Is America treating the UK like a colony?

Auguste Comte

I wonder who Donald will install in London as viceroy when brexit gets through and he completes his take over, Nigel, Boris or someone from the mainland?

riclad

If you look at the american rules on spying ,any person living outside
america could be considered an enemy ,
they will spy on every txt, email, mobile phone call from any person
,this includes the uk,germany , france so called allies .
That is official policy .
American airports will be bringing in face scanning ,if you want to
get an american visa you,ll have to give info on any social media accounts you use .
Drugs that cost 10 euros in spain cost 1000 dollars in america .
The us treats any country as a possible trade partner or a customer for american goods .
Or else they are an enemy like iran, north korea .

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_government_mass_surveillance_projects#United_States


Trump wants a new trade agreement with the uk so all nhs contracts
will be offered to companys in the usa .
I think america treats every country as a colony in that they
think the america way is the best policy ,
even if medical treatment and insurance is more expensive than
european countrys .
They view government health care as socialism .

Gringo180

Fan of Netflix wrote: »

You have to laugh at the idea the Russians are a bigger threat to us than the British. Turn off Sky News and read a history book Monte.

Even history is being rewritten, some would have you believe the Soviets were on the side of the Nazi's in WW2 :pac:

AbdulAbhaile

Auguste Comte wrote: »

I wonder who Donald will install in London as viceroy when brexit gets through and he completes his take over, Nigel, Boris or someone from the mainland?

One of his provo friends perhaps.

An Claidheamh

AbdulAbhaile wrote: »

One of his provo friends perhaps.

Lol

Has any in the British media actually asked the British right/Tories about how Trump donated money to Irish Republicans?


Personally I find it hilarious, but do the British have any pride at all?

On another note, Britain has about 2 years before Trump goes.

They probably won't even have fully Brexited - if at all - by then, and won't have any time to organise this fantasy US trade deal.

At the end of the day, Ireland has more influence in Congress and the White House on March 17th than the UK have all year - and we don't have to spend billions on nukes on their orders.

An Claidheamh

janfebmar wrote: »

Living above a humble shop is not coming from money. And a lot of Catholics in Northern Ireland thought a lot of her, for example the ones in the security forces for standing up to the pIRA.

Really a lot? A lot of the Catholics in the British army?

What did they think of her plan to force them all over the border as refugees?
To help the British army and loyalists terrorise Irish civilians. Her famed death MI5 squads.

If the British "security forces" had such a problem fighting a war, they should not have started one, murdering unarmed civilians.


By the way, Thatcher was negotiating with the provos after all :

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-16366413



And after the Brighton Hotel bomb, negotiations ended and she caved in.


Sorry to ruin your fetish.

janfebmar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Then she had her education bankrolled by a multimillionaire.

She had graduated from university with a science degree and was well working in industry with it when she met her future husband to be, who she married a few years later. He was well off but not a multimillionaire at the time. Nothing wrong with a woman marrying a wealthy successful man if they both desire.

An Claidheamh

Del.Monte wrote: »

Your point being? His posting history certainly would put him in that category.

Quote: FrancieBrady
steddyeddy is a 'shinnerbot' now too. :D:D


Rather Orwellian, those shinnerbots, posting their historical facts.

How dare they!

This is board's.co.uk after all!

FrancieBrady

janfebmar wrote: »

She had graduated from university with a science degree and was well working in industry with it when she met her future husband to be, who she married a few years later. He was well off but not a multimillionaire at the time. Nothing wrong with a woman marrying a wealthy successful man if they both desire.

Nothing wrong with being wealthy either.

It is wrong if you construct a fantasy of 'an ordinary shopkeepers daughter' that the gullible buy into, as you clearly have.

Wealthy parents,
Oxford education,
Millionaire Hubby,
Called to the Bar,
MP
PM

In that order. Pretty elite route to the top, if you ask anyone living in the real world.

janfebmar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Nothing wrong with being wealthy either.

It is wrong if you construct a fantasy of 'an ordinary shopkeepers daughter' that the gullible buy into, as you clearly have.

Wealthy parents,

I actually said "Not that wealthy, he lived above his small shop. Margaret Thatcher made her own way with her science degree. If she came from a very well off back ground instead, she probably would still have made her way to the top of UK politics. Not everyone goes to private school , and some people get scholarships."

Yes, at the age of 26 she married well, and eventually rose to the top of UK politics. But she did grow up living above her fathers ordinary shop. Not poor, but not as fantastically elite as you made out.

FrancieBrady

janfebmar wrote: »

I actually said "Not that wealthy, he lived above his small shop. Margaret Thatcher made her own way with her science degree. If she came from a very well off back ground instead, she probably would still have made her way to the top of UK politics. Not everyone goes to private school , and some people get scholarships."

Yes, at the age of 26 she married well, and eventually rose to the top of UK politics. But she did grow up living above her fathers ordinary shop. Not poor, but not as fantastically elite as you made out.

Which bit of 'buying your way into the elite' did you miss?

You have completely blown yet another argument. Why do you think you can keep dropping British-centric fantasies into threads and get away with it?

janfebmar

An Claidheamh wrote: »

Really a lot? A lot of the Catholics in the British army?
.

Many tens of thousands of Catholics served in the British army, none found any discrimination whatsoever.

An Claidheamh wrote: »

y the way, Thatcher was negotiating with the provos after all :
.

I never said there were never discussions with the pira, in fact the British government flew the Republican leadership over to London long before Thatchers time in order to try to get them to give up violence.

janfebmar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Which bit of 'buying your way into the elite' did you miss?

So someone who starts off in life living above a shop and who applies for scholarship to university, and who works 18 hour days and does well for herself in life , and is lucky enough to marry a wealthy enough person, is convicted in your eyes of "buying in to the elite"?

Do you think she was as well off or had the same trappings of wealth as her adversary across the Irish sea at the time, Lord Charles Haughey of Kinsealy?

FrancieBrady

janfebmar wrote: »

So someone who starts off in life living above a shop and who applies for scholarship to university, and who works 18 hour days and does well for herself in life , and is lucky enough to marry a wealthy enough person, is convicted in your eyes of "buying in to the elite"?

And further proof, were it needed, that you bought Thatcher's cute PR fantasy recreation...hook line and sinker.

janfebmar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

And further proof, were it needed, that you bought Thatcher's cute PR fantasy recreation...hook line and sinker.

I have looked at the facts, you have looked at what you wanted to believe. She was a very determined woman, you have to hand that to her.

janfebmar

An Claidheamh wrote: »

Has any in the British media actually asked the British right/Tories about how Trump donated money to Irish Republicans?

Well, despite attending a Sinn Féin fundraiser event in 1995, Donald Trump did not make a donation to the party according to Sinn Féin themselves. You can google it if you want.

_blaaz

janfebmar wrote: »

I have looked at the facts, you have looked at what you wanted to believe. She was a very determined woman, you have to hand that to her.

Determined to destroy the british economy and leave northern england decimated


Kudos to her i guess,if you like that kind of thing

janfebmar

_blaaz wrote: »

Determined to destroy the british economy and leave northern england decimated

It was in much better shape when she left power than when she came in to power there. Ask any of the hundreds of thousands of Irish people who emigrated to England in the eighties, who found good jobs and were welcomed and treated fairly. In the same era Charlie Haughey told everyone here to wear the hairshirt while he was carrying on with his mistress.

janfebmar

An Claidheamh wrote: »

At the end of the day, Ireland has more influence in Congress and the White House on March 17th than the UK have all year.

We get to present a bowl of shamrock for 15 minutes every January 15th, while our Taoiseach makes an eejit of himself again. See his body language with Trump yesterday when they met in the foyer of Shannion airport, of all unsuitable places. How cringeworthy. What did you think of the US President calling the US-UK "special relationship" the "greatest alliance the world has ever known.". Talk about rubbing it in who his best friends are!
I suppose the British gave him a proper meal, here we gave him a plastic cup of coffee.
Wonder will we name a motorway service station and cafe after him, like we did after Obama - the same Obama who came from Ireland lol...and the same Obama who repatriated 2.5 million illegial immigrants out of the USA during his reign.

kowloon

janfebmar wrote: »

and who works 18 hour days

Not criticising the rest of the post, but I've read she was big into napping during the day to make up the lost time.

janfebmar

kowloon wrote: »

Not criticising the rest of the post, but I've read she was big into napping during the day to make up the lost time.

Perhaps, but not according to the BBC (easily googled). With respect, are you sure you are not confusing her with Churchill, who was known to have 40 winks during the day?

Quote from BBC:
Margaret Thatcher is famously said to have slept for only four hours a night. How easy is it to do a high-powered job on this amount of sleep?

Part of Margaret Thatcher's fearsome reputation came from how little she slept. She could get by on four hours a night, it has often been said.

Indefatigability became part of her mystique. She would keep her officials up working on a speech until two or three in the morning and then be up by five in time to listen to Farming Today.

"She slept four hours a night on weekdays," says Sir Bernard Ingham, her Downing Street press secretary. "I wasn't with her at weekends. I guess she got a bit more then."

It isn't easy to ascertain when Baroness Thatcher first referred to her minimal sleep schedule, but the figure of four hours has passed into lore.

People use it as a benchmark of endurance, often jokingly referring to those who need much more.

Lady Thatcher's close friend and former Conservative Party treasurer Lord McAlpine stayed with her at Chequers during the holidays. "She worked right through Christmas. When everyone else went off to bed she went off to work."

Her biographer John Campbell, author of The Iron Lady, says her late-to-bed, early-to-rise routine made her the "best informed person in the room". Occasionally husband Denis would snap. "Woman - bed!" he is reputed to have shouted on one occasion.

More from BBC Online
We often worry about lying awake in the middle of the night - but it could be good for you. A growing body of evidence from science and history suggests that the eight-hour sleep may be unnatural.

The myth of the eight-hour sleep (Feb 2012)

Five things that stop a good night’s sleep

Her frugal sleep pattern created a problem for her successor John Major. "He found it difficult coming after her because the civil service had got used to a prime minister who never slept, and he used to sleep eight hours a night," Campbell says.

Sleep comes to be seen as part of a leader's character. When Napoleon Bonaparte was asked how many hours sleep people need, he is said to have replied: "Six for a man, seven for a woman, eight for a fool."

For the Iron Lady four hours was a badge of almost superhuman strength. It fits the narrative of the "warrior" prime minister as set out by the Times' Matthew Parris this week. "She understood that this was war when others didn't. And in war you need a warrior," he writes.

Churchill survived on four hours a night during the war. But what is less often noted is that he had regular afternoon naps in his pyjamas. Lady Thatcher was not one for these afternoon sleeps. "No, she wasn't a napper," Ingham says.

AngryHippie

Jaysus.

Thought I was on a Thatcher thread there for a minute, or one that says DID America treat the UK like a colony and not IS it treating it like one.



I suppose its not treating the UK like the UK used to treat its colonies.
Armritsar
Mau Mau
An Gorta Mor
Australia
New Zealand

But I don't suppose the comparison is the same in the modern era either, genocide is frowned upon and you can't even get away with getting pished and falling of a swing anymore because of the internet.

If it's just in terms of attitude, the arrogant insufferable administration thats there at the moment have been treating the entire world as if they are "the help", so I don't think the UK is getting any worse treatment than anyone else who has to put a diplomatic face on while dealing with a puddle of fake tan and horsehair

Kermit.de.frog

janfebmar wrote: »

How cringeworthy.

Cringeworthy?

1. He was sitting opposite a ****ing eejit who couldn't be bothered reading his brief

2. He called him out. Which is more than May did.

3. Why the fcuk would an Irish leader go to his golf course as a promotion stunt? Quite right to say no.

Honestly how leader after leader have the control and patience to sit and listen to Trump's verbal diarrhoea coming out opposite them is amazing.

FrancieBrady

janfebmar wrote: »

Perhaps, but not according to the BBC (easily googled). With respect, are you sure you are not confusing her with Churchill, who was known to have 40 winks during the day?

Quote from BBC:
Margaret Thatcher is famously said to have slept for only four hours a night. How easy is it to do a high-powered job on this amount of sleep?

Part of Margaret Thatcher's fearsome reputation came from how little she slept. She could get by on four hours a night, it has often been said.

Indefatigability became part of her mystique. She would keep her officials up working on a speech until two or three in the morning and then be up by five in time to listen to Farming Today.

"She slept four hours a night on weekdays," says Sir Bernard Ingham, her Downing Street press secretary. "I wasn't with her at weekends. I guess she got a bit more then."

It isn't easy to ascertain when Baroness Thatcher first referred to her minimal sleep schedule, but the figure of four hours has passed into lore.

People use it as a benchmark of endurance, often jokingly referring to those who need much more.

Lady Thatcher's close friend and former Conservative Party treasurer Lord McAlpine stayed with her at Chequers during the holidays. "She worked right through Christmas. When everyone else went off to bed she went off to work."

Her biographer John Campbell, author of The Iron Lady, says her late-to-bed, early-to-rise routine made her the "best informed person in the room". Occasionally husband Denis would snap. "Woman - bed!" he is reputed to have shouted on one occasion.

More from BBC Online
We often worry about lying awake in the middle of the night - but it could be good for you. A growing body of evidence from science and history suggests that the eight-hour sleep may be unnatural.

The myth of the eight-hour sleep (Feb 2012)

Five things that stop a good night’s sleep

Her frugal sleep pattern created a problem for her successor John Major. "He found it difficult coming after her because the civil service had got used to a prime minister who never slept, and he used to sleep eight hours a night," Campbell says.

Sleep comes to be seen as part of a leader's character. When Napoleon Bonaparte was asked how many hours sleep people need, he is said to have replied: "Six for a man, seven for a woman, eight for a fool."

For the Iron Lady four hours was a badge of almost superhuman strength. It fits the narrative of the "warrior" prime minister as set out by the Times' Matthew Parris this week. "She understood that this was war when others didn't. And in war you need a warrior," he writes.

Churchill survived on four hours a night during the war. But what is less often noted is that he had regular afternoon naps in his pyjamas. Lady Thatcher was not one for these afternoon sleeps. "No, she wasn't a napper," Ingham says.

ah, the BBC is a reputable source now, while it wasn't when it contradicted your findings on your precious 1973 poll.

You and Donald would get right along with each other.

FrancieBrady

janfebmar wrote: »

I have looked at the facts, you have looked at what you wanted to believe. She was a very determined woman, you have to hand that to her.

Wealthy parents, FACT
Oxford education, FACT
Millionaire Hubby, FACT
Called to the Bar, FACT
MP FACT
PM FACT


BTW: Her biographer Charles Moore said that there was absolutely no evidence of this 'sleep thing' and that it was invented (again that word) to portray an image in a macho world.
Same is said of Napolean's.

janfebmar

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Cringeworthy?

1. He was sitting opposite a ****ing eejit who couldn't be bothered reading his brief

2. He called him out. Which is more than May did.

3. Why the fcuk would an Irish leader go to his golf course as a promotion stunt? Quite right to say no.

Honestly how leader after leader have the control and patience to sit and listen to Trump's verbal diarrhoea coming out opposite them is amazing.

He is still the democratically elected leader of the most powerful country in the free world. You would not think it judging by his plastic cup of coffee Leo gave him in the lobby of Shannon airport. I'm sure if Leo went to the hotel he would have been treated much better, in nicer surroundings. Still, at least it was not the motorway chipper called after Obama, the man who repatriated 2.5 million illegal immigrants. What do you think of Trumps statement about the US-UK "special relationship^ being the "greatest alliance the world has ever seen".

Maybe you think the US-UK relstionship is or was not as strong as Ireland's relationship with with Col Gadaffi ( Who supplied us with shiploads of Semites to blow up protestants), or maybe Ireland's relationship with Nazi Germany (remember Dev offering his condolences on death of Hitler shortly after the extermination camps were liberated, the only leader in the world to do so), or maybe Ireland's relationship with Cuba (ask Michael D).

janfebmar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Wealthy parents, FACT
Oxford education, FACT
Millionaire Hubby, FACT
Called to the Bar, FACT
MP FACT
PM FACT


BTW: Her biographer Charles Moore said that there was absolutely no evidence of this 'sleep thing' and that it was invented (again that word) to portray an image in a macho world.
Same is said of Napolean's.

Nobody denied she was not a Mp or PM. Not bad for someone who grew up living above her father's shop and who applied for scholarship to university to study science. And her biographer did say she worked very long hours and often survived on 4 to 6 hours sleep per night.

threeball

janfebmar wrote: »

He is still the democratically elected leader of the most powerful country in the free world. You would not think it judging by his plastic cup of coffee Leo gave him in the lobby of Shannon airport. I'm sure if Leo went to the hotel he would have been treated much better, in nicer surroundings. Still, at least it was not the motorway chipper called after Obama, the man who repatriated 2.5 million illegal immigrants. What do you think of Trumps statement about the US-UK "special relationship^ being the "greatest alliance the world has ever seen".

Maybe you think the US-UK relstionship is or was not as strong as Ireland's relationship with with Col Gadaffi ( Who supplied us with shiploads of Semites to blow up protestants), or maybe Ireland's relationship with Nazi Germany (remember Dev offering his condolences on death of Hitler shortly after the extermination camps were liberated, the only leader in the world to do so), or maybe Ireland's relationship with Cuba (ask Michael D).

Oh yes, the special relationship that allowed one to make up a load of stories about Weapons of mass destruction, then call his "mates" to go round to the other lads house and give them a good kicking which the UK duly did without a shred of evidence.

When the Brits needed the US 60 years before against a genuine threat it took 3 years for their "mate" to rock up and only when they were goaded into the war by Japan. You can thank Japan for that one.

As for the Dev thing, yes it was stupid and no one agreed with it but you're talking about a country who was tortured by the UK for centuries. A man who'd see friends and relations killed at the hands of the Brits. Its kind of understandable that he wasn't their biggest fan. Its all fine looking at it 100years in the rear view mirror. When that happened most of the Irish government had been involved in the struggle for independence and there was damn all known about the true horrors of the Nazis.

FrancieBrady

janfebmar wrote: »

Nobody denied she was not Mp od PM. Not bad for someone who grew up living above her father's shop and who applied for scholarship to university to study science. And her biographer did say she worked very long hours and often survived on 4 to 6 hours sleep per night.

So you are watering down the contention that she survived on 4 hours sleep now.

Many many people can function on 4 hours sleep from time to time, including myself, nothing unusual or noteworthy in that.
Margaret Thatcher was a self publicist, she invented stories all the time during her career to project an image.

You clearly have fallen for it.

janfebmar

threeball wrote: »

Oh yes, the special relationship that allowed one to make up a load of stories about Weapons of mass destruction, then call his "mates" to go round to the other lads house and give them a good kicking which the UK duly did without a shred of evidence.

When the Brits needed the US 60 years before against a genuine threat it took 3 years for their "mate" to rock up and only when they were goaded into the war by Japan. You can thank Japan for that one.

As for the Dev thing, yes it was stupid and no one agreed with it but you're talking about a country who was tortured by the UK for centuries. A man who'd see friends and relations killed at the hands of the Brits. Its kind of understandable that he wasn't their biggest fan. Its all fine looking at it 100years in the rear view mirror. When that happened most of the Irish government had been involved in the struggle for independence and there was damn all known about the true horrors of the Nazis.

Do you miss an Phoblocht since they ceased printing their publications?

Wanderer78

janfebmar wrote:

He is still the democratically elected leader of the most powerful country in the free world. You would not think it judging by his plastic cup of coffee Leo gave him in the lobby of Shannon airport. I'm sure if Leo went to the hotel he would have been treated much better, in nicer surroundings. Still, at least it was not the motorway chipper called after Obama, the man who repatriated 2.5 million illegal immigrants. What do you think of Trumps statement about the US-UK "special relationship^ being the "greatest alliance the world has ever seen".

Democratically elected, and a free world! I don't think so!

janfebmar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

So you are watering down the contention that she survived on 4 hours sleep ...

No, just quoting what one person actually wrote, which is consistent with what I said earlier.

janfebmar

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Democratically elected, and a free world! I don't think so!

You do not think there is democracy in the USA (imperfect as it is - no country in the world is perfect)?

FrancieBrady

janfebmar wrote: »

No, just quoting what one person actually wrote, which is consistent with what I said earlier.

She worked hard, which nobody has denied, and which many many people have done in their lives.

threeball

janfebmar wrote: »

Do you miss an Phoblocht since they ceased printing their publications?

Don't have any time for the IRA and wouldn't get too worked up about a united Ireland so you're barking up the wrong tree there buddy. Unlike yourself I don't buy into all the chest beating nationalistic claptrap that the likes of an Trump or Thatcher would espouse. The world is more nuanced than that.

Wanderer78

janfebmar wrote:

You do not think there is democracy in the USA (imperfect as it is - no country in the world is perfect)?

Its clearly obvious that America is potentially the least democratic developed nation on the planet, its more plutocratic than democratic, only a small element of democracy is required to get favorable election outcomes for these plutocratic elements

suicide_circus

the uk needs to be a colony of the german run federal super-state, not the US.

FrancieBrady

suicide_circus wrote: »

the uk needs to be a colony of the german run federal super-state, not the US.

I think an element of the British (Brexiteers) are hellbent on avoiding that scaremongered fantasy, (a colony of the German run federal super-state) and are turning to the US in hope that they will rescue them...again.

recedite

suicide_circus wrote: »

the uk needs to be a colony of the german run federal super-state, not the US.

Hang on now, that's our gig. They should find another master.

suicide_circus

recedite wrote: »

Hang on now, that's our gig. They should find another master.

a vassal state, and glad of our chains

FrancieBrady

suicide_circus wrote: »

a vassal state, and glad of our chains

You could say Britain is a vassal state of ours atm. We are preventing them from getting what they want, because our interests come first.

Sometimes it us, sometimes it's the Germans.
Great thing the EU! :cool:

suicide_circus

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You could say Britain is a vassal state of ours atm. We are preventing them from getting what they want, because our interests come first.

Sometimes it us, sometimes it's the Germans.
Great thing the EU! :cool:

revenge is a dish best served cold, eh?

ArchXStanton

The US is treating the world as a colony..

steddyeddy

ArchXStanton wrote: »

The US is treating the world as a colony..

There's probably some truth in that to be honest. I wasn't any less sickened by the cringey sucking up to the Trump sons in Doonbeg either.

suicide_circus

ArchXStanton wrote: »

The US is treating the world as a colony..

who would you rather be world police? The US? China? because someone is going to be dominant

threeball

suicide_circus wrote: »

who would you rather be world police? The US? China? because someone is going to be dominant

Dominance doesn't mean you have to impose your will on much weaker countries and rob them of their resources, support leaders who support your interests at the expense. Wasn't it Roosevelt who said walk softly but carry a big stick? its been quite the opposite from America since WWII

ArchXStanton

suicide_circus wrote: »

who would you rather be world police? The US? China? because someone is going to be dominant

China being honest, every US president that gets elected seems to have a set agenda for him to achieve while in office that shapes the world to the US liking, with Trump it seems to be Iran, Venezuela and trade wars.

janfebmar

threeball wrote: »

Dominance doesn't mean you have to impose your will on much weaker countries and rob them of their resources, support leaders who support your interests at the expense.

So you do not think Germany should be imposing their will on us ( getting us to repay so much of the European banking debt), robbing us of our fish, taking our net contributions and taxes, imposing an EU army in a few years etc?
No wonder the US president said the UK would be much better off outside the shackles of the EU.

janfebmar

ArchXStanton wrote: »

China being honest, .

You would prefer China to be world policeman than the USA? Well, I suppose other Irishmen in the past have sucked up to Nazi Germany, Russia, Libya etc. They were all proved wrong.

steddyeddy

janfebmar wrote: »

You would prefer China to be world policeman than the USA? Well, I suppose other Irishmen in the past have sucked up to Nazi Germany, Russia, Libya etc. They were all proved wrong.

I'm convinced you're a Sinn fein plant put here to make unionists look bad.