RTE Investigates programme on greyhound racing industry

strandroad

For anyone looking to contact related businesses, please consider emailing or phoning Dublin Coach. They have been promoting greyhound racing for a while with some sort of free entry deal advertised on their buses. I have contacted them in the past (and actively discouraged any visitors I know from using them), there was no reaction then but perhaps the tide is turning and they will not want to be associated with widely publicised atrocities now, especially if they receive significant feedback.

ILoveYourVibes

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Did you even read what I said?

I never mentioned cross breeding.
I said cob mares who have foaled are used as wet nurses for thoroughbred foals. The cob foal then becomes surplus to requirements.
They, if they are lucky, end up in rescue where people are desperately trying to feed them to keep them alive. Most aren't that lucky.

No they are not. Only on rare occasion would you ever use a wet nurse.

As I said i have worked in stables with lots of thoroughbred mares. They are just as good mom's as any other breed. I don't know where you are getting that info from. That makes no sense.

You think the amount of cobs in rescues are down to the racing industry??

I am sorry but you are grossly misinformed. Not only about the racing industry but about horses and their behavior in general.

A thoroughbred mare has no more risk of rejecting a foal than any other breed.

The amount of cobs in rescues has nothing to do with racing. It's other horse owners. And yes they do take up a serious amount of space in rescues.

And I mean why would they not just use bottle feeding much cheaper than keeping another horse??

If a foal is rejected (very very rare btw with any breed inc thoroughbreds) they usually bottle feed.

unreg999

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Um. I don't think so. I think you might be naive.

Um OK... I will tell the researchers and people who put themselves at risk and paid thousands to make the documentary that YOU think I'm naive for believing the work they published :mad: (eyeroll)

By the way... it was also a belief that was kept in this side of the world in the past too... bulldogs were bred also for that purpose (and for entertainment), to harass and torment the poor bull by locking on to their noses as it was thought that adrenaline 'softened' the meat and made it taste better... there are other examples of this belief cropping up elsewhere too... but I guess it's all naivety?!

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/defenceless-dogs-scream-agony-boiled-8788111

I know this is from the Mirror but it was the first article I came across and I have better things to do than someone else's research for them... there's plenty more where that came from

Always Tired

Dante7 wrote: »

Corrupt sport. Dogs get thrown in a river prior to a race to tire them out and also get injected with coke to speed them up. Nonsense sport.

There's plenty of actual documented abuse, no need to repeat some silly stories you heard over the years. not saying either thing has not happened but it isnt in any way common - for one thing, there are much cheaper, more effective and less detectable substances than cocaine, and drug testing is pretty strict.

If you think injecting dogs with cocaine would be useful you have a poor grasp of both math and animal biology. And a dip in the river won't slow down a prey instinct in a greyhound or make them too tired to race.

It's really not that high tech. These guys can't even spell injection tbh.

unreg999

With regards to businesses- I know Barry's Tea for example sponsor the dog races in Cork and a few of the local radio stations allow them to advertise....
I'm sure there are other business around the country who regularly advertise and sponsor them too...

maggiepip

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

It seems to me very naive to think that in China people believe if you torture a dog it tastes better.

And since I have known several Chinese people since childhood it just stood out to me.

Eating dog in china is for some a tradition its not as mainstream as people think.

I suggest you seem very naive that just because you have known a few Chinese people you dismiss a poster more knowledgable than yourself.

Did you discuss the slaughter of dogs with your few Chinese aquaintences?

Unfortunately they do torture dogs before killing them because apparently adrenaline, and other stress hormones change the flavour of the meat.

There seems to be nothing too barbaric for the human race to discover. Filthy people.

ILoveYourVibes

unreg999 wrote: »

Um OK... I will tell the researchers and people who put themselves at risk and paid thousands to make the documentary that YOU think I'm naive for believing the work they published :mad: (eyeroll)

Calm down. I do think its naive to believe that yes.

I also think it's naive to believe that amount of effort and money goes into things like this.

Eating dog is not usual in China. It's never been mainstream. It's never been a mainstream tradition.

It's a myth that it's considered normal over there or that many people eat it regularly.

Most Chinese have never eaten dog meat and would consider it odd.

They might think 'well just let other people eat it if they want etc' but it's not mainstream.

And certainly any chinese I know would consider it weird.

southstar

Straffan1979 wrote: »

We can control it- and we will control it and we should control it.

why do we need to include that graphic footage of dog markets in Asia ? 20% of people in China eat dogs - there’s nothing the IGB can do about that;

There’s an onus on the national broadcaster to deliver fair and balanced reporting; the vibe I got here was to launch a total broadside on the Irish Greyhound Industry and inflict maximum damage - get the Industry banned and get hare coursing banned at all costs; that’s not balanced reporting.

These are legal sports in the country and should be afforded due process- whether u agree with them or not.

Knackeries r licensed to kill fallen animals in the fashion shown ; should they be killing dogs- absolutely not- horrific; there’s a very small number of these- this will be dealt with swiftly I’d imagine; the vibe seemed to be oh every Greyhound owner in the country visits knackeries;

It’s not balanced or reasoned reporting- there’s an onus to afford the industry that at least

It was balanced enough for me!!
I wasn't even aware that there was an issue of animal cruel associated with this industry... now I can see that there are lot of hideous ****ers attached to its coatails.... the final scene at that lowlife tramps slaughterhouse in Laois was truly appaling and shameful

ILoveYourVibes

maggiepip wrote: »

I suggest you seem very naive that just because you have known a few Chinese people you dismiss a poster more knowledgable than yourself.

Did you discuss the slaughter of dogs with your few Chinese aquaintences?

Unfortunately they do torture dogs before killing them because apparently adrenaline, and other stress hormones change the flavour of the meat.

There seems to be nothing too barbaric for the human race to discover. Filthy people.

And my brother lived in hongkong for six months.

I promise you its not mainstream.

https://www.hsi.org/news-media/yulin-dog-meat-survey-061217/


https://www.chinadialogue.net/culture/7175-The-myth-of-dog-eating-in-China/en

Its not even sanctioned by the chinese dept of agriculture for people to legally even eat it. So what does that tell you?

Its not mainstream.

dickangel

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Calm down. I do think its naive to believe that yes

So what is the reasoning behind boiling them alive as shown tonight and many, many times before? They clearly go out of their way to do it, as it would be much easier to kill the dogs awaiting cooking.

ILoveYourVibes

southstar wrote: »

It was balanced enough for me!!
I wasn't even aware that there was an issue of animal cruel associated with this industry... now I can see that there are lot of hideous ****ers attached to its coatails.... the final scene at that lowlife tramps slaughterhouse in Laois was truly appaling and shameful

I would say it was fair.

But that not everyone working with dogs in the industry is the same.

that doesn't mean it should not change though.

strandroad

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Eating dog is not usual in China. It's never been mainstream. It's never been a mainstream tradition.

It's a myth that it's considered normal over there or that many people eat it regularly.

Most Chinese have never eaten dog meat and would consider it odd.

They might think 'well just let other people eat it if they want etc' but it's not mainstream.

China is 1.4 bln people. Someone said 20% up thread but even if 10% eat it that's 140mln dog eaters.

Also, only single digit percentages in Ireland play golf or listen to dance music yet both are considered mainstream.

dickangel

strandroad wrote: »

China is 1.4 bln people. Someone said 20% up thread but even if 10% eat it that's 140mln dog eaters.

Also, only single digit percentages in Ireland play golf or listen to EDC yet both are considered mainstream.

But they knew some Chinese people once, therefore...

ILoveYourVibes

dickangel wrote: »

So what is the reasoning behind boiling them alive as shown tonight and many, many times before? They clearly go out of their way to do it, as it would be much easier to kill the dogs awaiting cooking.

There isn't one.

Chinese people are not stupid.

There is no reason for the cruelty. Its just part of the festival.

Chinese people KNOW it doesn't make meat taste better. They also know its bad.

By the way you realize Chinese people CANNOT protest about anything without it being supicious. They can't organize political rally's etc. It's too dangerous.

So if they think the god festival is just cruelty for the sake of cruelty it's not like they can become activists etc like we can in the west.

ILoveYourVibes

strandroad wrote: »

China is 1.4 bln people. Someone said 20% up thread but even if 10% eat it that's 140mln dog eaters.

Also, only single digit percentages in Ireland play golf or listen to EDC yet both are considered mainstream.

If 10% have only played golf once in their lives??

Dante7

Always Tired wrote: »

There's plenty of actual documented abuse, no need to repeat some silly stories you heard over the years. not saying either thing has not happened but it isnt in any way common - for one thing, there are much cheaper, more effective and less detectable substances than cocaine, and drug testing is pretty strict.

If you think injecting dogs with cocaine would be useful you have a poor grasp of both math and animal biology. And a dip in the river won't slow down a prey instinct in a greyhound or make them too tired to race.

It's really not that high tech. These guys can't even spell injection tbh.

I owned a share in an expensive greyhound. I saw what was happening. It's all about the gambling. They are absolutely slowed down by chucking them in a river for a thirty minute swim just before a race and they were heavily drugged. It's the most corrupt "sport" I ever had the displeasure of being involved in.

dickangel

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

There isn't one.

Chinese people are not stupid.

There is no reason for the cruelty. Its just part of the festival.

Chinese people KNOW it doesn't make meat taste better. They also know its bad.

The majority know perhaps. But the reason they are killed alive is for taste. I suppose you'll say the usage of rhino horn in China isn't prevalent enough to cause concern either.

gozunda

strandroad wrote: »

I find it impossible to believe, if half make it to the track rescues are most definitely not rehoming 6000 greyhounds a year. A couple hundred at best. Then some are kept for breeding. The remaining 5000 are also killed one way or another.

Of interest there are also 'some' non responsible pet owners who abandon their dogs

In 2015 alone some 13,500 dogs were taken in by dog pounds in Ireland.. Many of these dogs are killed because they are unwanted...

There is an issue with irresponsible ownership across the board I have no doubt.

ILoveYourVibes

Dante7 wrote: »

I owned a share in an expensive greyhound. I saw what was happening. It's all about the gambling. They are absolutely slowed down by chucking them in a river for a thirty minute swim just before a race and they were heavily drugged. It's the most corrupt "sport" I ever had the displeasure of being involved in.

My brother observed the same. Not chucking in the river but serious drugging issues sedation etc ...or the opposite ..the dogs weight would also bounce up and down ...like if you give a dog a large meal before a race etc.

ILoveYourVibes

dickangel wrote: »

The majority know perhaps. But the reason they are killed alive is for taste. I suppose you'll say the usage of rhino horn in China isn't prevalent enough to cause concern either.

No I would say it is. But have you ever been to a chinese hospital??

Not much rhino horn.

Also they use it in western medical research in china as well as chinese medicine.

And considering the documentary maybe we should get ourselves sorted before we blame the Chinese. It seems kind of like double standards and racism.

Always Tired

Dante7 wrote: »

I owned a share in an expensive greyhound. I saw what was happening. It's all about the gambling. They are absolutely slowed down by chucking them in a river for a thirty minute swim just before a race and they were heavily drugged. It's the most corrupt "sport" I ever had the displeasure of being involved in.

You said they were injected with coke.

Okay, what type of injections were they? Intramuscular, intravenous? Who gives them the injections? How much coke per injection? How much does each injection cost?

I'm asking because your answers will prove you have no actual knowledge of this as it is, like I said, a ridiculously impractical and ineffective way to fix a race.

And these races aren't worth fixing really. The prize money is feck all, and unlike horses the odds on dogs are rarely bigger than 5/1 or 6/1, leaving little chance for a huge payoff. And on top of that there are no jockeys to stop the animals bumping each other which happens all the time.

All this coke injecting stuff is old wives tales basically the actual issues arw what was on the doc tonight - the dogs being inhumanely disposed of in huge numbers.

maggiepip

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

And my brother lived in hongkong for six months.

I promise you its not mainstream.

https://www.hsi.org/news-media/yulin-dog-meat-survey-061217/


https://www.chinadialogue.net/culture/7175-The-myth-of-dog-eating-in-China/en

Its not even sanctioned by the chinese dept of agriculture for people to legally even eat it. So what does that tell you?

Its not mainstream.

The point wasn't about whether it was mainstream or not, so you don't need to promise me anything. There's is however many people eating dog meat in China and they do torture the dogs. Is that plain enough.

dickangel

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

No I would say it is. But have you ever been to a chinese hospital??

Not much rhino horn.

Also they use it in western medical research in china as well as chinese medicine.

And considering the documentary maybe we should get ourselves sorted before we blame the Chinese. It seems kind of like double standards and racism.

I've no idea what point you're trying to make about rhino horn in Chinese hospitals. You're saying it's not mainstream? I agree, but still it has decimated the rhino population. Not being mainstream is justification for nothing. There are a lot of people in China, a small percentage is still an enormous number compared to here.

And we should definitely sort out our own first, and part of that is not exporting dogs to China given their appalling treatment of animals.

Oh and racism me hole. Defending animal abuse because you're afraid it might be racism. Get a grip.

ILoveYourVibes

Always Tired wrote: »

You said they were injected with coke.

Okay, what type of injections were they? Intramuscular, intravenous? Who gives them the injections? How much coke per injection? How much does each injection cost?

I'm asking because your answers will prove you have no actual knowledge of this as it is, like I said, a ridiculously impractical and ineffective way to fix a race.

Orally. Not coke. They are drugged to lose just as often as they are drugged to win.

Always Tired

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Orally. Not coke. They are drugged to lose just as often as they are drugged to win.

Well I was responding to the poster who said they were injected with coke, not you.

ILoveYourVibes

dickangel wrote: »

I've no idea what point you're trying to make about rhino horn in Chinese hospitals. You're saying it's not mainstream? I agree, but still it has decimated the rhino population. Not being mainstream is justification for nothing.

And we should definitely sort out our own first, and part of that is not exporting dogs to China given their appalling treatment of animals.

Oh and racism me hole. Defending animal abuse because you're afraid it might be racism. Get a grip.

I am saying Doctors in China don't use it at all. Hospitals do not use traditional chinese medicine in china. It would be like a hospital here using herbalism.

And if you are sick in china you go to a doctor. Just like you do here.

You get me?

If you are kind of a hippie etc or you have this strange tummy ailment you go to this Chinese medicine place that you as a Chinese person probably don't actually believe in but you are willing to give it a try. And since a big country has a lot of suckers 'chinese medicine' makes money from a placebo effect. And people know this.

But while if this happened here you could go protest. In china that cannot happen.

But no doctor uses it. 'Healers' use it.

Chinese people go to hospital when they have cancer etc. And that chinese hospital is going to tell them that traditional Chinese medicine is pseudoscience and even harmful to them. And any Doctor in China will tell them the same.

That is the situation.

ILoveYourVibes

Always Tired wrote: »

Well I was responding to the poster who said they were injected with coke, not you.

I was just answering. Sorry.


You made several good points though.

maggiepip

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

No I would say it is. But have you ever been to a chinese hospital??

Not much rhino horn.

Also they use it in western medical research in china as well as chinese medicine.

And considering the documentary maybe we should get ourselves sorted before we blame the Chinese. It seems kind of like double standards and racism.

It's not fcuking racism jesus christ, highlighting the abuse and torture of innocent loving dogs, a billion times better than you or I, and someone starts with fcuking racism!!!!!

And the whole point of the documentary was our Irish dogs are ending up in places like China where they will suffer even more abuse. Fact!!!! No racism involved dummy.

dickangel

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

I am saying Doctors in China don't use it at all. Hospitals do not use traditional chinese medicine in china. It would be like a hospital here using herbalism.

And if you are sick in china you go to a doctor. Just like you do here.

You get me?

If you are kind of a hippie etc or you have this strange tummy ailment you go to this Chinese medicine place that you as a Chinese person probably don't actually believe in but you are willing to give it a try. And since a big country has a lot of suckers 'chinese medicine' makes money from a placebo effect. And people know this.

But while if this happened here you could go protest. In china that cannot happen.

But no doctor uses it. 'Healers' use it.

Chinese people go to hospital when they have cancer etc. And that chinese hospital is going to tell them that traditional Chinese medicine is pseudoscience and even harmful to them. And any Doctor in China will tell them the same.

That is the situation.

Pretty much none of that has any relevance to what I said. Not a single person here has said rhino horn or dog meat is mainstream, yet on and on you go..

China has a poor record with animal welfare, let's stop sending dogs there to be tortured. Simple.

"But not all Chinese" you'll say, well enough to cause international concern.

ILoveYourVibes

maggiepip wrote: »

The point wasn't about whether it was mainstream or not, so you don't need to promise me anything. There's is however many people eating dog meat in China and they do torture the dogs. Is that plain enough.

I never disagreed with you about that.

But you have to understand you are privileged to live in a country where you can protest about that. The Chinese are not. Do you understand?

Its not that they are less caring to animals. Its that when this happens they are powerless as a society to challenge it.

So think about that the next time you generalize and stigmatize.

They are human beings. And it's a country that puts HUMAN BEINGS in concentration camps.

They can't do anything to save the dogs without risking their own lives.

It's not because they don't care. It's not because they are barbaric it's not cultural. It's because they live under a totalitarian regime.

And most chinese people feel as you do. But what can they do?

ILoveYourVibes

dickangel wrote: »

Pretty much none of that has any relevance to what I said. Not a single person here has said rhino horn or dog meat is mainstream, yet on and on you go..

China has a poor record with animal welfare, let's stop sending dogs there to be tortured. Simple.

"But not all Chinese" you'll say, well enough to cause international concern.

Let's stop sending dogs anywhere.

dickangel

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

I never disagreed with you about that.

But you have to understand you are privileged to live in a country where you can protest about that. The Chinese are not. Do you understand?

Its not that they are less caring to animals. Its that when this happens they are powerless as a society to challenge it.

So think about that the next time you generalize and stigmatize.

They are human beings. And it's a country that puts HUMAN BEINGS in concentration camps.

They can't do anything to save the dogs without risking their own lives.

It's not because they don't care. It's not because they are barbaric. It's because they live under a totalitarian regime.

Your point on protest is irrelevant as no one is blaming the entire population of China. There is a sizable industry there where people winningly partake in cruelty to animals.

ILoveYourVibes

dickangel wrote: »

Your point on protest is irrelevant as no one is blaming the entire population of China. There is a sizable industry there where people winningly partake in cruelty to animals.

As there is here.
And my point on protest is very relevant if you actually care about animals.

Human rights going under usually means animal rights go under. Human rights go up animal right go up.

They do go hand in hand.

dickangel

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Let's stop sending dogs anywhere.

Agreed. And especially China where dogs are boiled alive.

dickangel

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

As there is here.
And my point on protest is very relevant if you actually care about animals.

Human rights going under usually means animal rights go under. Human rights go up animal right go up.

They do go hand in hand.

So don't condemn China's mistreatment of animals because the population can't protest. Ah no I'll condemn it alright.

ILoveYourVibes

dickangel wrote: »

Agreed. And especially China where dogs are boiled alive.

Ever read animal farm?

ILoveYourVibes

dickangel wrote: »

So don't condemn China's mistreatment of animals because the population can't protest. Ah no I'll condemn it alright.

Condemn their inability to protest. If that changed then so would the behavior you hate.

maggiepip

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

I never disagreed with you about that.

But you have to understand you are privileged to live in a country where you can protest about that. The Chinese are not. Do you understand?

Its not that they are less caring to animals. Its that when this happens they are powerless as a society to challenge it.

So think about that the next time you generalize and stigmatize.

They are human beings. And it's a country that puts HUMAN BEINGS in concentration camps.

They can't do anything to save the dogs without risking their own lives.

It's not because they don't care. It's not because they are barbaric it's not cultural. It's because they live under a totalitarian regime.

And most chinese people feel as you do. But what can they do?

This isn't about the Chinese. Its about the poor dogs.

Have a look on Caged Nationwide Facebook.

There should also be a Prime Time investigation on the minority group here who abuse and neglect Lurchers and horses.

dickangel

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Condemn their inability to protest. If that changed then so would the behavior you hate.

No I'll condemn anyone that chooses to boil a dog alive. You can still make good life choices if you can't protest. You're terrified of placing responsibility on the people in tonight's show just because they are Chinese.

And before you try to deflect yet again, of course I condemn the Irish people too ( like I should even have to say it.)

ILoveYourVibes

dickangel wrote: »

No I'll condemn anyone that chooses to boil a dog alive. You can still make good life choices if you can't protest. You're terrified of placing responsibility on the people in tonight's show just because they are Chinese.

Perhaps I am weak.

ILoveYourVibes

maggiepip wrote: »

This isn't about the Chinese. Its about the poor dogs.

Have a look on Caged Nationwide Facebook.

There should also be a Prime Time investigation on the minority group here who abuse and neglect Lurchers and horses.

I don't know much about Lurchers.

Horses I would be interested in ...from the rescue point of view you rarely find out who owned them.

Its not all just cobs by the way. You get all kinds. I used to ride a morgan horse in a rescue (pretty good horse breed from the states ) ..his previous owner had got him from the states shipped him over but then died a while after he was backed.

You get people with a lots of stories

There is some out right shocking abuses though. Some stuff you wish you hadn't seen. Mostly by idiots who haven't a clue about horses.

gctest50

Yulin Lychee and dogmeat festival is on this week

10,000+ dogs

ILoveYourVibes

gctest50 wrote: »

Yulin Lychee and dogmeat festival is on this week

10,000+ dogs

yup

will probably receive more attention than the people in concentration camps in china

And yes the festival is just a cruelty fest. There is no reason for it. It makes no sense. Its bizarre and freakish.

Atlantic Dawn

Too many powers that be involved and votes for a single thing to be done about this. Fur farming on the other hand is so much more damaging... my hole :rolleyes:

Blaizes

Didn’t see the documentary but it sounds barbaric and cruel. Surprised to hear that the poor dogs are very being sent to China but not that the Chinese eat dog. A Chinese chef studying here told me he cooked dog in China and said it was a very good meat. Another having arrived here with barely any English bought and ate part of a tin of dog food in the mistaken belief that it was dog meat for human consumption, his flat mate put him right.

Yurt2

Barry Cowen was the head of (or at least an executive of) Bord na Gcon / Irish Greyhound Board. Wonder what he has to say for himself

ILoveYourVibes

Yurt! wrote: »

Barry Cowen was the head of (or at least an executive of) Bord na Gcon / Irish Greyhound Board. Wonder what he has to say for himself

Who is head of it now? Do you know???

Flibble

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

I am saying Doctors in China don't use it at all. Hospitals do not use traditional chinese medicine in china. It would be like a hospital here using herbalism.

And if you are sick in china you go to a doctor. Just like you do here.

You get me?

If you are kind of a hippie etc or you have this strange tummy ailment you go to this Chinese medicine place that you as a Chinese person probably don't actually believe in but you are willing to give it a try. And since a big country has a lot of suckers 'chinese medicine' makes money from a placebo effect. And people know this.

But while if this happened here you could go protest. In china that cannot happen.

But no doctor uses it. 'Healers' use it.

Chinese people go to hospital when they have cancer etc. And that chinese hospital is going to tell them that traditional Chinese medicine is pseudoscience and even harmful to them. And any Doctor in China will tell them the same.

That is the situation.

Not true. Hospitals in China do use Traditional Chinese Medicine. There's Acupuncture departments & Tuina departments alongside all the other departments, and herbal dispensaries inside the hospitals. Remedies are handed out via prescriptions from doctors specialising in Traditional Chinese Medicines. Just like doctors here do their general degree and go on to specialise in Oncology etc, doctors there can specialise in Traditional modalities. You wouldn't be allowed practice if you weren't a fully qualified medical doctor, although a massive amount of local knowledge still exists so you will get people purchasing herbs for themselves according to known remedies.

Every pharmacy carries a good chunk of herbs. Unfortunately, they do farm animals enmass to supply certain medicines, as the animal ingredients are classified as 'herbs'. Most commonly, they will use insects like cicadas and scorpions etc, but you do get bears being farmed for their bile and I believe they have massive Tiger farms also (I'm not sure what they use from the Tigers but I have seen photos of the farms)

Tokyo

maggiepip wrote: »

There seems to be nothing too barbaric for the human race to discover. Filthy people.

Mod: <edit> Threadban lifted. Post was open to interpretation.

ILoveYourVibes

Flibble wrote: »

Not true. Hospitals in China do use Traditional Chinese Medicine. There's Acupuncture departments & Tuina departments alongside all the other departments, and herbal dispensaries inside the hospitals. Remedies are handed out via prescriptions from doctors specialising in Traditional Chinese Medicines. Just like doctors here do their general degree and go on to specialise in Oncology etc, doctors there can specialise in Traditional modalities. You wouldn't be allowed practice if you weren't a fully qualified medical doctor, although a massive amount of local knowledge still exists so you will get people purchasing herbs for themselves according to known remedies.

Every pharmacy carries a good chunk of herbs. Unfortunately, they do farm animals enmass to supply certain medicines, as the animal ingredients are classified as 'herbs'. Most commonly, they will use insects like cicadas and scorpions etc, but you do get bears being farmed for their bile and I believe they have massive Tiger farms also (I'm not sure what they use from the Tigers but I have seen photos of the farms)

That's odd. Because from my friend who is chinese and people who have lived there its strictly frowned upon by the medical profession in china.

You do have TCM hospitals though. But they are separate. Those separate hospiatls are not run and paid for by the state though. And they even have emergency departments (confusing i know). But they are not part of the state mainstream system.

In chinese hospitals you have everyone in one place...dentists gps etc.

But who knows it could differ from region to region though. It's so huge. She is from the north it could be particular to her region.

I know chinese medicine farms bears etc. I have zero idea of what the pseudoscience behind the bile things is though.

Obviously we use animals in western medicine as well. Only that is science. It's value can be proven.

Obviously i don't support animal testing or farming for medicine that isn't even going to work.