Pro14 Season 2019-2020

Digifriendly

Conference B looking interesting for top 3 play off places. Only Southern Kings look completely out of the picture.

bob mcbob

Buer wrote: »

Of course money is the driving factor not but I still believe there's a perception amongst the Welsh and Scottish that the GP is the better league. We've seen a glut of Scottish players move south to pretty mediocre teams who wouldn't have big budgets. Newcastle have always had several Scots on their books for example and I doubt they're making anything huge for uprooting their lives.

If all things were equal financially, I would still expect the odd one to move and no English players to move the other way unless it was for a shot at test rugby like Burns.

A factor that has to be taken into account is that there are only 2 professional teams in Scotland and they need to balance young player development with keeping the experienced internationals. There is a demand for the internationals but not so much for the young players coming thru.

Podge_irl

Big game for Treviso at the moment. Win this and they are seriously in the thick of things, but struggling and 12-19 down to Glasgow. Glasgow themselves can't really afford any more slip-ups.

Podge_irl

Crap, Glasgow breakaway and get the TBP score. Treviso really not have a great run of it this year after doing so well last year.

Podge_irl

Not convinced Treviso didn't score there, surprising lack of replays.

Podge_irl

Phenomenal score from Treviso. Some of the passes they are throwing are insanely reckless but somehow they all came off there.

Burkie1203

Zebre 20-8 cheetahs at half time

Burkie1203

Burkie1203 wrote: »

Zebre 20-8 cheetahs at half time

27-8 and the Italian TV director is in love with one female spectator too

razorblunt

OldRio wrote: »

To be fair a move to Newcastle is hardly uprooting their lives. About 90 mins travel time.

You’d spend longer getting out of a Glasgow to drive home to Edinburgh. I think the lacklustre replacement for Rennie made up the minds of a lot of players.

Jonny Gray has been poor though. He’s gone the way of Gray the elder, a bit flaky and not as imposing as he was or could be. His tackle stats mask a lot too.

They could do worse than get Hunter Hill up from Saracens, not sure how he snuck out of Scotland rugby but it’s a bit strange over here, the rugby school boys get massive hype and and almost always fail to live up to it.

thomond2006

Benetton aren't repeating last year's form by the looks of things.

Podge_irl

thomond2006 wrote: »

Benetton aren't repeating last year's form by the looks of things.

Game was closer than the final score would suggest. Really got away from them in the last 10 min when they were chasing. Small things just not going right for them.

razorblunt

Cheetahs score.
Two converted tries needed to draw, 20 mins to do it. Should be a good finish.

razorblunt

Canna not kicking for goal, might catch them.

Never mind , Zebre score in the corner.

sydthebeat

Dragons score at the death to win

Digifriendly

Cheetahs defeat helps Ulster and Glasgow in Conference A. Massive contrast in Cheetahs home and away form.

Tigerandahalf

Another one sided result in the Leinster Connacht game. I haven't watched much of the games over Xmas with the 2nd teams being put out. The league is in big trouble.

Eod100

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

Another one sided result in the Leinster Connacht game. I haven't watched much of the games over Xmas with the 2nd teams being put out. The league is in big trouble.

Leinster streets ahead that's for sure. Conference B much closer than A. Not sure what league could do differently. Can only work with teams in it and the form the bring to games.

razorblunt

S(h)it hole at 13 for the Kings.

Eod100

razorblunt wrote: »

S(h)it hole at 13 for the Kings.

Is it on the box?

Squidgy Black

Eod100 wrote: »

Is it on the box?

It's on premier sports 1

razorblunt

Kings red card, forearm charge.

thelad95

I don't see why Leinster can't do an unbeaten league season from here, there really is absolutely nobody close to them with the strength in depth of the squad.

razorblunt

Jim Hamilton embarrassing himself on comms, clash of heads in a tackle in which the Kings player raises an elbow after the hit. Jim calling for a red. Has thankfully backed down after seeing a replay for the 8th time.

Neville handed it brilliantly.

Tigerandahalf

Eod100 wrote: »

Leinster streets ahead that's for sure. Conference B much closer than A. Not sure what league could do differently. Can only work with teams in it and the form the bring to games.

The league is a joke with the national sides taking such precedence.
Wales played an extra autumn international meaning their sides were putting out mickey mouse sides while the inter pros this year were dead ducks.

People will be slower to pay out for season tickets when that is the dross that is served up. The tv rights holders can't be too happy either.

In truth progress in the champions cup is the only thing maintaining interest in the club game in Ireland. If Munster go out of Europe early there will be tumbleweed in Thomond Park.

Not sure what the solution is

molloyjh

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

The league is a joke with the national sides taking such precedence.
Wales played an extra autumn international meaning their sides were putting out mickey mouse sides while the inter pros this year were dead ducks.

People will be slower to pay out for season tickets when that is the dross that is served up. The tv rights holders can't be too happy either.

In truth progress in the champions cup is the only thing maintaining interest in the club game in Ireland. If Munster go out of Europe early there will be tumbleweed in Thomond Park.

Not sure what the solution is

The biggest dead duck games were the ones this weekend when the least amount of enforced rest was at play.

OldRio

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

The league is a joke with the national sides taking such precedence.
Wales played an extra autumn international meaning their sides were putting out mickey mouse sides while the inter pros this year were dead ducks.

People will be slower to pay out for season tickets when that is the dross that is served up. The tv rights holders can't be too happy either.

In truth progress in the champions cup is the only thing maintaining interest in the club game in Ireland. If Munster go out of Europe early there will be tumbleweed in Thomond Park.

Not sure what the solution is

Well the attendance figures for all the games this period looked very well indeed.

Digifriendly

OldRio wrote: »

Well the attendance figures for all the games this period looked very well indeed.

Last 2 Interpros at Ulster HQ were sell outs as was Munster vs Leinster.

AdamD

Difficult to see it lasting, worst interpros for years.

c.p.w.g.w

Don't think the reffing is helping either...There is such ambiguity, it makes it very hard to watch, not uniquely a Pro14 issue.

awec

OldRio wrote: »

Well the attendance figures for all the games this period looked very well indeed.

There are only so many times you can fool the casual fans with marketing before they realise what they’re really being served up in these games.

bilston

We need a British and Irish League and for the first time I think it may just be a possibility now. It might still be a few years away, but I think it will happen.

bilston

awec wrote: »

There are only so many times you can fool the casual fans with marketing before they realise what they’re really being served up in these games.

The atmosphere at both games in Belfast was great. To be honest I'd say the casual fans who went along for a jolly will probably be back. It helps that Ulster are playing well obviously.

Eod100

awec wrote: »

There are only so many times you can fool the casual fans with marketing before they realise what they’re really being served up in these games.

But interpros haven't involved full strength teams for years now. Granted people might get fed up of this but not like they shouldn't know what to expect going into these games.

Former Former

c.p.w.g.w wrote: »

Don't think the reffing is helping either...There is such ambiguity, it makes it very hard to watch, not uniquely a Pro14 issue.

It's a rugby issue. It's the nature of the sport. If you don't want ambiguous decisions, you're watching the wrong game.

OldRio

awec wrote: »

There are only so many times you can fool the casual fans with marketing before they realise what they’re really being served up in these games.

History says something completely different. I know you detest the Pro 14 but attendance figures over this period is not your best weapon.

stephen_n

awec wrote: »

There are only so many times you can fool the casual fans with marketing before they realise what they’re really being served up in these games.

You keep saying this but casual fans want tryfests, not tight arm wrestle games. It’s more likely to die hards who would get pissed off with these games.

sydthebeat

stephen_n wrote: »

You keep saying this but casual fans want tryfests, not tight arm wrestle games. It’s more likely to die hards who would get pissed off with these games.

That's exactly right.

The casual fans are delighted with the event and piss up and to see some tasty tries.

The die hards want competition.

The former will lead to the death of the Pro14.

stephen_n

sydthebeat wrote: »

That's exactly right.

The casual fans are delighted with the event and piss up and to see some tasty tries.

The die hards want competition.

The former will lead to the death of the Pro14.

Are attendances not up overall, I seem to remember some marketing blurb at the end of last season suggesting that?

sydthebeat

stephen_n wrote: »

Are attendances not up overall, I seem to remember some marketing blurb at the end of last season suggesting that?

Fair point, if correct, but that could be more due to outside economic reasons than any interest in the actual league.

Are the one off event games skewing the figures? They'd been many an RDS game with poor attendance over the last few years.

Are rumors and talks towards a British and Irish league louder now too?

There's already pretty much full consensus on here that the function of the pro 14 is to produce players for the Irish national team. That's a serious indictment of the competition of any league.

molloyjh

A bloke in work is about as casual a fan as you can get. The Ulster game was his first in the RDS. He loved it. Said the atmosphere was great and the game was enjoyable. As has been said, casual fans want line breaks and tries.

sydthebeat

molloyjh wrote: »

A bloke in work is about as casual a fan as you can get. The Ulster game was his first in the RDS. He loved it. Said the atmosphere was great and the game was enjoyable. As has been said, casual fans want line breaks and tries.

But like a porn addict, they will just want more and more extreme versions.
Wait till the day you have the rugby equivalent of a team of dwarfs in gimp masks melting candle wax on to a 90 yo granny's shot bolted vjj, while a one legged albino relieves himself all over everyone, singing the star spangled banner....

Will ye be happy then??

Squidgy Black

sydthebeat wrote: »

But like a porn addict, they will just want more and more extreme versions.
Wait till the day you have the rugby equivalent of a team of dwarfs in gimp masks melting candle wax on to a 90 yo granny's shot bolted vjj, while a one legged albino relieves himself all over everyone, singing the star spangled banner....

Will ye be happy then??

Jesus no need to kink shame on a Sunday morning Syd

jacothelad

sydthebeat wrote: »

But like a porn addict, they will just want more and more extreme versions.
On the day you have of a team of dwarfs in gimp masks melting candle wax on to a 90 yo granny's shot bolted vjj, while a one legged albino relieves himself all over everyone, singing the star spangled banner....

Will ye be happy then??

So you've been to a DUP game then......:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

sydthebeat

sydthebeat wrote: »

But like a porn addict, they will just want more and more extreme versions.
Wait till the day you have the rugby equivalent of a team of dwarfs in gimp masks melting candle wax on to a 90 yo granny's shot bolted vjj, while a one legged albino relieves himself all over everyone, singing the star spangled banner....

Will ye be happy then??

suspiciously specific...

stephen_n

sydthebeat wrote: »

Fair point, if correct, but that could be more due to outside economic reasons than any interest in the actual league.

Are the one off event games skewing the figures? They'd been many an RDS game with poor attendance over the last few years.

Are rumors and talks towards a British and Irish league louder now too?

There's already pretty much full consensus on here that the function of the pro 14 is to produce players for the Irish national team. That's a serious indictment of the competition of any league.

I still can’t see the British & Irish league working. We don’t bring enough revenue to make that fly. The Premiership clubs aren’t going to leave themselves open to getting dumped either. Maybe CVC will end up having a say, but again not sure it’s financially beneficial either.

Pro 14 is secondary to Europe here and yes it is subservient to the national teams needs. I don’t know what the answer is about the league. The next TV deals will determine how viable the pro 14 is though.

awec

I for one am getting fed up explaining to those who don’t understand the setup of Pro14 rugby why Ulster, for example, did not send their strongest team to play against the best team in the league, or why teams are effectively told to throw fixtures (and not only is this allowed, is practically encouraged).

The concept is just baffling. As a competition there just isn’t a whole lot of credibility or integrity.

I for one cannot wait for radical reform of rugby structures and would totally back anyone who proposed it. If it takes English or french clubs to drag the Pro14 kicking and screaming then so be it.

stephen_n

awec wrote: »

I for one am getting fed up explaining to those who don’t understand the setup of Pro14 rugby why Ulster, for example, did not send their strongest team to play against the best team in the league, or why teams are effectively told to throw fixtures (and not only is this allowed, is practically encouraged).

The concept is just baffling. As a competition there just isn’t a whole lot of credibility or integrity.

I for one cannot wait for radical reform of rugby structures and would totally back anyone who proposed it. If it takes English or french clubs to drag the Pro14 kicking and screaming then so be it.

The way you go on you’d think the Pro 14 was the only league this happens in. It happens in the premiership and the top 14 all the time too.

awec

stephen_n wrote: »

The way you go on you’d think the Pro 14 was the only league this happens in. It happens in the premiership and the top 14 all the time too.

Nowhere near to the same extent. Players are rested, but since there’s no nonsense like one owner controlling multiple clubs you don’t get this daft fixture scheduling so that teams with the same owner can be forced to play each other minus their best players.

Bridge93

The Pro14 is quite comfortably the worst product of the 3 big leagues. This is undeniable. Yes there are a number of factors that contribute to this but at a base level it really isn’t good enough. The competition makes up over 50% of our rugby consumption in any given year. It just isn’t acceptable to me that it is for the most part rubbish played by second XV’s and teams woefully out of their depth.

I don’t know what the solution is as it’s as much a mindset thing as others have alluded to. But the Pro14 in its current form can not be allowed to limp along as it is. Give me the perceived dull premiership or top14 over the crap we have. At least there is the hint of a competitive league and respect for it by the teams who participate

MarinersBlues

Bridge93 wrote: »

.... the perceived dull premiership or top14 over the crap we have. At least there is the hint of a competitive league and respect for it by the teams who participate

In the Top14 many if the clubs send their second string for every away game - half of their season is thrown games.

In the premiership Saracans have been at least as dominant as Leinster for the last 3 years and have shown zero "respect" for the competition.

The other leagues are just not that much better, if they are better at all, and are not financially sustainable in the long term, so I wouldn't be aspiring to that.

The only way to have games that are 100% competitive all of the time is to have a knock out tournament or a league with 12 fixtures max.
The nature of the sport means that you need 2 full teams to be rotate if you want to keep competitive for 9 months. There are only 4 or 5 teams in Europe that can do that. Demanding the other teams have this is just not reasonable.