Irish language revival

Snow Garden

Reati wrote: »

Have you emailed the department of education? Why are you, janfebmar and the rest of the keyboard warriors of social justice in the Gaelscoileanna not bringing this outrageous discrimination to their attention, the attention of the media and every platform possible. You clearly feel passionate about fixing the perceived lack of diversity you are constantly telling us exists.

This is your question? The answer is No. I have never emailed the Dept of Education.

I doubt they would agree to doing a racism survey.

Now quid pro quo. How many people openly told you they were racist?
Do you understand that I am trying to suggest that the vast majority of parents would never admit it so it's impossible to know for certain their motivations for sending their kids to Gaelscoils. Surely you must have an ounce of reasonable doubt?
You believe it has never happened and is impossible. Hence you look very foolish and close minded. Maybe it's time for another prayer?
.

Snow Garden

cameramonkey wrote: »

So are you suggesting that the reason most children get sent to Gaelscoils is because their parents are racist?

Defining most as 50%+

In places like Galway, probably not most but a sizable percentage.

In places like South Dublin, yes most

_blaaz

Snow Garden wrote: »

Defining most as 50%+

In places like Galway, probably not most but a sizable percentage.

In places like South Dublin, probably most yes.

So any chance you can pony up proof of this rampant racism in south dublin?

ted1

Snow Garden wrote: »

Defining most as 50%+

In places like Galway, probably not most but a sizable percentage.

In places like South Dublin, probably most yes.

Pure fiction !!!!!!

Snow Garden

_blaaz wrote: »

So any chance you can pony up proof of this rampant racism in south dublin?

:rolleyes:

It's like Groundhog day with you people. You have already read my response on this numerous times. Take off the blinkers.

Until RedC start doing exit polls on racisms outside Gaelscoils, we will never know.

_blaaz

Snow Garden wrote: »

:rolleyes:

It's like Groundhog day with you people. You have already read my response on this numerous times. Take off the blinkers.

Until RedC start doing exit polls on racisms outside Gaelscoils, we will never know.

So you have nothing to support your view of rampant racism??


Telling people to take off blinkers and not even suggesting something to look at seems like needing a cultish level of suspension of critical.thinking skills are required to believe you??


Just believe they are all racist,coz you say so is kinda childish?

Snow Garden

_blaaz wrote: »

So you have nothing to support your view of rampant racism??


Telling people to take off blinkers and not even suggesting something to look at seems like needing a cultish level of suspension of critical.thinking skills are requires to believe you

1 simple question which Reati never answers

Do you think that at least 1 parent sent their child to a Gaelscoil for racial reasons?

_blaaz

Snow Garden wrote: »

1 simple question which Reati never answers

Do you think that at least 1 parent sent their child to a Gaelscoil for racial reasons?

Until i see evidemce to the contary il go with no


But however yous have claimed over 50% of south dublin parents do so because of racist choices.....which is quite a bold claim to make with zero evidence

Snow Garden

Snow Garden wrote: »

Defining most as 50%+

In places like Galway, probably not most but a sizable percentage.

In places like South Dublin, yes most

I'd say it's the opposite.

I live in south Dublin. My kid is due to go to the local Gaelscoil, but there's no question of there being a racial element to this, as the local English-speaking school is also very middle-class, and all-too-pale.

I think this way of thinking, which you're referring to, only arises in places where there is a substantial population of children for whom neither English nor Irish are their first languages. Such as parts of Galway and Cork city, or in parts of west Dublin.

I think it's sad that Gaelscoileanna are manipulated in this way, but no doubt it happens.

Reati

Snow Garden wrote: »

This is your question? The answer is No. I have never emailed the Dept of Education.

I doubt they would agree to doing a racism survey.

And there we have it.

You have made very serious allegations that Gaelscoileanna are operating racist, exclusionary policies designed to proposely exclude foreign nationals, ethic minorities and people with special needs.

The Department are responsible for fair education in the Republic and such serious allegations would be immediately investigated. In fact the Social Inclusion Unit section of the department would be very interested in your "evidence" and "proof" given that's their entire remit.

So, it seems amazing to me, given how much dick waving you've done in this thread about unfair enrolment and with what passion you continue to make these allegations and present "evidence" and "proof" to us, that your social conscience only stretches to being "right" on boards.ie

Reati

Reati wrote: »

And there we have it.

You are making very serious allegations that Gaelscoileanna are operating racist, exclusionary policies designed to proposely exclude foreign nationals, ethic minorities and people will special needs.

I don't think the poster has suggested that, have they?

I think the issue is that most parents with a non-Irish nationality are unlikely to want to have their children instructed through Irish. They are likely to have no attachment to the language at all, nor the most rudimentary ability to understand/ relate to it.

It's a lot more organic than what is being suggested. But I've heard it come up in conversation that Gaelscoileanna have better resources because teachers don't have to spend time starting from scratch, with children whose first and only language may be Arabic or Hausa. This is a real issue in parts of the country where there is a strong foreign-national population, and the simple answer is better educational resources.

Reati

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

I don't think the poster has suggested that, have they?

That's where this whole thing started but now it's turned into well actually the parents are just racist.

Either way, if this is true why is no on making officla complaints. Seems weird to be so passionate on boards yet that passion can't open a new tabs and send an emailm

Snow Garden

Snow Garden wrote: »

This is your question? The answer is No. I have never emailed the Dept of Education.

I doubt they would agree to doing a racism survey.

Now quid pro quo. How many people openly told you they were racist?
Do you understand that I am trying to suggest that the vast majority of parents would never admit it so it's impossible to know for certain their motivations for sending their kids to Gaelscoils. Surely you must have an ounce of reasonable doubt?

No chance of an answer Reati?

ted1

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

I don't think the poster has suggested that, have they?

But I've heard it come up in conversation that Gaelscoileanna have better resources because teachers don't have to spend time starting from scratch, with children whose first and only language may be Arabic or Hausa. This is a real issue in parts of the country where there is a strong foreign-national population, and the simple answer is better educational resources.

That’s also fiction. When a child starts in a GaelScoil it’s generalLy regarded that the kid has no Irish and learns through immersion. Fir the first two years they’ll think that their teacher doesn’t actually speak English.
So the child may aswell have Arabic , mandran, Hausa etc.

So they HAVE to start from scratch with everyone.

Snow Garden

Reati wrote: »

That's where this whole thing started but now it's turned into well actually the parents are just racist.

Either way, if this is true why is no on making officla complaints. Seems weird to be so passionate on boards yet that passion can't open a new tabs and send an emailm

Not just racist. I maintain it's a convenient way for some parents to hide their xenophobia, racism or snobbery.

You think that's utterly impossible though without evidence

ted1

ted1 wrote: »

That’s also fiction. When a child starts in a GaelScoil it’s generalLy regarded that the kid has no Irish and learns through immersion. Fir the first two years they’ll think that their teacher doesn’t actually speak English.
So the child may aswell have Arabic , mandran, Hausa etc.

So they HAVE to start from scratch with everyone.

I think you've just missed the point I was making? A parent with no capacity whatever to assist the child with Irish, e.g. a parent who speaks Arabic, Hausa, or Cantonese at home, is unlikely to want to send their child to a Gaelscoil.

In most parts of the country, children attending Gaelscoileanna won't enroll with fluent Irish, so they're all on the same page anyway. I speak Irish fluently, but my kid doesn't. The point is that they're all equal.

The putative Cantonese or Arabic-speaking parent isn't going to want their kid to have to learn two new languages at once, so Gaelscoileanna are typically not a favoured option.

Reati

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

I think you've just missed the point I was making? A parent with no capacity whatever to assist the child with Irish, e.g. a parent who speaks Arabic, Hausa, or Cantonese at home, is unlikely to want to send their child to a Gaelscoil.

The putative Cantonese or Arabic-speaking parent isn't going to want their kid to have to learn two new languages at once, so Gaelscoileanna are typically not a favoured option.

Yes. I've made this point but it was also ignored as me hiding my head in the sand to the "truth".

I've posted my views on parents motivations pages and pages ago. I never said only people with a love of Irish send their kids to Gaelscoileanna.

My point that I've continued to put forward is Gaelscoileanna do not have policies that exclude foreign nationals, travellers or special needs people. This is the point that others have made in the thread and are seeking to prove (now we're moved onto its the claim that the majority of parents are racist) If Snow Garden and the other gate keepers want to confirm they do not believe Gaelscoileanna have these policies we might be able to move on...

Snow Garden

Reati wrote: »

Yes. I've made this point but it was also ignored as me hiding my head in the sand to the "truth".

I've posted my views on parents motivations pages and pages ago. I never said only people with a love of Irish send their kids to Gaelscoileanna.

My point that I've continued to put forward is Gaelscoileanna do not have policies that exclude foreign nationals, travellers or special needs people. This is the point that others have made in the thread and are seeking to prove. If Snow Garden and the other gate keepers want to confirm they do not believe Gaelscoileanna have these policies we might be able to move on...

What??? You really are all over the shop. Cannot answer simple questions.

For the last several posts, I have been asking you about parents and racial motivations. You refused to answer each and every time - where did I mention school policies?

Snow Garden

For the 3rd time....

Snow Garden wrote: »

This is your question? The answer is No. I have never emailed the Dept of Education.

I doubt they would agree to doing a racism survey.

Now quid pro quo. How many people openly told you they were racist?
Do you understand that I am trying to suggest that the vast majority of parents would never admit it so it's impossible to know for certain their motivations for sending their kids to Gaelscoils. Surely you must have an ounce of reasonable doubt?

No chance of an answer Reati? Is it possible?

Reati

Snow Garden wrote: »

What??? You really are all over the shop.

Snow Garden wrote: »

There is definitely a racist/xenophobic element to it - especially the Gaelscoils.

Is it your view that Gaelscoileanna have enrollment rules against the people I've listed above? Yes or no.

Snow Garden wrote: »

Cannot answer simple questions.

For the last several posts, I have been asking you about parents and racial motivations.l

I've answered the parents motivations question 3 times. You ignore it and that's fine

Stop moaning ffs

So are private boarding schools racist too?
Predominantly white kids from affluent backgrounds

Answer— no. They’re not.

Reati

Reati wrote: »

My point that I've continued to put forward is Gaelscoileanna do not have policies that exclude foreign nationals, travellers or special needs people. This is the point that others have made in the thread and are seeking to prove (now we're moved onto its the claim that the majority of parents are racist) If Snow Garden and the other gate keepers want to confirm they do not believe Gaelscoileanna have these policies we might be able to move on...

I think anyone who thinks that Gaelscoileanna have these policies are likely to have some weird grudge against Gaelscoileanna, or maybe the Irish language.

I think the demographic contrast between mainstream primary education and the Gaelscoileanna is entirely organic, whereby the latter tend not to have to allocate the same expenditure of resources on linguistic disparities in the classroom.This amounts to a net benefit to Gaelscoileanna, which can naturally increase teacher-contact time relative to some other schools.

Any notion of a conspiracy probably belongs in a CT forum.

Nevertheless, there is a problem here. Parents of all students must be mindful that some kind of educational arbitrage is taking place.

ted1

Snow Garden wrote: »

For the 3rd time....



No chance of an answer Reati? Is it possible?

You’ve got a tin foil hat on. There is no reply to your stupid question.

In my kids school there are 60 places each year. In our eldest year :

30 went to siblings
19 went to kids of past pupils ( several with partners from different countries )
10 went to kids being raised through Irish
1 went to the first kid on the waiting list. ( that was my kid)

0 went to racists.

Stop moaning ffs

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

I think anyone who thinks that Gaelscoileanna have these policies are likely to have some weird grudge against Gaelscoileanna, or maybe the Irish language.

I think the demographic contrast between mainstream primary education and the Gaelscoileanna is entirely organic, whereby the latter tend not to have to allocate the same expenditure of resources on linguistic disparities in the classroom.This amounts to a net benefit to Gaelscoileanna, which can naturally increase teacher-contact time relative to some other schools.

Any notion of a conspiracy probably belongs in a CT forum.

Nevertheless, there is a problem here. Parents of all students must be mindful that some kind of educational arbitrage is taking place.

There are definitely some here with an anti Irish agenda. If you love the language you’re a provo and deserve contempt.
You see the same people do this across multiple threads and topics.

cameramonkey

Snow Garden wrote: »

Defining most as 50%+

In places like Galway, probably not most but a sizable percentage.

In places like South Dublin, yes most

I think you must be just a troll.



My child is starting in a Gaelscoil next September, do you think I am a racist? Or maybe if its my wife she may be, but according to you 1 of us is definitely Racist going by your statistical analysis.

janfebmar

cameramonkey wrote: »

I think you must be just a troll.



My child is starting in a Gaelscoil next September, do you think I am a racist? Or maybe if its my wife she may be, but according to you 1 of us is definitely Racist going by your statistical analysis.

Not very good at logic, are you? But then if you are sending your kid to a Gaelscoil, that answers that! If 50% of parents had blue eyes and 50% had brown eyes, you are claiming every set of parents (every couple) would comprise of a blue eyed parent and a brown eyed parent.

Given your lack of mathematical reasoning ability, would you not send them to a normal school so they can be given every chance? The ability to reason in life and use mathematical skills will be much more valuable than clogging up their little heads with a language nobody speaks.

Reati

janfebmar wrote: »

random snide insults

Glad to see you took time away from trolling the other threads in After hours to come back and visit. I was hoping you had swam out to Rockall and done us all a favour

janfebmar

So because I and others disagree with you, and point out obvious flaws in your logic, we must be trolls.

cameramonkey

janfebmar wrote: »

Not very good at logic, are you? But then if you are sending your kid to a Gaelscoil, that answers that! If 50% of parents had blue eyes and 50% had brown eyes, you are claiming every set of parents (every couple) would comprise of a blue eyed parent and a brown eyed parent.

Given your lack of mathematical reasoning ability, would you not send them to a normal school so they can be given every chance? The ability to reason in life and use mathematical skills will be much more valuable than clogging up their little heads with a language nobody speaks.

So would it be your contention that there is a 50% chance that myself and my wife are racist?


I understand coming from where you come from that you have an intense dislike of Irish culture and language. I suppose the best I could say about you is that you don't understand what it is to be Irish and to have a desire to express that.

Reati

janfebmar wrote: »

So because I and others disagree with you, and point out obvious flaws in your logic, we must be trolls.

You must not have done very well in English in school.I never said the others. Just you. You must have went to a mainstream school

Anyway...

janfebmar wrote: »

Not very good at logic, are you? But then if you are sending your kid to a Gaelscoil, that answers that! If 50% of parents had blue eyes and 50% had brown eyes, you are claiming every set of parents (every couple) would comprise of a blue eyed parent and a brown eyed parent.

Given your lack of mathematical reasoning ability, would you not send them to a normal school so they can be given every chance? The ability to reason in life and use mathematical skills will be much more valuable than clogging up their little heads with a language nobody speaks.

Reads more like trolling than anything else

Baggly

Mod

Thread closed for review.

Baggly

Mod

Thread reopened.

Stay on topic. Stop the personal attacks and backseat modding.

Thanks.

janfebmar

Back on topic. If there is an Irish language revival, as the thread title suggests, can someone tell me why there are only a few posts a month in the Irish language thread on boards.ie? Or why there is no Irish language equivalent of boards.ie? Or why I have never seen any Irish language magazines in any newsagents I have ever been in? Maybe I am blind? Are there any (genuine question).

Nice, reflective article in today's The Irish Times on the state of Irish ins na Gaeltachtai

https://www.irishtimes.com/culture/books/yes-the-gaeltacht-is-in-a-bad-way-but-don-t-panic-yet-1.3909860

I can't find any resource online where Mór agus Muilc can be read for free; there is apparently a book but it is designed for children.

ohnonotgmail

janfebmar wrote: »

Back on topic. If there is an Irish language revival, as the thread title suggests, can someone tell me why there are only a few posts a month in the Irish language thread on boards.ie? Or why there is no Irish language equivalent of boards.ie? Or why I have never seen any Irish language magazines in any newsagents I have ever been in? Maybe I am blind? Are there any (genuine question).

you are aware of other discussion forums apart from boards?

RobMc59

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

you are aware of other discussion forums apart from boards?

Who wants crab sticks when you can have caviar?:)

janfebmar

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

you are aware of other discussion forums apart from boards?

There never seems to be more than a couple of posts per month in the Irish language on them, judging by an example someone posted of such a site earlier in this thread.

Hamsterchops

In Ireland our mother tongue is English.

Speaking Irish as our main language of communication is from the past, and along with Latin these ancient languages should be protected and cherished, but not force fed to our children.

Stop moaning ffs

janfebmar wrote: »

There never seems to be more than a couple of posts per month in the Irish language on them, judging by an example someone posted of such a site earlier in this thread.

I have many friends from here but loving all over that only use Irish when posting on Facebook etc.
Just because you don’t know where to see it find these things doesn’t mean they don’t happen. There’s countless websites and pages and groups for all kinds of interests. Billions of them. You aren’t engaged in them, but they are there.

Thelonious Monk

I never understood why anyone cared whether we spoke it or not? Speaking English has opened so many doors for us anyway.
It's not coming back, face it. I went to a Gaelscoil too, was fluent, but have no love for the language really. It's a waste of everyone's time at this stage.

cameramonkey

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

I never understood why anyone cared whether we spoke it or not? Speaking English has opened so many doors for us anyway.
It's not coming back, face it. I went to a Gaelscoil too, was fluent, but have no love for the language really. It's a waste of everyone's time at this stage.

Obviously wasted on you but not on everyone.

Thelonious Monk

cameramonkey wrote: »

Obviously wasted on you but not on everyone.

Not everyone, just about 99% of the population that can't speak the language

Reati

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Speaking English has opened so many doors for us anyway.

Which doors exactly?

Thelonious Monk

Reati wrote: »

Which doors exactly?

F to the D to the I

cameramonkey

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Not everyone, just about 99% of the population that can't speak the language

Some people just dont understand the importance of language and culture, they are ignorant of the opportunities that a language offers , others have a political or personal grudge against all things Irish and a few people on these threads are British people who like to stir things up.



Its amazing that people are against a language , its like being against culture or learning. As a matter of interest are you against other languages or is it just Irish?

Reati

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Reati wrote: »

Which doors exactly?

F to the D to the I

Oh yeah that was because 100% because we speak English and nothing to do with our exceedingly generous tax system.

Thelonious Monk

cameramonkey wrote: »

Some people just dont understand the importance of language and culture, they are ignorant of the opportunities that a language offers , others have a political or personal grudge against all things Irish and a few people on these threads are British people who like to stir things up.



Its amazing that people are against a language , its like being against culture or learning. As a matter of interest are you against other languages or is it just Irish?

I speak decent Spanish, I've been learning it for over 10 years now, and used to learn German which I can still converse in somewhat.
No I'm not particularly against Irish, but this revival is not working. No one cares or wants to learn it, apart from a tiny minority.
People have a romantic idea that we'll revive it and we'll speak it as much as we speak English in future. We won't. If you think otherwise you're clueless.

Stop moaning ffs

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

F to the D to the I

If I look through your post history and see a single comment in a premiership thread I will laugh. Heartily.

Thelonious Monk

Reati wrote: »

Oh yeah that was because 100% because we speak English and nothing to do with our exceedingly generous tax system.

I would think it's down to both

Thelonious Monk

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

If I look through your post history and see a single comment in a premiership thread I will laugh. Heartily.

I don't get it?