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Clare GAA Discussion - 2024 All Ireland Hurling Champions
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When we think back to 2013 when he burst onto the scene, his instinct was to head for goal or take things on himself.
His goal V Galway in 2018 was another example of his ability.
If I recall correctly, he had an injury a few years back which limited his movement and he transformed into a playmaker, laying the ball off at nearly every opportunity.
I think there is a potent attacker in there, and his playmaking is more of a habit than anything.
It’s not necessarily a bad one, but we need scoring forwards not just this year but going forward.
He is playing well, and you can’t fault his work rate and selflessness, but to compete for all Irelands in the modern era you need 4 of your 6 forwards at least having the primary mindset of looking for scores. Maybe we are not genuine contenders yet, but now we find ourselves in a ¼ final we shouldn’t be afraid to throw the kitchen sink at it from here on in.
I would expect Waterford and any team beyond that to curtail TKs impact leaving us short on scores.
I don't see Malone, Guilfoyle or Taylor shooting the lights out if Kelly gets tied down.
Compared to Galway, Tipp and Limerick we are well down on firepower and we know the Wexford game plan doesn’t work.
We need to fight fire with fire.SoD isn't a scorer, he hasn't scored this year and he's averaging less than 2 points a game in championship hurling since 2013 so I'm not sure what benefit of having him at the edge of the square would be, his role of a disrupter around centre forward seems to be working a bit of him but he's not going to win clean ball and he's not going to score, he'll harass defenders and get on a break like he did for the handpass for the goal on Saturday so if we are going to persist with him I think that's the role for him.0 -
I was kind of hoping for Galway this morning, not that there is a huge amount between the sides, but I feel Galway are more suited to us. Waterford have a very good half back line, where is probably our weakest area. And always the best way to neutralise Kelly has been to gain the upper hand in the half back line so Kelly isn't running off players for passes. I think Waterford are more compact than Galway overall at the back, good goalie, full back, half backline, Barron at midfield, Liam Cahill has them well drilled and disciplined. The Galway corner backs and goalie are nervous enough in dealing with balls breaking around the 20.
Lohan has a few selection decisions this week coming.
David McInerney will be coming into the side, but it's not obvious where. Jason McCarthy played very well last Saturday at midfield, while its likely Kelly will be the other midfielder. You could put Kelly back up into a roaming corner forward role too like where he played against Limerick, but I think Lohan will prefer him around midfield to be honest. David McInerney could play in the half back line.
There is a selection decision in the half back line too. Seadna was named at corner back, but obviously to play the extra man role against Wexford. Lohan hasn't and won't play Seadna as a conventional corner back and I expect Browne, if fit, to come back into the side. Lohan will be picking 3 half backs from Patch, Aidan McCarthy, Seadna Morey, Stephen O'Halloran and possibly David McInerney.
Diarmuid Ryan is another who will be pushing strong for a place at wing forward in the expense of Reidy too. Ryan's made a good impression since coming on the last two games and gives Clare another aerial presence. If it were up to me, I'd line up Malone, Fitz and Ryan across the 40 and make it a right battlezone under puckouts.
Full forward is a black hole for Clare at the moment. Shanagher pulling him hamstring is an unmitigated disaster. Were essentially down to our 4th choice full forward now that Conlon, Shanagher and Deasy are all unavailable. I don't really rate Guilfoyle to be honest, he is a tall lad but doesn't have a presence on the edge of the square. We have options like Cunningham and Cathal McInerney but I don't know how highly Lohan rates those two seen as they have been given such little playing time.0 -
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When we think back to 2013 when he burst onto the scene, his instinct was to head for goal or take things on himself.
His goal V Galway in 2018 was another example of his ability.
If I recall correctly, he had an injury a few years back which limited his movement and he transformed into a playmaker, laying the ball off at nearly every opportunity.
I think there is a potent attacker in there, and his playmaking is more of a habit than anything.
It’s not necessarily a bad one, but we need scoring forwards not just this year but going forward.
He is playing well, and you can’t fault his work rate and selflessness, but to compete for all Irelands in the modern era you need 4 of your 6 forwards at least having the primary mindset of looking for scores. Maybe we are not genuine contenders yet, but now we find ourselves in a ¼ final we shouldn’t be afraid to throw the kitchen sink at it from here on in.
I would expect Waterford and any team beyond that to curtail TKs impact leaving us short on scores.
I don't see Malone, Guilfoyle or Taylor shooting the lights out if Kelly gets tied down.
Compared to Galway, Tipp and Limerick we are well down on firepower and we know the Wexford game plan doesn’t work.
We need to fight fire with fire.
I don't know, I think the 3 goals in 2013 is glossing over a lot of his performances, a couple of those goals I could have scored myself thanks to the brilliant off the ball running and passes but he'll always be known as the guy who scored 3-3 in an All Ireland final and that can't be taken away from him. I don't think he's a natural scorer, if he was he'd be doing it at club level or in the league.
that's about 1.5 points per game, that's not the return from a natural scorer.2014 - Clare played 3 games, SoD scored 0-1
2015 - Clare played 3 games, SoD scored 1-3
2016 - Clare played 4 games, SoD scored 1-6
2017 - Clare played 3 games, SoD scored 2-4
2018 - Clare played 7 games, SoD scored 1-8
2019 - Clare played 3 games, SoD scored 1-1
2020 - Clare played 3 games, SoD scored 0-0
26 games played, 6-23 scored
His goal against Galway in 2018 was something special alright, had to take another look at it there, if I was a Galway supporter I'd be questioning the amount of steps, we were lucky that it wasn't pulled for a free in but it was a great goal
https://youtu.be/oJfo-onc8_o?t=740 -
You are right and I can't argue with the facts and I am not trying to.
What I am getting at is he has the speed and skill to be an effective scoring threat.
It may not be what we see from him most, but I think he should be encouraged to be more direct a little closer to goal.
Any one of a number of lads can do the donkey work out the field.
If we don’t get SOD or someone else (open to suggestions) scoring more, we simply will not score enough to beat the remaining teams.0 -
SoD isn't a scorer, he hasn't scored this year and he's averaging less than 2 points a game in championship hurling since 2013 so I'm not sure what benefit of having him at the edge of the square would be, his role of a disrupter around centre forward seems to be working a bit of him but he's not going to win clean ball and he's not going to score, he'll harass defenders and get on a break like he did for the handpass for the goal on Saturday so if we are going to persist with him I think that's the role for him.
If 'we are going to persist" with Shane O Donnell. Have you lost your marbles. ? I understand you question his scoring but you can't question anything else.0 -
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I was kind of hoping for Galway this morning, not that there is a huge amount between the sides, but I feel Galway are more suited to us. Waterford have a very good half back line, where is probably our weakest area. And always the best way to neutralise Kelly has been to gain the upper hand in the half back line so Kelly isn't running off players for passes. I think Waterford are more compact than Galway overall at the back, good goalie, full back, half backline, Barron at midfield, Liam Cahill has them well drilled and disciplined. The Galway corner backs and goalie are nervous enough in dealing with balls breaking around the 20.
Lohan has a few selection decisions this week coming.
David McInerney will be coming into the side, but it's not obvious where. Jason McCarthy played very well last Saturday at midfield, while its likely Kelly will be the other midfielder. You could put Kelly back up into a roaming corner forward role too like where he played against Limerick, but I think Lohan will prefer him around midfield to be honest. David McInerney could play in the half back line.
There is a selection decision in the half back line too. Seadna was named at corner back, but obviously to play the extra man role against Wexford. Lohan hasn't and won't play Seadna as a conventional corner back and I expect Browne, if fit, to come back into the side. Lohan will be picking 3 half backs from Patch, Aidan McCarthy, Seadna Morey, Stephen O'Halloran and possibly David McInerney.
Diarmuid Ryan is another who will be pushing strong for a place at wing forward in the expense of Reidy too. Ryan's made a good impression since coming on the last two games and gives Clare another aerial presence. If it were up to me, I'd line up Malone, Fitz and Ryan across the 40 and make it a right battlezone under puckouts.
Full forward is a black hole for Clare at the moment. Shanagher pulling him hamstring is an unmitigated disaster. Were essentially down to our 4th choice full forward now that Conlon, Shanagher and Deasy are all unavailable. I don't really rate Guilfoyle to be honest, he is a tall lad but doesn't have a presence on the edge of the square. We have options like Cunningham and Cathal McInerney but I don't know how highly Lohan rates those two seen as they have been given such little playing time.
I dont rate Guilfoyle either. From what I have seen of him ,he is rash in his decision making. And slow to release the ball. Theres more improvements to come from Clare. Aiden McCarthy has more in him. His tackling is overly aggressive and he needs to chill out abit.
I can see Jack Brown being kept in reserve. Morey played a fine game as did Patch0 -
I was kind of hoping for Galway this morning, not that there is a huge amount between the sides, but I feel Galway are more suited to us. Waterford have a very good half back line, where is probably our weakest area. And always the best way to neutralise Kelly has been to gain the upper hand in the half back line so Kelly isn't running off players for passes. I think Waterford are more compact than Galway overall at the back, good goalie, full back, half backline, Barron at midfield, Liam Cahill has them well drilled and disciplined. The Galway corner backs and goalie are nervous enough in dealing with balls breaking around the 20.
Lohan has a few selection decisions this week coming.
David McInerney will be coming into the side, but it's not obvious where. Jason McCarthy played very well last Saturday at midfield, while its likely Kelly will be the other midfielder. You could put Kelly back up into a roaming corner forward role too like where he played against Limerick, but I think Lohan will prefer him around midfield to be honest. David McInerney could play in the half back line.
There is a selection decision in the half back line too. Seadna was named at corner back, but obviously to play the extra man role against Wexford. Lohan hasn't and won't play Seadna as a conventional corner back and I expect Browne, if fit, to come back into the side. Lohan will be picking 3 half backs from Patch, Aidan McCarthy, Seadna Morey, Stephen O'Halloran and possibly David McInerney.
Diarmuid Ryan is another who will be pushing strong for a place at wing forward in the expense of Reidy too. Ryan's made a good impression since coming on the last two games and gives Clare another aerial presence. If it were up to me, I'd line up Malone, Fitz and Ryan across the 40 and make it a right battlezone under puckouts.
Full forward is a black hole for Clare at the moment. Shanagher pulling him hamstring is an unmitigated disaster. Were essentially down to our 4th choice full forward now that Conlon, Shanagher and Deasy are all unavailable. I don't really rate Guilfoyle to be honest, he is a tall lad but doesn't have a presence on the edge of the square. We have options like Cunningham and Cathal McInerney but I don't know how highly Lohan rates those two seen as they have been given such little playing time.
I see where your coming from with wanting Galway ahead of Waterford.
Waterford played with a Kilkennyesque workrate yesterday that caused lots of problems for Limerick.
Going into the last quarter it was anyone's game, Limericks half back line bailed them out in the end. They forced the Waterford puck outs long and the three giants won the majority in the half backline and blunted Waterford's momentum and saw out the game.
Lohan will have to play McInerney centre back and have two physically imposing wing backs with him, if Waterford win the areial battle there it could be a long day, of course Clare could concede the puckouts, Waterford go short and then you work manically to get it back, which I think is a flawed tactic.0 -
BloodyBill wrote: »I dont rate Guilfoyle either. From what I have seen of him ,he is rash in his decision making. And slow to release the ball. Theres more improvements to come from Clare. Aiden McCarthy has more in him. His tackling is overly aggressive and he needs to chill out abit.
I can see Jack Brown being kept in reserve. Morey played a fine game as did Patch
I agree, I'd love if Lohan pulled out a wildcard and played Rodgers, but it wouldn't be fair on the kid to be put up against a lad like Prunty who is a good, tough full back. I think we'd be better off starting Cunningham to be honest and move Prunty around than having a more stationary target like Guilfoyle.
Yeah, I'm a fan of Aidan McCarthy too. I'd retain him. I was having a thought, possibly if we keep the midfield the same against Wexford, we could bring in David McInerney to mark Stephen Bennett, who is their talisman up front. Probably means taking out Stephen O'Halloran in that case.0 -
Treble double wrote: »I see where your coming from with wanting Galway ahead of Waterford.
Waterford played with a Kilkennyesque workrate yesterday that caused lots of problems for Limerick.
Going into the last quarter it was anyone's game, Limericks half back line bailed them out in the end. They forced the Waterford puck outs long and the three giants won the majority in the half backline and blunted Waterford's momentum and saw out the game.
Lohan will have to play McInerney centre back and have two physically imposing wing backs with him, if Waterford win the areial battle there it could be a long day, of course Clare could concede the puckouts, Waterford go short and then you work manically to get it back, which I think is a flawed tactic.
I'm the same, in that what worried me watching Waterford was how for 55, nearly 60 minutes, they gave Limerick enough of it between the 40s. We only lasted 35 minutes. They are plenty physical and work their socks off. That's why I'd be more in favour of retaining the likes of Jason McCarthy and David Fitz and bringing in David McInerney and Diarmuid Ryan, just to match them in those stakes. We can bring on the likes of David Reidy later when the game breaks up.
The one thing I noticed from them that we can work on, is the Waterford have a tendency to carry the ball into traffic. They got away with it a bit against Limerick as the ref wasn't having any of Limerick 'overly' physical tackling (I taught it wasn't) but they got alot of frees from it. If Clare keep their discipline and look to get in the flicks and hooks, there could be opportunities to turnover Waterford possession in the middle third.0 -
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This is our fourth championship game, I don't think this is the place to bring in an under 20. The conditions are going to get worse and worse and I think goals are going to make the big differences now as the year goes on, it's about getting the wind in the first half, getting ahead as much as possible and then holding on, if you can get a goal that makes it a lot easier.0 -
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BloodyBill wrote: »If 'we are going to persist" with Shane O Donnell. Have you lost your marbles. ? I understand you question his scoring but you can't question anything else.
That's seems to be a big problem when it comes to SoD, you can't question anything about him. He has played the full 70 minutes in every game so far even when I think he could have be taken off before others, for example against Limerick Taylor had 1-1 scored but he was taken off. In my opinion he's not as good as a lot of Clare supporters make him out to be and I have made that opinion clear, I can't wait to be proven wrong, I really can't, I think he has the potential to be an all time great but he hasn't played up to his potential often enough.0 -
If we are to disregard him, bearing mind Kelly is a midfielder, where does our threat come from?0
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I figured I'd give SoD a chance and re-watch the Wexford game to see his performance to hopefully spot something that I didn't see in the first watching.
Start of the game, himself & Guilfoyle were a 2 man full forward line, no ball went near him for the first 5 minutes.
5 minutes 50 seconds, short puck out by Wexford, SoD fouls.
6 minutes 50 seconds, puck out on top of him, loses possession, follows up to player who was passed to, Wexford clear their lines.
9 minutes, mis-reads pass in and Wexford clear.
10 minutes, up against 2 Wexford players fails to get possession, possible free either way, had the opportunity to gain clean possession buy failed to take it
12 minutes, short Wexford puck out, harasses Wexford defenders who still clear their lines.
13 minutes, free down on top of him, fails to gain possession, helps to get ball to Malone who puts the ball wide.
15 minutes, wins clean possession, hand pass to Taylor who make a run on goal, save, 65 scored
Water break, 1 clean possession, no score, turnovers or assist
17 minutes behind defender, defender mis controls and concedes sideline
19 minutes, contests Wexford puck out at midfield, harasses back to own 65 almost causes a turnover, Wexford score. Seems to have swopped positions with TK.
28 minutes, gets handpass and is fouled, TK scores free.
31 minutes, blocks Wexford defender, takes shot, is blocked, TK gets possession and scores from near side/end line. Feel wrong to give anyone an assist for that cause it's pure class from TK but will give him the credit.
37 minutes, ball into edge of square, fails to gain possession, Wexford clear
Half time, 1 clean possession, 2 turnovers, 2 assists.
Total positives for the first half, 2 clean possession, 2 turnovers and 2 assists.
Start of second half, seems to be playing in midfield.
41 minutes, throws defenders hurley away off the ball, is tackled by the defender, Wexford defender booked for it, SoD lucky not to get booked as well.
44 minutes, under Clare puck out, fails to gain possession
45 minutes, under Clare puck out, fails to gain possession
51 minutes, under Clare clearance, fails to gain possession
Water break, 0 possession or turnovers. Targeted for a few clearances/puckouts but being in midfield and the ball hanging in the air it was always going to be a backs ball.
53 minutes, ball passed to him, fails to gain possession
55 minutes, picks up break from puck out, passes to TK who goals.
56 minutes, turnovers possession and passes.
58 minutes, gains possesion on his own 45, passes.
60 minutes, under Clare puck out, fails to gain possesion
61 minutes, fields ball from sideline and hits the ball into the inside forwards, cleared by Wexford
4 possessions, 3 successful passes and 1 assist for a goal.
At this stage GAA Go has stopped the stream, seems to be limited to 90 minutes so I can't comment on the last 10 minutes. Looking at the first 60 minutes, he struggled to get clean possession but was starting to find his men with passes in the last quarter. He seems to be playing more as an attacking midfielder than a forward and the conditions didn't suit him but they didn't suit any forward. The commentator called him out for the pass for the goal and getting the ball on his own 45 after 58 minutes. Re-watching the game, I would have liked him to got into space more, every other forward had a shot on goal, he had 1 blocked attempt.0 -
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Down to Cork we go at 3.45 on Saturday, live on Sky Sports. I'm actually glad that people aren't allowed attend matches, trying to get to PUC for that time on a Saturday would be a nightmare.0 -
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I figured I'd give SoD a chance and re-watch the Wexford game to see his performance to hopefully spot something that I didn't see in the first watching.
Start of the game, himself & Guilfoyle were a 2 man full forward line, no ball went near him for the first 5 minutes.
5 minutes 50 seconds, short puck out by Wexford, SoD fouls.
6 minutes 50 seconds, puck out on top of him, loses possession, follows up to player who was passed to, Wexford clear their lines.
9 minutes, mis-reads pass in and Wexford clear.
10 minutes, up against 2 Wexford players fails to get possession, possible free either way, had the opportunity to gain clean possession buy failed to take it
12 minutes, short Wexford puck out, harasses Wexford defenders who still clear their lines.
13 minutes, free down on top of him, fails to gain possession, helps to get ball to Malone who puts the ball wide.
15 minutes, wins clean possession, hand pass to Taylor who make a run on goal, save, 65 scored
Water break, 1 clean possession, no score, turnovers or assist
17 minutes behind defender, defender mis controls and concedes sideline
19 minutes, contests Wexford puck out at midfield, harasses back to own 65 almost causes a turnover, Wexford score. Seems to have swopped positions with TK.
28 minutes, gets handpass and is fouled, TK scores free.
31 minutes, blocks Wexford defender, takes shot, is blocked, TK gets possession and scores from near side/end line. Feel wrong to give anyone an assist for that cause it's pure class from TK but will give him the credit.
37 minutes, ball into edge of square, fails to gain possession, Wexford clear
Half time, 1 clean possession, 2 turnovers, 2 assists.
Total positives for the first half, 2 clean possession, 2 turnovers and 2 assists.
Start of second half, seems to be playing in midfield.
41 minutes, throws defenders hurley away off the ball, is tackled by the defender, Wexford defender booked for it, SoD lucky not to get booked as well.
44 minutes, under Clare puck out, fails to gain possession
45 minutes, under Clare puck out, fails to gain possession
51 minutes, under Clare clearance, fails to gain possession
Water break, 0 possession or turnovers. Targeted for a few clearances/puckouts but being in midfield and the ball hanging in the air it was always going to be a backs ball.
53 minutes, ball passed to him, fails to gain possession
55 minutes, picks up break from puck out, passes to TK who goals.
56 minutes, turnovers possession and passes.
58 minutes, gains possesion on his own 45, passes.
60 minutes, under Clare puck out, fails to gain possesion
61 minutes, fields ball from sideline and hits the ball into the inside forwards, cleared by Wexford
4 possessions, 3 successful passes and 1 assist for a goal.
At this stage GAA Go has stopped the stream, seems to be limited to 90 minutes so I can't comment on the last 10 minutes. Looking at the first 60 minutes, he struggled to get clean possession but was starting to find his men with passes in the last quarter. He seems to be playing more as an attacking midfielder than a forward and the conditions didn't suit him but they didn't suit any forward. The commentator called him out for the pass for the goal and getting the ball on his own 45 after 58 minutes. Re-watching the game, I would have liked him to got into space more, every other forward had a shot on goal, he had 1 blocked attempt.
He scored 3-3 in the last 10 minutes.0 -
Did he get Shannon Gaels to a county semi or final? They nearly beat Kilkee one year. Would Kilmihill have any hurling now? I see Kilkee/Belacha were trying to get going again this year.
I think we might have beaten the Gales in a semi final or quarter final around 04 or 05 can’t remember. Kilmihil don’t have any hurling anymore but they have a lot of players that would play hurling for either Ballyea or Kilmaley.
Kilkee/Belacha had to give Clonbony a walkover in the Championship this year, would have been great if that match had gone ahead, but considering that they are struggling in the football it’s no suprises that they weren’t able to field a hurling team this year.
Clonbony are still playing away got to a final this year and I heard that they got in Brendan Bugler for a few sessions this year. They were supposed to have rounded up a few of the refugees that were staying in Miltown to train with them this year but have since left their direct provision centre in Miltown.0 -
It has to be said thats a thorough review of the game.
I will say however that I am sure if you gave the 12 other clare players a similar review (Goalie and TK aside) it would look underwhelming also.
Whether we agree or not SOD is as good as what we have at our disposal at the moment.
But I stand by my belief if he was closer to goal it would be better for both him and the team.I figured I'd give SoD a chance and re-watch the Wexford game to see his performance to hopefully spot something that I didn't see in the first watching.
Start of the game, himself & Guilfoyle were a 2 man full forward line, no ball went near him for the first 5 minutes.
5 minutes 50 seconds, short puck out by Wexford, SoD fouls.
6 minutes 50 seconds, puck out on top of him, loses possession, follows up to player who was passed to, Wexford clear their lines.
9 minutes, mis-reads pass in and Wexford clear.
10 minutes, up against 2 Wexford players fails to get possession, possible free either way, had the opportunity to gain clean possession buy failed to take it
12 minutes, short Wexford puck out, harasses Wexford defenders who still clear their lines.
13 minutes, free down on top of him, fails to gain possession, helps to get ball to Malone who puts the ball wide.
15 minutes, wins clean possession, hand pass to Taylor who make a run on goal, save, 65 scored
Water break, 1 clean possession, no score, turnovers or assist
17 minutes behind defender, defender mis controls and concedes sideline
19 minutes, contests Wexford puck out at midfield, harasses back to own 65 almost causes a turnover, Wexford score. Seems to have swopped positions with TK.
28 minutes, gets handpass and is fouled, TK scores free.
31 minutes, blocks Wexford defender, takes shot, is blocked, TK gets possession and scores from near side/end line. Feel wrong to give anyone an assist for that cause it's pure class from TK but will give him the credit.
37 minutes, ball into edge of square, fails to gain possession, Wexford clear
Half time, 1 clean possession, 2 turnovers, 2 assists.
Total positives for the first half, 2 clean possession, 2 turnovers and 2 assists.
Start of second half, seems to be playing in midfield.
41 minutes, throws defenders hurley away off the ball, is tackled by the defender, Wexford defender booked for it, SoD lucky not to get booked as well.
44 minutes, under Clare puck out, fails to gain possession
45 minutes, under Clare puck out, fails to gain possession
51 minutes, under Clare clearance, fails to gain possession
Water break, 0 possession or turnovers. Targeted for a few clearances/puckouts but being in midfield and the ball hanging in the air it was always going to be a backs ball.
53 minutes, ball passed to him, fails to gain possession
55 minutes, picks up break from puck out, passes to TK who goals.
56 minutes, turnovers possession and passes.
58 minutes, gains possesion on his own 45, passes.
60 minutes, under Clare puck out, fails to gain possesion
61 minutes, fields ball from sideline and hits the ball into the inside forwards, cleared by Wexford
4 possessions, 3 successful passes and 1 assist for a goal.
At this stage GAA Go has stopped the stream, seems to be limited to 90 minutes so I can't comment on the last 10 minutes. Looking at the first 60 minutes, he struggled to get clean possession but was starting to find his men with passes in the last quarter. He seems to be playing more as an attacking midfielder than a forward and the conditions didn't suit him but they didn't suit any forward. The commentator called him out for the pass for the goal and getting the ball on his own 45 after 58 minutes. Re-watching the game, I would have liked him to got into space more, every other forward had a shot on goal, he had 1 blocked attempt.0 -
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It has to be said thats a thorough review of the game.
I will say however that I am sure if you gave the 12 other clare players a similar review (Goalie and TK aside) it would look underwhelming also.
Whether we agree or not SOD is as good as what we have at our disposal at the moment.
But I stand by my belief if he was closer to goal it would be better for both him and the team.
Absolutely the other players would have similar reviews but people aren't singling out the others as being special, he is a player with great potential who on his day can win a game on his own but those days are few and far between.0 -
I think we might have beaten the Gales in a semi final or quarter final around 04 or 05 can’t remember. Kilmihil don’t have any hurling anymore but they have a lot of players that would play hurling for either Ballyea or Kilmaley.
Kilkee/Belacha had to give Clonbony a walkover in the Championship this year, would have been great if that match had gone ahead, but considering that they are struggling in the football it’s no suprises that they weren’t able to field a hurling team this year.
Clonbony are still playing away got to a final this year and I heard that they got in Brendan Bugler for a few sessions this year. They were supposed to have rounded up a few of the refugees that were staying in Miltown to train with them this year but have since left their direct provision centre in Miltown.
Did Shannon Gaels take ye to a replay that year?Kilkee/Belacha probably had lads from Doonbeg, Naomh Eoin or O'Currys? Kilkee completely took eye off the ball at juvenile when they were going strong at senior at football. Do any Quilty/Milltown lads play hurling with Clonbony?0 -
Did Shannon Gaels take ye to a replay that year?Kilkee/Belacha probably had lads from Doonbeg, Naomh Eoin or O'Currys? Kilkee completely took eye off the ball at juvenile when they were going strong at senior at football. Do any Quilty/Milltown lads play hurling with Clonbony?
I can’t remember if they took us to a replay or not, quite possibly could have. Shannon Gaels had quite a decent team around the mid 2000’s and early 2010’s. Jesus I wouldn’t like to see Doonbeg lads with hurleys in there hands there bad enough without them, so I can’t imagine the damage they would do if they took up hurling.
Clonbony would be mainly made up of Kilmurry and Miltown lads to be honest, a lot of them would be playing Junior football for both clubs, but there would be some Senior players that would play for Clonbony, the likes of Martin McMahon and Gordon Kelly used to play with Clonbony. Seanie Malone was also playing for Clonbony this year, after Miltown got knocked out.
Other lads would play for the craic or the social element really, anyone half way decent goes playing with Inagh Kilnamona and Kilmaley so they are not going to be winning much really and probably gonna struggle to be able to field a team into the future.0 -
That's seems to be a big problem when it comes to SoD, you can't question anything about him. He has played the full 70 minutes in every game so far even when I think he could have be taken off before others, for example against Limerick Taylor had 1-1 scored but he was taken off. In my opinion he's not as good as a lot of Clare supporters make him out to be and I have made that opinion clear, I can't wait to be proven wrong, I really can't, I think he has the potential to be an all time great but he hasn't played up to his potential often enough.
I think we will "persist" with one of our best players. I find it hard to understand the lack of appreciation for a superb player.
As others have said, he's not a high scorer, you seem to be judging him as not top quality because of that, which is a bit ridiculous. As Tony Kelly himself said in his interview when he singled him out, SOD is unbelievable, and doesn't get the credit he deserves.
And an avg of 2 points from play per game in championship isn't a terrible record by any means. But it's the other stuff he contributes that makes him the wonderful all round player he is. I'd love to see stats on ground covered, hooks/blocks, chances created, fouls on him for which frees scored etc.
I've no doubt he's one of the first names on Lohan's teamsheet.0 -
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TheHopeful wrote: »I think we will "persist" with one of our best players. I find it hard to understand the lack of appreciation for a superb player.
As others have said, he's not a high scorer, you seem to be judging him as not top quality because of that, which is a bit ridiculous. As Tony Kelly himself said in his interview when he singled him out, SOD is unbelievable, and doesn't get the credit he deserves.
And an avg of 2 points from play per game in championship isn't a terrible record by any means. But it's the other stuff he contributes that makes him the wonderful all round player he is. I'd love to see stats on ground covered, hooks/blocks, chances created, fouls on him for which frees scored etc.
I've no doubt he's one of the first names on Lohan's teamsheet.
If you look back a few posts you'll see the stats for the first 60 minutes against Wexford, he assisted towards 1-2, the goal was a handpass about 45 out and 1 of the points was scored from the sideline near the end line. I'm not saying he's not a player with great potential but I am saying that he's not as good as he's made out to be, I was willing to rewatch a match to see his contribution I'd ask others do the same.0 -
I will agree SOD is one of our most important players for all the reasons you outlined.
My point is I think he would be more dangerous closer to goal if he was encouraged to have that killer instinct which is in there somewhere.
My worry going into the weekend is WF will keep TK to 3 or 4 points from play.
If his impact is reduced to this, we are in right trouble going on what we have seen to date. We simply will not outscore WF if this happens, even in a low scoring tight game, im not sure we would get to 15 points, unless they concede a mountain of scorable frees.
All in all, we need our other forwards whoever they are to be a little braver than we have seen, as the template we have used to win our 2 games to date will not work Saturday afternoon.
WF have too much quality for that.
We shouldn’t be afraid to try something a little different and ask the questions of WF, the presumption is we will have to play the game on their terms.
We should challenge that and dictate proceedings to suit ourselves.TheHopeful wrote: »I think we will "persist" with one of our best players. I find it hard to understand the lack of appreciation for a superb player.0 -
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I think SoD is showing himself more as a link player than either a ball winner or a scorer, he'll get a break and feed it onto other players, he'll also track back and harass the opposition to force them into a mistake or a turnover. Rewatching the game it's clear that our forwards are playing from behind their man without making many runs off the game, they aren't making themselves available for a pass, I've a feeling that's so they stay in to make more space out the field.
As the weather is getting worse and the pitch in Cork is a bit of an unknown this time of year the key to Saturday's game is going to be goals, I'm surprised Waterford didn't go for more goals against Limerick but we've had a few chances for goals in every game, I could see a score like 3-16 winning at the weekend,0 -
I think SoD is showing himself more as a link player than either a ball winner or a scorer, he'll get a break and feed it onto other players, he'll also track back and harass the opposition to force them into a mistake or a turnover. Rewatching the game it's clear that our forwards are playing from behind their man without making many runs off the game, they aren't making themselves available for a pass, I've a feeling that's so they stay in to make more space out the field.
As the weather is getting worse and the pitch in Cork is a bit of an unknown this time of year the key to Saturday's game is going to be goals, I'm surprised Waterford didn't go for more goals against Limerick but we've had a few chances for goals in every game, I could see a score like 3-16 winning at the weekend,
The pitch in Cork isn't an unknown anymore. They've spent a million or 2 on it last year or the year before. Its as good or better than Croke Park. Same people look after both and both are 30% artificial.
Id agree with you on the forwards. The full forwards are told to stay where they are and let the outfield players have the space0 -
The amount of times lads were behind the WX backs the last day was shocking and if they are being directed to stay inside they should be being coached to move laterally.
Which poses the question, are they being given one to one coaching?
I am not knocking Lohan or any previous MGMT for that matter, but these are basic things.
It was like hitting a ball against a wall for the last 10 mins.
You see it in the NFL or rugby, how players get individual coaching to work on their weaknesses.
That level of detail is clearly a lot of work, and you could argue that hurling is too fast and dynamic for that, but I do think 2 or 3 minor areas of improvement for each player after a game as a feedback and development tool would be very useful.
They say you learn more from losses than wins, but if we want to compete year in year out we need to learn from every game.
Marginal tactical/mental improvements in multiple areas are much easier to accumulate over a huge improvement in one specific area
e.g. Look at how Limerick treat possession from side-lines. It is a ground stroke/pass rather than a “hit is as far as you can approach”. (could be a marginal improvement for us)
Even TK the last day hit a side-line directly to an unmarked WX back.
With no Munster title and only 4 final appearances since ’98 we need to really assess where we are and where we are going.
OK we have had a couple of runs at all Irelands outside of 2002 and 2013, but I feel we should have more to show for the last 20 years than we do.BloodyBill wrote: »The full forwards are told to stay where they are and let the outfield players have the space0 -
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BloodyBill wrote: »The pitch in Cork isn't an unknown anymore. They've spent a million or 2 on it last year or the year before. Its as good or better than Croke Park. Same people look after both and both are 30% artificial.
Id agree with you on the forwards. The full forwards are told to stay where they are and let the outfield players have the space
It's still a new pitch next to a river, might be below the riverline I'm not sure, that's going to have a 70 minute hurling game played on it at the end of November after a week or torrential rain, even Croke Park cut up the first few years it was down.0
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