Donald Trump Presidency discussion Thread VI

20Cent

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

"Does he ever stand on the floor?" :P

Trump hates him because Beto has what trump can't buy.

Honesty, class, morals and sincerity.

everlast75

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

"Does he ever stand on the floor?" :P


https://twitter.com/PolishPatriotTM/status/1190434549148397568

Hey Pete,

Looks like some Republicans can accept something you can't....

https://twitter.com/rachaelmbade/status/1190413932198014976?s=19

duploelabs

Danzy wrote: »

Probably but the electorate will look at the economy.

They'll look at that and the ever increasing crazy show that is the Dems and enough will hold their nose and vote on the economy, God only knows what the Democrat plan is or if the varying factions can even agree on anything.

And so that's where the stock market does so well. Those high level tax cuts facilitated stock buy backs, which boosted the Dow Jones, not the economy doing well.

And guess what, another round of the same tax cuts are being mooted.

It's not that hard to understand the motives here

everlast75

Danzy wrote: »

Probably but the electorate will look at the economy.

They'll look at that and the ever increasing crazy show that is the Dems and enough will hold their nose and vote on the economy, God only knows what the Democrat plan is or if the varying factions can even agree on anything.

In what world is the deficit *not* part of the economy?

I'm guessing it's the world where it doesn't suit the Republicans to talk about it!?

pixelburp

peddlelies wrote: »

*Disclaimer had a few beers *

I guess one of the things that boggles me about Trump, and I'd imagine this applies to most people, how did this guy, become the guy we know today?

Everything is different, his voice, his demeanour, his manner, his looks, his speech, everything. The guy below you could actually respect as a President. Trump is some sort of enigma, everything about him.

Honestly, my theory is that he has some degenerative disease that he's keeping hushed up, not like at that age the signs won't become more prominent, he is in his mid 70s after all.

Couple that with the fact he stepped into arguably the most stressful and scrutinised job in the world, with no preparation or desire to play any differently to his business management. Had Trump parked the braggadocio for a hot minute and deferred to actual experts - or called everyone's bluff with a coalition cabinet - he could have been a sensation. Instead he continues to wing it, dissemble and maintain stubbornness in the face of his flailing experience.

everlast75

everlast75 wrote: »

In what world is the deficit *not* part of the economy?

I'm guessing it's the world where it doesn't suit the Republicans to talk about it!?

If the dems win next year I'm willing to bet that the Gop will be extremely concerned about the deficit all of a sudden.

Brian?

Eric Cartman wrote: »

about the same proportion as in european countries with a less generous welfare state than ours id imagine.

That’s nonsense.

dark crystal

peddlelies wrote: »

*Disclaimer had a few beers *

I guess one of the things that boggles me about Trump, and I'd imagine this applies to most people, how did this guy, become the guy we know today?

Everything is different, his voice, his demeanour, his manner, his looks, his speech, everything. The guy below you could actually respect as a President. Trump is some sort of enigma, everything about him.

Wasn't he a Democrat at that stage?

I imagine turning Republican metamorphised him from Anakin Skywalker into Darth Vader.

mcmoustache

everlast75 wrote: »

Hey Pete,

Looks like some Republicans can accept something you can't....

And here's the top intellectual of the alt-right going down the same road. These guys are really lucky that their fans don't have the memory to notice the contradiction there with the "No QPQ" argument that they were previously making. If they did, they might realise their thought-leaders are full of manure.


https://twitter.com/JasonSCampbell/status/1190357366136541186

Christy42

mcmoustache wrote: »

And here's the top intellectual of the alt-right going down the same road. These guys are really lucky that their fans don't have the memory to notice the contradiction there with the "No QPQ" argument that they were previously making. If they did, they might realise their thought-leaders are full of manure.


https://twitter.com/JasonSCampbell/status/1190357366136541186

There is a chart to predict their arguments right? It didn't happen etc. And now we are into it did happen but wasn't a big deal. Impressively predicable playbook

26000 Elephants

Christy42 wrote: »

There is a chart to predict their arguments right? It didn't happen etc. And now we are into it did happen but wasn't a big deal. Impressively predicable playbook

Yup. The narcissists prayer or apology or some such. Its the GOP playbook, quoted in sequence and verbatim by Trump apologists for every issue.

You’re imagining it, it didn’t happen.

But, if it did, it wasn’t so bad.

But, if it was, it wasn’t so big a deal.

But, if it is, it wasn’t my fault.

But, if it was, I didn’t mean it.

But, if I did, you deserved it

everlast75

mcmoustache wrote: »

And here's the top intellectual of the alt-right going down the same road. These guys are really lucky that their fans don't have the memory to notice the contradiction there with the "No QPQ" argument that they were previously making. If they did, they might realise their thought-leaders are full of manure.


https://twitter.com/JasonSCampbell/status/1190357366136541186

Well this is what he said previously...

https://twitter.com/benshapiro/status/1176603361518374912?s=19

Dohnjoe

One British official with knowledge of Barr’s wish list presented to London commented that “it is like nothing we have come across before, they are basically asking, in quite robust terms, for help in doing a hatchet job on their own intelligence services”.

Trump and Barr have also been asking other foreign governments for help in investigating the FBI, CIA and Mueller investigators. The US president has called on the Australian prime minister Scott Morrison for assistance, while the attorney general has been on similar missions to the UK and Italy.

Two weeks ago Giuseppe Conte, the Italian prime minister, revealed that Barr had visited his country twice in the previous two months, alongside John Durham, the Connecticut attorney he had appointed to lead his investigation, and had pressed for information about the activities of the US intelligence services.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-impeachment-inquiry-latest-russia-mueller-ukraine-zelensky-a9181641.html?utm_source=reddit.com

Insane stuff

26000 Elephants

Dohnjoe wrote: »

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-impeachment-inquiry-latest-russia-mueller-ukraine-zelensky-a9181641.html?utm_source=reddit.com

Insane stuff

The Italian prime minister is already on record as saying the same thing- Barr was asking him to frame US IC staff.

At least the Italian PM told him where he could stick his ludicrous conspiracy theories.


An AG doesnt get more anti American than that, in fairness.

marno21

Remember when Barr was appointed and people said he was one of the normal ones

That above there is beyond insane

AbusesToilets

[Deleted User] wrote: »

If the dems win next year I'm willing to bet that the Gop will be extremely concerned about the deficit all of a sudden.

4 years of obstruction to look forward to. It's the same hymn sheet they've been using for decades now. Drive up debt when they can, they decry government spending when they can't.

duploelabs

marno21 wrote: »

Remember when Barr was appointed and people said he was one of the normal ones

That above there is beyond insane

He was? All I recall about his appointment is how he's a dab hand at killing investigations like he's done previously for GHW Bush

26000 Elephants

TomOnBoard wrote: »

I don't yet get the sense that the shakeup in the Ukranian prosecutor's service is related to the Trump "Quid Pro Quo" allegations. I think that Zelinskyy's new regime may be trying to clean house in a part of the Ukranian Justice System that has been judged for over a decade as being patently corrupt. In any such house- cleaning, some things will naturally fall between stools and frankly, I reckon Ukraine has an awful lot more investigative need in relation to ongoing internal corruption and the undermining of its existence internally, than any need to further investigations for U.S. political advantage whether its for Democrat or Republican benefit.

I could be totally wrong, but I am not yet ready to judge any internal Ukranian action(s) as a Quid related to the US Quo...

I think there is another story brewing in this: theres mounting evidence that Trump pulled an earlier QPQ with Zelensky's predecessor Poroshenko to close the Manafort investigation in exchange for some javelin missiles.

I think the WaPo and MSNBC have done pieces in it. It seems at the time the Ukrainians were unhappy because an investigation into the so-called 'Black Ledger' (in which Manafort made several celebrity appearances) was moved from a largely independent investigation team (similar to Mueller) to one under direct political control.

The narrative around that sounds particularly resonant with the Zelensky call ("The next prosecutor will be 100 percent my person, my candidate, who will be approved by parliament and will start as a new prosecutor in September.” ) Prosecutors are supposed to be independent....

Outlaw Pete

26000 Elephants wrote: »

The Italian prime minister is already on record as saying the same thing- Barr was asking him to frame US IC staff.

Do you have a link to support that accusation, that Barr asked the Italian PM "to frame US IC staff"?

marno21 wrote: »

That above there is beyond insane

There is nothing "insane" about it - although I totally understand why the regulars on this thread would see it as such, seeing as you all bought into the Trump-Russia collusion nonsense for well over two years.

Those involved in the Durham-Barr investigation are simply doing what they should be doing and that is investigating the origins of the fit up that was the basis of the Crossfire Hurricane investigation. Just because some British official (no doubt with a dog in the race) parses the Durham-Barr team asking questions regarding the actions of the US intelligence officials, as them looking for "help in doing a hatchet job on their own intelligence services" doesn't make it bloody so.

End of the day, someone tasked Mifsud to say what he did to George P. He didn't do it for the craic. Neither did Downer then meet with him for the craic either. Someone was pulling these people's strings and given their ties to western intelligence, questions have to be asked what their motivations were.

The Durham-Barr team will soon speak with Brennan and Clapper also. Will that too be said to be them trying to fit up their own? Most likely, but it sure bloody ain't. Brennan's actions leading up to the 2016 election are extremely questionable and so answer questions on them he will.

For the past three years all we heard was how interfering with elections was wrong and full support was thrown behind Mueller and his team of legal eagle democrats. God forbid anyone questioned their motives during that time. Funny now though, how when it's officials with allegiances to the left that are in the crosshairs of justice, all that's changed, and you're all questioning the motives and integrity of DOJ officials. Now trying to uncover if there was nefarious undertakings by those in positions of power to affect the 2016 election results is "insane" - strange that.

Nothing the Barr-Durham team are doing is incorrect. It's one of the biggest scandals in political history. Whether you all want to accept it or not, individuals (some within the US Dept of Justice & Intelligence services and some with close ties to the DNC) went out of their way to ensure that there would be stories in the media in the run up to the 2016 election linking Trump with Putin.

Be it the Steele dossier or meetings members of the Trump campaign were to have with those claiming to have access to Hillary's emails, it didn't matter. Either would do, both would be better and it absolutely has to found out who it was that was behind orchestrating both of these things which amount to little more than scurrilous attempts to frame the Trump campaign and of course Trump himself.

All this pearl clutching over Trump apparently asking foreign countries for favours to win elections but yet clear examples of the DNC paying certain individuals who used foreign sources in their attempts to take down Trump in 2016 go ignored. In fact there is baulking at the very notion of investigating this stuff. FISA abuse, FBI/CIA officials leaking information to the media, and all with the goal of swaying how the public votes, and you turn a blind eye to that??

Something tells me there's gonna be a lot of eyes opened around here when the Horowitz and Durham investigations are complete but then again, the Mueller report falling flat on its face didn't result in too many of you questioning what had been the bs consensus for two years so maybe their findings won't either, even if it results in multiple indictments. None so blind and all that.

looksee

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-barr-italy/italy-pm-says-barrs-meetings-with-rome-intelligence-were-legitimate-idUSKBN1X22BV

The meetings were legitimate from the Italian point of view,

Prime Minister Giuseppe Conte on Wednesday confirmed that U.S. Attorney General William Barr held two secret meetings with Italian intelligence officers in Rome and described the encounters as “legal and correct”.

However, Conte told reporters the meetings, attended by Italy’s spy chief Gennaro Vecchione and other senior officials, had established that Italy had no information on the matter and was not involved in the investigation.

“The meetings were fully legal, correct and didn’t remotely harm our national interests,” Conte said

He also said

Barr wanted information on the conduct of U.S. intelligence officers based in Italy in 2016, Conte said.

The Italians said nothing to do with us, we know nothing.

So, you interpret it whichever way suits you...either Barr held secret meetings to gather dirt on US Intelligence staff, or he held secret meetings to er gather information on US Intelligence staff. You know, the way heads of state do go rooting around half a dozen other countries asking if their own Intelligence Staff are misbehaving.

FrostyJack

Outlaw Pete wrote:

All this pearl clutching over Trump apparently asking foreign countries for favours to win elections but yet clear examples of the DNC paying certain individuals who used foreign sources in their attempts to take down Trump in 2016 go ignored. In fact there is baulking at the very notion of investigating this stuff. FISA abuse, FBI/CIA officials leaking information to the media, and all with the goal of swaying how the public votes, and you turn a blind eye to that??

When this investigation, if it ever ends, comes back with nothing, as the whole origin of it is stuff of fantasy, are you going to admit you were dupped or will you disappear and deflect like you always do. Are you going to have your eyes opened that a man who has over 13000 proveable lies and a man like Bill Barr who has history of dishonestly defending Republican presidents, are not good people and completely corrupt?

Brian?

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

Do you have a link to support that accusation, that Barr asked the Italian PM "to frame US IC staff"?



There is nothing "insane" about it - although I totally understand why the regulars on this thread would see it as such, seeing as you all bought into the Trump-Russia collusion nonsense for well over two years.

Those involved in the Durham-Barr investigation are simply doing what they should be doing and that is investigating the origins of the fit up that was the basis of the Crossfire Hurricane investigation. Just because some British official (no doubt with a dog in the race) parses the Durham-Barr team asking questions regarding the actions of the US intelligence officials, as them looking for "help in doing a hatchet job on their own intelligence services" doesn't make it bloody so.

End of the day, someone tasked Mifsud to say what he did to George P. He didn't do it for the craic. Neither did Downer then meet with him for the craic either. Someone was pulling these people's strings and given their ties to western intelligence, questions have to be asked what their motivations were.

The Durham-Barr team will soon speak with Brennan and Clapper also. Will that too be said to be them trying to fit up their own? Most likely, but it sure bloody ain't. Brennan's actions leading up to the 2016 election are extremely questionable and so answer questions on them he will.

For the past three years all we heard was how interfering with elections was wrong and full support was thrown behind Mueller and his team of legal eagle democrats. God forbid anyone questioned their motives during that time. Funny now though, how when it's officials with allegiances to the left that are in the crosshairs of justice, all that's changed, and you're all questioning the motives and integrity of DOJ officials. Now trying to uncover if there was nefarious undertakings by those in positions of power to affect the 2016 election results is "insane" - strange that.

Nothing the Barr-Durham team are doing is incorrect. It's one of the biggest scandals in political history. Whether you all want to accept it or not, individuals (some within the US Dept of Justice & Intelligence services and some with close ties to the DNC) went out of their way to ensure that there would be stories in the media in the run up to the 2016 election linking Trump with Putin.

Be it the Steele dossier or meetings members of the Trump campaign were to have with those claiming to have access to Hillary's emails, it didn't matter. Either would do, both would be better and it absolutely has to found out who it was that was behind orchestrating both of these things which amount to little more than scurrilous attempts to frame the Trump campaign and of course Trump himself.

All this pearl clutching over Trump apparently asking foreign countries for favours to win elections but yet clear examples of the DNC paying certain individuals who used foreign sources in their attempts to take down Trump in 2016 go ignored. In fact there is baulking at the very notion of investigating this stuff. FISA abuse, FBI/CIA officials leaking information to the media, and all with the goal of swaying how the public votes, and you turn a blind eye to that??

Something tells me there's gonna be a lot of eyes opened around here when the Horowitz and Durham investigations are complete but then again, the Mueller report falling flat on its face didn't result in too many of you questioning what had been the bs consensus for two years so maybe their findings won't either, even if it results in multiple indictments. None so blind and all that.

Hey Pete. What’s your opinion on Trump withholding military aid until Ukraine promised announce an investigation into the Bidens?

PopePalpatine

Brian? wrote: »

Hey Pete. What’s your opinion on Trump withholding military aid until Ukraine promised announce an investigation into the Bidens?

Hold on, you need to wait until @PatriotPUA88 or whatever disseminates the party line.

Christy42

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

Do you have a link to support that accusation, that Barr asked the Italian PM "to frame US IC staff"?



There is nothing "insane" about it - although I totally understand why the regulars on this thread would see it as such, seeing as you all bought into the Trump-Russia collusion nonsense for well over two years.

Those involved in the Durham-Barr investigation are simply doing what they should be doing and that is investigating the origins of the fit up that was the basis of the Crossfire Hurricane investigation. Just because some British official (no doubt with a dog in the race) parses the Durham-Barr team asking questions regarding the actions of the US intelligence officials, as them looking for "help in doing a hatchet job on their own intelligence services" doesn't make it bloody so.

End of the day, someone tasked Mifsud to say what he did to George P. He didn't do it for the craic. Neither did Downer then meet with him for the craic either. Someone was pulling these people's strings and given their ties to western intelligence, questions have to be asked what their motivations were.

The Durham-Barr team will soon speak with Brennan and Clapper also. Will that too be said to be them trying to fit up their own? Most likely, but it sure bloody ain't. Brennan's actions leading up to the 2016 election are extremely questionable and so answer questions on them he will.

For the past three years all we heard was how interfering with elections was wrong and full support was thrown behind Mueller and his team of legal eagle democrats. God forbid anyone questioned their motives during that time. Funny now though, how when it's officials with allegiances to the left that are in the crosshairs of justice, all that's changed, and you're all questioning the motives and integrity of DOJ officials. Now trying to uncover if there was nefarious undertakings by those in positions of power to affect the 2016 election results is "insane" - strange that.

Nothing the Barr-Durham team are doing is incorrect. It's one of the biggest scandals in political history. Whether you all want to accept it or not, individuals (some within the US Dept of Justice & Intelligence services and some with close ties to the DNC) went out of their way to ensure that there would be stories in the media in the run up to the 2016 election linking Trump with Putin.

Be it the Steele dossier or meetings members of the Trump campaign were to have with those claiming to have access to Hillary's emails, it didn't matter. Either would do, both would be better and it absolutely has to found out who it was that was behind orchestrating both of these things which amount to little more than scurrilous attempts to frame the Trump campaign and of course Trump himself.

All this pearl clutching over Trump apparently asking foreign countries for favours to win elections but yet clear examples of the DNC paying certain individuals who used foreign sources in their attempts to take down Trump in 2016 go ignored. In fact there is baulking at the very notion of investigating this stuff. FISA abuse, FBI/CIA officials leaking information to the media, and all with the goal of swaying how the public votes, and you turn a blind eye to that??

Something tells me there's gonna be a lot of eyes opened around here when the Horowitz and Durham investigations are complete but then again, the Mueller report falling flat on its face didn't result in too many of you questioning what had been the bs consensus for two years so maybe their findings won't either, even if it results in multiple indictments. None so blind and all that.

The main leak before the election was about Hilary and hurt her chances a lot if I remember correctly.

Multiple indictments doesn't seem to have convinced you of the validity of Mueller's investigation. Why is it enough for this new investigation?

The Mueller report heavily suggested the only reason that Trump remained out of prison was that the US president is above the law. Hardly falling flat.

Again the main issue with Trump is that he is using presidential power as a trading tool for personal favours. Personal money. Go ahead and start your investigation. Public fund and using US foreign policy to benefit yourself instead of the US is a big no no. Remember all the hype about the allegations over Hilary's pay for play? Why is not a big deal now?

(Always interesting when people leave out that the Republicans ordered the Steele document)

aloyisious

The DOJ Inspector General's [Horowitz] report into the way the DOJ & FBI got the 4 FISA warrants to use against Carter Page is due out soon, over the next few days apparently. He's submitted it to the DOJ for review. According to Rep. Jim Jordan (R-OH), top Republican on the House Oversight and Reform Committee, the report will find the warrants were obtained illegally. If it does as JJ seems to have been lead to believe, I can see it being used by the AG against the present investigation.

rossie1977

Deleted User wrote: »

If the dems win next year I'm willing to bet that the Gop will be extremely concerned about the deficit all of a sudden.

Labour participation rate as well. Obama got killed for this every month the jobs reports came out and its remained 62-63% since Trump became president.

We also never hear of the supposed 94 million out of work now either even though that's a increased since 2016..

Unemployment was 4.7% when Obama left and Dow at record levels so those stats shouldn't effect 2020 election if they didn't effect 16 one

aloyisious

Brian? wrote: »

Hey Pete. What’s your opinion on Trump withholding military aid until Ukraine promised announce an investigation into the Bidens?

On a different take looking at 26000 elephants mention of an earlier QPQ to Poroshenko from Don of Javelin missiles to scrub the investigation into Manafort, I can see why Don cancelled QPQ 1. The Russians wouldn't be happy with Ukraine having javelins then and all three parties would know how important they would be in QPQ 2 to Ukraine as a battlefield infantry weapon against Russian armour. The US are testing a new one-man longer-range [4.5 Km] version with better optical-control now in Jordan.

It'd be useful as a specific pointer for the average GOP member to see how far Don was prepared to go to get info on Joe Biden that he would enable Russia in its bid to destroy an independent Ukraine.

26000 Elephants

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

Do you have a link to support that accusation, that Barr asked the Italian PM "to frame US IC staff"?

Sure, if you promise you wont play any semantic games, Iike saying "that article only says he tried to get information about the activities of IC in Italy (despite that he would have access to these records from his own office so the only motive would be to engineer a scenario where he could charge the IC with acting outside their remit) and does not say 'Frame'!!"

Ok?

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/23/world/europe/italy-trump-conspiracy-conte.html

everlast75

We are now on the "it wasn't quid pro quo" because there wasn't an investigation

https://twitter.com/brithume/status/1190718939862642694?s=19

So.... attempted murder isn't a crime?

26000 Elephants

everlast75 wrote: »

We are now on the "it wasn't quid pro quo" because there wasn't an investigation

https://twitter.com/brithume/status/1190718939862642694?s=19

So.... attempted murder isn't a crime?

To quote Sideshow Bob:

"Nobody ever got a Nobel prize for attempted chemistry" :-)