Fine Gael TD sues Dublin Hotel after falling off swing

inforfun

InTheShadows wrote: »

It's events like this that make me sit back shake my head and wonder if things will ever change on our little island.

You think it is different elsewhere?
We are talking politicians. Carreer politicians even. 90% of them are dodgy as ****

In The Netherlands we had Tara Singh Varma

Singh Varma Affair
In 2000 Singh Varma claimed that she was less able to perform her work as Member of Parliament. Twice she appeared in the House of Representatives in a wheelchair. She claimed to suffer from an incurable form of cancer and announced that she would leave the House of Representatives to prepare for the end of her life.

In June 2001 the TROS television show Opgelicht?! (in English Conned?!) discovered that Singh Varma did not suffer from cancer.[1][2] Moreover, according to this program, Singh Varma had not fulfilled financial promises to the Indian development organization Ninash Foundation, which had put the organization into financial problems.

First Singh Varma denied both claims and sued the journalists. In August 2001 she claimed that she had not suffered from cancer and instead suffered from post traumatic stress disorder after self-fabricated far right threats and her commitment to the victims of the plane crash in the Bijlmermeer. In 2002 she publicly apologized for her actions. She denied lying on purpose about her diseases and stated that she suffered from delusions and medical condition called pseudologia fantastica.[3] Paul Rosenmöller, political leader of the GreenLeft at the time writes that he felt "cheated and angry" because of her revelations.[4]

Beat that.

ChikiChiki

Jupiter Mulligan wrote: »

If you know different -as presumably you do, otherwise you wouldn't have written such a sarcastic comment - then the world of Boards.ie awaits your wisdom!

I'm all agog! Should I hold my breath while you explain how other parties could have reduced the costs?

Smaller wards? Fewer patients? No car parks? Reduced operating theatres? No toilet facilities for visitors?

Or perhaps you'd simply have scrapped the whole thing and started again!

They should have reviewed the estimates in the first place with a fine tooth comb before signing off on an abnormally low bid leaving it open for BAM to run amok.

Inexperience and incompetence.

ChikiChiki

mad muffin wrote: »

HAHA MOTHERFÜCKING HA!!!!

Varadkar is too concerned and preoccupied with his image and what he’ll do after being Taoiseach to ever be an effective leader. His focus an absolute shambles, and it’s all his own doing.

If FG get re-elected and Leo wins back his seat, I’ll eat my hat. And if FF lose, they should disband and go into exile because an easier win will never been seen again.

Leo will make an absolute fortune on the consulting and after dinner speeches circuit when his Taoiseach gig is done. Its a funny old world.

blinding

ChikiChiki wrote: »

They should have reviewed the estimates in the first place with a fine tooth comb before signing off on an abnormally low bid leaving it open for BAM to run amok.

Inexperience and incompetence.

And Bam said

Wham Bam thank you Mam !:eek:

mad muffin

ChikiChiki wrote: »

Leo will make an absolute fortune on the consulting and after dinner speeches circuit when his Taoiseach gig is done. Its a funny old world.

I have absolutely no doubt that you are 100% correct in that.

ArrBee

It's a shame this thread has devolved into a series of party political PR messages.

The only party aspect that should be relevant is how FG respond to the Maria Bailey situation.
Comparing it to other grievances (as if some other party is actually any better, lol) is just pushing an agenda. as is brushing over what MB has done and the response from FG.


I don't think this issue has people angry because she is FG.
I think it has people angry because she is a politician, a public servant and should know better.
This topic should absolutely be the catalyst for change, if that means she is made an example of then so be it. If she didn't want that to happen then she shouldn't have started the ball rolling.

NIMAN

The party she is connected to is totally irrelevant to me.

Its the fact that she is a TD and is making such a stupid claim.
If she had been in a car accident, or something more serious, but falling on your arse off a swing and then claiming she should have been supervised.

I think she deserves every single bit of ridicule she's getting. Hopefully we are getting a head of steam up for false claims, and more frauds are exposed daily.

BattleCorp

ArrBee wrote: »

The only party aspect that should be relevant is how FG respond to the Maria Bailey situation.

If she hasn't been convicted of doing anything illegal, can Fine Gael kick her out? Or would that open the door to her taking legal action against the party?

ohnonotgmail

BattleCorp wrote: »

If she hasn't been convicted of doing anything illegal, can Fine Gael kick her out? Or would that open the door to her taking legal action against the party?

Of course they can kick her out. She has brought the party into disrepute.

tototoe

InTheShadows wrote: »

I hope he continues with his weak "leadership" all the way until the next election when he'll be kicked out on his arse himself.

Here here, an utter waste of space imo. One of the worst taoisigh ever...and that's saying something.

Snow Garden

tototoe wrote: »

Here here, an utter waste of space imo. One of the worst taoisigh ever...and that's saying something.

Enda was worse. Massive opportunity in 2011 with a massive government majority and no credible opposition but he blew it. Achieved nothing. Got lucky that economy recovered. He could have fixed so many problems and retired a success. Too afraid.

Snow Garden

ChikiChiki wrote: »

They should have reviewed the estimates in the first place with a fine tooth comb before signing off on an abnormally low bid leaving it open for BAM to run amok.

Inexperience and incompetence.

Don't you worry. Some politicians benefit from the BAM selection.

ArrBee

BattleCorp wrote: »

If she hasn't been convicted of doing anything illegal, can Fine Gael kick her out? Or would that open the door to her taking legal action against the party?

If you are asking me personally (As opposed to rhetorically musing), I have already suggested that yes they can. It might have been a direct to reply to you. aaaaaages ago.

I wouldn't know though. It depends on what their rules of party membership and disciplinary governance is. I would suggest that any party that doesn't have clauses in there membership charter that allow them to expel members regardless of criminal conviction would be the icing on the cake in a "they really don't know what the feck they are doing" kind of a way.
I'd go as far as to say you'd be naïve to think that they can't expel her. Perhaps intentionally so?

FG may yet choose some disciplinary action or none.
My point is, that what FG do as it relates to this is absolutely fair game. It's how people will judge where FG stand on such issues.

If FG choose to do nothing then it will send a message that the PR machine will have to defend by jumping on boards to post drivel like "their hands were tied"


You don't have to be a criminal to be "kicked out". Just ask professional sports people how it goes when they "bring the game into disrepute"

ArrBee

NIMAN wrote: »

The party she is connected to is totally irrelevant to me.

Its the fact that she is a TD and is making such a stupid claim.
If she had been in a car accident, or something more serious, but falling on your arse off a swing and then claiming she should have been supervised.

I think she deserves every single bit of ridicule she's getting. Hopefully we are getting a head of steam up for false claims, and more frauds are exposed daily.

Good.

There are only a fairly small number in this thread that seem to be banging a party drum.

Chiparus

ArrBee wrote: »

If you are asking me personally (As opposed to rhetorically musing), I have already suggested that yes they can. It might have been a direct to reply to you. aaaaaages ago.

I wouldn't know though. It depends on what their rules of party membership and disciplinary governance is. I would suggest that any party that doesn't have clauses in there membership charter that allow them to expel members regardless of criminal conviction would be the icing on the cake in a "they really don't know what the feck they are doing" kind of a way.
I'd go as far as to say you'd be naïve to think that they can't expel her. Perhaps intentionally so?

FG may yet choose some disciplinary action or none.
My point is, that what FG do as it relates to this is absolutely fair game. It's how people will judge where FG stand on such issues.

If FG choose to do nothing then it will send a message that the PR machine will have to defend by jumping on boards to post drivel like "their hands were tied"


You don't have to be a criminal to be "kicked out". Just ask professional sports people how it goes when they "bring the game into disrepute"

Just like Willie O'Dea compared to Bertie Ahern its only when it hurts them in the ballot box , that they will take action.

But south county Dublin is a bit different, as the electorate will kick her out , as they did with "Holy"Mary Hanafin. FG DL might be wise to de-select her.

josip

ChikiChiki wrote: »

They should have reviewed the estimates in the first place with a fine tooth comb before signing off on an abnormally low bid leaving it open for BAM to run amok.

Inexperience and incompetence.

Isn't that oversight and due diligence the job of the permanent civil servants in the relevant departments rather than the government of the day?

BattleCorp

ArrBee wrote: »

I have already suggested that yes they can.
I wouldn't know though. It depends on what their rules of party membership and disciplinary governance is.

This is not a personal attack so please don't take it as one but you seem very sure that FG can throw her out of the party yet you admit that you don't know the rules. My question was genuine, as I don't know the rules either.

Do I think she deserves to be booted out, probably. But getting enough proof to boot people out can be difficult.

FG may yet choose some disciplinary action or none.
My point is, that what FG do as it relates to this is absolutely fair game. It's how people will judge where FG stand on such issues. If FG choose to do nothing then it will send a message that the PR machine will have to defend by jumping on boards to post drivel like "their hands were tied"

I'm guessing that FG will take the cowardly option and hope that this all passes. I'd be surprised if they kick her out.

You don't have to be a criminal to be "kicked out". Just ask professional sports people how it goes when they "bring the game into disrepute"

Agreed. But Falou was kicked out by his employer. FG aren't (as far as I am aware) Bailey's employer. And Falou had the option of appealing the dismissal. He chose not to. And if his appeal failed, he would then have had the option of going to court.

Given Bailey's fondness for litigation, FG would need all their ducks in a row before they go kicking her out.

McMurphy

BattleCorp wrote: »

This is not a personal attack so please don't take it as one but you seem very sure that FG can throw her out of the party yet you admit that you don't know the rules. My question was genuine, as I don't know the rules either.

Do I think she deserves to be booted out, probably. But getting enough proof to boot people out can be difficult.

I'm guessing that FG will take the cowardly option and hope that this all passes. I'd be surprised if they kick her out.

Agreed. But Falou was kicked out by his employer. FG aren't (as far as I am aware) Bailey's employer. And Falou had the option of appealing the dismissal. He chose not to. And if his appeal failed, he would then have had the option of going to court.

Given Bailey's fondness for litigation, FG would need all their ducks in a row before they go kicking her out.

If the CCTV footage is ever released, they might have no option but to kick her out, and then some more with her.

ohnonotgmail

BattleCorp wrote: »

This is not a personal attack so please don't take it as one but you seem very sure that FG can throw her out of the party yet you admit that you don't know the rules. My question was genuine, as I don't know the rules either.

Do I think she deserves to be booted out, probably. But getting enough proof to boot people out can be difficult.

I'm guessing that FG will take the cowardly option and hope that this all passes. I'd be surprised if they kick her out.

Agreed. But Falou was kicked out by his employer. FG aren't (as far as I am aware) Bailey's employer. And Falou had the option of appealing the dismissal. He chose not to. And if his appeal failed, he would then have had the option of going to court.

Given Bailey's fondness for litigation, FG would need all their ducks in a row before they go kicking her out.

section 44B.1 though i think you are being deliberately obtuse.

https://www.finegael.ie/app/uploads/2017/05/FG-Constitution-2014-Aug.pdf

Sajid Javid

blinding wrote: »

Surely her miracle recovery and not giving credit to All Mighty God must be some sort of Crime .

Not if your a Satanist.

James Brown

BattleCorp wrote: »

The problem with personal injury claims here is that the bar is set too high for employers and business owners.

Like it or not, Bailey had grounds to sue once she fell off the swing. Would she have won, I don't know. I have my doubts. By the way, you don't have to be guaranteed a win to put in a claim. I've seen people do the dumbest sh1t and still put in a claim even though they caused the accident. And unfortunately they still usually end up winning.

For those of you who are saying that Bailey should be done for fraud, while I agree with your sentiments, it's clear that you aren't familiar with PI claims and how easy it is to succeed with them. There's zero chance Bailey will be charged with fraud.

Just to echo Eagle Eye, I'm surprised the hotel gave their files to a third party. Unless Bailey gave permission, that is.

In that she did fall. Knowing she was holding beer in one hand and reaching for wine with the other, causing her to fall would say she knew right well it was on her, therefore putting in a claim based on lack of supervision or the seat being highly polished was the most spurious of claims, but as you say, she'd a right to try it on.
Would you 'having your doubts' be the lamest of attempts in coming across as unbiased? That ship has sailed for both yourself and eagle eye.

Jupiter Mulligan

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

Just found it odd you singled out SF. And the term activist. What did you mean by that?

1. I "singled out" the SF MEP because she was the only one to have lost her seat. I can't really see what's particularly "odd" about that.

2. It is widely known - although obviously not to you - that elected members of the Sinn Féin Movement are told who to employ by Head Office. (I'm not exactly sure how that works out in the case of their absentee Westminster MPs, so maybe you could do a bit of digging and let me know.)

Sajid Javid

BattleCorp wrote: »

If she hasn't been convicted of doing anything illegal, can Fine Gael kick her out? Or would that open the door to her taking legal action against the party?

To have to kick out a TD is Misfortune having to kick a TD and a Minister that is a conspiracy.

Jupiter Mulligan

ChikiChiki wrote: »

They should have reviewed the estimates in the first place with a fine tooth comb before signing off on an abnormally low bid leaving it open for BAM to run amok.

Inexperience and incompetence.

Who are "they"? Obviously not the politicians because they certainly aren't competent to evaluate complex tenders for billion euro construction projects.

So do you mean the Civil Servants?

Like the politicians the vast majority of Civil Servants are generalists and aren't qualified or competent to assess complex construction tenders or to manage high value capital projects, so they normally outsource them either to consultants or to multi-disciplinary project teams.

In this case, the project was assigned to "The National Paediatric Hospital Development Board" which is ... "responsible for overseeing the building of the hospital. The skill set of the Board includes planning, architecture, design, engineering, construction, procurement, clinical, legal and financial capabilities of the highest order."

Membership: http://www.newchildrenshospital.ie/the-project/national-paediatric-hospital-development-board/

And these, it appears, are the bozos who (it is claimed) failed to inform the government about the massive increase in the cost of the new hospital until too late. In Feb 2019, when the brown stuff hit the fan, the chairman of the Board, Tom Costello, fell on his sword following the controversy over the escalating cost of the project. He had been chairman for 5 years.

If you (and all of the other Mister Angrys out there) are looking for someone to blame, then why not at least try to blame the right people!

PS I'm angry too - my pet project probably won't be funded for the next decade because of this omnishambles.

mcmoustache

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

section 44B.1 though i think you are being deliberately obtuse.

https://www.finegael.ie/app/uploads/2017/05/FG-Constitution-2014-Aug.pdf

I saw this earlier today. It looks like a fairly standard disciplinary disciplinary process that any large club would have. There's no requirement that laws be broken or that accusations meet anything like the burden of proof that would be required in a court.

To add to that, it's not unprecedented for people to be kicked out of the party. Lucinda Creighton was booted out in 2013 for defying the whip. Defying a party whip isn't any kind of statutory offence that I'm aware of.

I'll also add that expulsion from the party does not mean expulsion from the Dáil.

ohnonotgmail

mcmoustache wrote: »

I saw this earlier today. It looks like a fairly standard disciplinary disciplinary process that any large club would have. There's no requirement that laws be broken or that accusations meet anything like the burden of proof that would be required in a court.

To add to that, it's not unprecedented for people to be kicked out of the party. Lucinda Creighton was booted out in 2013 for defying the whip. Defying a party whip isn't any kind of statutory offence that I'm aware of.

I'll also add that expulsion from the party does not mean expulsion from the Dáil.

Its all pretty standard stuff. They could expel her from the parliamentary party by removing the whip and let her stay in the party itself. They can do this temporarily. they have lots of options.

RustyNut

Jupiter Mulligan wrote: »

Who are "they"? Obviously not the politicians because they certainly aren't competent to evaluate complex tenders for billion euro construction projects.

So do you mean the Civil Servants?

Like the politicians the vast majority of Civil Servants are generalists and aren't qualified or competent to assess complex construction tenders or to manage high value capital projects, so they normally outsource them either to consultants or to multi-disciplinary project teams.

In this case, the project was assigned to "The National Paediatric Hospital Development Board" which is ... "responsible for overseeing the building of the hospital. The skill set of the Board includes planning, architecture, design, engineering, construction, procurement, clinical, legal and financial capabilities of the highest order."

Membership: http://www.newchildrenshospital.ie/the-project/national-paediatric-hospital-development-board/

And these, it appears, are the bozos who (it is claimed) failed to inform the government about the massive increase in the cost of the new hospital until too late. In Feb 2019, when the brown stuff hit the fan, the chairman of the Board, Tom Costello, fell on his sword following the controversy over the escalating cost of the project. He had been chairman for 5 years.

If you (and all of the other Mister Angrys out there) are looking for someone to blame, then why not at least try to blame the right people!

PS I'm angry too - my pet project probably won't be funded for the next decade because of this omnishambles.

Well when members of the governing party dont have the intellect to know that you need to hold onto a swing or you will most likely fall on your arse, complex contracts are definitely going to challenge them.

The buck stops at the top desk in this case the minister's.The NCH is a brexit project, every cat dog and divil can see the massive problems with it that the children of Ireland will have to suffer for generations but Leo will just push ahead anyway with tory like arrogance.

Remind us again what qualifications this guy has to run the health services? A masters in public administration perhaps?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YXbP_FQ81FI

Plumbthedepths

RustyNut wrote:

Remind us again what qualifications this guy has to run the health services? A masters in public administration perhaps?

Pretty sure Harris dropped out of college with no qualifications, not defending the guy but his leader was also the minister for health ( Leo's a qualified doctor) think he was also useless although was exceptional at commenting on other departments.

Jupiter Mulligan

RustyNut wrote: »

Remind us again what qualifications this guy has to run the health services? A masters in public administration perhaps?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YXbP_FQ81FI

Exceptionally clever, apart, of course from the fact that he's not running the Health Service,

this guy is:

vriesmays

What did Simon Harris say to Bailey: How low can you go.