RTE Investigates programme on greyhound racing industry

Jupiter Mulligan

MarinersBlues wrote: »

The industry was impeded in its chance to clean up its act by constant appeals to the high court.

By? Dodgy/scummy breeders who didn't want the changes to be implemented, presumably. Who else would bother?

Straffan1979

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Yeah yeah, try and bring the Travelling community into it now.

Deflect.
Deflect.
Deflect.

The programme was based on the report the IGB sat on for 2 years because it's "commercially sensitive".
Which is true. They knew once people saw the truth behind the scenes in their grubby little industry their business model was going to be exposed for what it is.
Greedy, unscrupulous, unregulated, cheats who see dogs as disposable commodities to be exploited and then gotten rid of as cheaply as possible.

You know well broadcasting lines were crossed here with the dog in the pot of boiling water- at least give me that!

pheasant tail

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

No. Safer Jumping.

OK well I am involved in horse sport and I support it and love it. So obviously i am a bad person then.

And quite clearly if you are against horses in sport it might indicate you don't know a lot about them.

No I don’t know much about horses, and I’m not letting on I do, look at my posts. I’m not saying your a bad person! But people who own greyhounds and race them will say exactly as you said above. And they will genuinely believe it. If the demand wasn’t there we wouldn’t have the problem!

ILoveYourVibes

Doctors room ghost wrote: »

You owe it to the dogs at least to sit down and watch it.otherwise you will be one of the other people who choose to look the other way and pretend it doesn’t exist

I sometimes have to look after myself first.

MarinersBlues

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

It couldn't it would collapse.

The English system collapsed because of it's reliance on bookmakers.
The long term survival is in becoming self sufficient.
The ICC is to a large extent self sufficient from charging breeder registration fees.

MarinersBlues

Jupiter Mulligan wrote: »

By? Dodgy/scummy breeders who didn't want the changes to be implemented, presumably. Who else would bother?

Dodgy/scummy owners and trainers mostly.

I am saying they IGB and ICC couldn't deal with them as they wanted due to legal loop holes.

If they are going to survive these individuals need to be removed from the sport for the good of the non-dodgy/non-scummy people that are left (a fastly reducing number I will concede).

Bannasidhe

If anyone is interested these are the 92 TDs who voted to give €16 million to the IGB.

MarinersBlues

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

If it's enforced it sounds good.

Thanks!!
I spent the last 10 years thinking about it once I gave up on the current system :D:D:D

c.p.w.g.w

Bannasidhe wrote: »

If anyone is interested these are the 92 TDs who voted to give €16 million to the IGB.

Look who's second

Bannasidhe

Straffan1979 wrote: »

You know well broadcasting lines were crossed here with the dog in the pot of boiling water- at least give me that!

I honestly disagree it was crossed. Because that is what happens.

I know it's a horrific sight and I haven't recovered from first seeing footage of it some 5 years ago.

But it's what happens.

ILoveYourVibes

pheasant tail wrote: »

No I don’t know much about horses, and I’m not letting on I do, look at my posts. I’m not saying your a bad person! But people who own greyhounds and race them will say exactly as you said above. And they will genuinely believe it. If the demand wasn’t there we wouldn’t have the problem!

There are about 7000k horses slaughtered in Ireland each year.

That is for ALL breeds. Cobs Sport horses half breds and thoroughbreds.


Between 30% - 50% of those are going to be thoroughbreds assuming its the same ratio that appear in rescues.

That is about 2500 race horses per year.

They way they are slaughtered is much the same as cattle humanely. And they are sold to be eaten in the French market.

Ideally we could reduce this. Ideally we could make more use of them as riding horses.



Obviously lots of racehorses retire to a good life.

There is no demand for cobs etc.

Discodog

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

I don't think that is realistic. You would have to mass euthanize them.

Winding it down over a decade while reducing breeding you might be able to do that for a lot of them.


You have to be careful or you will have a worse immediate crisis.

But even if 6000 dogs were euthanised thousands more would be saved long term.

ILoveYourVibes

c.p.w.g.w wrote: »

Look who's second

Yes I see.

Jupiter Mulligan

Bannasidhe wrote: »

If anyone is interested these are the 92 TDs who voted to give €16 million to the IGB.

No sign of Leo there - or Joan Burton; the cute hoors!

ILoveYourVibes

Discodog wrote: »

But even if 6000 dogs were euthanised thousands more would be saved long term.

True. I think winding it down slowly would be more human though.

MarinersBlues

Bannasidhe wrote: »

I honestly disagree it was crossed. Because that is what happens.

I know it's a horrific sight and I haven't recovered from first seeing footage of it some 5 years ago.

But it's what happens.

Pure straw man arguement but here you go.

Imagine a Prime Time special on Clonskeagh Mosque, they cut to 15 minutes of attrocities by ISIS.

Because that is what happens.


Context is everything.

They had plenty of horrific stuff going on at home, there was no need for the Chinese stuff. The only link they had was one guy once sent a handful of dogs to China. You have found an article where IGB mooted an idea that was quickly shot down 8 years ago. Those are tenuous links given how many dogs there are in Ireland and greyhound people there are.

It was excessive but the rest of the show was absolutely damning for everyone in the greyhound industry.

ILoveYourVibes

I think I WILL watch the show actually. But when i feel ...stronger than i do right now. Maybe in a day or so.

Then do something nice after. These things really affect me.

ILoveYourVibes

I will tell you what though. I would be surprised if RTE is not sued any day now.

Bannasidhe

MarinersBlues wrote: »

Pure straw man arguement but here you go.

Imagine a Prime Time special on Clonskeagh Mosque, they cut to 15 minutes of attrocities by ISIS.

Because that is what happens.


Context is everything, they had plenty of horrific stuff going on at home, there was no need for the Chinese stuff. The only link they had was one guy once sent a handful of dogs to China. You have found an article where IGB mooted an idea that was quickly shot down 8 years ago. Those are tenuous links given how many dog and greyhound people there are.

It was excessive but the rest of the show was absolutely damning for everyone.

It was shot down because Sean McEntee wouldn't grant the licences for export on the scale the IGB wanted.

What happens in China was well publicised. At the time there was a huge campaign highlighting the welfare issues.

Irish dogs were still sent.

Did you miss the link I shared where the ISPCA was appealing to Lufthansa not to transport 24 greyhounds?

That was 24 on one flight.

Strawman is bringing Muslims into it.

MarinersBlues

Bannasidhe wrote: »

It was shot down because Sean McEntee wouldn't grant the licences for export on the scale the IGB wanted.

What happens in China was well publicised. At the time there was a huge campaign highlighting the welfare issues.

Irish dogs were still sent.

Did you miss the link I shared where the ISPCA was appealing to Lufthansa not to transport 24 greyhounds?

That was 24 on one flight.

I was involved with greyhounds at the time and was not made aware of this by any newspaper or protest. It was greyhound people who told me and were appaled.
The links you posted on greyhound forums at the time reflected my experience.

I won't defend the IGB.
I think they have screwed up royally for decades.
I hope this sorts them out like the FAI, and OCI.

I will say that I felt implicated and guilty by association when watching last night. That felt excessive and unfair to the people I know who are still involved.
The rest was fair game.

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Strawman is bringing Muslims into it.

Yep, pure straw man, just the best example I could think of.
I felt dirty typing it but it reflected how I felt.

archer22

And what becomes of those dead Greyhounds we saw in the Knackeries ?.

As I understand it stuff from Knackeries is used for Dog food :eek:.

angel eyes 2012

MarinersBlues wrote: »

The industry was impeded in its chance to clean up its act by constant appeals to the high court.




Agree.



Agree.
Greyhound betting makes up a tiny portion of bookmakers turnover anyway and I would like to see the sport stand on its own two feet.



Congratulations!?!

I had a typo.

The Government should then legislate for stricter penalties for any breach of animal wefare including custodial sentences and massive fines where necessary.

Thanks for the congrats.

angel eyes 2012

MarinersBlues wrote: »

The industry was impeded in its chance to clean up its act by constant appeals to the high court.




Agree.



Agree.
Greyhound betting makes up a tiny portion of bookmakers turnover anyway and I would like to see the sport stand on its own two feet.



Congratulations!?!

I had a typo.

The Government should then legislate for stricter penalties for any breach of animal wefare including custodial sentences and massive fines where necessary.

Thanks for the congrats.

MarinersBlues

angel eyes 2012 wrote: »

The Government should then legislate for stricter penalties for any breach of animal wefare including custodial sentences and massive fines where necessary.

I agree 1000%!
The book should be thrown at people who break the rules.
They should never be allowed near any registered premises or track again.

The time for lip-service is done!

bb12

MarinersBlues wrote: »

I agree 1000%!
The book should be thrown at people who break the rules.
They should never be allowed near any registered premises or track again.

The time for lip-service is done!

there are already tough laws for animal abuse here. the problem is nothing is ever done about it and if perchance a case ends up in court, they'll get away with a fine of a few hundred..sure look at the guy who swung his jack russell around in a park with kids in it and killed the dog in front of everyone...when it went to court he walked away scot free and didn't even get an animal ban....the welfare laws are completely useless as they are just not enforced in any way yet every td will come out and say " we have the best welfare laws in the world"...absolutely worthless drivel.

Igotadose

Just wind down the "industry." Start by preventing any and all exports of Greyhounds from Ireland. Period full stop. Spend the IGB funding in the budget on rehoming the existing greyhound population in the breeder pipeline and easing the job transition for the legitimate, registered breeders and trainers.
Certify breeders. What a horror show that documentary was, even ignoring the abominable behavior in China and Pakistan (where in fact you can easily google "trainers" who claim Irish dogs in their stud books, amusing the dogs were all born around 2009-2011, I call BS on that but you can't get at the data.)

CiarraiAbu2

Igotadose wrote: »

Just wind down the "industry." Start by preventing any and all exports of Greyhounds from Ireland. Period full stop. Spend the IGB funding in the budget on rehoming the existing greyhound population in the breeder pipeline and easing the job transition for the legitimate, registered breeders and trainers.
Certify breeders. What a horror show that documentary was, even ignoring the abominable behavior in China and Pakistan (where in fact you can easily google "trainers" who claim Irish dogs in their stud books, amusing the dogs were all born around 2009-2011, I call BS on that but you can't get at the data.)

Is it just greyhound racing you want wound up, what about horse racing?

Igotadose

CiarraiAbu2 wrote: »

Is it just greyhound racing you want wound up, what about horse racing?

Fuck whataboutery. Just greyhounds. Wind it down, seedy dying industry that, due to its lingering death throes, is selling dogs for meat to China and abuse to Pakistan. Many better uses for E16million all over Ireland.

Bannasidhe

MarinersBlues wrote: »

I was involved with greyhounds at the time and was not made aware of this by any newspaper or protest. It was greyhound people who told me and were appaled.
The links you posted on greyhound forums at the time reflected my experience.

I won't defend the IGB.
I think they have screwed up royally for decades.
I hope this sorts them out like the FAI, and OCI.

I will say that I felt implicated and guilty by association when watching last night. That felt excessive and unfair to the people I know who are still involved.
The rest was fair game.


Yep, pure straw man, just the best example I could think of.
I felt dirty typing it but it reflected how I felt.

I was involved with Rescue so I couldn't avoid knowing.
But having said that the Canidrome in Macau was infamous across the world (ABC in Australia did a programme on it) for it's appalling conditions - there was extensive news coverage in Ireland at the time.
Plus demonstrations outside the Dail.

I don't mean this in any nasty way but perhaps you didn't want to know?
I know people involved in greyhound racing any they didn't want to know either until events meant they couldn't ignore it anymore.

The father of a friend of mine was devoted to greyhound racing and his dog (Georgie). When Georgie retired he went to live with his owner and the two of them could be seen tottering around every evening on their walk. When Georgie died that man's heart broke. Sadly, he is one of the rare ones. More and more greyhound racing has been corrupted and it's down to the owners, trainers, breeders failing to see/choosing to ignore/being complicit in the abuses that were allowed to go unchecked.

It's not RTE's fault.
It's not animal welfare activists fault.
The fault lies with those involved who abused this beautiful breed out of sheer greed and those who ignored all the warnings. Dismissing protesters as "hippies" etc. They were telling the truth.

CiarraiAbu2

Igotadose wrote: »

Fuck whataboutery. Just greyhounds. Wind it down, seedy dying industry that, due to its lingering death throes, is selling dogs for meat to China and abuse to Pakistan. Many better uses for E16million all over Ireland.

Horse meat is sold to France each year
https://www.google.ie/amp/s/amp.irishexaminer.com/ireland/7618-horses-killed-for-meat-in-ireland-446276.html

That is 1618, more than what greyhounds are supposed to have died, the above are actual figures. Ireland doesn't export to China anymore has been banned for a while now.