Ex's partner leaves house with 3 kids when my child visits

Tres Say T

volchitsa wrote: »

Ideally you need to get your ex to see that this hurts because your daughter and her siblings. Easier said than done I know, but you might find that his current partner is more concerned by the idea that her own children may resent her for this later on than she is about your child.

Perhaps they could stay with their father to meet her, at least from time to time, and the ex could still leave if she wants? Would that be feasible?

My Ex has told me that he barely gets to have his sons on his own. His Mum has told me that she can't be around her grandchildren without this woman being there. My Ex wants his children to know eachother (apparently). Its all very weird indeed. They stay with her family when she leaves. It seems to me that they are her children and not his.
Thank you all for your advise - even the advise I didn't particularly like to hear. Its a very hard lesson that I have to teach my little girl at a very very young age - that some people are just nasty and there's nothing we can do about it really.

The narcissistic mother..

Could you maybe try to explain to your daughter that like, some people aren't nice, and she might get to meet her brothers in a few years?

Ah, just saw you realised this yourself..

Rubberchikken

they both need to grow up.
what does this woman imagine coukd or would happen if all these kids were together regularly.

your ex needs yo realise that they are all his kids.

those two adults need to sort out sonething practical. it cant be easy to up and take 3 kids from their home every 2nd weekend just because she doesnt want anything to do with his ex or his first born.

Rubberchikken

they both need to grow up.
what does this woman imagine coukd or would happen if all these kids were together regularly.

your ex needs yo realise that they are all his kids.

those two adults need to sort out sonething practical. it cant be easy to up and take 3 kids from their home every 2nd weekend just because she doesnt want anything to do with his ex or his first born.

Gangu

I would ask for a meeting with your ex, explain your concerns, deliver a letter setting out what you say here about your concerns and asking him nicely to take all the children on a picnic or joint activity in the next few weeks.

Explain why it’s needed. Keep a copy of the letter. If he doesn’t do that small thing consult with your solicitor about continued access in his home. Keep a copy of the letter to show the solicitor (and your daughter perhaps later in life),

Why should she go there out of her comfort zone. This is psychological abuse. He’s either a coward or a complete dick. Your daughter is being damaged.

volchitsa

Mod Note - Post edited
No I haven't simply made this up, though moral may not be the best description, but even legally, once there are children, the ex cannot just "move on" - he has legal obligations to his child that make that impossible. We can't legally force someone to love their children, but the legal obligation to continue to contribute financially to their upbringing is a recognition of that more general obligation on both parents to care for children even after the relationship between the parents has broken down.

As does the fact that we have a whole legal system to (try to) ensure that children of broken relationships continue to have contact with both parents.
The fact that this doesn't always work very well is not evidence that some people are better to just move on. As you put it. Because it shouldn't be about the parents' feelings, but the children's.

sbsquarepants

bertsmom wrote: »

I totally see where your coming from but maby it's not coming from being vindictive when I was dating a single parent I went out if the child was in the house etc simply because I didn't want to be interacting with a kid I had no interest in.

I'd have dumped you the first time you did that.

I hope you'd do the same if someone ever treats bert in such a shítty way!

sbsquarepants

MOd NOte - post edited

It is absolutely not understandable, or in any way acceptable. I have very few absolute red lines in my life but this is certainly one of them - if you think it's acceptable to blank my kids then you can bounce the fúck on, no matter who you are or how perfect you may be in every other way.

No way, no how, not for any reason whatsoever - if that's your stance then you pack up and piss off!

JustMe,K

I feel for both of you, but by reading the updates it appears that your ex is not strong enough to stand up to his other half. You say he rarely gets time alone with his sons, his mother cant spend time with them either, clearly there is a lot of pandering going on here to the whims of one person. That doesn't sound like a happy family situation to me, and your daughter might be lucky that she is closeted from what else could be going on there. Sounds like the mother of your exes sons has issues that extend beyond you and beyond your daughter. Does your ex pay maintenance even?

Practically, if my child was coming home at that age angry and upset from seeing her dad and feeling excluded from his new and growing family, I would be asking her how she wants to proceed, does she still want to go there or does she want to see dad somewhere else. Explain to her that what goes on in dads house has nothing to do with you, and you have no control over it, that she needs to tell dad herself how she feels face to face, but that it might not change anything. At 11, your daughter is old enough to start to understand that mammy cannot fix everything as much as you might try. She also needs to understand that not everyone is nice, not everyone has the same viewpoint. Yes, it would be great for her to have a relationship with her brothers, but they are not your sons and you have no control over it.

I think you have done all you can. My focus at this point would be on rebuilding my daughters confidence, making sure she knows she is not a problem. Practice some daily gratitude and meditation with her even so she focuses more on other things, and reduce the impact of this on her.

mylittlepony

**My daughter met their first son quiet regularly for the first year or so. She met their second son once when he was about 6 weeks old and has never met their third 6 month old son**
I think this explain it all.
She have 3 sons. No daughter. ��*♀️ irrational jealousy over gender.
The first son had regular contact with his sister then it tailed off with 2nd son and zilch by 3rd son.
But the background info on the father and grandmother lack of bonding time with sons/grandsons shows that her overall behaviour have gone beyond the pale.
This is abuse. He should contact Amen.
Confront father on this, don't allow him to stick head in sand anymore. He enabling her behaviour too. He at fault as much as her.
It is time to turn tables over. Request father to bring sons to meet sister in her county every other weekend for a change of scenery I think best all round. Weekends overnight/holiday terms away together for the overnights with grandmother too whether at GM home or daughter county in cheap B&B.

SusieBlue

Mod Note - Post edited

Of course they can, when she's flouncing off to her mothers house cause she can't bear the company of her 11 year old stepchild, she can leave their sons at home with dad so all the siblings can get to know each other and form a bond.
Or dad can take all his kids to the zoo, or the cinema, or the playground or whatever and she can sit at home stewing in her self pity.

Absolutely no need at all for her to be involved, and she sounds so poisonous I think that's for the best. There is absolutely no good reason for the children not to know each other though, not one. Depriving them of a relationship with each other is not in their best interests and extremely selfish.

Tres Say T

Tres Say T wrote: »

I am a very concerned parent trying to figure out what is best for my daughter.

I think a lot of the advice on the thread has been about what to do with the father - the new partner - and so on. So I really do not know what more I could add to that to be honest.

In terms of your daughter however I guess the best you can do is help her process and express her feelings the best you can. It sounds like you already console her when she is upset my all of this - which is good of course. But equal focus can be placed on processing and expressing those things - as can be placed on just consoling them.

It sounds from all you have said that the father is not going to be moved by any arguments you or his new partner present. Therefore if he is going to listen to anyone - it is most likely going to be his daughter in the end.

So this will involve asking her why she is upset - even though you know already. Have her express it and work through it with you. Get her to tell her why she is upset. What upset her. How did it make her feel - not just in the moment about the situation but about herself the father the mother and everyone. Why does she feel the person who caused it is doing what they are doing. Who does she blame and why.

If she struggles to find the right words - offer her new ones yourself until she says "yes thats it!". Maybe even keeping a diary - similar to the scrap book you mentioned - tracking all of this.

There are three benefits to this. The first is that working through it all in this way will help her process it emotionally which is good.

The second is that this level of communication and diarying will help you catch early any beginning of her blaming herself for any of this or somehow thinking she herself has less value in some way. The sooner you catch such negative thoughts the better before they become established and entrenched.

And finally as her ability to communicate what she is feeling and why increases - her ability to be the one to communicate this in a meaningful and effective way to the father will develop too. I think we can expect at _some_ point she is going to let this spill out and she is going to hit the father with it. You want to be sure she is best prepared emotionally and verbally to do so when - not if - it happens.

There are books for girls that age with titles like "Knowing what to say" which can be a confidence boost for them. Often their direct situation is not in that book of course - as life is too diverse for a small book to cover every scenario. But I have found girls from 7-12 reading books like that are good at drawing on the material and piecing together improved communication - and motivation to communicate well and effectively - from them.

Finally a therapy method which might help - and I suppose is also a way to undermine the new partner your ex has - is to have your daughter build, draw, construct, cook, create or in some other ways work on gifts for her siblings. While the new woman might not want your daughter around - she would look pretty petty to not allow gifts from her. This however helps built a conneciton for your daugther even in their abscence in a material and emotional way. It also lets the siblings know that whatever else the parents might be up to _she_ is thinking of them so later in life when they seek a relationship on their own - they will have that to build on. And finally it undermines the new woman as receiving such gifts is going to eventually lead them to ask their mother questions the might not otherwise start asking. Which will be uncomfortable for her.

jlm29

Mod Note - post edited
By your reasoning, if the mother commenced a new relationship, and had a child with someone else, what would she do with her daughter? Send her off to live with her grandparents and visit when it suits? Or is it just fathers who can pick and choose which children they give priority to?

And do you actually propose that all these kids should have no idea who their close genetic relations (what term do you like, if you don’t think they should be called siblings??) are? What happens when little Johnny comes home in a few years to introduce his new girlfriend, and it’s his half sister? Or his cousin he never knew?

shesty

Morbid though it is, I often wonder in these situations, what would happen if the Dad died?Who would be front row at the funeral....just his three sons, or all four of his children?Because there would be four kids with no dad.Not just the three who he now lives with.

Some good advice here OP, and I hope you can find help for your daughter.You sound like you are trying your best to cushion it for her, and I am sure she will see that in time.It's a horrible situation to be stuck in.

bertsmom

sbsquarepants wrote:

I'd have dumped you the first time you did that.

sbsquarepants wrote:

I hope you'd do the same if someone ever treats bert in such a shítty way!

If you read my previous posts it was I who recognized that it would be better not to continue the relationship. I am not sorry that I felt nothing for a kid its just a fact. No point in pretending that we are all programmed to love kids. I DID NOT TREAT ANY CHILD IN A ****TY WAY.
I already stated I dont have children myself so dont assume my username is anything other than a username.
I was simply giving a point of view to the op who is the one who is looking for people's opinions....I'm not they are irrelevant to me

seasidedub

So sorry OP. I wonder is it just jealousy on your daughter's dad's partners part? Is she insecure and seeing your girl reinforces the fact he had a life before her.

I've 2 stepdaughters and they were with us since they were 4 and 2. I love them insanely and they mean the world to me. They've grown up now but we are so close. I can't understand taking your "stuff" out on a child instead of integrating her into the blended family. So sad.

volchitsa

Mod Note - post edited
I can't agree with this.

We can't force them to do it, sure, I'm aware of that - but they sure as hell have some sort of moral obligation to do so. Luckily most people do it naturally, but TBH while I'm not usually into parent-shaming, I think the idea that they can decide to just cut themselves off from their children as soon as it's a bit awkward to continue caring for them is one of the most shameful things a parent can do to their child.

I'm genuinely shocked to hear you say that.

volchitsa

Who said they had to stay together?

That's some rant and has very little to do with the situation here which is about a father who is perfectly willing to parent his child, but just not willing to stand up to his new partner in order to do so.

You may think that's fine, I don't. You see parents forced to stay together for the sake of their children, but literally nobody has said that. I'm saying that once you have a child, some relationships just won't work, and while I have sympathy for people like Bertsmom who simply doesn't want children but ended up being a part time parent against her will, I have none for the father (or mother) who prioritises their new relationship over their child's mental wellbeing. I think it's a truly sh1tty thing to do.

So there's not much point in discussing this further. You think it's grand, I don't.

shesty

Mod Note

Can we please keep the thread on topic and try to advise the OP.

mollygreene

Mod Note - post edited

This viewpoint is grand if you're just seeing each other or going out a while and haven't made a serious commitment yet. These guys are engaged yet she still won't be around his daughter or let their siblings be around her?!

It's petty, childish and cruel.

The ex sounds like a spoilt brat who can't be around evidence of her fiancé being with someone else (ie OPs daughter)

She needs to be an adult and suck it up, imo.

& OP, as others have said, you really seem to be doing the best you can for your daughter in this situation. She's very lucky to have you. Make sure and look after yourself too x

Tres Say T

I have mulled over this situation time and time again. I have tried everything talking, writing, explaining, appealing. I am so glad I asked for advise here, you all have been so helpful and I really do appreciate you taking the time to mull over this with me. My conclusion and what I will take from this is
I will not use my daughter as a bargaining tool by making it more difficult for her Dad to see her so as to get what I think is right. It's beneath my moral standard. They love eachother and have every right to see eachother. If his fiancee wants to go to the trouble of packing up her three boys every other weekend then so be it. It can't be easy for her. My daughter's Dad is fulfilling his legal obligations and I do believe he is doing his best. He's not good under pressure - never has been and will do anything for a quiet life. He never takes accountablity for anything and gets defensive, always pointing fingers away from himself. He is a victim of his own circumstances.
My moral code is obviously different to theirs. That is why they are with eachother. I don't like that there are people like this in the world but the simple fact is that there are and there is nothing I can do to change that or them other than to appeal to their better nature which they are obviously in very short supply of.
I have sent emails and made phone calls to get some psychological help for my daughter so that she can process this and accept it knowing that other peoples bad and nasty behaviours are no reflection on her and who knows maybe it will turn out to be a good thing. We learn to deal with these things later in life anyway so at the very least - she has a head start! I'll help her along as much as I can too by surrounding her people who value integrity, family, fairness, personal responsibility, and above all else ... kindness

bertsmom

Op from an outsider point of view it sounds like she won't go far wrong with a mum like you.
As the years pass maby the situation will adapt and improve too but your daughter will definitely be able to look back and know her mam is and was always her biggest supporter.
As her step siblings get older perhaps their lives will intertwine more and she will develop a relationship.
Your ex's partner is probably trying to make her way in the parenting world too as best she can but for now you seem to be doing an amazing job. Best wishes for the future.

Tres Say T

Thank you x

marieholmfan

You do your best because that's all you can do.
Your best is pretty good I have to say.

Tres Say T wrote: »

I have mulled over this situation time and time again. I have tried everything talking, writing, explaining, appealing. I am so glad I asked for advise here, you all have been so helpful and I really do appreciate you taking the time to mull over this with me. My conclusion and what I will take from this is
I will not use my daughter as a bargaining tool by making it more difficult for her Dad to see her so as to get what I think is right. It's beneath my moral standard. They love eachother and have every right to see eachother. If his fiancee wants to go to the trouble of packing up her three boys every other weekend then so be it. It can't be easy for her. My daughter's Dad is fulfilling his legal obligations and I do believe he is doing his best. He's not good under pressure - never has been and will do anything for a quiet life. He never takes accountablity for anything and gets defensive, always pointing fingers away from himself. He is a victim of his own circumstances.
My moral code is obviously different to theirs. That is why they are with eachother. I don't like that there are people like this in the world but the simple fact is that there are and there is nothing I can do to change that or them other than to appeal to their better nature which they are obviously in very short supply of.
I have sent emails and made phone calls to get some psychological help for my daughter so that she can process this and accept it knowing that other peoples bad and nasty behaviours are no reflection on her and who knows maybe it will turn out to be a good thing. We learn to deal with these things later in life anyway so at the very least - she has a head start! I'll help her along as much as I can too by surrounding her people who value integrity, family, fairness, personal responsibility, and above all else ... kindness

ElizaBennett

I think the mediation idea is a good one. It's great option to have a cool headed outsider to broker things and find solutions. Is there any way you can impress the need for this on your ex? Otherwise explore legal route re her right to know siblings.