Do you blame him or not, MP manhandles woman protester

ILoveYourVibes

ILoveYourVibes wrote:

She is not as strong as him.

Oh ok. So we should only be allowed to try and apprehend people who are stronger than us?

Get a grip.

ILoveYourVibes

Deleted User wrote: »

...

Can you actually imagine hearing this in a court of law if she actually had a weapon.

No. I can't.

Because it wouldn't be said if she had a weapon.


She passed through metal detectors and didn't have a weapon. We have established this.

And yes he might have been influenced by HEARING terrible stories of attacks on politicians into believing she posed a threat.

It might have been on his nerves a lot.

I think he is unbalanced. And overeactive.

He is definitely not well. It's possible why he has been given time off.

Timberrrrrrrr

Sleeper12 wrote: »

He hit her several times. Are watching the correct video?

He didn't hit her ffs

If throwing liquid on someone is assault then slamming someone against a wall, hitting them & grabbing them by the neck is definitely assault. I'd love her to post photos of her neck. I'm betting she's black and blue today

You can guarantee if there was a single mark it would be all over the fromt pages. Also i don't see a milkshake being thrown as "assault" either.

ILoveYourVibes

Deleted User wrote: »

Oh ok. So we should only be allowed to try and apprehend people who are stronger than us?

Get a grip.

If a child of 8 attacked you and you defended yourself and the child's parents charged you with assault the fact that a child is less strong than you would come into it.

runawaybishop

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

He wasn't. This is very very important.

He at best BELIEVED he was.

That's all that matters, as far as the law is concerned.

Ironically, this reminds me of living in Vietnam.

You never stop at a crash. You never stop anywhere to help someone. It's likely that you will be ruined by having the finger pointed at you.

Help someone in a crash? You caused it. Stop someone who looks like they may be attacking a prominent politician? Assault.


Ye fukers sow the world ye reap. Why should anyone do anything to help if some loud children scream that you were wrong, when you didn't even hurt anyone.

Sleeper12

Deleted User wrote:

So he assaulted her and that is a fact but you can't say that he is guilty of assaulting her.

Ah go away. You are playing the fool here. It's been examined several times here. The physical act of assault & a legal definition or conviction for assault are two totally different things. He hit her. Pushed her & grabbed her by the neck. All versions of the physical atc of assault. That's not to say that he is guilty or innocent of the crime of assault. Again only a court of law can determine that

ILoveYourVibes

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

He didn't hit her ffs



You can guarantee if there was a single mark it would be all over the fromt pages. Also i don't see a milkshake being thrown as "assault" either.

I do see a milkshake being thrown as assault and so did the court.

ILoveYourVibes

runawaybishop wrote: »

That's all that matters, as far as the law is concerned.

Apologies but that is incorrect. The belief has to be reasonable.

You could if you were mentally ill believe people walking down the street were going to murder you and your family.


I actually think Mark Field is not well.

Maybe not mentally fit for his job. I hope he gets better.

runawaybishop

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Apologies but that is incorrect. The belief has to be reasonable.

You could if you were mentally ill believe people walking down the street were going to murder you and your family.


I actually think Mark Field is not well.

Maybe not mentally fit for his job. I hope he gets better.

It is eminently reasonable to believe she was going to commit an assault. She was already trespassing and on route to the senior MPs after being told to leave

listermint

The UK is a kip. It's politicians are a kip it's closing in on the US as being the biggest kips in the western world. The US are throwing kids and families into camps on dirt floors with no soap blankets pillows nothing .


This thread is littered with people who defend this sort of kippish behaviour. The usual suspects you know their usernames you know their diatribe they frequent all sorts of threads where outrage is concerned and will defend literally any act that fits their warped view of the world.

And a concurrent theme in their diatribe is the 'othering' there's always someone to blame. Religiously , skin colour , gender , sexual persuasion or political outlook.


I see you , I see you all. If you love those kips so much why don't you all jaunt off to them and live there rather than sitting here hurling from the ditch calling for this sort of crap outlook to be imported to out little part of the world.

Sleeper12

Deleted User wrote:

Can you actually imagine hearing this in a court of law if she actually had a weapon. Some self-anointed solicitor of the free people of the world blathering on about this and that nonsense defending that person's right to go at someone.

You do know that she didn't have a weapon though, right?

The way you are interpreting the law means that door staff in a night club can hit people & claim that they felt they might be assaulted. Yes your honnor, he does have a broken jaw but can you imagine if he had a weapon?

If it gets to court you have to demonstrate that there was a risk. He is the only person in the room that felt there was a risk. No one else overreacted in such a way.

ILoveYourVibes

runawaybishop wrote: »

It is eminently reasonable to believe she was going to commit an assault. She was already trespassing and on route to the senior MPs after being told to leave

Then why did no one else believe it?

I don't think he is well. I think he is genuine. But I don't think he is at all well.

Sleeper12

Sleeper12 wrote: »

You do know that she didn't have a weapon though, right?

Did he?

elperello

Madeleine Refined Martian wrote: »

completely wrong.
an mp was murdered in england not so long ago, more have seriously assaulted like george calloway, and just lately politicians have has items thrown at them and the comedian jo brand encourages throwing battery acid at people.
add to this that he is not a trained security professional and there it would be impossible to prosecute him for assault.

So let his constituency decide whether he keeps his job not the social media mob.

Jo Brand did not encourage throwing battery acid at people.
His constituency will decide if he is re-elected as an MP.
His job as a junior minister is in the gift of the PM.

Sleeper12

runawaybishop wrote:

It is eminently reasonable to believe she was going to commit an assault. She was already trespassing and on route to the senior MPs after being told to leave

I don't believe she was trespassing. I think you are overreaching on that one.

ILoveYourVibes

ILoveYourVibes wrote:

If a child of 8 attacked you and you defended yourself and the child's parents charged you with assault the fact that a child is less strong than you would come into it.

Yes. That's exactly a perfect comparison.

Sleeper12 wrote:

Ah go away. You are playing the fool here. It's been examined several times here. The physical act of assault & a legal definition or conviction for assault are two totally different things. He hit her. Pushed her & grabbed her by the neck. All versions of the physical atc of assault. That's not to say that he is guilty or innocent of the crime of assault. Again only a court of law can determine that

No. It's not. He restrained her by pushing her against a pillar and then by holding her neck while he made sure she left.

I disagree that that is assault.

listermint wrote:

I see you , I see you all. If you love those kips so much why don't you all jaunt off to them and live there rather than sitting here hurling from the ditch calling for this sort of crap outlook to be imported to out little part of the world.

What the **** are you talking about?

ILoveYourVibes

Deleted User wrote: »

Did he?

I am pretty sure nobody had a weapon.

I am actually worried about both parties state of mind though.

Let's be honest. They both seem nuts.

ILoveYourVibes

Deleted User wrote: »

Yes. That's exactly a perfect comparison.



No. It's not. He restrained her by pushing her against a pillar and then by holding her neck while he made sure she left.

I disagree that that is assault.



What the **** are you talking about?

I think he is telling you to move to the UK.

ILoveYourVibes

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

I am pretty sure nobody had a weapon.

I am actually worried about both parties state of mind though.

Let's be honest. They both seem nuts.

I don't care about all ye with your information afterwards. Did he know whether or not she had a weapon?

Ye'd let your families be shot because the person was firing at you from a public road and you didn't have the ballistics reports to prove he was shooting at yourselves.

ILoveYourVibes

Deleted User wrote: »

I don't care about all ye with your information afterwards. Did he know whether or not she had a weapon?

Ye'd let your families be shot because the person was firing at you from a public road and you hadn't had the ballistics reports to prove he was shooting at yourselves.

He must have known she went through metal detectors.

Well I say logically he must have known. His nerves or PTSD etc might have meant his brain was unable to process that information at the time.

He was obviously under a lot of stress.

I think am a better defense lawyer here than some.

Sleeper12

Sleeper12 wrote:

The way you are interpreting the law means that door staff in a night club can hit people & claim that they felt they might be assaulted. Yes your honnor, he does have a broken jaw but can you imagine if he had a weapon?

That is not an accurate comparison. You know this.

Sleeper12 wrote:

I don't believe she was trespassing. I think you are overreaching on that one.

Well she was. You can bull**** about the difference between the legal and practical definition of assault but being somewhere where you are not permitted to be is trespassing.

ILoveYourVibes wrote:

I think he is telling you to move to the UK.

Oh. He sounds reasonable. Why?

ILoveYourVibes

https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/letters/mark-field-mp-climate-change-protester-greenpeace-boris-johnson-brexit-a8970471.html

Boris Johnson says he deserves a knighthood.

And we all know how smart Boris Johnson is!

ILoveYourVibes

Deleted User wrote: »

Oh. He sounds reasonable. Why?

How do i know?

ILoveYourVibes

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

He must have known she went through metal detectors.

Well I say logically he must have known. His nerves or PTSD etc might have meant his brain was unable to process that information at the time.

He was obviously under a lot of stress.

I think am a better defense lawyer here than some.

The fuk Vibes. He acted on an instinct. You want to argue that he should have suppressed that because he should have known?

Not only is that idea stupid; Weapons can be anywhere. You also seem to be suggesting that rather than stop this woman in her tracks, he should just let her by so she can confront the person and hope she doesn't have a weapon...


You don't need metal to kills someone. You can do it with a pen.

ILoveYourVibes

ILoveYourVibes wrote:

He must have known she went through metal detectors.

I'd imagine there was no knives at a dinner then? Or that acid would set off a metal detector.

<snip>

ILoveYourVibes

Deleted User wrote: »

The fuk Vibes. He acted on an instinct. You want to argue that he should have suppressed that because he should have known?

Not only is that idea stupid; Weapons can anywhere. You also seem to be suggesting that rather than stop this woman in her tracks, he should just let her by so she can confront the person and hope she doesn't have a weapon...


You don't need metal to kills someone. You can do it with a pen.

Thank you for calling me vibes.

I doubt she is handy with a pen.

Yes it WAS his instinct. But his instincts were wrong. He needs help not condemnation.

ILoveYourVibes

ILoveYourVibes wrote:

And we all know how smart Boris Johnson is!

I don't. But I do know that he is on course to be the next prime minister of england.

Obviously not a complete idiot.

(In before "whut uboot trump")

ILoveYourVibes

Deleted User wrote: »

I'd imagine there was no knives at a dinner then? Or that acid would set off a metal detector.

Give your head a wobble.

Those ideas seem paranoid. They don't seem reasonable.

And no one else there thought this.

He needs help.

listermint

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Yes. That's exactly a perfect comparison.



No. It's not. He restrained her by pushing her against a pillar and then by holding her neck while he made sure she left.

I disagree that that is assault.



What the **** are you talking about?

I'm calling them a sad version of the alt right.

Like alt right lite.

Reveling in the new found ability to give out about minorities you don't like.

Sure that oul climate change protestor.... She should have got a good oul slap isn't that right? A nice dig in the nose. Make the mp feel like a real man get the oul harden in his trouser area.

ILoveYourVibes

Deleted User wrote: »

I don't. But I do know that he is on course to be the next prime minister of england.

Obviously not a complete idiot.

(In before "whut uboot trump")

Only an idiot would want that job right now.

listermint

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I don't. But I do know that he is on course to be the next prime minister of england.

Obviously not a complete idiot.

(In before "whut uboot trump")

Evidently you know nothing about inherited wealth and station


Read a book the odd time. You might pick something up.


Might
...

ILoveYourVibes

listermint wrote: »

I'm calling them a sad version of the alt right.

Like alt right lite.

Reveling in the new found ability to give out about minorities you don't like.

Sure that oul climate change protestor.... She should have got a good oul slap isn't that right? A nice dig in the nose. Make the mp feel like a real man get the oul harden in his trouser area.

From mark fields point of view ..i don't think that was the case.


I think he either cannot control his temper. Or is slightly anxious.

His gut reaction was incredibly wrong.

It needs to be reprogrammed.

I wouldn't say its easy to be him going around with that everyday.

ILoveYourVibes

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Thank you for calling me vibes.

I doubt she is handy with a pen.

Yes it WAS his instinct. But his instincts were wrong. He needs help not condemnation.

His instincts are fine. He didn't hurt anyone.

The fact is he's untrained to deal with this and he managed to do it without hurting anyone. Security made a mess of things and he snap decisioned his way into losing his livelihood by the sounds of things. I feel sorry for the guy.

As much as **** on here will foam at the lips trying to paint him as some sort of abuser, he acted on an instinct and didn't hurt anyone. Sad, really. Had she had a weapon, he'd be a hero.

listermint

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Drunk already.......?

You'd need a few drinks to understand how people put silver spoon babies on such a pedestal as the saviours for their sad life's. Like these people give a trot about your working class position in life.


Hilarious actually.

I blame the schooling

Plumbthedepths

ILoveYourVibes wrote:

Well I say logically he must have known. His nerves or PTSD etc might have meant his brain was unable to process that information at the time.

You should take s break, get some air.

ILoveYourVibes

There used to be a middle ground in politics.


In the US the right went off on one....now the left with the likes of Cortez is pulling harder to the extreme left in reaction

Same is happening in the Uk.

Both sides pulling way way way WAY out.

What happened to trying to meet each other in the middle?

And people are just RUDE to each other.

listermint

[Deleted User] wrote: »

His instincts are fine. He didn't hurt anyone.

The fact is he's untrained to deal with this and he managed to do it without hurting anyone. Security made a mess of things and he snap decisioned his way into losing his livelihood by the sounds of things. I feel sorry for the guy.

As much as **** on here will foam at the lips trying to paint him as some sort of abuser, he acted on an instinct and didn't hurt anyone. Sad, really.

I've been in many confrontations, it happens when you travel around the world and unknowingly end up in a less that salubrious area.

One thing I do know, I use my mouth to talk down situations. It's actually a trained tactic. Our own police force are great at it. Something the US cops don't have.

What fields did was grab a woman by the throat. He's a prick. He did nothing right he failed on all accounts.

But it wouldn't matter to you though he fits your defense zoning he's a Tory he's anti EU therefore infallible.


Too easy.

Sleeper12

Deleted User wrote:

Well she was. You can bull**** about the difference between the legal and practical definition of assault but being somewhere where you are not permitted to be is trespassing.

She went through all the same security checks as he did going in. I've no idea if they had forged tickets or what but they went through all the security checks. It appears no one stopped them or questioned them. They didn't break in. They were allowed in. It was only when they entered the room that security realised that they didn't belong.

listermint

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

There used to be a middle ground in politics.


In the US the right went off on one....now the left with the likes of Cortez is pulling harder to the extreme left in reaction

Same is happening in the Uk.

Both sides pulling way way way WAY out.

What happened to trying to meet each other in the middle?

And people are just RUDE to each other.

Exactly.

Two kips. We need to be very careful that it doesn't catch on here. And lads like those on this thread have to be called out at all times

We don't need a divided Ireland. We've had it. It's zero crack.

ILoveYourVibes

I am just NOT about extreme polarization in politics or life.


And definitely not about hate.

And you hang out with people just like you ...your ideas become more extreme.

Both sides are at it.

Sleeper12

ILoveYourVibes wrote:

And we all know how smart Boris Johnson is!

Boris will make him head of national security if he wins. Its exactly the same thing Trump would do. Boris & trump will get along well together

ILoveYourVibes

listermint wrote: »

Exactly.

Two kips. We need to be very careful that it doesn't catch on here. And lads like those on this thread have to be called out at all times

We don't need a divided Ireland. We've had it. It's zero crack.

Yeah. We are all people.

It can take generations to get over that divide.

listermint

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

I am just NOT about extreme polarization in politics or life.


And definitely not about hate.

And you hang out with people just like you ...your ideas become more extreme.

Both sides are at it.

It begins with finding a problem. Let's say austerity for example.

Then second stage is finding blame .


Any minority will do.

Then it starts with being open about how bad this minority is. Public declarations do fine for that.

Then you attack anyone that trys to defend that group.

Then you attack the middle ground media.

Finally the judiciary and then the political parties that hold the centre



Job completed


Germany 1939

FishHook

Looking at the footage I thought he was OTT, but the protestor can't expect to just stroll into an event like that and not expect a reaction, particularly in this day and age.

ILoveYourVibes

listermint wrote: »

It begins with finding a problem. Let's say austerity for example.

Them second stage is finding blame .


Any minority will do.

Then it starts with being open about how bad this minority is. Public declarations do fine for that.

Then you attack anyone that trys to defend that group.

Then you attack the middle ground media.

Finally the judiciary and then the political parties that hold the centre



Job completed


Germany 1939

Germany Russia China.

Extremism and radicals.

listermint

FishHook wrote: »

Looking at the footage I thought he was OTT, but the protestor can't expect to just stroll into an event like that and not expect a reaction, particularly in this day and age.

I know yeah. Walking into a dinner party in dinner attire. Not shouting but calmly talking about climate policy.

It's just like you know..... Extreme. It should be met with extreme force.

Especially.... In this day and age of fear and more fear and division


Division



Division
.

ILoveYourVibes

FishHook wrote: »

Looking at the footage I thought he was OTT, but the protestor can't expect to just stroll into an event like that and not expect a reaction, particularly in this day and age.

She shouldn't have done it. He should not have reacted.

They are both wrong.

Plumbthedepths

ILoveYourVibes wrote:

And we all know how smart Boris Johnson is!

He's actually very smart, although he plays the buffoon quite well.

listermint

listermint wrote: »

I've been in many confrontations, it happens when you travel around the world and unknowingly end up in a less that salubrious area.

One thing I do know, I use my mouth to talk down situations. It's actually a trained tactic. Our own police force are great at it. Something the US cops don't have.

What fields did was grab a woman by the throat. He's a prick. He did nothing right he failed on all accounts.

But it wouldn't matter to you though he fits your defense zoning he's a Tory he's anti EU therefore infallible.


Too easy.

What the fuk is "defence zoning" and why do you think I like Tories? And I'm one of the post pro-EU posters on here.

This reminds of that time you accused me of mocking my girlfriend for using the actual medical term for what she has. 10 seconds of research would have told you how fuking stupid you were about to sound. No apology yet.


See, listermint. If you just post of feelings, you end up sounding like a wanker.


Mod-Banned