Is America treating the UK like a colony?

FrancieBrady

janfebmar wrote: »

Indeed when you see the way Leo offered the President of the USA a plastic cup of coffee in the lobby of Shannon Airport as his official welcome to Ireland, you can see the Americans were not impressed. What you you think of the US president saying the US-UK "special relationship" was the "greatest alliance the world had ever seen?

I'd say Trump was doing what Trump does best - bull****ting.

Junkyard Tom

_blaaz wrote: »

praise british

Every. Single. Post.

Haven't you copped that? Everything the British did is wonderful and everything the Irish did is terrible. Can you not just ignore instead of giving her an excuse to deface threads with her boring mantra?

FrancieBrady

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

Every. Single. Post.

Haven't you copped that? Everything the British did is wonderful and everything the Irish did is terrible. Can you not just ignore instead of giving her an excuse to deface threads with her boring mantra?

It's fun reading the pivots and twisting Tom...I might have to mow the lawn otherwise.

kowloon

janfebmar wrote: »

Perhaps, but not according to the BBC (easily googled). With respect, are you sure you are not confusing her with Churchill, who was known to have 40 winks during the day?

Churchill's scheduling habits are legendary, and a strain on everryone who had to work around them.

I read Thatcher would doze off in some meetings and liked to nap in the back of the car.

Junkyard Tom

FrancieBrady wrote: »

It's fun reading the pivots and twisting Tom...I might have to mow the lawn otherwise.

Not for page after page! Shame we can't discuss what the thread's supposed to be about rather than giving yer wan and excuse for muck-spreading.

Anyhoo, I think that the British have a very strong social-democratic streak and will resist letting US corporations cannibalise its public services. Look at this great tweet:



The British Military Industrial Complex has a strong grip on the British economy so Britain receives a dividend from being the US's junior partner - especially in the Middle East.

janfebmar

_blaaz wrote: »

Journey times were 40% slower than similar distamce over similar terrain in england

In the mid and late 20th century you are correct. Not when we were joined with Britain, plenty of coal came from Britain then and journey times were similar, and rolling stock was the same. Close to indepenence, there were some spectacular attacks on the infrastructure such as the bombing of the Mallow viaduct. The worldwide depression hit rail travel too. Then during the war years, Britain could not spare coal for neutral Ireland. Thus, Irish steam engines often ran on poor quality Irish coal, wood, or not at all. Unsuccessful attempts were even made to burn peat. The deteriorating quality and frequency of service discouraged rail travellers, whose numbers were also diminishing due to steadily increasing emigration.

Quote: "In the 1950s and 1960s large swathes of route were closed in the Republic [a maximum of 2,668 miles (4,294 km) in Éire and 754 miles (1,213 km) in Ulster was reached in 1920, declining to 2,440 miles (3,930 km) and 542 miles (872 km) respectively in 1950 and 2,221 miles (3,574 km) and 336 miles (541 km) by 1957][4] but evidence is still visible in the landscape, as are more significant features like bridges and viaducts. Notable was the loss of the entire West Cork Railway network. Most branch lines in the Republic were also closed."

janfebmar

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

Everything the British did is wonderful and everything the Irish did is terrible.

It was your comrade blaaz who was saying that, I correct him, informing him our Irish built infrastructure in the 19th and early 20th century was every bit as good as that in Britain. The history of rail transport in Ireland began only a decade later than that of Britain - by world standards that is pretty good. The Dublin to Kingstown line was the first commuter railway in the world. Our lighthouses stand up to huge Atlantic waves, even after all this time. Engineering second to none.

_blaaz

janfebmar wrote: »

In the mid and late 20th century you are correct. Not when we were joined with Britain, plenty of coal came from Britain then and journey times were similar, and rolling stock was the same. Close to indepenence, there were some spectacular attacks on the infrastructure such as the bombing of the Mallow viaduct. The worldwide depression hit rail travel too. Then during the war years, Britain could not spare coal for neutral Ireland. Thus, Irish steam engines often ran on poor quality Irish coal, wood, or not at all. Unsuccessful attempts were even made to burn peat. The deteriorating quality and frequency of service discouraged rail travellers, whose numbers were also diminishing due to steadily increasing emigration.

Quote: "In the 1950s and 1960s large swathes of route were closed in the Republic [a maximum of 2,668 miles (4,294 km) in Éire and 754 miles (1,213 km) in Ulster was reached in 1920, declining to 2,440 miles (3,930 km) and 542 miles (872 km) respectively in 1950 and 2,221 miles (3,574 km) and 336 miles (541 km) by 1957][4] but evidence is still visible in the landscape, as are more significant features like bridges and viaducts. Notable was the loss of the entire West Cork Railway network. Most branch lines in the Republic were also closed."

Naw mate....im on about peripd 1900 to 1913


The infrastructure your so wanting to ram down everyones throat wasnt fit for purpose

Sh1t condition rails made even moderate speeds unsafe and in many cases didmt last half their projected lifespan..no mind constant threat of more sunsidence which repairs had to be subsidised by ratepayers in the 1800s


Train over similar distance and terrain were 40% slower here vs england....why you think this is a good thing is something for you to reconcile

Your cheering on half arsed infrastruture because youve read the half truth and ill informed semi-facts off likes of union bears.....they built the stuff alright....just wasnt fit for purpose....

Try to rationale it all you want....but a half arse job may as well not be done atal

janfebmar

_blaaz wrote: »

Naw mate....im on about peripd 1900 to 1913

I'm not your mate and so much would not have been built and expanded to new areas over such a long period of time if it was not fit for purpose. The locomotives were the same and up to date with those on the British mainland, and train speeds were on average the same as on the mainland. Some of the engineering was at the cutting edge of world technology at the time.
For example, I gave you the link earlier with the following quote" By January 1901 the entire city system,[12] which covered about 60 miles (97 km) to 66 miles (106 km),[13] was electrified [14] while the system has 280 trams," "[15] In 1911 the system had 330 trams[16] At its peak the system was known as technically innovative, and was described in 1904 as "one of the most impressive in the world",[1] so that representatives of other cities from around the world would come to inspect it and its electric operation"

_blaaz

janfebmar wrote: »

I'm not your mate and so much would not have been built and expanded to new areas over such a long period of time if it was not fit for purpose. The locomotives were the same and up to date with those on the British mainland, and train speeds were on average the same as on the mainland. Some of the engineering was at the cutting edge of world technology at the time"

Except they werent...a similar distance journey over similar terrain in england was 40% slower??

This is not the same speed...it is slower,quite wht you think somethimg 40% slower is same speed is brilliant insight



As for cutting edge engineering,how is it,they were beset by subsicidemce and required tax payer bailouts to repair it??

They werent fit for purpose,half arsed rubbish that you think is world class :pac:....half arsed railways,harbours that cant take boats and subject to repeated silting,canels that were too small to be efficive....train tracks that were sh1t quality and didnt last half their projected lifespan

This is the infrasturture you wish to ram down peoples throats and promote as a good thing....who are you trying to fool?

janfebmar

_blaaz wrote: »

Except they werent...a similar distance journey over similar terrain in england was 40% slower?

In the the mid and late 20th century yes, but we had our independence then and we all know the government here /CIE did not maintain the railways well and always had to be rescued by the taxpayer. In fact so much of the train service to counties like Donegal the British provided was stopped by the Irish government, another case of Dublin ignoring the rest of the country. Even in the railways kept operational here, train journeys took longer in the sixties that before independence_ you think that is progress? As Gay Byrne used to say, we wanted our independence, we had to pay for it.

To get back to The thread subject, do you not think it embarrassing the taoiseach meeting the US President in Shannon airport and offering him a plastic cup of coffee was not exactly Ireland of the thousand welcomes, considering US firms here employ so many, and there are what 40 million Irish Americans? Maybe Trump telling Leo that he was a good little boy and doing well but that he was better friends with the neighbours ( the US-UK "special relationship" being the biggest alliance the world had ever seen) rubbed Leo up the wrong way? Leo looked very uncomfortable and you could tell that by his body language.

Our country seemed to show so little respect on an official level to the president of the USA...Even the comments by our own president the night before criticising the USA president...yet Michael D had only great things to say about Fidel Castro and signed the book of condolences on his death. I do not think the Americans were too impressed.

FrancieBrady

janfebmar wrote: »

To get back to The thread subject,

Is America treating the UK like a colony?

janfebmar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Is America treating the UK like a colony?

Read the post above, the US president has said the US -UK " special relationship" is the greatest alliance the world has ever seen, and has urged the UK to ditch the shackles of the EU asap.

Contrast that with the relationship of Michael D insulting the Americans and our taoiseach offering the visiting US president a plastic cup of coffee as a welcome.

FrancieBrady

janfebmar wrote: »

Read the post above, the US president has said the " special relationship" is the greatest alliance the world has ever seen, and has urged the UK to ditch the shackles of the EU asap.

Contrast that with the relationship of Michael D insulting the Americans and our taoiseach offering the visiting US president a plastic cup of coffee as a welcome.

Yes he would say that about a US -UK 'special relationship' that gets him what he wants...'an armed lackey in Europe'.

Open your eyes Jan.

He was in Ireland in a private capacity, essentially promoting his golf course. He got way more deference than he deserved tbh.

janfebmar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Yes he would say that about a US -UK 'special relationship' that gets him what he wants...'an armed lackey in Europe'.

Open your eyes Jan.

He was in Ireland in a private capacity, essentially promoting his golf course. He got way more deference than he deserved tbh.

How many well heeled Americans come to Ireland to play golf, and how many people are employed by American multinationals here? And yet all our awkward Taoiseach can do is offer him a plastic cup of coffee in an airport? The most powerful country in the world was clearly not impressed with that, or Michael D who showed more respect to Castro.

FrancieBrady

janfebmar wrote: »

How many well heeled Americans come to Ireland to play golf, and how many people are employed by American multinationals here? And yet all our awkward Taoiseach can do is offer him a plastic cup of coffee in an airport? The most powerful country in the world was clearly not impressed with that, or Michael D who showed more respect to Castro.

How do you know it wasn't choreographed? How do you know he wasn't impressed?

janfebmar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

How do you know it wasn't choreographed? How do you know he wasn't impressed?

Would you be impressed with Michael D' behaviour, and Leo with his plastic cup of coffee if you were President of the most powerful country in the world?
The awkward body language of both men during their brief encounter said it all.

FrancieBrady

janfebmar wrote: »

Would you be impressed with Michael D' behaviour, and Leo with his plastic cup of coffee if you were President of the most powerful country in the world?
The awkward body language of both men during their brief encounter said it all.

So you don't know if he was impressed or not. You are actually getting offended on Trump's behalf.

Knowing what I know, every aspect of what Trump would have been doing/getting would have been pre-planned and agreed to by his security detail, down to how much milk was in the coffee.

I think therefore you are talking nonsense here.

Michael D stuck to his principles and core beliefs regarding Castro and pointed out the problems he had with his leadership while praising him for the good he had done.
You can do that with any world leader, from Haughey to Thatcher to Trump

RobMc59

I don't think trump cares what Britain or Ireland thinks of him and any trade agreements he sanctions will only probably suit American interests. The EU has its faults but is generally an organisation for the good of Europe which is where I think the UK should stay-as far as how rubbish British engineering and infrastructure skills are-do me a favour and stop talking bollox,think of all the beautiful architecture in Ireland built whilst Ireland was a HOME nation-not a colony,to say it was a colony isn't true.

threeball

janfebmar wrote: »

How many well heeled Americans come to Ireland to play golf, and how many people are employed by American multinationals here? And yet all our awkward Taoiseach can do is offer him a plastic cup of coffee in an airport? The most powerful country in the world was clearly not impressed with that, or Michael D who showed more respect to Castro.

Trump created no multinational jobs in Ireland. They were there before he came and will be there when he's gone because it's in their interest to do so. They're not charities.

Trump had his chance to be received in Dromoland but he wanted the meeting in Doonbeg to promote his interests. Shannon was the compromise. Varadkars awkwardness was more to do with being landed beside an unpredictable goon than anything else. Trump got as much as his last minute self serving jaunt deserved. Gardai had annual leave cancelled so this simpleton could promote his business and we paid for the lot.

janfebmar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You can do that with any world leader, from Haughey to Thatcher to Trump

You could do it (think of the good points as leader) for Hitler too, like Develera did by being the only eejit in the world to express condolences on the death of Hitler to the German ambassador.

What has Cuba ever done for us ? Ask Michael D when Cuba will take our emigrants, or when we get investment from Cuba to employ tens of thousands here, or when are all the Cuban tourists coming?

janfebmar

threeball wrote: »

Trump created no multinational jobs in Ireland.

He created 300 jobs in Doonbeg so no point in reading the rest of your post. He is the elected President of the USA which has created many many more jobs here.

threeball

janfebmar wrote: »

You could do it (think of the good points as leader) for Hitler too, like Develera did by being the only eejit in the world to express condolences on the death of Hitler to the German ambassador.

What has Cuba ever done for us ? Ask Michael D when Cuba will take our emigrants, or when we get investment from Cuba to employ tens of thousands here, or when are all the Cuban tourists coming?

You're a great man for posting the same sh1t over and over. Go back and re-read the thread if you're desperate for answers as they've been answered a number of times already

threeball

janfebmar wrote: »

He created 300 jobs in Doonbeg so no point in reading the rest of your post. He is the elected President of the USA which has created many many more jobs here.

You're not even intelligent enough to know what a multinational is. There's no point in explaining anything else to you.

FrancieBrady

janfebmar wrote: »

You could do it (think of the good points as leader) for Hitler too, like Develera did by being the only eejit in the world to express condolences on the death of Hitler to the German ambassador.

What has Cuba ever done for us ? Ask Michael D when Cuba will take our emigrants, or when we get investment from Cuba to employ tens of thousands here, or when are all the Cuban tourists coming?

Some people don't live in a world where you have to get something from somebody to respect them.
Michael D admired some of what Castro did while paying due recognition to bad things he did.

'Balanced', would be the word I would ascribe to his comments.

As a private visitor to Ireland Trump got a balanced welcome.

_blaaz

janfebmar wrote: »

In the the mid and late 20th century yes, but we had our independence then and we all know the government here /CIE did not maintain the railways well and always had to be rescued by the taxpayer. In fact so much of the train service to counties like Donegal the British provided was stopped by the Irish government, another case of Dublin ignoring the rest of the country. Even in the railways kept operational here, train journeys took longer in the sixties that before independence_ you think that is progress? As Gay Byrne used to say, we wanted our independence, we had to pay for it.

To get back to The thread subject, do you not think it embarrassing the taoiseach meeting the US President in Shannon airport and offering him a plastic cup of coffee was not exactly Ireland of the thousand welcomes, considering US firms here employ so many, and there are what 40 million Irish Americans? Maybe Trump telling Leo that he was a good little boy and doing well but that he was better friends with the neighbours ( the US-UK "special relationship" being the biggest alliance the world had ever seen) rubbed Leo up the wrong way? Leo looked very uncomfortable and you could tell that by his body language.

Our country seemed to show so little respect on an official level to the president of the USA...Even the comments by our own president the night before criticising the USA president...yet Michael D had only great things to say about Fidel Castro and signed the book of condolences on his death. I do not think the Americans were too impressed.

Hmm....except im.going off excerts from.turn of the 20th century regarding train jourmeys....not mid 20 like you keep imagined up...lolz you excusing sh1t infrasturture and imagining it as a great.thing



I dont really care about trump visit since it wasnt a state visit....micheal d is a legde and actually elected by majority...unlike the queen or trump,come to think of.it

janfebmar

_blaaz wrote: »

.micheal d is a legde

We"ll excuse him so, as long as he brings in the high spending tourists and investors from Cuba. We can afford to insult the Americans when they come to visit.

RustyNut

janfebmar wrote: »

How many well heeled Americans come to Ireland to play golf, and how many people are employed by American multinationals here? And yet all our awkward Taoiseach can do is offer him a plastic cup of coffee in an airport? The most powerful country in the world was clearly not impressed with that, or Michael D who showed more respect to Castro.

Ah now come on, our awkward Taoiseach has made the orange pussy grabber welcome before, sure didn't the donald give him credit for trying to interfere in the planning process on his behalf.

Is this the sort of thing you would have liked?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9i1HHTdcXU

FrancieBrady

RustyNut wrote: »

Ah now come on, our awkward Taoiseach has made the orange pussy grabber welcome before, sure didn't the donald give him credit for trying to interfere in the planning process on his behalf.

Is this the sort of thing you would have liked?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9i1HHTdcXU

The 'awkwardness' this time was probably because Leo wasn't sure what embarassing titbit Trump would drop this time.

janfebmar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

The 'awkwardness' this time was probably because Leo wasn't sure what embarassing titbit Trump would drop this time.

Remember Leo and his embarrassing comments when he went to Downing st.?
No surprise Leo was embarrassed at the welcome the president of the USA got this time in Shannon. Trump put him in his place by saying he was better friends with the neighbours next door.

_blaaz

janfebmar wrote: »

We"ll excuse him so, as long as he brings in the high spending tourists and investors from Cuba. We can afford to insult the Americans when they come to visit.

Meh....we excuse him while majority elect him...unlike trump and the queen

FrancieBrady

janfebmar wrote: »

Remember Leo and his embarrassing comments when he went to Downing st.?
No surprise Leo was embarrassed at the welcome the president of the USA got this time in Shannon. Trump put him in his place by saying he was better friends with the neighbours next door.

They are welcome to him imo. Relieved us of an onerous job

Wanderer78

janfebmar wrote:

Remember Leo and his embarrassing comments when he went to Downing st.? No surprise Leo was embarrassed at the welcome the president of the USA got this time in Shannon. Trump put him in his place by saying he was better friends with the neighbours next door.

Wtf! Trump showed, he's still as ignorant as anything

Auguste Comte

janfebmar wrote: »

Remember Leo and his embarrassing comments when he went to Downing st.?

Downing Street the home of modern political embarrassment.

Duckworth_Luas

janfebmar wrote: »

Remember Leo and his embarrassing comments when he went to Downing st.?
No surprise Leo was embarrassed at the welcome the president of the USA got this time in Shannon. Trump put him in his place by saying he was better friends with the neighbours next door.

Luckily Canada sits next to the USA and the UK was able to pass one of these across.

janfebmar

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Wtf! Trump showed, he's still as ignorant as anything

Maybe he was just overwhelmed by the grand surroundings of the Shannon airport building.....Not lol

Not every visitor to Ireland gets offered a plastic cup of coffee either. Even the French gave him a better welcome when he was there on Thursday.

FrancieBrady

I didn't know about the 'plastic cup'...quite proud of that tbh.

_blaaz

janfebmar wrote: »

Maybe he was just overwhelmed by the grand surroundings of the Shannon airport building.....Not lol

Not every visitor to Ireland gets offered a plastic cup of coffee either. Even the French gave him a better welcome when he was there on Thursday.

Tbh it wasnt a state visit......he is no more important a visitor than anyone else in this scenario



Welcome.to a republic....where everyone is equal and heads of state are elected by majority unlike uk and us

janfebmar

_blaaz wrote: »

Tbh it wasnt a state visit......he is no more important a visitor than anyone else in this scenario

If he was no more important a visitor than anyone else, why did our Taoiseach and half the countries media go to Shannon to meet him at all?

_blaaz

janfebmar wrote: »

If he was no more important a visitor than anyone else, why did our Taoiseach and half the countries media go to Shannon to meet him at all?

He shouldnt have....it wasnt a state visit....media is free to do they please unlike in the uk and us with state restrictions and removing press passes with bullsh1t excuses for media who call out bullsh1t


Seems trump didnt want to me mikey d an elected by majority head of state unlike the us or uk....perhaps this tendancy towards undemocratic head of states is what their special alliance is

janfebmar

_blaaz wrote: »

He shouldnt have....it wasnt a state visit....

Trump was elected President of the US, while Varadker was never elected Taoiseach here, is that your point?

threeball

janfebmar wrote: »

Trump was elected President of the US, while Varadker was never elected Taoiseach here, is that your point?

You don't elect a Taoiseach, you elect a government. Who they choose as Taoiseach is not within the control of the electorate. You have alot of brushing up to do. I'd suggest reading a book or two rather than posting uninformed rubbish on online forums.

_blaaz

janfebmar wrote: »

Trump was elected President of the US, while Varadker was never elected Taoiseach here, is that your point?

Taoiseach isnt head of state here??


Trump couldnt even get a majority...hence why is afraid to meet a democratically elected mikey d and prefers to stay visiting undemocratic england as it aligns their special undemocratic alliance

janfebmar

threeball wrote: »

You don't elect a Taoiseach, you elect a government. Who they choose as Taoiseach is not within the control of the electorate.

Precisely the point I made. Leo never had the majority vote of the electorate, and when we voted, he was not Taoiseach.

steddyeddy

janfebmar wrote: »

Precisely the point I made. Leo never had the majority vote of the electorate, and when we voted, he was not Taoiseach.

Well a bit of a stupid point to be honest.

Auguste Comte

janfebmar wrote: »

Read the post above, the US president has said the US -UK " special relationship" is the greatest alliance the world has ever seen, and has urged the UK to ditch the shackles of the EU asap.

He's just trying to biggly up his new colony.

janfebmar

steddyeddy wrote: »

Well a bit of a stupid point to be honest.

Tell that to Blaaz , he was waffling along those lines, I asked him is that the point he was making.

janfebmar

Auguste Comte wrote: »

He's just trying to biggly up his new colony.

It does not need civilising, they were at least able to give their visitors the courtesy of a first class slap up meal.;)

FrancieBrady

janfebmar wrote: »

It does not need civilising, they were at least able to give their visitors the courtesy of a first class slap up meal.;)

Because that was a state visit.
ANd there were plenty of elected reps who snubbed him too...what a disgraceful thing to do to your 'special' friend.
Give it up jan.

Auguste Comte

janfebmar wrote: »

Auguste Comte wrote: »

He's just trying to biggly up his new colony.

It does not need civilising, they were at least able to give their visitors the courtesy of a first class slap up meal.;)

Of course, they have to suck up to the new boss.