Luke Kelly statue vandalised

Doctors room ghost

sugarman wrote: »

Two men in their 30s ...and yeah not charged from what I can see.

Ridiculous carry on, I'd expect it from teens but not fully grown men.

Charge them and fine them the full amount, no pussy footing.

40 year old pond rat charged with criminal damage according to the wireless

Dyr

Christian Red Logging wrote: »

Into the West was made in Ballymun too.. The scene where Tayto and Ossy are taking the horse into the lift was shot on Coultry Road (7 stories flats, long gone now). I'd an aunt living in the same block for years.

Which block?

gormdubhgorm

Christian Red Logging wrote: »

Just having the craic so don't start looking to take offence for a piece of stone, I know all about the statue, I went to Ballymun comp. Funny enough that statue was originally erected at James Connolly Tower (opposite 'the comp), guess why it was moved into the grounds of the school [you've probably guessed it], it was vandalized.

It said here that it was moved because of the Metro North plans:

https://www.rte.ie/archives/2015/0914/727699-bronze-statue-unveiled-in-ballymun/

Anyway I don't like it well intentioned as it may be, it comes across as a piss take.
It is different I suppose. And well done.

I like the Luke Kelly sculpture because it is unique looking.
Kind of reminds me of animal from the Muppet's.




Plus the hair and beard looks a bit like a thatched cottage. A reminder of simpler times.

Strumms

Wouldn’t be particularly to my own taste the Luke thing but... less to my taste is people’s desire and actions to wreck it as others may enjoy and appreciate it and somebody went to a lot of effort to create it too. People need to cop the fûck on and parents, need to parent ffs.

Church on Tuesday

Church on Tuesday wrote: »

Its a damn awful statue which seeks to normalizes anti social behavior.

This isn't Into the West.

How has it anything to do with anti-social behaviour?

The statue is re-cast from that of an Anglo-Irish hero blown up by the republicans, and presumably the message here is that young people (young women, even) can be heroes in the new republic. That's what I assume it is anyway.

The fact that she's bareback astride the horse is a throwback to those TV images we're familiar with down the years of Ballymun. Her past is actually supporting her progress, she's taking the horse with her. I don't know, I found it very uplifting, but of course it won't be to everyone's liking.

But how you thought it was supporting anti social behaviour, I'm confused. You're worried it might encourage kids to get into horses? Good! I hope it does,

whisky_galore

Strumms wrote: »

Wouldn’t be particularly to my own taste the Luke thing but... less to my taste is people’s desire and actions to wreck it as others may enjoy and appreciate it and somebody went to a lot of effort to create it too. People need to cop the fûck on and parents, need to parent ffs.

The vandal is a grown man in his 40s, parenting...lol.
That boat sailed decades ago.

whisky_galore

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

How has it anything to do with anti-social behaviour?

The statue is re-cast from that of an Anglo-Irish hero blown up by the republicans, and presumably the message here is that young people (young women, even) can be heroes in the new republic. That's what I assume it is anyway.

The fact that she's bareback astride the horse is a throwback to those TV images we're familiar with down the years of Ballymun. Her past is actually supporting her progress, she's taking the horse with her. I don't know, I found it very uplifting, but of course it won't be to everyone's liking.

But how you thought it was supporting anti social behaviour, I'm confused. You're worried it might encourage kids to get into horses? Good! I hope it does,

Celebrating people in council houses who keep horses as "pets".
Perhaps they should have another sculpture, a scrawny, ill treated horse on deaths door tied up with a blue nylon rope.

Dyr

The Luke Kelly statue would be pretty good if it was a bust.

Sculptors have know for millenia that you dont just stick a head on a neck and call it a job, disembodied heads look wrong and freaky, so you create a bust. I assume the artist responsible for the Luke Kelly thing also knew this but decided to have it the way it was for some reason

JohnnyFlash

I quite like the statue. It’s certainly different. Luke Kelly was a fairly hideous looking man in fairness, so you could argue the statue captures that.

whisky_galore

I don't know what the obsession with 'stachas' is about.
Local does some stuff, we simply have to have a statcha.
Many of them are just uninspired street clutter, typically a life sized seemingly chocolate covered figure, this one a bit different in that it's an ugly, outlandishly huge disembodied head, resembling one of those traitors heads on a spike of yore.

Looks like a head hacked off by Isis. Get rid of it and replace it with a scholarship for a singer or musician in Luke's name.

Dyr

whisky_galore wrote: »

typically a life sized seemingly chocolate covered figure, this one a bit different in that it's an ugly, outlandishly huge disembodied head, resembling one of those traitors heads on a spike of yore.

Thats the problem with nearly every statue we put up now, like the Phil Lynnott one or the other Luke Kelly statue, they're just life sized.

They might as well be one of those spray painted Grafton street performers.

We should have great, big **** off neo classical yokes not this modern guff.

gormdubhgorm

Bambi wrote: »

Thats the problem with nearly every statue we put up now, like the Phil Lynnott one or the other Luke Kelly statue, they're just life sized.

They might as well be one of those spray painted Grafton street performers.

We should have great, big **** off neo classical yokes not this modern guff.

Replace Daniel O'Connell with Jim Gavin for a start! Neo classical kinda looks boring and samey though. No harm with the artist having a bit of fun with it imo.

Ush1

I like the statue I have to say. It would be ruined by putting it up high or surrounded by fencing, would lose the impact.

Pawwed Rig

Just looking at it again and if you didn't know who it was it does look like a severed head with the mouth gaping in a death mask

Patrick2010

How did it cost 80,000?

septictank

Looks like a stand up guy.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/district-court/man-47-charged-over-damage-to-luke-kelly-statue-in-dublin-1.4304206

The name is a common one but might be the same guy.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/man-jailed-for-slashing-passer-by-with-a-knife-1.206099

Dempo1

Patrick2010 wrote: »

How did it cost 80,000?

I saw that this morning 80k wtf, they've had got a better and cheaper job from the local primary school art class.

Intriguing a 47 year old man charged with damaging this monstrosity, perhaps an art critic

Dyr

62 previous convictions, how the fook is someone with more form than fookin Ladbrokes still wandering the streets without let nor hinderance?

There is not a single political party in this country willing to deal with this.

Effects

Bambi wrote: »

62 previous convictions, how the fook is someone with more form than fookin Ladbrokes still wandering the streets without let nor hinderance?

Because there isn't enough money to build, or keep people like that in prisons.

Imagine how many other crimes he's actually gotten away with.

Dyr

septictank wrote: »

Looks like a stand up guy.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/district-court/man-47-charged-over-damage-to-luke-kelly-statue-in-dublin-1.4304206

The name is a common one but might be the same guy.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/man-jailed-for-slashing-passer-by-with-a-knife-1.206099

Ages match anyway, did time for killing a fella aged 15, slashed a fella open aged 25, found time 67 convictions in his 47 years

How the fook is a toerag like that not in prison for life?

Doctors room ghost

Effects wrote: »

Because there isn't enough money to build, or keep people like that in prisons.

They should be forced to join the army or the navy the fcukin useless layabouts and take them off the streets.
They’re decades laying about claiming their entitlements while normal people head off to work for the day.
Meanwhile johnny the pond rat sits at home drinking,drugging and being a nuisance to society.there isn’t a days good in them pond rats and the more resources thrown at them the more they want and the more we waste.
The pond rat breeds then to ensure the next generation of layabouts all the while spending his or her entitlements on their own selfish needs instead of providing for the pond rat litter.
It’s the state’s responsibility to rear them.
A fcukin jokeshop of a country.
He hadn’t even the guts to admit he did it then so it’s an expensive case in September with the tax payer footing the bill for the pond rats day out.
A grade A pond rat that is and there’s a pocket of them in every parish in the country.
A vermin on society.

septictank

Bambi wrote: »

Ages match anyway, did time for killing a fella aged 15, slashed a fella open aged 25, found time 67 convictions in his 47 years

How the fook is a toerag like that not in prison for life?

Wouldn't you like to be some old boy walking up to him late at night saying "What do you think you are doing there"?

Seen him on Tv leaving the court, looks out of it.

Dyr

Effects wrote: »

Because there isn't enough money to build, or keep people like that in prisons.

Imagine how many other crimes he's actually gotten away with.

We spend 5.5 billion every year on NGOs

Lets create an NGO called the National Council for Civil Protection and give them enough money to build a f**k off prison and keep these recidivist knackbags safely tucked away in there for very long spells

whisky_galore

whisky_galore wrote: »

Celebrating people in council houses who keep horses as "pets".
Perhaps they should have another sculpture, a scrawny, ill treated horse on deaths door tied up with a blue nylon rope.

You think that's it? You think the message of that sculpture is to encourage people to keep horses in their gardens?

I have no words. You're missing the point completely.

Effects

Doctors room ghost wrote: »

He hadn’t even the guts to admit he did it then so it’s an expensive case in September with the tax payer footing the bill for the pond rats day out.

They never admit it when caught. It's got nothing to do with having guts. It's just how guys like that live. They don't care about how much it costs. The government is there to look after them no matter what.

I'd a mate who used to work defending people like that. Often, no matter how much evidence there was against them, they'd insist on pleading not guilty. Often with the mantra, "you never know what'll happen on the day".

TheW1zard

Coming into our area from Sean Mc Dermott Street..

Dyr

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

You think that's it? You think the message of that sculpture is to encourage people to keep horses in their gardens?

I have no words. You're missing the point completely.

The point is that it was your typical patronising load of bollocks, a negative sterotype transformed by the genius of the artiste into an empowering symbol of emancipation, bestowed upon the plebs by the artiste as if he was some benevloent missionary amongst the natives.

It's a chung wan in a tracksuit on a horse, stuck in a neighborhood where most people hate those ****ing horses and the little bollixes on them. Might as well have stuck her up on a scrambler

Ipso

But d'bankerz

Bambi

Bambi wrote: »

The point is that it was your typical patronising load of bollocks, a negative sterotype transformed by the genius of the artiste into an empowering symbol of emancipation, bestowed upon the plebs by the artiste as if he was some benevloent missionary amongst the natives.

It's a chung wan in a tracksuit on a horse, stuck in a neighborhood where most people hate those ****ing horses and the little bollixes on them. Might as well have stuck her up on a scrambler

If people don't like their area being associated with urban horses, I get that. But don't come along saying the artist is trying to encourage people to keep animals illegally.

But I know that a lot of guys from underprivileged parts of Dublin have ended up training in RACE in Kildare, and subsequently ended up on yards and getting rides. Others might have left horses behind them or gone in other directions, but horses would have given them some focus and discipline down the years.

Church on Tuesday

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

How has it anything to do with anti-social behaviour?

The statue is re-cast from that of an Anglo-Irish hero blown up by the republicans, and presumably the message here is that young people (young women, even) can be heroes in the new republic. That's what I assume it is anyway.

The fact that she's bareback astride the horse is a throwback to those TV images we're familiar with down the years of Ballymun. Her past is actually supporting her progress, she's taking the horse with her. I don't know, I found it very uplifting, but of course it won't be to everyone's liking.

But how you thought it was supporting anti social behaviour, I'm confused. You're worried it might encourage kids to get into horses? Good! I hope it does,

I hope not, the horse needs a saddle ideally and proper care and maintenance.

The statue reflects exactly zero of any of that.

Church on Tuesday

Church on Tuesday wrote: »

I hope not, the horse needs a saddle ideally and proper care and maintenance.

The statue reflects exactly zero of any of that.

Do you ride?

A rider needs a saddle to learn to ride. Once you learn to ride, there is no problem in riding without a saddle; obviously not doing fast work, but still. Some people love it.

Anyway you can get saddles for fifty or sixty quid. The tack isn't the issue. If they have enough food and water and are seeing a vet and getting their feet seen, that'd be my only big query. There are organisations that do that now, in areas like Ballyfermot I believe. They might even have an equestrian centre. Isn't that good?

Church on Tuesday

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Do you ride?

A rider needs a saddle to learn to ride. Once you learn to ride, there is no problem in riding without a saddle; obviously not doing fast work, but still. Some people love it.

Anyway you can get saddles for fifty or sixty quid. The tack isn't the issue. If they have enough food and water and are seeing a vet and getting their feet seen, that'd be my only big query. There are organisations that do that now, in areas like Ballyfermot I believe. They might even have an equestrian centre. Isn't that good?

No I don't, I actually think it's cruel IMO.

My understanding is that it's unpleasant for the horse to not have a saddle.

It's grand if the horse is being taken care of, but the character portrayed in the statue (and therefore representative of a certain demographic) wouldn't exactly fill you with confidence as a kind of clarion call to impressionable youths.

Pawwed Rig

Are we really arguing that horses in council estates held on scrub land is a good thing?

Church on Tuesday

Church on Tuesday wrote: »

No I don't, I actually think it's cruel IMO.

My understanding is that it's unpleasant for the horse to not have a saddle.

But where are you getting that understanding?I don't know who anyone who rides and doesn't occasionally do it, even just for fun. In fact, it's a reasonably common practice to teach kids to improve by riding without a saddle -- it improves your seat and teaches you how to carry your legs.

As I said, you need a saddle to learn to ride. But this is getting off the issue somewhat. Tack can be bought cheaply, and anyway, a lot of these underprivileged areas seem to have equestrian facilities now. Cherry Orchard certainly does.

Deebles McBeebles

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

a lot of these underprivileged areas seem to have equestrian facilities now. Cherry Orchard certainly does.

Thats very optimistic to think a lot of underprivileged areas have these facilities. I've never seen it myself, I doubt many have. I have seen many, many horses being treated horribly and without any sign of vet care or just care in general. If you're keeping your horse on an estate or illegally in someone elses field, you shouldn't have a horse.

Anyway, 47 year old man spray painting a statue of an Irish legend, is there anything f*cking sadder? The twat.

whisky_galore

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

You think that's it? You think the message of that sculpture is to encourage people to keep horses in their gardens?

I have no words. You're missing the point completely.

If you don't have the facilities, don't get a damn horse, get a fcukin hamster or goldfish.

Doctors room ghost

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Do you ride?

A rider needs a saddle to learn to ride. Once you learn to ride, there is no problem in riding without a saddle; obviously not doing fast work, but still. Some people love it.

Anyway you can get saddles for fifty or sixty quid. The tack isn't the issue. If they have enough food and water and are seeing a vet and getting their feet seen, that'd be my only big query. There are organisations that do that now, in areas like Ballyfermot I believe. They might even have an equestrian centre. Isn't that good?

The saddle you’d get for 50 quid would be pure rubbish.would be uncomfortable for the horse and would do more harm than good.
Also who’s paying the bills on the organisations?are the owners paying the vet and farrier fees or is it another freebie for the entitled?
It’s very simple in my view. If you haven’t the money or the facilities to care for and shelter a horse you simply shouldn’t have one.

amadangomor

Doctors room ghost wrote: »

The saddle you’d get for 50 quid would be pure rubbish.would be uncomfortable for the horse and would do more harm than good.
Also who’s paying the bills on the organisations?are the owners paying the vet and farrier fees or is it another freebie for the entitled?
It’s very simple in my view. If you haven’t the money or the facilities to care for and shelter a horse you simply shouldn’t have one.

Went to the last page of the story about Luke Kelly's statue and seem to have been re directed to the horse forum somehow

Doctors room ghost

Doctors room ghost wrote: »

The saddle you’d get for 50 quid would be pure rubbish.would be uncomfortable for the horse and would do more harm than good.
Also who’s paying the bills on the organisations?are the owners paying the vet and farrier fees or is it another freebie for the entitled?
It’s very simple in my view. If you haven’t the money or the facilities to care for and shelter a horse you simply shouldn’t have one.

You could have found this out the way I did, using google, but the one in Cherry Orchard runs FETAC courses, so they're being paid to give people recognized qualifications and, you know, a job.

I'm sure you'll find some way to criticise that.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Deebles McBeebles wrote: »

Thats very optimistic to think a lot of underprivileged areas have these facilities. I've never seen it myself, I doubt many have. I have seen many, many horses being treated horribly and without any sign of vet care or just care in general. If you're keeping your horse on an estate or illegally in someone elses field, you shouldn't have a horse.

Ballymun had (I think its gone now) the Ballymun Horse Owners Association, they had stables (of sorts) up opposite the last blocks of Balcurris Road flats in an area we used to call (as kids) 'the seven pitches'.

Didn't stop them 'owners' going into Finglas & Coolock to rob other horses and tying them up around Ballymun and Poppintree (even in their back gardens and courts).

The poor horses lead totally miserable lives in these area's, horribly mistreated by the same little cretins who are out robbing motorbikes to rally them around the same estates and fields.

Ask the vest, vast majority of people in Ballymun what that horse and rider statue represents in 'the comp and this is what they'll tell you.

I'd love to see the uproar had someone tried to erect that monstrosity in Foxrock.

arybvtcw0eolkf

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

It said here that it was moved because of the Metro North plans:

https://www.rte.ie/archives/2015/0914/727699-bronze-statue-unveiled-in-ballymun/

Metro article my arse, don't mind what that says.

The statue was constantly vandalized because they people of Ballymun hated the thing, so it was moved into the grounds of the comp (Ballymun Comprehensive school) where its surrounded by locked gates and high walls when the school is closed.

Rodney Bathgate

whisky_galore wrote: »

If you don't have the facilities, don't get a damn horse, get a fcukin hamster or goldfish.

Or a terrapin called Terry.

DEFTLEFTHAND

Why dont they just bomb it like they did with Nelsons?

Kelly was always very open about his love of the brits and his time spent living there.

Dyr

Christian Red Logging wrote: »

Ballymun had (I think its gone now) the Ballymun Horse Owners Association, they had stables (of sorts) up opposite the last blocks of Balcurris Road flats in an area we used to call (as kids) 'the seven pitches'.

Didn't stop them 'owners' going into Finglas & Coolock to rob other horses and tying them up around Ballymun and Poppintree (even in their back gardens and courts).

The fella who ran that was a neighbor of mine, it was the old Workmans Club. he wasnt a bad sort, ran a horse transport business. His horses were well looked after, anyway

The little knacks on the other hand...

gormdubhgorm

Christian Red Logging wrote: »

Metro article my arse, don't mind what that says.

The statue was constantly vandalized because they people of Ballymun hated the thing, so it was moved into the grounds of the comp (Ballymun Comprehensive school) where its surrounded by locked gates and high walls when the school is closed.

I only ever saw that school from the outside looks like a prison with the high walls. :eek:

Sad state of affairs that things have to protected and locked away. At least you are from the area and can say it as it is. Since the regeneration a lot of the talk from the outside seemed to be sort of arty farty and idealism. Always talking things up, new hope, new dawn etc.

I dunno what is going to be done with this Luke Kelly head. As a last resort. Maybe O'Donoghues Pub could buy it and have it as a centre piece?

josip

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I only ever saw that school from the outside looks like a prison with the high walls. :eek:

Sad state of affairs that things have to protected and locked away. At least you are from the area and can say it as it is. Since the regeneration a lot of the talk from the outside seemed to be sort of arty farty and idealism. Always talking things up, new hope, new dawn etc.

I dunno what is going to be done with this Luke Kelly head. As a last resort. Maybe O'Donoghues Pub could buy it and have it as a centre piece?

There wouldn't be much room left in O'Donoghues if that thing was put inside.
Imagine the hassle for the staff trying to clean the manky 'hair' every week after drink is spilled over it.
"Jaysus, there's some bang off Luke tonight"

gormdubhgorm

Hopefully it will stop after this 47 year old gob****e from Sean McDermott street got his wrap on the knuckles.

https://www.rte.ie/news/courts/2020/0714/1153231-michael-dunne-court/

Pushing 50 and going around deliberately doing that sort of thing, what a class act!

Someone put up this innovative solution on reddit:

https://www.reddit.com/r/ireland/comments/hqjrqd/luke_kelly_statue_vandalism_problem_solved_simply/

Effects

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

Are we really arguing that horses in council estates held on scrub land is a good thing?

I think the argument is that they could be doing worse things?

SlowMotion321

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

Why dont they just bomb it like they did with Nelsons?

Kelly was always very open about his love of the brits and his time spent drinking there.

Fixed your post, no charge