Donald Trump Presidency discussion Thread VI

Overheal

Can you zoom and enchance on that placecard mate

mcmoustache

Overheal wrote: »

Can you zoom and enchance on that placecard mate

It's just Parnas's name and the menu I think.

mcmoustache

Why was Giuliani flying to Vienna where Firtash hangs out and where the two arrested guys were headed?

It doesn't look great.

And it's been reported on CNN that Giuliani is under investigation. Not particularly surprising but I's surprised it took this long to get out.

mcmoustache

This is moving fast, as pointed out earlier by Everlast.

BonnieSituation

mcmoustache wrote: »

This is moving fast, as pointed out earlier by Everlast.

Who wrote that?

Overheal

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Who wrote that?

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2019/10/rudy-giuliani-vienna/599833/

BonnieSituation

Overheal wrote: »

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2019/10/rudy-giuliani-vienna/599833/

Cheers

beggars_bush

There's always a tweet to catch Trump out

It's fantastic

BonnieSituation

beggars_bush wrote: »

There's always a tweet to catch Trump out

It's fantastic

Gizza look

Water John

Really closing in, with Giuliani no longer an asset.

aloyisious

Overheal wrote: »

both of them

"In May 2018, the two men gave $325,000 to the pro-Trump super PAC America First Action through an LLC, Global Energy Producers, the group confirmed to NBC News. That same month, Parnas posted photos on Facebook of himself and Fruman with Trump, and with the president's oldest son, Donald Trump Jr.

Jay Sekulow, the president's outside counsel, told NBC News: "As the indictment states, neither the President nor the campaign were aware."

Trump said Thursday that he didn't know the two Giuliani associates.

"Now it’s possible I have a picture with them because I have a picture with everybody. I have a picture with everybody here. But somebody said that there may be a picture or something at a fundraiser or somewhere. But I have pictures with everybody," Trump told reporters on the South Lawn of the White House. "I don't know if there’s anybody I don't have pictures with. I don't know them. I don't know about them, I don't know what they do, but I don't know, maybe they were clients of Rudy, you’d have to ask Rudy, I just don't know."

The Trump campaign declined to comment, while John Dowd, an attorney for the two men, did not immediately respond to a request for comment. Reached by NBC News, Giuliani said he could not yet comment.

A spokesman for America First Action said Thursday that it had "placed that contribution in a segregated bank account, it has not been used for any purpose and the funds will remain in this segregated account until these matters are resolved.""

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/florida-businessmen-who-helped-giuliani-ukraine-arrested-campaign-finance-charges-n1064606

The 3rd gent arrested, Andrey Kukushkin [another Ukraine-American] founded 4 companies in the US over the past two years, one of which is still extant. LLC is one of those companies. I suppose they could be what are called shell corporations, set up to cover activities which could not be performed openly but give them an air of legitimacy at first sight. It'd be interesting to find out if the original donations were already spent and then replaced from other donation for sequestration purposes to prevent the overall [re-election campaign] donated funds from being frozen by court-order, re the investigation.

It seems the airline tickets to be used by the two gents arrested at Dulles were one-way tickets.

Another thing that's come up is that John Bolton was present in the Oval Office when Don spoke about Ukraine and the Bidens. According to CNN, another person there said Bolton went "ballisitic" on hearing what Don was thinking of doing. It might explain his abrupt departure if he said something to Don along the lines of Rex Tillerson's comment.

mcmoustache

Water John wrote: »

Really closing in, with Giuliani no longer an asset.

Was he ever? Not even the Trumpies here take him seriously.

Overheal

The pair seen with RNC co-chair Tommy Hicks and Don Jr.

Financially embedded deep with the RNC on numerous levels https://lawandcrime.com/high-profile/here-are-the-republicans-so-far-connected-to-rudy-giulianis-arrested-ukrainian-clients/ one of their primary goals was the outing of US Ambassador to Ukraine

TomOnBoard

Frank Figliuzzi is a former senior counter-intelligence officer at the FBI. He was interviewed by Nicole Wallace earlier and intimated that the indictment of the Ukrainian lads has so much specificity that it probably came from audio surveillance and/or undercover resources. It also probably dates back to Summer 2018. Unless the 2 clowns were the prime target, it is possible if not likely that meetings / conversations with Rudy was also swept up in any such surveillance. In which case, Michael Cohen is currently making space for a new inmate in the Donald Trump Personal Lawyer wing in upstate New York... I hope Rudy doesn't snore!

Overheal

TomOnBoard wrote: »

Frank Figliuzzi is a former senior counter-intelligence officer at the FBI. He was interviewed by Nicole Wallace earlier and intimated that the indictment of the Ukrainian lads has so much specificity that it probably came from audio surveillance and/or undercover resources. It also probably dates back to Summer 2018. Unless the 2 clowns were the prime target, it is possible if not likely that meetings / conversations with Rudy was also swept up in any such surveillance. In which case, Michael Cohen is currently making space for a new inmate in the Donald Trump Personal Lawyer wing in upstate New York... I hope Rudy doesn't snore!

Thanks to all those 'deep state' tools (like PRISM) that Republicans pretend to hate but haven't lifted a finger to reign in (and actively supported in the past for 'keeping Murica safe')

aloyisious

TomOnBoard wrote: »

Frank Figliuzzi is a former senior counter-intelligence officer at the FBI. He was interviewed by Nicole Wallace earlier and intimated that the indictment of the Ukrainian lads has so much specificity that it probably came from audio surveillance and/or undercover resources. It also probably dates back to Summer 2018. Unless the 2 clowns were the prime target, it is possible if not likely that meetings / conversations with Rudy was also swept up in any such surveillance. In which case, Michael Cohen is currently making space for a new inmate in the Donald Trump Personal Lawyer wing in upstate New York... I hope Rudy doesn't snore!

An aside to this is that it can't do the Trump family business much good for its clientele to be rattled about who knows what about their personal and business affairs conducted in the chain premises. Don might fly off the handle at the notion that the FBI have been bugging his hotels, friends and clients and have a swipe at Rudy on the basis he's partly to blame for it happening, as he doesn't believe in coincidences.

everlast75

TomOnBoard wrote: »

Frank Figliuzzi is a former senior counter-intelligence officer at the FBI. He was interviewed by Nicole Wallace earlier and intimated that the indictment of the Ukrainian lads has so much specificity that it probably came from audio surveillance and/or undercover resources. It also probably dates back to Summer 2018. Unless the 2 clowns were the prime target, it is possible if not likely that meetings / conversations with Rudy was also swept up in any such surveillance. In which case, Michael Cohen is currently making space for a new inmate in the Donald Trump Personal Lawyer wing in upstate New York... I hope Rudy doesn't snore!

I was thinking how incredible it would be to have Rudy on tape warning the two goons..... or how much better if they had barr warning Rudy to warn those two goons.


Imagine being Trump and having both of your personal lawyers in jail? The mental gymnastics trump supporters would have to perform to not see how that shows Trump to be utterly corrupt.


Cohen and Giuliani are the two worst lawyers I've ever seen. Best people, huh?

StringerBell

There was a good last word on the last word podcast this morning.

When posed with the question of the problem a lot of Trump's people have with distancing themselves from him after they have bought fully into him and gone so far down the road with him, is to leave is to admit "I'm an idiot" but to stay is saying to the world "I'm with this idiot"

FreudianSlippers

You literally wouldn't accept this in a television show script... would be dismissed as lazy writing.

https://twitter.com/jonfavs/status/1182495109922746368?s=20

Igotadose

everlast75 wrote: »

Cohen and Giuliani are the two worst lawyers I've ever seen. Best people, huh?

Cohen was a joke. Cooley school of law. One of the lowest ranked law schools in the US, and that's saying a lot. The school you go to matters tremendously for a lawyer in terms of their job opportunities, and their aptitude. You need a pulse to get into Cooley. You need far more to get into an Ivy league law school, Stanford, etc. It's not a democracy, its (more or less) a competitive meritocracy.

Giuliani was a good mayor for NYC and did commendable work during 9/11. He's gone gaga since then and I think was brought in by Trump once Cohen went to prison because Trump, as always, was thinking of the optics and not the person's ability. Then someone came up with this Ukraine idea and Trump, being lazy, dispatched Rudy to handle the dirt - it's how he uses lawyers. Rudy can be the tough guy for awhile but I expect when the klieg lights are on in front of Congress he'll fold like a cheap suit.

Penn

Igotadose wrote: »

Cohen was a joke. Cooley school of law. One of the lowest ranked law schools in the US, and that's saying a lot. The school you go to matters tremendously for a lawyer in terms of their job opportunities, and their aptitude. You need a pulse to get into Cooley. You need far more to get into an Ivy league law school, Stanford, etc. It's not a democracy, its (more or less) a competitive meritocracy.

Giuliani was a good mayor for NYC and did commendable work during 9/11. He's gone gaga since then and I think was brought in by Trump once Cohen went to prison because Trump, as always, was thinking of the optics and not the person's ability. Then someone came up with this Ukraine idea and Trump, being lazy, dispatched Rudy to handle the dirt - it's how he uses lawyers. Rudy can be the tough guy for awhile but I expect when the klieg lights are on in front of Congress he'll fold like a cheap suit.

I'd be more inclined to think Trump would do everything in his power to help Rudy, especially with Barr on his side too. With Cohen, most of what Cohen knew about was before he became President. Rudy would now have info on stuff Trump has done while President. Cohen was expendable. I'm not so sure Trump would think the same of Rudy, useless as he is.

Brian?

Penn wrote: »

I'd be more inclined to think Trump would do everything in his power to help Rudy, especially with Barr on his side too. With Cohen, most of what Cohen knew about was before he became President. Rudy would now have info on stuff Trump has done while President. Cohen was expendable. I'm not so sure Trump would think the same of Rudy, useless as he is.

Trump believes he can get away with anything, because he always has. I’m hoping it’ll be his downfall, but I honestly don’t think he’ll be impeached.

everlast75

Penn wrote: »

I'd be more inclined to think Trump would do everything in his power to help Rudy, especially with Barr on his side too. With Cohen, most of what Cohen knew about was before he became President. Rudy would now have info on stuff Trump has done while President. Cohen was expendable. I'm not so sure Trump would think the same of Rudy, useless as he is.

When asked about Rudy, Trump said the exact same thing he said about Cohen - "you'd have to ask... about that". Just a similarity I noticed

Water John

The last time when Don said that about Cohen, he himself knew the answer.
It's the polls will decide impeachment. Already 55% want him impeached, and most of those want him removed too.

26000 Elephants

Brian? wrote: »

Trump believes he can get away with anything, because he always has. I’m hoping it’ll be his downfall, but I honestly don’t think he’ll be impeached.

He has to be. The Senate will be left with no choice than to convict - or else they will be seen to be acting outside the constitution themselves.

They are being given every opportunity to ditch Trump: this whole Turkey/Kurds situation is a well scripted get-out-of-jail clause for Republicans who still have a shred of decency left and are not immediately implicated in this White House.

Quin_Dub

Water John wrote: »

The last time when Don said that about Cohen, he himself knew the answer.
It's the polls will decide impeachment. Already 55% want him impeached, and most of those want him removed too.

Just on that. I don't understand that 4% that say they want him Impeached but not removed from Office.

I don't get the thought process there at all.

The only thing I can think of is that they interpret it as "I agree with there being Impeachment proceedings but I don't think he's guilty so I want him to stay".

But even that is a bit odd to me.

pixelburp

Quin_Dub wrote: »

Just on that. I don't understand that 4% that say they want him Impeached but not removed from Office.

I don't get the thought process there at all.

The only thing I can think of is that they interpret it as "I agree with there being Impeachment proceedings but I don't think he's guilty so I want him to stay".

But even that is a bit odd to me.

I'd guess it's similar to the Evangelical thought process / hypocrisy, rationalising that while yes, Trump might be a sinner with his adultery & whatnot, he's also a vessel in God's larger plans.

Quin_Dub

26000 Elephants wrote: »

He has to be. The Senate will be left with no choice than to convict - or else they will be seen to be acting outside the constitution themselves.

They are being given every opportunity to ditch Trump: this whole Turkey/Kurds situation is a well scripted get-out-of-jail clause for Republicans who still have a shred of decency left and are not immediately implicated in this White House.

Sadly , none of that matters at present.

Rule of Law is entirely secondary to the Rule of Public Perception.

As long as his support with GOP voters remains solid they will not vote against him.

Having said that , the current trend in not in his favour.

There has been a small shift in GOP voters saying they support impeachment - something like 2/3% however there has been a very large shift in the strength of opinion against Impeachment.

I can't find the link to the report now , but will search and update but basically the question on Impeachment in the poll had 4 possible answers - Strongly For , For , Against , Strongly Against and there had been a really big shift among GOP voters from "Strongly Against" to "Against" , in the order of 20% points.

So whilst they are still not supporting impeachment , their opposition is softening and that's before there has been a single public hearing.

Everything can change of course , but so far there doesn't seem to be much upside for Trump.

spacecoyote

Apparently Deutsche don't have any personal account records for Trump, they destroyed them years ago

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/10/business/deutsche-bank-trump-tax-returns.html#click=https://t.co/tC1wqOQFuV

Seems just slightly fishy, and certainly wouldn't line up with standard accounting practices I would think?

everlast75

However, he won't be providing docs.

https://twitter.com/kyledcheney/status/1182638663433363456?s=20