Donald Trump Presidency discussion Thread VI

aloyisious

Don won't appear live before a committee to answer questions, even from his own party members on the committee who are doing their best to ensure his actions get the best defence they can throw at him, like: Mr President, what do you mean by "do the right thing" when you are talking to President Zelensky across the media airwaves, what exactly is the right thing you wanted him to do?

In respect to Ukraine, the OMB, by order of President Trump, put a hold on US funds being provided by the Senate as part of the Senate Republican Party policy to help Ukraine's Govt and people defend themselves and their country's national integrity from further Russian invasion and aggression. Don and his supporters say he did it to ensure the funds were being spent properly and not being used by corrupt Ukraine politicians, that they wanted to see the colour of Zelensky's cloth as it were. They knew from their own witnesses on the ground that their hold on the funds was being paid for in Ukrainian blood. A lot of the input from Don's committee supporters and party friends has been about the denial by the Obama Administration to provide weaponry to Ukraine [Blankets and MRE's only] for self-defence purposes totally blanking that that was what his "hold the funds" policy was resulting in.

They also knew, or should have been able to figure out, that the money would come straight back to the US state coffers through the purchase of US armaments that Don, peculiarly enough has been promoting around the world as the best ever, with the added bonus that the sales would keep up and increase US sale and employment figures. So a question for Don [maybe from his own party] should be "Mr President, did you know what regional power would directly benefit from your chosen policy [in contradiction to that of your own party] to deny Ukraine funds for it's national self-defence"? but I don't see the GOP asking that question across the open floor of a committee room, with or without him being there. The silence from that quarter is deafening.

drunkmonkey

Overheal wrote: »

My right wing of social media insists Trump is innocent unless there’s an audio recording of him breathing into a microphone and admitting to high crimes.

My no wing uncencored media also says he's innocent. It's an awful pity the mainstream media is so fake and I'm talking about about both sides when I say that. Most people don't know there's life outside what Google feeds them. Hence we end up with Shifty the hero and a burst balloon.

Gbear

PropJoe10 wrote: »

One of the great beliefs of the Trump base is that it doesn't matter what Trump does because "What about Hillary?" "What about Hunter Biden?" "What about everyone else in the world?" They seem to feel that there's a moral equivalency for everything so basically everyone is at it, meaning that everyone can do whatever they like.

Another another amusing aspect is the right wing or pseudo-centrist talking point about how the left are all about cultural and mortal relativism.

Trump has clearly exposed the total lack of morals or principles in the right. Their sole interest is the dominance of hierarchy.

Gwen Cooper

drunkmonkey wrote: »

My no wing uncencored media also says he's innocent. It's an awful pity the mainstream media is so fake and I'm talking about about both sides when I say that. Most people don't know there's life outside what Google feeds them. Hence we end up with Shifty the hero and a burst balloon.

I'm not saying you're wrong, but I have yet to see any media that's "no wing". The ones presenting themselves as independent/not biased usually turn out to be extremely biased. Can I have a link to some no wing sources please?

pixelburp

drunkmonkey wrote: »

My no wing uncencored media also says he's innocent. It's an awful pity the mainstream media is so fake and I'm talking about about both sides when I say that. Most people don't know there's life outside what Google feeds them. Hence we end up with Shifty the hero and a burst balloon.

Please provide your sources; if you're going to claim they're "no wing", then at least have the gumption to give them. You're putting yourself out there a tad by claiming impartiality while making a clichéd knock at "mainstream" media, so put your money where your mouth is. It's a reasonable request

Overheal

drunkmonkey wrote: »

My no wing uncencored media also says he's innocent.

Got a link?

Overheal

aloyisious wrote: »

Don won't appear live before a committee to answer questions, even from his own party members on the committee who are doing their best to ensure his actions get the best defence they can throw at him, like: Mr President, what do you mean by "do the right thing" when you are talking to President Zelensky across the media airwaves, what exactly is the right thing you wanted him to do?

In respect to Ukraine, the OMB, by order of President Trump, put a hold on US funds being provided by the Senate as part of the Senate Republican Party policy to help Ukraine's Govt and people defend themselves and their country's national integrity from further Russian invasion and aggression. Don and his supporters say he did it to ensure the funds were being spent properly and not being used by corrupt Ukraine politicians, that they wanted to see the colour of Zelensky's cloth as it were. They knew from their own witnesses on the ground that their hold on the funds was being paid for in Ukrainian blood. A lot of the input from Don's committee supporters and party friends has been about the denial by the Obama Administration to provide weaponry to Ukraine [Blankets and MRE's only] for self-defence purposes totally blanking that that was what his "hold the funds" policy was resulting in.

They also knew, or should have been able to figure out, that the money would come straight back to the US state coffers through the purchase of US armaments that Don, peculiarly enough has been promoting around the world as the best ever, with the added bonus that the sales would keep up and increase US sale and employment figures. So a question for Don [maybe from his own party] should be "Mr President, did you know what regional power would directly benefit from your chosen policy [in contradiction to that of your own party] to deny Ukraine funds for it's national self-defence"? but I don't see the GOP asking that question across the open floor of a committee room, with or without him being there. The silence from that quarter is deafening.

Well think about what they’re doing: the GOP members of the committee thus far have tried to push for the same dirt-digging investigation into the Bidens from the dais as Trump was trying to get from the Ukrainians. How can they defend or condemn Trumps actions while they are acting complicitly?

peddlelies

drunkmonkey wrote: »

My no wing uncencored media also says he's innocent. It's an awful pity the mainstream media is so fake and I'm talking about about both sides when I say that. Most people don't know there's life outside what Google feeds them. Hence we end up with Shifty the hero and a burst balloon.

Give up Breitbart, reddit and whatever else for a month and only use a neutral source like thehill.com and you'll start to see things for what they are.

I don't mean to be smart or insulting but they literally spin everything to the point of brainwashing. What Breitbart does is take one snippet which may be deemed neutral or positive and use that as the headline while ignoring 99% of stuff that's negative. Look at the current headline



I'd even recommend the drudge report which is currently being slammed by Trump supporters simply for reporting the actual news in a non rabid partisan manner. Obviously it's right leaning but when it comes to important issues like impeachment Matt Drudge does a good and imo fairly honest job on linking to the important stories.

PropJoe10

Gbear wrote: »

Another another amusing aspect is the right wing or pseudo-centrist talking point about how the left are all about cultural and mortal relativism.

Trump has clearly exposed the total lack of morals or principles in the right. Their sole interest is the dominance of hierarchy.

Yep, and this is all coming from a party that's meant to be all about America First, and traditional values. Remarkable. They've all turned into Trump's bit**es, it's too late for them to change course now.

PropJoe10

This David Holmes guy isn't holding back either.

DrumSteve

I feel like this lad isnt going to be having any of Devin Nunes today.

MadYaker

drunkmonkey wrote: »

My no wing uncencored media also says he's innocent. It's an awful pity the mainstream media is so fake and I'm talking about about both sides when I say that. Most people don't know there's life outside what Google feeds them. Hence we end up with Shifty the hero and a burst balloon.

Or ya know we could just watch the live stream of the hearings and make our own minds up no media necessary. I’m pretty sure that’s what most people in this thread do. You can point fingers at the Bidens and the media all you want but it’s laughable at this stage. This mess is entirely of Donny’s own making and do you really think that if the Biden’s had real questions answer the republicans wouldn’t be investigating? It’s a distraction if it were anything else the republicans would be using it as more than a bullish!t talking point.

Dohnjoe

drunkmonkey wrote: »

It's an awful pity the mainstream media is so fake

"The mainstream media is fake"

-Conspiracy theorists
-The Kremlin
-The far right
-Every dictator ever
-Trump and Trump supporters

PropJoe10

Fiona Hill is already extremely impressive. I can't see her taking any crap from Nunes/Jordan either.

Dohnjoe

Dohnjoe wrote: »

"The mainstream media is fake"

-Conspiracy theorists
-The Kremlin
-The far right
-Every dictator ever
-Trump and Trump supporters

There is a saying regarding arguing with certain people and playing chess with a pigeon that applies to that list.

sid waddell

What have the Republicans done to stop Russian inteference in 2020?

Anything?

I can't say I recall them doing anything to stop it, and I can certainly recall them making several moves which make it more likely.

So I think it would be fair to say the Republicans will be actively encouraging Russian interference in 2020, yes?

PropJoe10

sid waddell wrote: »

What have the Republicans done to stop Russian inteference in 2020?

Anything?

I can't say I recall them doing anything to stop it, and I can certainly recall them making several moves which make it more likely.

So I think it would be fair to say the Republicans will be actively encouraging Russian interference in 2020, yes?

Yep. Sure even Trump has actively encouraged Russia to interfere in the past, and openly said that he'd be open to a foreign government providing dirt on opponents. He said this in the George Stephanopolous interview.

AtomicHorror

drunkmonkey wrote: »

I don't think people will get what your on about, CNN are doing the editing here again today. Can't have anyone looking bad that's a Democrat. Unreal. This is why you can't believe mainstream media.

The whole thing is live-streamed. The only editing are the different graphics for each network.

Example:

CNN Chyron: "Sondland: I followed the orders of the president"
FOX Chyron: "LOOK OVER THERE WHAT IS THAT, A GHOST?"

Sure, some folks are watching the highlights later on "television". Mostly Trump supporters.

Overheal

Let’s be clear about that: Fox News is far and away leading ratings now in the impeachment livestream. So they have the most potential to influence events with graphics clips and punditry. Which, I would argue, is now why they’re so watched: most people want to see how Trump’s world will react to the news, how they will spin it, what the next colorful chyron about a witness’ credibility is. One half is doing this out of amazement, the other is doing this because they need to know from their television heroes that this is all fake news and everything will be alright if they just cover their eyes and ears

AtomicHorror

Overheal wrote: »

Let’s be clear about that: Fox News is far and away leading ratings now in the impeachment livestream. So they have the most potential to influence events with graphics clips and punditry. Which, I would argue, is now why they’re so watched: most people want to see how Trump’s world will react to the news, how they will spin it, what the next colorful chyron about a witness’ credibility is. One half is doing this out of amazement, the other is doing this because they need to know from their television heroes that this is all fake news and everything will be alright if they just cover their eyes and ears

Well they carried footage of the GOPs post-hearing press-conference and billed it as a celebratory outcome or something. So that's what you're up against.

Hard to see how any vaguely objective viewer would call yesterday anything less than a nightmare for Trump and his defenders. They seemed to have been entirely blindsided by Sondland, and Cooper's emails were the icing on the cake.

everlast75

Fiona Hill is making the very valid point that saying anyone else other than Russia interfered in the US elections means that you are covering for them. You are acting in Russia's defence. That means you are an asset to Russia, ie a Russian Asset.

And she's basically telling that to the Republicans' faces.

everlast75

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1197503790729121794?s=20

But Hillary something something deplorables....

Outlaw Pete

Igotadose wrote: »

I call bullsh1t. What potentially illegal behaviour are you talking about, considering that during the period in question, the GOP controlled the Presidency and both houses of Congress, the DOJ and FBI, and 'all sorts of ....behaviour' has resulted in what, zero arrests and indictments related to Ukraine?

You can call "bull****" on it all you like, but that won't make a hill of beans of difference.

Inspector General Horowitz's report on the Trump-Russia investigation will be released Dec 9th and he will testify before the Senate Judiciary Committee on Dec 11th.


https://twitter.com/dcexaminer/status/1196574657954144258

And of course, John Durham's criminal inquiry is underway also ..

Understandable though that you (and most of the left) would feel that it's all bull though given that mainstream media have been referring to much of what they have been investigating as resulting from right wing conspiracy theorists and of course suggesting that AG Barr is merely indulging the President. Far from it. Barr is well aware of what has gone on and of course, the mainstream media's role in it all.


https://twitter.com/thehill/status/1195528246617690113

everlast75

https://twitter.com/MSignorile/status/1197550550268690432?s=19

Speculation, but before Nixon resigned a number of Republican senators paid him a visit and told him they would vote against him

aloyisious

Watching the CNN host and guest panel discussing what has happened at the hearings, I can honestly say the man on the right is better at obfuscation than the GOP committee members are.

everlast75

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

You can call "bull****" on it all you like, but that won't make a hill of beans of difference.

Inspector General Horowitz's report on the Trump-Russia investigation will be released Dec 9th and he will testify before the Senate Judiciary Committee on Dec 11th.


https://twitter.com/dcexaminer/status/1196574657954144258

And of course, John Durham's criminal inquiry is underway also ..

Understandable though that you (and most of the left) would feel that it's all bull though given that mainstream media have been referring to much of what they have been investigating as resulting from right wing conspiracy theorists and of course suggesting that AG Barr is merely indulging the President. Far from it. Barr is well aware of what has gone on and of course, the mainstream media's role in it all.


https://twitter.com/thehill/status/1195528246617690113

Barr lied through his teeth about the mueller report.

That is a fact.

Spin it all you want, but the dog on the street knows Barr does what Trump wants.

TomOnBoard

everlast75 wrote: »

Barr lied through his teeth about the mueller report.

That is a fact.

Spin it all you want, but the dog on the street knows Barr does what Trump wants.

Pete is obviously throwing in the towel in respect of providing fact-based defence of Trump's bribery and attempts to strong-arm Zekinskyy in Ukraine and wants to deflect us from the Republican **** show performance at the hearings. So he's now trying to move discussion on to yet another bright and shiny object that doesn't even exist in a public form yet, i.e. a report from lying AG Barr designed to undermine the Mueller investigation..

Don't follow his spotlight... Stick with the real truth- finding that is happening before our eyes on Capitol Hill...

Igotadose

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

You can call "bull****" on it all you like, but that won't make a hill of beans of difference.

Inspector General Horowitz's report on the Trump-Russia investigation will be released Dec 9th and he will testify before the Senate Judiciary Committee on Dec 11th.


https://twitter.com/dcexaminer/status/1196574657954144258

And of course, John Durham's criminal inquiry is underway also ..

So, my calling of bullsh!t stands, until you actually have something. A bunch of investigations, no reports, nada.

Understandable though that you (and most of the left) would feel that it's all bull though given that mainstream media have been referring to much of what they have been investigating as resulting from right wing conspiracy theorists and of course suggesting that AG Barr is merely indulging the President. Far from it. Barr is well aware of what has gone on and of course, the mainstream media's role in it all.

So, hyperbole, no facts. Pretty much what we've seen from the tGOP since Obama got elected. Barr speaking in front of the embarrasingly named Federalist society means zip. Zero. Nada.


https://twitter.com/thehill/status/1195528246617690113[/QUOTE]

marno21

Surely if Trump was as innocent as his fans would like you to believe the Republicans would have a better strategy than having Nunes look like a clown the whole time and resort to constantly trying to windup the chairman and having Gym Jordan shouting at witnesses, becoming more aggressive and loud the more credible the witness?

Outlaw Pete

everlast75 wrote: »

Barr lied through his teeth about the mueller report.

The Mueller Report which gave credence to a dossier which had Russian sources. Sources which claimed Trump paid prostitutes to pee on a bed Michelle Obama slept in. And yet the left pearl clutch about Trump trying to dig up dirt on the Bidens, when all he did was ask for real events to be looked into? I would think the former was a better example of that than the latter. In fact the Steele Dossier wasn't just digging up dirt, it was fabricating it.

As for George P and Mifsud, and who was behind that, guess we'll soon see, but someone tasked him and that someone had a clear motive to link the Trump campaign with the Kremlin. Don't bother bringing up the Trump Tower meeting as it's a nothing burger. Always was, always will be.

As to Barr lying? Give me a break. Trump did not conspire with Russians to influence the 2016 election. He committed no crime and despite that the democrats, and the left, claimed he tried to obstruct an investigation into a crime which didn't even take place.

This is all about framing Donald Trump. Has been since the get-go. The left just despise the him and will do anything to remove him from office. They pretend to care about Ukraine but yet where were they when Ukraine needed lethal aid? Where's their outrage at FBI leaks? Where's their outrage at Ukrainians meddling in 2016? Where's the outrage at anything the left do? Nowhere, that's where.

Barr has integrity and will expose the truth of what has really been going on over the last three years while the left and the MSM were focused on trying to oust Trump from office as they painted him as everything from a treasonous racist, to a broke rapist.