions/the-gruesome-truth-about-the-climbers-who-die-on-mount-everest#LdQ6QOx8p2EMZ87X.97

Actually you copied your entire post. Except you spelled cruising wrong.

And put crushing instead of cruising...

with all the discussion here about the gofundme page I suppose you have to bear in mind that it was set up by somebody working in Trinity (named above) and not a family member and that person probably just came up with the text herself - some of which is certainly not correct (e.g the bit about insurance) and being edited in terms of the comments that are "allowed" to remain on it.

McCrack

Snow Garden wrote: »

If you climbed Everest, why did you copy&paste the parts in bold above from this website? Word for word.

https://mpora.com/mountaineering-expeditions/the-gruesome-truth-about-the-climbers-who-die-on-mount-everest#LdQ6QOx8p2EMZ87X.97

Actually you copied your entire post. Except you spelled cruising wrong.

I think you are a fraud. Sad.

I thought it was pretty obvious the poster was acting Walter mitty claiming to have climbed everest

wrestlemaniac

Snow Garden wrote: »

If you climbed Everest, why did you copy&paste the parts in bold above from this website? Word for word.

https://mpora.com/mountaineering-expeditions/the-gruesome-truth-about-the-climbers-who-die-on-mount-everest#LdQ6QOx8p2EMZ87X.97

Actually you copied your entire post. Except you spelled cruising wrong.

I think you are a fraud. Sad.

Definitely a fraud, just had a quick scan through his post history since you posted that!! Sad really

pc7

wrestlemaniac wrote: »

Definitely a fraud, just had a quick scan through his post history since you posted that!! Sad really

I was going to say would be a great AMA in the future, I’m too believing

tuxy

Does anyone have info on Ravi Thakar? Did he leave any family behind and will they need financial help also?

Hal3000

Snow Garden wrote: »

If you climbed Everest, why did you copy&paste the parts in bold above from this website? Word for word.

https://mpora.com/mountaineering-expeditions/the-gruesome-truth-about-the-climbers-who-die-on-mount-everest#LdQ6QOx8p2EMZ87X.97

Actually you copied your entire post. Except you spelled cruising wrong. Probably on purpose.

I think you are a fraud. Sad.

That's pretty embarrassing!

Richard Hillman

Richard Hillman wrote: »

The government are now weighing in (Simon Coveney) offering financial support.

Government will help family of Trinity professor who went missing on Everest 'in any way possible' https://jrnl.ie/4642667

Comments closed for some reason. Is this guy connected to the media/political establishment in some way?

That help is available to any Irish family when one of them dies abroad.

KevRossi

The bit that got me from the beginning is knowing it will cost €750,000 to recover him, even though they have no idea where the body actually is. If they don't know where it is, how can they know how much it will cost to get it down.

It's beginning to stink a bit. The page needs to have some auditors and a commitment needs to be made that all expenses and accounts will be always freely available.

Ultimate Seduction

Snow Garden wrote: »

If you climbed Everest, why did you copy&paste the parts in bold above from this website? Word for word.

https://mpora.com/mountaineering-expeditions/the-gruesome-truth-about-the-climbers-who-die-on-mount-everest#LdQ6QOx8p2EMZ87X.97

Actually you copied your entire post. Except you spelled cruising wrong. Probably on purpose.

I think you are a fraud. Sad.

How mortifying! Word for Word hahaha

kurtainsider

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

I hope he is found. And if he died he died doing what he loved.

I agree - just like my uncle who drank himself to death. What a hero.

gctest50

tuxy wrote: »

With crowd funding like this media coverage and timing are the most important factors. Olivia Waters has done an excellent job, the way she worded the description of the situation and quick moderation(censorship) of comments about the reality of the situation has paid off.


€220,000 raised in two days from such a small island is a great achievement.

A great achievement since it seems to some sherpa lives are worth less than the body of a rich westerner who was doing it for midlife crisis / bragging rights -

which is all it is at this stage unless :

no sherpas
no guide ropes
no oxygen




( unless it was a dress rehersal for next year )

Crusty Jocks

Interesting...

https://www.quora.com/Are-there-pictures-of-Rob-Hall%E2%80%99s-body-after-the-incident-in-Everest


"dead bodies on Everest have frozen into solid nearly immobile very heavy objects on a mountain where just taking one step takes three to five breaths. There is almost no way to be able to transport the dead bodies down, and any such effort would come at great risk to the lives of the persons trying to move the bodies."

"The case of Hannelore Schmatz is an infamous one. On October 2, 1979, after a successful summit, and for reasons unclear, she died of exhaustion 100 meters short of reaching Camp IV. For years, any climber attempting the southern route could see her body, sitting, leaning against her backpack with her eyes open and brown hair blowing in the wind. Despite being so exposed and so visible along the well-trodden climbing route, rescue operations are virtually suicidal in the Death Zone. A Nepalese police inspector and a Sherpa who tried to recover Hannelore's body in 1984 both fell to their deaths. It was finally high winds that blew her remains over the edge and down the Kangshung face"

He's dead, and he's not coming down the mountain...its like trying to move a bolder of rock down kilometres of near vertical ice. To say this much you don't need to know anything about mountain climbing, just the very basic amount about physics and human physiology and more importantly both of those combined under the circumstances. It's not happening. The family need to be informed and Simon Coveney needs to be blunt with them about what can be done which is absolutely nothing in terms of body repatriation.

If that money goes to sherpas on some daft rescue mission I hope they do nothing and take the money. As mentioned earlier on in the thread, this film is well worth a watch

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt3746250/

Go Fund Me and the likes of them need some kind of responsible regulation, this is grossly endangering further lives which seem to be totally expendable.

kurtainsider

el Fenomeno wrote: »

On the "raising money for charity" aspect, I'd note that the fundraiser page says:

" Everything that we raise above and beyond our expedition costs will go directly to Barretstown"

With him having already reached the summit yesterday and only 7k raised, none of this money was going to charity. You'd need to raise many, many multiples of that before you could even think of what you're going to do with the spare change.

Dear All
I've a fantastic idea for raising much needed funds for Barretstown. I am offering to selflessly go to Ibiza in August for a week. I will, without a moments consideration for myself, visit the bars, restaurants and clubs of Ibiza. Drink myself into a stupor for this worthy cause. Everything that I raise above and beyond our expedition costs will go directly to Barretstown.

Will somebody please think of the kids!!!!

recedite

Deleted User wrote: »

That help is available to any Irish family when one of them dies abroad.

Its a bit different if your mate gets hit by a lorry while crossing the road in Barcelona, and you have no idea what to do next.


In this situation there were serious known risks that were considered and planned for. It is also well known that any dead bodies tend to get left up there.

Nobelium

Crusty Jocks wrote: »

Interesting...

https://www.quora.com/Are-there-pictures-of-Rob-Hall%E2%80%99s-body-after-the-incident-in-Everest


"dead bodies on Everest have frozen into solid nearly immobile very heavy objects on a mountain where just taking one step takes three to five breaths. There is almost no way to be able to transport the dead bodies down, and any such effort would come at great risk to the lives of the persons trying to move the bodies."

"The case of Hannelore Schmatz is an infamous one. On October 2, 1979, after a successful summit, and for reasons unclear, she died of exhaustion 100 meters short of reaching Camp IV. For years, any climber attempting the southern route could see her body, sitting, leaning against her backpack with her eyes open and brown hair blowing in the wind. Despite being so exposed and so visible along the well-trodden climbing route, rescue operations are virtually suicidal in the Death Zone. A Nepalese police inspector and a Sherpa who tried to recover Hannelore's body in 1984 both fell to their deaths. It was finally high winds that blew her remains over the edge and down the Kangshung face"

He's dead, and he's not coming down the mountain...its like trying to move a bolder of rock down kilometres of near vertical ice. To say this much you don't need to know anything about mountain climbing, just the very basic amount about physics and human physiology and more importantly both of those combined under the circumstances. It's not happening. The family need to be informed and Simon Coveney needs to be blunt with them about what can be done which is absolutely nothing in terms of body repatriation.

If that money goes to sherpas on some daft rescue mission I hope they do nothing and take the money. As mentioned earlier on in the thread, this film is well worth a watch

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt3746250/

Go Fund Me and the likes of them need some kind of responsible regulation, this is grossly endangering further lives which seem to be totally expendable.

Does anyone know yet what height/altitude Seamus Lawless's (RIP) remains are lying at ?

What's the maximum height/altitude bodies have been successfully retrieved from with acceptable risk ?

Crusty Jocks

kurtainsider wrote: »

I agree - just like my uncle who drank himself to death. What a hero.

If your uncle drank himself to death he most certainly did not love drinking, or anything.

tuxy

Noel Richmond Hanna is an Irishman who has been to the summit of Everest many times, he was the leader of the expedition that Seamus was on. Wouldn't he be able to give advice to both the family and Irish government?

Blaizes

Deleted User wrote: »

Richard Hillman wrote: »

The government are now weighing in (Simon Coveney) offering financial support.

Government will help family of Trinity professor who went missing on Everest 'in any way possible' https://jrnl.ie/4642667

Comments closed for some reason. Is this guy connected to the media/political establishment in some way?

That help is available to any Irish family when one of them dies abroad.

That’s true, consular assistance.

bucketybuck

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

However, I doubt that anyone about to set off on a trek like that would think there was any chance of them dying while trying it.

You can't be serious? Climbing something like Everest is inherently dangerous, they are literally climbing in the death zone! Perhaps they might think it won't happen to them, but they will absolutely know that the chance and risk of death is there for anybody making the attempt.

Thinking that there was no chance of them dying while trying to climb Everest would just be bizarre.

tuxy

Correct, it's well know that for every 100 people that make it 3 will die. How could you not take that into consideration.

kurtainsider

Crusty Jocks wrote: »

If your uncle drank himself to death he most certainly did not love drinking, or anything.

No he loved it. He'd actually have loved it even more if, like this Everest expedition, he'd hit upon a wheeze to get other people to fund it. He had to pay for his hobby all by himself.

Why is it that some self indulgent, expensive, destructive-of-family, dangerous pursuits are seen by some as heroic while other, less selfish, ones aren't?

tuxy

tuxy wrote: »

Does anyone have info on Ravi Thakar? Did he leave any family behind and will they need financial help also?

To quote Animal Farm 'Some animals are more equal than others' :mad: