RTE Investigates programme on greyhound racing industry

whisky_galore

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Maybe we should stop thinking if it as being two sides and try to make it one side.

Speaking in riddles.

Straffan1979

Discodog wrote: »

You will have to:

They didn't suggest or even infer that all owners were complicit. They suggested that the IGB/ICC were at least negligent.

All the good Greyhound people have to do is agree with the evidence, condemn it & make efforts to change it.

No incitement whatsoever. RTE gave the IGB & ICC every opportunity & right of reply. The sad thing is that "the responsible" owners etc are criticising RTE rather than speaking out in support of stopping these atrocities.

It's reasonable for people to assume that, if you don't condemn cruelty, you support it.

let's do another programme where RTE imply and infer and allege through conjecture & highly emotive video clips that members of the ethnic Travelling community for example are involved in a racket where for money animals are burned alive in pots of water in China- there'd be uproar

whisky_galore

mooseknunkle wrote: »

But it was fair and balanced,the "other side" declined all requests from RTE if they are all dog loving as you're portraying them,then why didnt they offer their side of the story?,why arent all the dog trainers/owners coming out and defending themselves?

Incitement to hatred legislation?,give me a break :rolleyes:

Silence speaks volumes. Caught by the balls and they knew it.

ILoveYourVibes

pheasant tail wrote: »

Aw I don’t know how much I’d trust the vets either. I remember the Clare Byrne show, they showed a small clip of the segment last night. It was about the greyhounds and hare coursing. There was a vet in the audience there saying that she checks on the conditions of the hares pre race and then after the dogs run at them. That the hare won’t be put into the ring unless it’s in good condition. Of course she reported that the hares are all ok and perfectly okay to be released back into the wild. Thankfully, someone in the audience asked her who is she employed by, off course is was the hare coursers/greyhound body or whatever it is. They even payed her expenses to get to Dublin that night. What a joke. I’d love to see the light shone on the horse racing industry. Think it was cheltenham alone last year, 7 horses had to be killed due to injuries on the track. The horses didn’t ask to be there. It wasn’t their choice. They where there for our selfish entertainment. What about the horses that aren’t fast enough just like these dogs. Unfortunately, money trumps ethics for the majority of people. If you pay any money to any bookies then you are contributing to this!

I would trust vets. I think not to do so is slightly paranoid and arrogant.

Horses that don't make it on the track just become someone's riding horse. Racehorse to riding class. They make good riding horses.

If you are against horse racing you are pretty much against all horse sport.

Far fewer horses die in horse racing than in eventing for example comparatively.

As for cheltenham etc well courses can be altered. They can be better maintained.

They can back horses a bit later etc so they are more experienced and less green.

But I will say this the people in the horse racing industry have some of the best horsemanship I have ever seen. I mean it's almost superhuman.
Their knowledge and expertise is world class.

Actually if you do to the Dublin horse show this year you can see a racehorse to riding horse competition event. Jockeys usually judge it.

They have lots of other events etc...the whole of the equestrian world. Everyone from natural horsemanship people to dressage to barrel racers.

ILoveYourVibes

whisky_galore wrote: »

Speaking in riddles.

No. I mean it.

This constant you are my enemy etc they are evil etc. who are they???

It's this reactionary pull of both sides to an extreme driven by that paradigm.

It's crippling.

You just end up with two sides that are radicalized.

Straffan1979

whisky_galore wrote: »

Silence speaks volumes. Caught by the balls and they knew it.

so Greyhound owners will go on screen beside the footage of the dog being boiled alive and try and explain it-

As Ronnie Regan said- when you're explaining your losing - that clip was put in there to cause maximum damage in the public eye with zero evidence to back up that that was an Irish dog; As I said there's laws against broadcasting in that fashion using public money.

That footage should not have formed part of that programme

Discodog

Straffan1979 wrote: »

let's do another programme where RTE imply and infer and allege through conjecture & highly emotive video clips that members of the ethnic Travelling community for example are involved in a racket where for money animals are burned alive in pots of water in China- there'd be uproar

Nothing last night alleged that the IGB were abusing animals in China.
They presented proof not conjecture.
And it's refreshing that you found the clips emotive as you clearly support the industry.

Discodog

Straffan1979 wrote: »

so Greyhound owners will go on screen beside the footage of the dog being boiled alive and try and explain it-

As Ronnie Regan said- when your explaining your losing - that clip was put in there to cause maximum damage in the public eye with zero evidence to back up that that was an Irish dog; As I said there's laws against broadcasting in that fashion using public money.

That footage should not have formed part of that programme

How about the footage at the Knackery ?

whisky_galore

Straffan1979 wrote: »

so Greyhound owners will go on screen beside the footage of the dog being boiled alive and try and explain it-

As Ronnie Regan said- when your explaining your losing - that clip was put in there to cause maximum damage in the public eye with zero evidence to back up that that was an Irish dog; As I said there's laws against broadcasting in that fashion using public money.

That footage should not have formed part of that programme

How is anyone apart from the makers, supposed to know the final content of a programme before it's even aired?
Besides they were only expected to comment on their own part, not something half way around the world.

Straffan1979

Discodog wrote: »

Nothing last night alleged that the IGB were abusing animals in China.
They presented proof not conjecture.
And it's refreshing that you found the clips emotive as you clearly support the industry.

Where's the proof the dog boiled alive or killed with the hatchet were Irish racing dogs?

bb12

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

I would trust vets. I think not to do so is slightly paranoid and arrogant.

Horses that don't make it on the track just become someone's riding horse. Racehorse to riding class. They make good riding horses.

If you are against horse racing you are pretty much against all horse sport.

Far fewer horses die in horse racing than in eventing for example comparatively.

As for cheltenham etc well courses can be altered. They can be better maintained.

They can back horses a bit later etc so they are more experienced and less green.

But I will say this the people in the horse racing industry have some of the best horsemanship I have ever seen. I mean it's almost superhuman.
Their knowledge and expertise is world class.

very few ex racehorses are retrained for leisure or sport riding. the majority of young racehorses that are not good enough are sent to the abbatoirs. the bigger race yards would have a large turnover in this respect. had a long conversation about this with one of my vets. however she said that the killing of racehorses in the abbatoirs is actually well regulated and done pretty well without any undue stress to the horses.

i'm involved in the sport horse side of things and i do feel sorry for the race horses though. the sport horses usually get to live out their full lives but not the racehorses in general.

ILoveYourVibes

strandroad wrote: »

I think that I am in fact reading it right. Out of the ca 5000 industry employees overall, IGB alone employs 850. It's nuts!

Ah yes. I get you. Yes they would have trouble justifying their grants actually. :cool:

dickangel

Straffan1979 wrote: »

Where's the proof the dog boiled alive or killed with the hatchet were Irish racing dogs?

They may not have been. But why should we export greyhounds to a country that treats animals this way? Do you think that Irish dogs would avoid this fate purely because they came from Ireland?

Bannasidhe

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Compulsory microchipping was introduced 4 years ago.
Four Years Ago.

The IGB were told 2 years ago in a report that the whereabouts of 6,000 pups per year was unknown.

2 years after microchipping became compulsory.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/whereabouts-of-6-000-greyhound-pups-a-year-unknown-igb-told-1.3939498


But do keep digging. It gives me the opportunity to refute your comments with actual links.

4 years ago for pups. 3 years ago for adult dogs. IGB commissioned the report themselves and are acting on it. I’m sure that if the report was commissioned now it’d show a different story. Your links are opinion pieces.

Bannasidhe

Straffan1979 wrote: »

Where's the proof the dog boiled alive or killed with the hatchet were Irish racing dogs?

Did they say they were Irish dogs?

Or did they say Irish dogs are known to have been sent to China and this is what happens to some dogs in parts of China?

ILoveYourVibes

bb12 wrote: »

very few ex racehorses are retrained for leisure or sport riding. the majority of young racehorses that are not good enough are sent to the abbatoirs. the bigger race yards would have a large turnover in this respect. had a long conversation about this with one of my vets. however she said that the killing of racehorses in the abbatoirs is actually well regulated and done pretty well without any undue stress to the horses.

i'm involved in the sport horse side of things and i do feel sorry for the race horses though. the sport horses usually get to live out their full lives but not the racehorses in general.

I think it's getting better though.

Also i have to point out one thing. It's all the horses that don't make. It ..eventing horses showjumpers that don't make it ...often don't get to retire etc. Every part of the equestrian world needs to step up.
They are sold as meat to France etc.

But its not just racehorses. Many other horses etc.

Its a pity because they can make great pets and riding horses.

There are lots of thoroughbreds in rescues ..i thought that was weird when i first started riding because they in my head were always so expensive.

Also inc ALL horses slaughtered in Ireland last year its about 7000 ..that is ALL breeds cobs etc.

Whereas this is just greyhounds totaling 6000k.

You can't compare it.

Straffan1979

Discodog wrote: »

How about the footage at the Knackery ?

Read back the tread- totally illegal on every level; I'd expect DAFM inspectors to have been in there today ; Simple one to solve considering the limited numbers of these facilities; Again if they showed a fallen cow on the floor of that facility stunned by a bolt gun there'd be a public outcry- but that's why them facilities exist and that's how animals are killed; Highly emotive responses from 95% of people highly likely despite there being no other option for farmers;

Dogs at these facilities will stop very quickly today I'd imagine.

Straffan1979

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Did they say they were Irish dogs?

Or did they say Irish dogs are known to have been sent to China and this is what happens to some dogs in parts of China?

Oh they're only 'known' so and this 'might' happen to 'some' dogs- that's a different spin on it now

Will you or I inform most of the posters on this tread?

mooseknunkle

whisky_galore wrote: »

Silence speaks volumes. Caught by the balls and they knew it.

Couldn't of said it better,for an industry on its knees hopefully this will be the final nail in its coffin and we will see the complete ban on racing dogs.

klaaaz

Straffan1979 wrote: »

Read back the tread- totally illegal on every level; I'd expect DAFM inspectors to have been in there today ; Simple one to solve considering the limited numbers of these facilities; Again if they showed a fallen cow on the floor of that facility stunned by a bolt gun there'd be a public outcry- but that's why them facilities exist and that's how animals are killed; Highly emotive responses from 95% of people highly likely despite there being no other option for farmers;

Dogs at these facilities will stop very quickly today I'd imagine.

Explain the huge skip full of dead greyhounds at that knackery. That's the only site that got caught, probably many others at it involving thousands of deaths. It proves that many greyhound racing owners hate their dogs when they don't win a race, they rather kill them.

bb12

Straffan1979 wrote: »

Read back the tread- totally illegal on every level; I'd expect DAFM inspectors to have been in there today ; Simple one to solve considering the limited numbers of these facilities; Again if they showed a fallen cow on the floor of that facility stunned by a bolt gun there'd be a public outcry- but that's why them facilities exist and that's how animals are killed; Highly emotive responses from 95% of people highly likely despite there being no other option for farmers;

Dogs at these facilities will stop very quickly today I'd imagine.

yeah but one wonders if they're not willing to pay €50 to the vet to have the animals put down and now don't have an outlet at a knackery where it can at least be done quickly, how will they go about dispatching their dogs in the future?

isn't it in spain where they hang their unwanted greyhounds out of the trees and thrown them down wells?

mooseknunkle

Straffan1979 wrote: »

Read back the tread- totally illegal on every level; I'd expect DAFM inspectors to have been in there today ; Simple one to solve considering the limited numbers of these facilities; Again if they showed a fallen cow on the floor of that facility stunned by a bolt gun there'd be a public outcry- but that's why them facilities exist and that's how animals are killed; Highly emotive responses from 95% of people highly likely despite there being no other option for farmers;

Dogs at these facilities will stop very quickly today I'd imagine.

Wouldn't surprise me if you were the fella in the van waiting for his collar back.

dickangel

Straffan1979 wrote: »

Read back the tread- totally illegal on every level; I'd expect DAFM inspectors to have been in there today ; Simple one to solve considering the limited numbers of these facilities; Again if they showed a fallen cow on the floor of that facility stunned by a bolt gun there'd be a public outcry- but that's why them facilities exist and that's how animals are killed; Highly emotive responses from 95% of people highly likely despite there being no other option for farmers;

Dogs at these facilities will stop very quickly today I'd imagine.

It was clear from the footage that these guys aren't intimidated by inspections. They didn't give a sh1te when the inspector showed up as they were about to kill a greyhound. It was supposed to have been stopped before and it didn't. They'll keep doing it, and the level of inspection is ineffective.

Straffan1979

klaaaz wrote: »

Explain the huge skip full of dead greyhounds at that knackery. That's the only site that got caught, probably many others at it involving thousands of deaths. It proves that many greyhound racing owners hate their dogs when they don't win a race, they rather kill them.

my God....is this is what ur up against these days

Bannasidhe

Straffan1979 wrote: »

Oh they're only 'known' so and this 'might' happen to 'some' dogs- that's a different spin on it now

Will you or I inform most of the posters on this tread?

Not at all.
Most posters on this thread are perfectly capable of seeing the issue with sending dogs to a country where dogs are boiled alive.

As they are with seeing your tactics with the silly use of inverted commas.

You are trying to defend the indefensible.

ILoveYourVibes

The problem is owners who are not connected to dogs. They are connected to gambling and racing.

They are not dog people.

MarinersBlues

klaaaz wrote: »

Explain the huge skip full of dead greyhounds at that knackery. That's the only site that got caught, probably many others at it involving thousands of deaths. It proves that many greyhound racing owners hate their dogs when they don't win a race, they rather kill them.

That is an issue for the knackeries regulators.

The new legislation passed a couple of months ago should give the IGB and ICC the ability to deal with the dog owner from now on.

They just didn't have the power to fully enforce their rules prioir to this beacause everything was being appealed to the high court.

It's up to the IGB/ICC to enforce rules stringently it now.
It really is do or die time for the Greyhound industry.

As stated in the program the root of the problem is over production.
IMO they should start limiting the number of bitches allowed to breed every year. Providing licences to those deemed to be of a high enough standard.

Limiting the number of dogs will make them more valuable hence less disposable.

Straffan1979

dickangel wrote: »

They may not have been. But why should we export greyhounds to a country that treats animals this way? Do you think that Irish dogs would avoid this fate purely because they came from Ireland?

The point I'm making is in Legally sound reporting on matters such as this in big black writing under the footage it would read

'THERE IS NO EVIDENCE THAT THE DOGS IN THIS FOOTAGE ARE ACTUAL GREYHOUNDS FROM THE IRISH RACING INDUSTRY'

that's all I want- a balanced fair programme on the national broadcaster ; not sensational emotive conjecture that's the personal view of an editor or reporter in that programme; Again there are Laws against broadcasting in this manner.

ILoveYourVibes

MarinersBlues wrote: »

That is an issue for the knackeries regulators.

The new legislation passed a couple of months ago should give the IGB and ICC the ability to deal with the dog owner from now on.

They just didn't have the power to fully enforce their rules prioir to this beacause everything was being appealed to the high court.

It's up to them to do it now.
It really is do or die time for the Greyhound industry.

As stated in the program the root of the problem is over production.
IMO they should start limiting the number of bitches allowed to breed every year. Providing licences to those deemed to be of a high enough standard.

Limiting the number of dogs will make them more valuable hence less disposable.

Mandatory nuetering?

MarinersBlues

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Mandatory nuetering?

For those bitches that don't get a license absolutely!