New environmental era of farming. Are you playing your part?

Say my name

Sooo there's been controversy and hulabaloo about the Green party having a good election result in Ireland.
Coupled to this you have disquiet from some quarters in agriculture in this country saying "Farming is finished now" and "how will we ever live now".

The Green party result was an expression from the public about rising co2 levels and environmental abuse both here and abroad. People mightn't know what to do but they want to feel they're doing something positive for the planet. So hence Greens.

That's the feeling out there but it's been building in the public forum before the election and building in governmental departments worldwide, Paris Agreement,etc.
It's only now it's really hitting home for the farming community here.

https://twitter.com/tom_hubert/status/1134084880407699456?s=20


So the question has been asked today of Irish agriculture. ^^

I was wondering. We don't hear much about measures that farmers and landowners are currently doing with help or of their own free will.

So the question is what are you currently doing for the environment or wildlife or soil biota?
Are you doing anything at all?

Post it up there.

cacs

Say my name wrote: »

Sooo there's been controversy and hulabaloo about the Green party having a good election result in Ireland.
Coupled to this you have disquiet from some quarters in agriculture in this country saying "Farming is finished now" and "how will we ever live now".

The Green party result was an expression from the public about rising co2 levels and environmental abuse both here and abroad. People mightn't know what to do but they want to feel they're doing something positive for the planet. So hence Greens.

That's the feeling out there but it's been building in the public forum before the election and building in governmental departments worldwide, Paris Agreement,etc.
It's only now it's really hitting home for the farming community here.

https://twitter.com/tom_hubert/status/1134084880407699456?s=20


So the question has been asked today of Irish agriculture. ^^

I was wondering. We don't hear much about measures that farmers and landowners are currently doing with help or of their own free will.

So the question is what are you currently doing for the environment or wildlife or soil biota?
Are you doing anything at all?

Post it up there.

Great topic.

Still waters

planting native bird/bee friendly bushes/trees/hedges wherever and whenever I can, I've reduced stock to the minimum. dont make silage because I buy in the bit I need, less stock less output, I work full time and it seems a waste of my time to be producing beef for no profit, less spent on diesel, less emissions, I know its minuscule in the grand scheme of things but everything makes a difference

PoorFarmer

Been putting in as many trees as possible over the last 3 years. Moved some fences not at an open drain out 2 metres to get a double row in. (Will probably take a hit on SFP for this eventually)
Have been told black alder will fix nitrogen to the soil so hope to source these over the winter months and plant a few hundred. If it cuts back on a few bags if fertiliser then that's a bonus to having trees.
Managed to get all my summer water for the last 18 months from 2 wells that I trapped with drains and have continued this to the sheds for this winter. All gravity fed too :-)

All habitats have been fenced off where possible,Mining bees that I noticed this week, pheasant chicks in one field so not grazing this for another week or so, hares in a corner of another field so fenced that off too. All trees that are felled have the branches heaped to provide nesting areas for birds and rabbits actually use them too instead of burrowing

Nekarsulm

Planting some hardwood trees (well, a few dozen), cut right back on fertilizer and contracting costs, killed all the beef cattle and didnt buy any more.
Keeping about 3 ewes to the acre.
Locked the cheque book in a drawer.
Parked two tractors in a shed, joined Glas ( two years ago).
Leased out some of the land on a long term tax efficient lease.
Got a full time job in the civil service.
Let the factories and the average green voter go füçķ themselves.
When they are paying double for their food, I'll review the situation.

_Brian

Nekarsulm wrote: »

When they are paying double for their food, I'll review the situation.

Im in this state of mind at the moment.
Honestly there is no appreciation for the brilliant food produced on Irish farms.

We’re not making many more changes because we already farm in a low impact style anyway.

Minimal fertiliser, minimal sprays, low stocking density etc
Hedgerows grown large rather than hacked to the ground.
Occasional wild areas not touched.
Planted fruit trees and bushes
Small coppice area for own fuel
Thinking about some bees

Honestly the general public are an ungrateful lot, when beef farming is near extinct here and they are munching on untraceable beef from land cleated of rainforest I’ll be eating beef farmed on our own land with no air miles and full traceability.

Dinzee Conlee

Similar to most posts so far...

Putting in trees where I can...
Low stocking rate, no fertiliser so far this year...
Minimise chemical use...

Just try to farm in as low impact, low cost way I can...

Keepgrowing

Our contribution
1 Yearly Soil samples
2 Fert based on SS
4 Land GPS measured
5 Spray and fert applies using GPS
6 All nutrients recycled
7 Trailing shoe
8 Several applications
9 Recycle policy
10 All Plate cooler water recycled
11 Comply fully with nutrient storage
12 Nutrient mgt plan
13 Measure grass
14 Fert plan
15 Continuous water testing
16 annual hedge maintenance
17 10 ac native unmanaged woodland
18 7 ac wildlife reserve

Dakota Dan

Say my name wrote: »

Sooo there's been controversy and hulabaloo about the Green party having a good election result in Ireland.
Coupled to this you have disquiet from some quarters in agriculture in this country saying "Farming is finished now" and "how will we ever live now".

The Green party result was an expression from the public about rising co2 levels and environmental abuse both here and abroad. People mightn't know what to do but they want to feel they're doing something positive for the planet. So hence Greens.

That's the feeling out there but it's been building in the public forum before the election and building in governmental departments worldwide, Paris Agreement,etc.
It's only now it's really hitting home for the farming community here.

https://twitter.com/tom_hubert/status/1134084880407699456?s=20


So the question has been asked today of Irish agriculture. ^^

I was wondering. We don't hear much about measures that farmers and landowners are currently doing with help or of their own free will.

So the question is what are you currently doing for the environment or wildlife or soil biota?
Are you doing anything at all?

Post it up there.

Did you check the election results? The greens were almost bottom of the heap at 11.4%, the rest is media hype that people who aren't arsed to research easily swallow.

SuperTortoise

Well the green party's last great contribution to our country was promotion and tax breaks on buying diesel cars.

One of the most historically stupid decisions ever made, our health as a nation is much worse off thanks to them.
People have short memorys, how would anyone trust that shower to deliver a coherent plan on climate change? They've done more harm than good.

Grueller

Dakota Dan wrote: »

Did you check the election results? The greens were almost bottom of the heap at 11.4%, the rest is media hype that people who aren't arsed to research easily swallow.

Don't be so sure. We are effectively governed from Europe on these matters and the green wave is getting mainstream there. To top this off the average voter under 40 has never seen expensive food and has a complete disconnect with its production. This leads them to think nothing of sacrificing ag at the altar of the social media campaign. We might not like it, but change is coming.

Birdnuts

Greens are a waste of space - however I'm not overly enamored with the strong showing of the blueshirts yet again in places like Mayo. Leo is as keen on Carbon taxes as the Greens and would go into government with them too. Anyways on a more positive note I discovered I have 4 species of Orchids growing on my place in North Mayo this past week, namely Early Marsh, Western Marsh, Northern Marsh and Heath Spotted Orchid. Also got 2 pairs of Grey Herons nesting in Shelter belts I planted 20 years - some noise and entertainment from that lot. This week added Corn Cockle and Corn Marigold to the Bird cover - the latter likes acid soil so sowed an extra area as it did really well last year. Raspberry bushes doing well too and the birds get their share of the crop;)

K.G.

If theres one thing id love to do is reduce the amount of plastic that comes on the farm.fert bags ration bags buckets dry cow tubes and never them fecking bales..

Still waters

_Brian wrote: »

Honestly the general public are an ungrateful lot, when beef farming is near extinct here and they are munching on untraceable beef from land cleated of rainforest I’ll be eating beef farmed on our own land with no air miles and full traceability.

That's unfair, the general public dont get a say in what they buy no more than the farmer get a say in the price factories pay for beef, it goes above Joe public, it's a closed shop once the beef is in the ring, the monopoly dictates prices and choice

Timmaay

K.G. wrote: »

If theres one thing id love to do is reduce the amount of plastic that comes on the farm.fert bags ration bags buckets dry cow tubes and never them fecking bales..

You do recycle the most of them I assume? But if you want to reduce the above, more pit silage, more fert in bulk, meal in bulk, and you'll reduce your plastic use by 90%.

Nekarsulm

SuperTortoise wrote: »

Well the green party's last great contribution to our country was promotion and tax breaks on buying diesel cars.

One of the most historically stupid decisions ever made, our health as a nation is much worse off thanks to them.
People have short memorys, how would anyone trust that shower to deliver a coherent plan on climate change? They've done more harm than good.

True to a point, but on the other hand, floods of good second-hand diesels at historically low prices for those of us who would rather cut off a limb than pay 40k for a "20 D" with more tech than the space shuttle.
For this, I thank the Greens .....

I says

Will be leasing the place out soon let someone else worry about it for the next 8 yrs.

80sDiesel

PoorFarmer wrote: »

Have been told black alder will fix nitrogen to the soil so hope to source these over the winter months and plant a few hundred. If it cuts back on a few bags if fertiliser then that's a bonus to having trees.

Yep more commonly know as common or European alder. Available at any nursery. Planted about 200 of them in the wetter areas. They are a very fast growing tree and will grow even better in wet soil. Fantastic for the bees too.

When they report a drop in sales on weed killer in the local Woodies then I will believe the hype re greens.

_Brian

SuperTortoise wrote: »

Well the green party's last great contribution to our country was promotion and tax breaks on buying diesel cars.

One of the most historically stupid decisions ever made, our health as a nation is much worse off thanks to them.
People have short memorys, how would anyone trust that shower to deliver a coherent plan on climate change? They've done more harm than good.

Really, do you think our health is worse because of diesel cars since the cheap tax came in ??

Have to say it’s a link I can never see, granted I don’t live in an urban area but even on the odd occasion I visit Dublin it seems cleaner air than wine I would have visited 20 or 30 years ago.

_Brian

Still waters wrote: »

That's unfair, the general public dont get a say in what they buy no more than the farmer get a say in the price factories pay for beef, it goes above Joe public, it's a closed shop once the beef is in the ring, the monopoly dictates prices and choice

That’s just untrue and lazy.
Consumers make a choice every single time they shop.

For beef that means finding an artisan butcher shop that kills its own animal and butchers on site. That ensures better beef, local beef and a fairer price to the farmer.

Consumers actually have a lot of power regarding how farming operates. Consumers get the food they buy, keep buying cheap crap and that is all there will be, buy better quality ethically farmed animals and that is where the market will move to fill that demand.

Still waters

_Brian wrote: »

That’s just untrue and lazy.
Consumers make a choice every single time they shop.

For beef that means finding an artisan butcher shop that kills its own animal and butchers on site. That ensures better beef, local beef and a fairer price to the farmer.

Consumers actually have a lot of power regarding how farming operates. Consumers get the food they buy, keep buying cheap crap and that is all there will be, buy better quality ethically farmed animals and that is where the market will move to fill that demand.

I'll have to disagree, how many towns and villages across Ireland have their very own artisan butchers, very few, the nearest to me is 40 min away and does a roaring trade so the consumer will buy right when presented with the opportunity.

Its very lazy for farmers to keep blaming the consumer when we're part of the circle that demands cheaper produce to feed our animals, cheaper fertilizers, cheaper labour, we're part of the problem and we dont look for solutions because we're just as helpless as the consumer, who here doesn't price different suppliers when pricing products not caring about small local independent dealers but instead buying materials and goods off the big agri chain stores who can sell Chinese crap cheaper

we need to look at how we produce and sell our beef instead of taking the lazy option of always blaming the consumer, while factories can buy prime beef for less than it cost to produce it then I'm afraid the argument gets very weak from the producers side

_Brian

Still waters wrote: »

I'll have to disagree, how many towns and villages across Ireland have their very own artisan butchers, very few, the nearest to me is 40 min away and does a roaring trade so the consumer will buy right when presented with the opportunity.

Its very lazy for farmers to keep blaming the consumer when we're part of the circle that demands cheaper produce to feed our animals, cheaper fertilizers, cheaper labour, we're part of the problem and we dont look for solutions because we're just as helpless as the consumer, who here doesn't price different suppliers when pricing products not caring about small local independent dealers but instead buying materials and goods off the big agri chain stores who can sell Chinese crap cheaper

we need to look at how we produce and sell our beef instead of taking the lazy option of always blaming the consumer, while factories can buy prime beef for less than it cost to produce it then I'm afraid the argument gets very weak from the producers side

There are many more than people think, people just don’t look.

Also choosing free range, organic and origin Ireland would be a big help as it all dictates which way the market goes.

Consumers need to stop buying beef and chicken through supermarkets and get back to butcher shops, preferably those that kill animals too.

Consumers come online and rattle on about farmers stopping chemicals, not having chickens and pigs in cages and exporting calves.

Start buying more local produce ethically produced and things change.

People should be looking for anveal industry here if they want calves not to be exported live. Asking for it to stop but providing no viable alternative is the carry on of petulant teenagers not grown adults.

Good ethical food is out there, it takes an effort and costs more but if that’s where you want farming to move then get out and buy the damn stuff.

Dakota Dan

_Brian wrote: »

Really, do you think our health is worse because of diesel cars since the cheap tax came in ??

Have to say it’s a link I can never see, granted I don’t live in an urban area but even on the odd occasion I visit Dublin it seems cleaner air than wine I would have visited 20 or 30 years ago.

I was thinking the same, it's the usual scaremongering hype. Not so long ago they nearly started a nuclear war, they weren't too worried about the planet or it's inhabitants back then.

Nekarsulm

Still waters wrote: »

Its very lazy for farmers to keep blaming the consumer when we're part of the circle that demands cheaper produce to feed our animals, cheaper fertilizers, cheaper labour, we're part of the problem and we dont look for solutions because we're just as helpless as the consumer, who here doesn't price different suppliers when pricing products not caring about small local independent dealers but instead buying materials and goods off the big agri chain stores who can sell Chinese crap cheaper

Where are you buying this cheaper fertilizer, cheaper animal ration, cheaper labour?
All I have seen is rising input prices and static sales prices.

And the reason Aldi and Lidl do well at the meat counter is because everything is clearly priced.
If a customer hasn't an unlimited budget, they can compare cuts at a glance, and the price to be paid.
So many butchers have no price displayed, or at least you dont know what its going to be untill they have it cut and on the scales.
Then there is a subtle pressure on you to accept it, even though its 6 or 7 euro more than you planned on spending.

Buford T. Justice XIX

_Brian wrote: »

There are many more than people think, people just don’t look.

Also choosing free range, organic and origin Ireland would be a big help as it all dictates which way the market goes.

Consumers need to stop buying beef and chicken through supermarkets and get back to butcher shops, preferably those that kill animals too.

Consumers come online and rattle on about farmers stopping chemicals, not having chickens and pigs in cages and exporting calves.

Start buying more local produce ethically produced and things change.

People should be looking for anveal industry here if they want calves not to be exported live. Asking for it to stop but providing no viable alternative is the carry on of petulant teenagers not grown adults.

Good ethical food is out there, it takes an effort and costs more but if that’s where you want farming to move then get out and buy the damn stuff.

Just on the butchers, Brian, I am good friends with two local butchers here, both of whom killed and cut their own meat. Both have closed in the last few years because of the unrealisable standards and investment required by the Dept.

They were expected to spend in excess of 10k to upgrade their facilities which were used for about 2 hours a week and wouldn't have done anything to improve either the welfare of the animals or the quality of the meat.

Every village used have its own butcher that killed his own meat but there's only one left within 20 miles of us now. Amazingly, once they all closed, the Dept staff actually realised that their interpretation of the rules was putting themselves out of a job and significantly eased off in their interpretation of what needed to be done.

Too late now though.

_Brian

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

Just on the butchers, Brian, I am good friends with two local butchers here, both of whom killed and cut their own meat. Both have closed in the last few years because of the unrealisable standards and investment required by the Dept.

They were expected to spend in excess of 10k to upgrade their facilities which were used for about 2 hours a week and wouldn't have done anything to improve either the welfare of the animals or the quality of the meat.

Every village used have its own butcher that killed his own meat but there's only one left within 20 miles of us now. Amazingly, once they all closed, the Dept staff actually realised that their interpretation of the rules was putting themselves out of a job and significantly eased off in their interpretation of what needed to be done.

Too late now though.

Yea it’s a big problem.
I’m in Scotland at the moment and town after town there isn’t a butcher shop in any of them.

Thing I can’t undersrand is if you go to France, while they are apparently running to the same eu standards they seem to get away with much less polava over everything and much more basic facilities seem acceptable.

I was chatting to a fella one day and he was saying rhat France asks people to do the minimum to meet an eu directive where in Ireland we move to meet the highest possible standard or even more. It’s killing small artisan business by driving overheads sky high. It’s killing whatever small bit of food culture we have.

Timmaay

Timmaay wrote: »

You do recycle the most of them I assume? But if you want to reduce the above, more pit silage, more fert in bulk, meal in bulk, and you'll reduce your plastic use by 90%.

https://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/tipperary-recycling-plant-to-provide-vital-solution-to-farm-plastics-waste/

Definitely a good news story also!

Mooooo

Have a few spots on the farm which are awkward to graze so may allow these go wild or plant native trees but will hold tough to see what may happen, as don't trust many new regs to be interpreted to include much of what is already there. Other than that all the things farms in dero do, fert plan etc. Plenty slurry storage but more work to do in the yard,
Low emission slurry spreading,and little and often doing it. Thru the season.
Spread less fert in the first rounds this year and follow the cow's instead of blanket spreading

PoorFarmer

80sDiesel wrote:

Yep more commonly know as common or European alder. Available at any nursery. Planted about 200 of them in the wetter areas. They are a very fast growing tree and will grow even better in wet soil. Fantastic for the bees too.

Any idea how good it is for coppicing or what kind of calorific value it has?

Buford T. Justice XIX

Mooooo wrote: »

Have a few spots on the farm which are awkward to graze so may allow these go wild or plant native trees but will hold tough to see what may happen, as don't trust many new regs to be interpreted to include much of what is already there. Other than that all the things farms in dero do, fert plan etc. Plenty slurry storage but more work to do in the yard,
Low emission slurry spreading,and little and often doing it. Thru the season.
Spread less fert in the first rounds this year and follow the cow's instead of blanket spreading

From dealings with the Dept over the years, the one thing you WILL NOT be allowed do is let a piece of ground become a natural wildlife reserve.

To qualify, it can ONLY be artificially created:rolleyes:

RIGOLO

_Brian wrote: »

Y

Thing I can’t undersrand is if you go to France, while they are apparently running to the same eu standards they seem to get away with much less polava over everything and much more basic facilities seem acceptable.

I was chatting to a fella one day and he was saying rhat France asks people to do the minimum to meet an eu directive where in Ireland we move to meet the highest possible standard or even more. It’s killing small artisan business by driving overheads sky high. It’s killing whatever small bit of food culture we have.

Youve hit the nail on the head.

Ive a house in FRance, spend alot of time there.
Im always amazed at the clear breaches of regulations that French restaurants and food outlets have compared to the same ones back home .

The same applies to many other aspects of life I notice as I go about things here, building sites , etc .
Theres no way the French authorities penalise and push regulations as much as the Irish civil servants do. Part of us trying to be the good boys of Europe and pay all our debts etc ..

So yep Im sure Irish butchers are being forced at huge cost to implement a regulation that the French designed in the EU, but that the FRench dont implement themselves.

Also the French butchers produce about 20 times the number of cuts that the Irish butcher offers, the French pretty much have a dish thats specific to every dfferent part of the carcass, and specific to whether it was the male or female of the livestock , more or less. Could Irish butchers learn from them, or perhaps first the Irish consumer needs to be that discerning.

And yes alot of IRish produce is the better and tastier , full of natural flavour,
unfortunately the cooking and what we do in the kitchen lets it down. IVe seen many average French housewives take a few scrawny dry carrots and produce a wonderous meal, and seen far superior product in Ireland being turned into a bland meal . They know how to cook here, possibly cos we have lost alot of the Home Economics and the boom means everyone is eating out.

Ive had 2 fellas in white vans call to the house in France this week with new potatoes. Happens every year. The farmers come into the cities in their white vans and go door to door selling large sacks of new potatoes. They charge ALOT, but they do it everyyear so I expect its worth their while . I know we have the stalls on the side of the road in IRl.
Would you get away with that in Irl going door to door, or would the Dept. be after you.

Great thread , good on you farmers who are doing your bit. Ignore the Greens their a bunch of gob****es ..

Dakota Dan

I only put out fertilizer on silage ground yet only starting with fertilizer on grazing ground now after 2 grazings but it’s mainly because I was under stocked due to cows not going in calf. But this environmental alarmism that has nothing to do with the environment, they have already admitted that.

TPF2012

Buford T. Justice V wrote:

From dealings with the Dept over the years, the one thing you WILL NOT be allowed do is let a piece of ground become a natural wildlife reserve.

Buford T. Justice V wrote:

To qualify, it can ONLY be artificially created

Sure everyone has to get their cut, the planners, co-ops, contractors, icbf and so on. Take WBC that I have put in for GLAS, ground was cleared of scrub, sprayed off with glycophosphate, ploughed, seeded and fertilized. All this, removed natural habitat, released carbon from soil through cultivation, increase fertiliser use, chemicals introduced to the soil. I wasn't forced to do it but it was the biggest return I was going to get from that bit of ground. I get 900 a hectare for that. Would giving a farmer 300 a hectare to maintain existing habitats not give greater return for less?

Water John

If you had any stock and put them into it for a week or two, you wouldn't have had to spray it. I did end up ploughing mine afterwards, I suppose if I disced it, would have done.
We need to examine each action.

TPF2012

Water John wrote:

If you had any stock and put them into it for a week or two, you wouldn't have had to spray it. I did end up ploughing mine afterwards, I suppose if I disced it, would have done. We need to examine each action.

I had cattle in it for a week but it still had a lot of weeds mainly rushes. I only got it ploughed the 1st year, diced every year since but without spraying of at start it is not going to get much of a chance. Post emergence spraying is not allowed.

Dinzee Conlee

TPF2012 wrote: »

I had cattle in it for a week but it still had a lot of weeds mainly rushes. I only got it ploughed the 1st year, diced every year since but without spraying of at start it is not going to get much of a chance. Post emergence spraying is not allowed.

Put horses on my WBC for a few weeks, they made a savage job of it, ate it down bare...
Good few docks left all right though...

20silkcut

_Brian wrote: »

That’s just untrue and lazy.
Consumers make a choice every single time they shop.

For beef that means finding an artisan butcher shop that kills its own animal and butchers on site. That ensures better beef, local beef and a fairer price to the farmer.

Consumers actually have a lot of power regarding how farming operates. Consumers get the food they buy, keep buying cheap crap and that is all there will be, buy better quality ethically farmed animals and that is where the market will move to fill that demand.

I honestly don’t believe that. People may say this and that and virtue signal etc but at the end of the day price is king. It’s been that way since time began.
You have two products the exact same and the cheapest one will sell.
No matter how many artisan butchers there are the cheapest one will be the busiest.
The market will reward him for cutting costs and cutting corners and he will cut further costs and corners. It is the essence of business and a market economy unless the government come in and control even then corners will be cut its human nature.

Water John

The consumer market is far more complicated and nuanced than that. If price only was king, then we would all be shopping in Aldi and Lidl.

patsy_mccabe

Tesco bread is sh1te. That's all I have to say on the matter.

20silkcut

Water John wrote: »

The consumer market is far more complicated and nuanced than that. If price only was king, then we would all be shopping in Aldi and Lidl.

If you have two artisan butchers in a town and both are equal in terms of product and one is cheaper than the other.
Then the cheaper one will be busier.


If the bread in Aldi is as good as the bread in superquinn people will pop into Aldi on the way home from superquinn .

Once you meet the standards the market demands then price is king.

gozunda

Dinzee Conlee wrote: »

Put horses on my WBC for a few weeks, they made a savage job of it, ate it down bare...
Good few docks left all right though...

Australia?

_Brian

Supermarkets are part of the cartel that drives down prices. They are in league with processors to control and suppress beef prices and as a result we are seeing more and more feedlot cattle through the system. Artisan butchers buy locally grown cattle from small farmers and kill them locally, so the two 10oz steaks aren’t equal, they are very different products. The payment to the farmer and the life the animal has had is very different too.

They not only do it for meat but they also treat the likes of veg growers terribly. Dropping prices when crops are ready to harvest, they often cause crops to be ploughed back into the ground with their unfair tactics. You won’t see smaller shops doing stuff like that.

If farmers think that buying farm products on price alone is acceptable that the whole thing is ****ed for sure.

If we start with the message that supermarkets are good places to buy meat and veg then we are handing them and the processors all the power and may as well put up and shut up about poor prices going forward.

Yes if the two products are actually the same then price is key.

But 6 burgers from a butcher where they are minced “beef” hand prepared, you can’t pretend they are the same as 6 burgers in a box from Tesco from “meat” for €1.99

Mooooo

Agree supermarkets have too much of a share of the pie, however the vast majority of our beef is exported so it needs to be shown on an international level the advantages of Irish beef, which processors aren't willing to do. They prefer to buy it as cheap as possible, and it's worked for them as the barons are all in the rich list every year so why would they bother changing.

_Brian

Mooooo wrote: »

Agree supermarkets have too much of a share of the pie, however the vast majority of our beef is exported so it needs to be shown on an international level the advantages of Irish beef, which processors aren't willing to do. They prefer to buy it as cheap as possible, and it's worked for them as the barons are all in the rich list every year so why would they bother changing.

How will this work though and keep production so high, is it too simplistic to say we’re overproducing would limiting sticking density of beef animals help green credentials ?

Mooooo

_Brian wrote: »

How will this work though and keep production so high, is it too simplistic to say we’re overproducing would limiting sticking density of beef animals help green credentials ?

I think the government are looking for regional status for Irish beef, or whatever the term is, similar to cheeses etc in France would help i guess dunno will anythimg trickle down to the beef farmer tho. Removing age limits would allow more fully grass fed beef as younger stock have to be pushed with meal. All these things won't behind benefit to mii so they will go against it

20silkcut

_Brian wrote: »

How will this work though and keep production so high, is it too simplistic to say we’re overproducing would limiting sticking density of beef animals help green credentials ?

They’d only increase production in Brazil and Argentina.

20silkcut

Mooooo wrote: »

I think the government are looking for regional status for Irish beef, or whatever the term is, similar to cheeses etc in France would help i guess dunno will anythimg trickle down to the beef farmer tho. Removing age limits would allow more fully grass fed beef as younger stock have to be pushed with meal. All these things won't behind benefit to mii so they will go against it

The problem with beef is it would take a fair sensitive palate to detect the nuances of differently produced beef.
It’s the beef type and cooking process that makes the most difference to taste and texture.
The sad reality is people were unwittingly eating horse meat and didn’t know it at one stage. That was one epic corner cutting exercise. Highlights the cut throat nature of the beef market.

lalababa

_Brian wrote: »

Really, do you think our health is worse because of diesel cars since the cheap tax came in ??

Have to say it’s a link I can never see, granted I don’t live in an urban area but even on the odd occasion I visit Dublin it seems cleaner air than wine I would have visited 20 or 30 years ago.

The man that invented putting lead in petrol Thomas Midgley according to some historians was the single most destructive organism ever to exist on Earth. The greastest single threat to the environment ever, also the greatest ever killer- take the two world wars and mutiply by ten. And he knew lead was poison! He also messed with CFCs. I'm not saying petrol is great now but diesel is not good causing all sorts of ill health. There will be a time (it's here already for the majority of specialized scientists) when we will look back at the combustion engine and ask ' what the heck were we thinking'.

Nekarsulm

lalababa wrote: »

The man that invented putting lead in petrol Thomas Midgley according to some historians was the single most destructive organism ever to exist on Earth. The greastest single threat to the environment ever, also the greatest ever killer- take the two world wars and mutiply by ten. And he knew lead was poison! He also messed with CFCs. I'm not saying petrol is great now but diesel is not good causing all sorts of ill health. There will be a time (it's here already for the majority of specialized scientists) when we will look back at the combustion engine and ask ' what the heck were we thinking'.

Its a pity that lead is poisonous, as its was such a great lubricant for the ic engine for 70 years.
Of course, while we do have some pollution from engines, (lead is gone) we no longer have lead in every thing thats painted.
Every kitchen door, shed roof, cart, barrow and piece of farm equipment was painted with red lead or orange lead paint.
Water pipe threads had white lead compound as a lubricant/anti-seize paste, not to mention the wide spread use of lead piping in houses before pvc was invented.

_Brian

lalababa wrote: »

The man that invented putting lead in petrol Thomas Midgley according to some historians was the single most destructive organism ever to exist on Earth. The greastest single threat to the environment ever, also the greatest ever killer- take the two world wars and mutiply by ten. And he knew lead was poison! He also messed with CFCs. I'm not saying petrol is great now but diesel is not good causing all sorts of ill health. There will be a time (it's here already for the majority of specialized scientists) when we will look back at the combustion engine and ask ' what the heck were we thinking'.

That’s all well documented.

I was just surprised by the claim that health has suffered since the introduction of lower tax bands and sales of diesel cars. I’m struggling to see that to be honest.

Two biggest issues faced in the health services is still smoking and drinking related illnesses.

Track9

Timmaay wrote: »

You do recycle the most of them I assume? But if you want to reduce the above, more pit silage, more fert in bulk, meal in bulk, and you'll reduce your plastic use by 90%.

Im absolutely demented by Single Use Plastic on the Farm.
It comes from the House & the Farm . Around food ( Fruit , Vegs etc )
Fertiliser , Meals etc .
Shrink Wrapping around tools etc irritates me .
Recenty asked our Suppler of Farm meds , Drugs, etc if they had a return system , to which he replied they pay a company to take their empty med bottles & if did it for us , they would have to charge .
Govt bodies should do more so we can do the right thing & reduce our waste to close to zero .