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IBT Question - Bear with me...

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  • 23-05-2019 1:20pm
    #1
    seblex
    Registered Users Posts: 28 ✭


    Hi,

    Riding bikes all my life. Stopped the riding and now want to go back.
    None of this has anything to do with my question.

    Booked in for IBT soon.

    Rang insurance company to sort out the quote on the bike.
    They asked when id like to start the insurance. I said i just need to sort the IBT out and get the cert over to you.

    They said they dont need the cert they go on my word.

    So my question;

    What is to stop anyone simply saying "yeah i have that" and jumping up on the bike. OK im sure insurance is null and void in the event of an accident if you dont have a cert but thats it isnt it? There is no way for it to be checked?

    Maybe you need to produce it at test center for full license???

    Anyone know the legals?

    Thanks!


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    #2
    LastStop
    Registered Users Posts: 309 ✭✭LastStop


    seblex wrote: »
    Hi,

    Riding bikes all my life. Stopped the riding and now want to go back.
    None of this has anything to do with my question.

    Booked in for IBT soon.

    Rang insurance company to sort out the quote on the bike.
    They asked when id like to start the insurance. I said i just need to sort the IBT out and get the cert over to you.

    They said they dont need the cert they go on my word.

    So my question;

    What is to stop anyone simply saying "yeah i have that" and jumping up on the bike. OK im sure insurance is null and void in the event of an accident if you dont have a cert but thats it isnt it? There is no way for it to be checked?

    Maybe you need to produce it at test center for full license???

    Anyone know the legals?

    Thanks!

    With insurance it comes down to if you need to make a claim. Just like with modifications. You can say you have none and they won't ask to inspect the bike/car. but if you go to claim and what you've stated while getting the policy is incorrect then your insurance is null and void.


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    #3
    seblex
    Registered Users Posts: 28 ✭seblex


    yeah thought so myself. I just thought with it being a compulsory thing that it would be a document they would ask for.
    Business side of it is I suppose they are happy to take your money and void your insurance because you lied on your policy so they dont have to pay out. Win Win for them really


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    #4
    IrishGrimReaper
    Registered Users Posts: 1,033 ✭✭✭IrishGrimReaper


    You need to have the IBT cert on you at all times while you're a learner. As well as learner tabard.

    Not sure what happens if you don't have it on you if the guards stopped you and asked to see it; I'm sure they can check the system with the RSA to see if you've actually done it or not; and if not you're going to get wrecked.

    For the full test you need to show it to the Instructor before he will let you do the test.


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    #5
    ayux4rj6zql2ph
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,001 ✭✭✭ayux4rj6zql2ph


    Had to produce my IBT cert to my insurance company before they validated the policy.

    Regarding the test, if you don’t have it don’t them the RSA won’t log it on your file but may still issue a test date, I know with cars if EDT is not done they won’t issue a date.

    Either way you won’t be able to sit a driving test without it and will be in hot water with insurers in the event of a claim.


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    #6
    honda boi
    Registered Users Posts: 1,719 ✭✭✭honda boi


    Was never asked to show the insurance company an ibt.
    Tho When I was ringing for quotes for the missus some wouldn't even give me a quote because she hasn't done ibt. Makes no sense as if I said yes how they gonna know .
    For the test I was never asked for it so I'm guessing they have it on the system and know who has it done or they don't care.


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    #7
    galwaytt
    Registered Users Posts: 12,776 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    LastStop wrote: »
    With insurance it comes down to if you need to make a claim. Just like with modifications. You can say you have none and they won't ask to inspect the bike/car. but if you go to claim and what you've stated while getting the policy is incorrect then your insurance is null and void.

    Only kinda.

    For the purposes of the Road Traffic Act, you're covered: once a Cert has been issued the Ins Co has to honour any claim against it. So can't get prosecuted for No Insurance.

    However, as soon as that's done, they'll be after you and all your belongings to claim it back in civil court. Insurance is given on what's called Utmost Good Faith and by lying well.............you're not Good !!

    And that's before you get blacklisted by insurance companies and woe betide you ever try to buy any insurance again: car, house, bike.....

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



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    #8
    galwaytt
    Registered Users Posts: 12,776 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    seblex wrote: »
    yeah thought so myself. I just thought with it being a compulsory thing that it would be a document they would ask for.
    Business side of it is I suppose they are happy to take your money and void your insurance because you lied on your policy so they dont have to pay out. Win Win for them really


    Nope, they do have to pay out, and then you're liable for all expenses with no protection.

    Would you risk your house over bike insurance ??

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



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    #9
    seblex
    Registered Users Posts: 28 ✭seblex


    IrishGrimReaper wrote: »
    You need to have the IBT cert on you at all times while you're a learner. As well as learner tabard.

    If you have a full license in a different category you dont need to wear the tabard as you are not a novice on the road


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    #10
    IrishGrimReaper
    Registered Users Posts: 1,033 ✭✭✭IrishGrimReaper


    Do you have a learner permit or a full license for the category you're doing the IBT for?

    If you're returning to bikes and hold a full A license that didn't expire I'm surprised the IBT is mandatory.


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    #11
    Xodar
    Registered Users Posts: 118 ✭✭Xodar


    seblex wrote: »
    If you have a full license in a different category you dont need to wear the tabard as you are not a novice on the road

    Is this 100% true?


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    #12
    seblex
    Registered Users Posts: 28 ✭seblex


    IrishGrimReaper wrote: »
    Do you have a learner permit or a full license for the category you're doing the IBT for?

    If you're returning to bikes and hold a full A license that didn't expire I'm surprised the IBT is mandatory.

    I let my license expire a few years ago. Back on the provo for the bike.


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    #13
    seblex
    Registered Users Posts: 28 ✭seblex


    Xodar wrote: »
    Is this 100% true?

    Seems to be. I checked a few things out before jumping back on.
    1 - I would not be restricted to power (My age helps with that :) )
    2 - As i have a full license in a different catagory i have sat the test and I am not a novice on the road.
    3 - Did i have to do IBT even with advanced training previously (Yes i do)


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    #14
    IrishGrimReaper
    Registered Users Posts: 1,033 ✭✭✭IrishGrimReaper


    Then you 100% need to be wearing the L high vis by law. Other categories don't matter.

    If you do or not is up to you. I had my L vest on for a few months but it started to get cold so I had a thick high vis fleeced vest I wore instead.


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    #15
    Xodar
    Registered Users Posts: 118 ✭✭Xodar


    seblex wrote: »
    Seems to be. I checked a few things out before jumping back on.
    1 - I would not be restricted to power (My age helps with that :) )
    2 - As i have a full license in a different catagory i have sat the test and I am not a novice on the road.
    3 - Did i have to do IBT even with advanced training previously (Yes i do)

    Ahhh, I mis-read the post (or read what I wanted to read).

    On point 2 - As i have a full license in a different catagory i have sat the test and I am not a novice on the road - I read that as : If I have a full licence Cat B (car) that I do not need to wear an 'N' tabbard or a 'L' tabbard. Now, on second reading, I'm thinking it means a full licence in another bike category (AM, A1, A2) and the tabbard is not required.


    Finally, I now believe it to understand:
    If I have a full licence for a car I do not need to wear an 'N' tabbard but I do need to wear a 'L' tabbard....


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    #16
    IrishGrimReaper
    Registered Users Posts: 1,033 ✭✭✭IrishGrimReaper


    It's like this folks, if you're on a learner permit for a particular category and you're using that category bike you need to have an L vest on. your other categories or licenses for a car etc don't matter.

    You are seen as a learner for that class of bike.

    When you pass the test on that category and you are using that category vehicle you need to use an N vest for 2 years, regardless of other categories or if you have a full license for a car etc for 10 years.

    You are seen as a novice for that class of bike.

    If you wear them or not it's up to you, but you're overthinking it by adding other factors into it. All that matters is the learner permit for that class of bike.


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    #17
    honda boi
    Registered Users Posts: 1,719 ✭✭✭honda boi


    IrishGrimReaper wrote: »
    It's like this folks, if you're on a learner permit for a particular category and you're using that category bike you need to have an L vest on. your other categories or licenses for a car etc don't matter.

    You are seen as a learner for that class of bike.

    When you pass the test on that category and you are using that category vehicle you need to use an N vest for 2 years, regardless of other categories or if you have a full license for a car etc for 10 years.

    You are seen as a novice for that class of bike.

    If you wear them or not it's up to you, but you're overthinking it by adding other factors into it. All that matters is the learner permit for that class of bike.

    I always assumed once you had a full licence for let's say a car since 2012. Go to do the bike test and pass and get your full bike licence tomorrow, that your not a novice .
    That's what I gathered reading this on the RSA site :
    "A person granted a first full driving licence on or after 1 August 2014 must display N-plates on the vehicle for a period of 2 years, and during that period display N-plates on any other vehicle in respect of which they get a driving licence. Where the vehicle is a motorcycle, the rider must wear an N – tabard."
    And
    "The novice period applies only once ie someone who holds a driving licence for a category of vehicle and who after a period of two years becomes entitled to drive another category, does not become a novice in respect of the new category."
    Now I could be reading it a**e ways :p but that's how I read it.


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    #18
    Xodar
    Registered Users Posts: 118 ✭✭Xodar


    Think it comes down to the definition of 'category'.

    A - Motorcycle
    B - Passenger vehicle (car)
    C - Van/Truck
    D - Bus
    .
    .
    .

    Is AM, A1, A2, A categorised as category A...so is A1 considered to be the same category of AM and therefore no bearing on moving from one to the other or is it simply a category B licence (obtained before 01/08/2014) renders the need to wear a tabard unnecessary?

    For the record I will be doing my IBT in July and fully intend to wear a 'L' tabard and an 'N' tabard when I pass my test.


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    #19
    seblex
    Registered Users Posts: 28 ✭seblex


    honda boi wrote: »
    :
    "A person granted a first full driving licence on or after 1 August 2014 must display N-plates on the vehicle for a period of 2 years, and during that period display N-plates on any other vehicle in respect of which they get a driving licence. Where the vehicle is a motorcycle, the rider must wear an N – tabard."

    That's the job :)


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    #20
    IrishGrimReaper
    Registered Users Posts: 1,033 ✭✭✭IrishGrimReaper


    honda boi wrote: »
    .
    I don't think you're reading that wrong, it looks like the way you've said it.

    I'd drop an email to the RSA to confirm.

    Say you have a full license in a car for x amount of time and just passed your motorcycle test do you need to wear an N vest. I always assumed you were supposed to, not that anyone actually does :pac:. I've never seen one on the road.


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    #21
    ayux4rj6zql2ph
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,001 ✭✭✭ayux4rj6zql2ph


    Just to confirm the following, i got my full licence's as follows:

    Car 2007
    Rigid 2012
    Bus 2013
    Artic 2015
    Bike 2019

    I did not have to display an N plate or use an N tabard for the bike as i acquired my first full licence before August 2014, i asked the testers for clarification in 2015 & 2019


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    #22
    Xodar
    Registered Users Posts: 118 ✭✭Xodar


    Kyle Weak Squeegee wrote: »
    Just to confirm the following, i got my full licence's as follows:

    Car 2007
    Rigid 2012
    Bus 2013
    Artic 2015
    Bike 2019

    I did not have to display an N plate or use an N tabard for the bike as i acquired my first full licence before August 2014, i asked the testers for clarification in 2015 & 2019

    That's exactly what I thought but reading the RSA doc's.

    However, I do think riding a bike is immensely different to driving a car and prior to doing the test should have to wear the 'L' tabard? - Is this correct or incorrect


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    #23
    ayux4rj6zql2ph
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,001 ✭✭✭ayux4rj6zql2ph


    Xodar wrote: »
    That's exactly what I thought but reading the RSA doc's.

    However, I do think riding a bike is immensely different to driving a car and prior to doing the test should have to wear the 'L' tabard? - Is this correct or incorrect

    On a bike an L tabard must be worn until one has a full licence in their hand, remember, passing the test and having a certificate of competency is not a full licence.

    You are correct, each category of motor vehicle is a different skill, it boils my blood when i see car drivers giving out about buses and artic's yet they haven't a clue how to drive them or know the skill involved in driving them, the same car drivers have bees in their bonnets about bikers, again clueless.


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    #24
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users Posts: 35,072 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    L plate / tabard is required unless you have a full licence for the exact vehicle being driven/ridden. e.g. full A1 but riding an A bike on an A learner permit = L tabard required.

    N plate / tabard is only for 2 years after you pass your FIRST driving test, you don't have to have it again if you pass a driving test in another category after that.

    © 1982 Sinclair Research Ltd



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    #25
    Spook_ie
    Registered Users Posts: 10,896 ✭✭✭✭Spook_ie


    seblex wrote: »
    I let my license expire a few years ago. Back on the provo for the bike.

    More than 10 years? If not you just renew the license.

    http://www.rsa.ie/en/Utility/News/2015/DRIVERS-URGED-TO-CHECK-THEIR-LICENCES-HAVE-NOT-EXPIRED/


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