Donald Trump Presidency discussion Thread VI

ct5amr2ig1nfhp

AOC, Ilhan Omar, Rashida Tlaib and Ayanna Pressley are about to give a press conference in response to Trump.

PropJoe10

Sean Melodic Comb wrote: »

"Go back to where you came from"...
...Spikes in numbers of death threats received whenever the president criticizes Omar....
..It doesn't matter if people think he's racist because lots of people agree with him (paraphrasing trump)...
...1 percenter bikers celebrating trump...
...Pence touring illegal immigrants in outrageous conditions, saying it's tough but necessary...

My perception of the situation has suddenly shifted. Been bemused, wondering at the idiocy and sh!tness of the president and his followers. Thinking it's a protest anger thing, a reaction to having a black president, things will swing back the other way much further in the next term.

Maybe that's true but in my mind something has changed. The threat of political violence - the openness of the racism and brutality - the fanatical supporters... All this is crystallizing into something more frightening than a shambling oaf that got lucky and a bunch of angry rednecks.

You're not wrong. It is absolutely vital that the Dems get their act together and defeat Trump emphatically at the ballot box in 2020. The future of the USA might depend on it.

Headshot

AOC is a very impressive woman, she didnt have to read any notes but yet was very clear and precise.

She seems to always comes across so well.

greenfield21

To the posters on here talking about the inevitable crash under Trump's policies, surely when that time comes will there not be a further swing to the right of center? What happens with people during a downturn? They become less tolerant, more nationalism etc. I know after the GR this didn't really happen but we had bailouts qe and low interests, next time we may have run out of ammo.

I think people need to be careful what they wish for on the economy. A downturn may not be good for trump personally but it could further the cause of nationalism. Interesting times.

EltonJohn69

AOC really is the best speaker in the Democratic Party

InTheShadows

EltonJohn69 wrote: »

AOC really is the best speaker in the Democratic Party

Highly unlikable character tbh. Her stunt at the border with the fake crying was pathetic.

FartyBlartFast

greenfield21 wrote: »

To the posters on here talking about the inevitable crash under Trump's policies, surely when that time comes will there not be a further swing to the right of center? What happens with people during a downturn? They become less tolerant, more nationalism etc. I know after the GR this didn't really happen but we had bailouts qe and low interests, next time we may have run out of ammo.

I think people need to be careful what they wish for on the economy. A downturn may not be good for trump personally but it could further the cause of nationalism. Interesting times.

To be honest if the past is anythi g to go by, in the event of a national financial crisis they'll likely turn democrat, the economy will improve and stabilise, then republicans will offer them free money (which will only go to the ultra wealthy) and the same fools will lap it up as they do seemingly every time.

Mind you, unemployment in the US is at something like 35-40%, which isn't good. That figure isn't mine either, it is as per Trump himself and his own supporters.

FartyBlartFast

InTheShadows wrote: »

EltonJohn69 wrote: »

AOC really is the best speaker in the Democratic Party

Highly unlikable character tbh. Her stunt at the border with the fake crying was pathetic.

I'm not overly familiar with her, but drawing attention to little children getting flung into concentration camps isn't something that tur s me off a person.

One of the few things I have seen her speaking with was this, which struck me as being a long way from 'unlikeable'.

I am also more than open to being corrected on this, but am quite sure I have read that she had zero corporate funding for her campaign, and managed it while also working as a waitress. Relative to to almost every other politician in the entire US (on either side of the aisle), that again is quote hard not to like.

What would you suggest might make her more likeable?

s7ryf3925pivug

FartyBlartFast wrote: »

greenfield21 wrote: »

Mind you, unemployment in the US is at something like 35-40%, which isn't good. That figure isn't mine either, it is as per Trump himself and his own supporters.

It’s less than 4% according to google. Trump and his supporters are not credible sources obviously.

peddlelies

FartyBlartFast wrote: »

What would you suggest might make her more likeable?

Perhaps not mocking victims of the holocaust claiming border detention centers are akin to concentration camps?

I'm not overly familiar with her, but drawing attention to little children getting flung into concentration camps isn't something that tur s me off a person.

Oh wait. Nevermind.

FartyBlartFast

Sean Melodic Comb wrote: »

FartyBlartFast wrote: »

greenfield21 wrote: »

Mind you, unemployment in the US is at something like 35-40%, which isn't good. That figure isn't mine either, it is as per Trump himself and his own supporters.

It’s less than 4% according to google. Trump and his supporters are not credible sources obviously.

The prob e is, that is it the metric Trump and his supporters weigh unemoyment on, which they made clear to. E and again during the 2016 election.

As per them and him, it was 40% back then. Statistics showing around 4-5% were false an inaccurate, alps as per Trump and his supporters. Which has not changed a lot in the 2.5 years since.

Edit: linky - https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2015/09/28/trump_unemployment_rate_as_high_as_40.html

Brian?

InTheShadows wrote: »

Highly unlikable character tbh. Her stunt at the border with the fake crying was pathetic.

Fake crying. That’s beyond cynical.

You can criticise her on policy all you want, but why make stuff up to have a dig at her. There didn’t look to be anything fake about it.

Hurrache

peddlelies wrote: »

Perhaps not mocking victims of the holocaust claiming border detention centers are akin to concentration camps?

Jesus.

Sir Oxman

Absolutely correct response by the four women.


He is distracting from something (or everything)

aloyisious

Ref Don tweeting about AOC & the other Dem congresswomen, I hope they take it carefully and don't fall for his bait. He's trying to provoke them into a public spat and distract from his failings and whatever may be uncovered during the current investigations into his acquaintances.

On another front very relative to Ireland and Don's interference in UK Govt politics/election, I'm hoping that BJ loses out in the UK Con leadership vote as he's as shifty as hell, in more ways than one. The vote result will be in on the 22nd. If BJ loses, Don will probably throw the tantrum of the decade and the "special relationship" between the US and the UK may take an even bigger hit. If the UK police inquiry into the ambassadors diplomatic email leak find's a provable source linked to some-one not approving of T May [say some-one with Foreign Office service] the gap between both Govts may be very difficult when it comes to the appointing and acceptance of a new ambassador from London, esp if Jeremy Hunt gets the leadership & PM's job.

FartyBlartFast

peddlelies wrote: »

FartyBlartFast wrote: »

What would you suggest might make her more likeable?

Perhaps not mocking victims of the holocaust claiming border detention centers are akin to concentration camps?

I'm not overly familiar with her, but drawing attention to little children getting flung into concentration camps isn't something that tur s me off a person.

Oh wait. Nevermind.

You might want to have a go at the other people saying these are concentration camps too. You know, the ones who actually lived in concentration camps. Like this one, who said it is very much like Auschwitz where she was kept, and who very much says it's because of their Ra e that this is happening to these children.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/holocaust-survivor-yes-the-border-detention-centers-are-like-concentration-camps

Bloch said the conditions reported at the border camps sound painfully similar to her own. “It’s the same conditions I lived through—we never had soap, but we had water, cold water, and not necessarily a shower. No toilet paper. It was inhuman.”

“[In concentration camps] people have no control over their lives,” she continued. “You have to go to sleep when the light goes out, you have to eat when they want you to eat. You can’t express your own thoughts, because you might get penalized for that.”

- - -

It's mainly because of their (the migrants) color and where they’re coming from. But as a rule, humans are not very nice. People like to always look down on somebody else,” she said. “Instead of when you look down to pull that person up, they shove them down more. They don’t want to identify as human beings with those people and that’s a bad attitude. But it’s a human thing.”

Or better again, this one that Trump supporters have mocked time and again:

https://mobile.twitter.com/GeorgeTakei/status/1141174822619242496?ref_src=twsrc^tfw|twcamp^tweetembed|twterm^1141174822619242496&ref_url=https://www.huffpost.com/entry/george-takei-concentration-camps_n_5d0be29fe4b0aa375f49b69f

peddlelies

Hurrache wrote: »

Jesus.

Jesus and pretend to act surprised all you want about it. Using that term the first thing that comes to mind is Nazi concentration camps. Those people on the border weren't rounded up by some US militant group and forced to be there on some grand scheme of genocide, they came by their own free will. Nobody is being executed or forced to do hard labour. The detention centers are overrun and there's no reason not to believe that the vast majority of border patrol are decent hard working people.

It's a lazy insensitive comparison but not surprising given all the anti-semitic tones coming from that corner of the Democrat party.

Manic Moran

Headshot wrote: »

AOC is a very impressive woman, she didnt have to read any notes but yet was very clear and precise.

She seems to always comes across so well.

She does, but there are two catches.

One, as Biden, Pelosi and others have correctly observed, she does no favours to the party on the national level. She doubtlessly represents her constituents faithfully, honestly, and to the best of her abilities, but what passes for 'good' in New York City is not always going to match in the Mid-West: The attention she is getting is a point of serious concern as her policies are being conflated with the policies of the Democrat establishment as a whole. The Democrat coming across the news and facebook feeds of someone in, say, Kentucky, is more likely to be AOC than Amy McGrath, but McGrath is far closer to the sort of person who a Kentucky voter will vote for. Although Trump is very much embarrassing himself with this latest batch of tweets, it does have the effect of, again, putting folks like AOC and Omar in front of the more rural mid-western voters, not the people that the Democrats want them to be focusing on.

Second, she's letting her inexperience show, or at least her enthusiasm get the better of it. I can't recall the last time Pelosi put her foot in her mouth in the same manner as AOC saying that NYC would be able to use the billions of tax cuts from Amazon on something else, and she didn't come out great in exchange against former ICE director Tom Homan this week either: She asked questions which had obvious responses she should have anticipated. (That hearing seems to have been something of a crap-show, honestly. Did you catch the full exchange between Homan and Garcia?)

It seems that the Republican counterpart to AOC, in terms of social media savvy and publicity, is co-freshman Dan Crenshaw. He's not getting much time on the news, presumably because Trump's not attacking him, but he is quite prolific with the tweets, live-streams and youtube videos, he's crossing my feed a lot recently. He's the most-followed Republican on Twitter. Here's his most recent video, on the NDAA. It hits the various social media bases fairly well. It's short, to the point, in plain english, and casually presented. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hNiVX5ccbAw . I expect, much as AOC has managed to do to revitalise a lot of the youth vote in the Democrat side, folks like Crenshaw will be doing the same on the Republican side. The balance of power between the old guard (Pelosi/McConnel etc) and the new guard will eventually change to the new generation, but it won't be for one side onlly.

FartyBlartFast

peddlelies wrote: »

[Using that term the first thing that comes to mind is Nazi concentration camps.

Thats probably because as per Nazi concentration camp survivors, these children are being thrown into concentration camps.

peddlelies

aloyisious wrote: »

Ref Don tweeting about AOC & the other Dem congresswomen, I hope they take it carefully and don't fall for his bait. He's trying to provoke them into a public spat and distract from his failings and whatever may be uncovered during the current investigations into his acquaintances.

It was political idiocy. Pelosi and that wing of the Dems were already publicly fighting and it was just heating up with the aoc NYT article, then Trump tweets garbage sticking his nose in and now they're reunited against him.

What goes on in that head of his is anyone's guess.

ChikiChiki

EltonJohn69 wrote: »

AOC really is the best speaker in the Democratic Party

She is very impressive and connecting with a lot of people through simple language. A bold prediction but I would put money on her being America's first female president.

For a newbie she is unfazed by DC and you would think she has years of experience on Capitol Hill. Amazing really and the haters still throw "cocktail waitress" jibes at her as if she is unqualified to be there.

Professor Moriarty

Manic Moran wrote: »

She does, but there are two catches.

One, as Biden, Pelosi and others have correctly observed, she does no favours to the party on the national level. She doubtlessly represents her constituents faithfully, honestly, and to the best of her abilities, but what passes for 'good' in New York City is not always going to match in the Mid-West: The attention she is getting is a point of serious concern as her policies are being conflated with the policies of the Democrat establishment as a whole. The Democrat coming across the news and facebook feeds of someone in, say, Kentucky, is more likely to be AOC than Amy McGrath, but McGrath is far closer to the sort of person who a Kentucky voter will vote for. Although Trump is very much embarrassing himself with this latest batch of tweets, it does have the effect of, again, putting folks like AOC and Omar in front of the more rural mid-western voters, not the people that the Democrats want them to be focusing on.

Second, she's letting her inexperience show, or at least her enthusiasm get the better of it. I can't recall the last time Pelosi put her foot in her mouth in the same manner as AOC saying that NYC would be able to use the billions of tax cuts from Amazon on something else, and she didn't come out great in exchange against former ICE director Tom Homan this week either: She asked questions which had obvious responses she should have anticipated. (That hearing seems to have been something of a crap-show, honestly. Did you catch the full exchange between Homan and Garcia?)

It seems that the Republican counterpart to AOC, in terms of social media savvy and publicity, is co-freshman Dan Crenshaw. He's not getting much time on the news, presumably because Trump's not attacking him, but he is quite prolific with the tweets, live-streams and youtube videos, he's crossing my feed a lot recently. He's the most-followed Republican on Twitter.

Crenshaw seems about as intelligent as Trump. Once I read that they're climate change deniers, I dismiss them as populist Trump wannabes.

peddlelies

FartyBlartFast wrote: »

Thats probably because as per Nazi concentration camp survivors, these children are being thrown into concentration camps.

That sentence/logic doesn't make any sense. Believe what you want, you're not going to change my opinion on the matter.

mcmoustache

Headshot wrote: »

AOC is a very impressive woman, she didnt have to read any notes but yet was very clear and precise.

She seems to always comes across so well.

On some subjects, sure. But her suggestion that Pelosi had racist motivations when telling the Dems to cut the infighting and be more disciplined showed that she still has a lot to learn.


I don't mind what she stands for but throwing around accusations of racism like that isn't on.

Hurrache

peddlelies wrote: »

Jesus and pretend to act surprised all you want about it.

Only thing I'm surprised about is there's people like you regurgitating such rubbish.

Even the ADL themselves say you're talking nonsense.

peddlelies

ChikiChiki wrote: »

A bold prediction but I would put money on her being America's first female president.

Bold indeed considering how badly she polls, even in her home state.

FartyBlartFast

Manic Moran wrote: »

Headshot wrote: »

AOC is a very impressive woman, she didnt have to read any notes but yet was very clear and precise.

She seems to always comes across so well.

She does, but there are two catches.

One, as Biden, Pelosi and others have correctly observed, she does no favours to the party on the national level. She doubtlessly represents her constituents faithfully, honestly, and to the best of her abilities, but what passes for 'good' in New York City is not always going to match in the Mid-West: The attention she is getting is a point of serious concern as her policies are being conflated with the policies of the Democrat establishment as a whole. The Democrat coming across the news and facebook feeds of someone in, say, Kentucky, is more likely to be AOC than Amy McGrath, but McGrath is far closer to the sort of person who a Kentucky voter will vote for. Although Trump is very much embarrassing himself with this latest batch of tweets, it does have the effect of, again, putting folks like AOC and Omar in front of the more rural mid-western voters, not the people that the Democrats want them to be focusing on.

Second, she's letting her inexperience show, or at least her enthusiasm get the better of it. I can't recall the last time Pelosi put her foot in her mouth in the same manner as AOC saying that NYC would be able to use the billions of tax cuts from Amazon on something else, and she didn't come out great in exchange against former ICE director Tom Homan this week either: She asked questions which had obvious responses she should have anticipated. (That hearing seems to have been something of a crap-show, honestly. Did you catch the full exchange between Homan and Garcia?)

It seems that the Republican counterpart to AOC, in terms of social media savvy and publicity, is co-freshman Dan Crenshaw. He's not getting much time on the news, presumably because Trump's not attacking him, but he is quite prolific with the tweets, live-streams and youtube videos, he's crossing my feed a lot recently. He's the most-followed Republican on Twitter. Here's his most recent video, on the NDAA. It hits the various social media bases fairly well. It's short, to the point, in plain english, and casually presented. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hNiVX5ccbAw . I expect, much as AOC has managed to do to revitalise a lot of the youth vote in the Democrat side, folks like Crenshaw will be doing the same on the Republican side. The balance of power between the old guard (Pelosi/McConnel etc) and the new guard will change to the new generation, but it won't be for one side onlly.

The problem with this line of thinking is that following it through to its conclusion means everyone just shuts up and says nothing.

If AOC speaking up is going to turn off Midwest voters, 5hen she should be quiet. But McGrath speaking up would alienate coastal voters, so she should keep quiet. Biden speaking up might out off poorer voters, so he should be quiet. And sanders or warren speaking up might scare off wealthier voters and donors, so they should be quiet. And so on.

There is in my opinion nothing wrong with disagreement within parties - the opposite actually. It shows that sides are being represented by their representatives, and leads to working toward resolution and something both sides can be happy with (ideally). I would take that every day of the week over what has happened to the republican party in the last 2-3 years, which has turned into an echo chamber where any even marginally dissenting voice is ocstracised and ousted, and must be destroyed by their supposed peers. Justin amash is a very recent example of this, only a week or two back.

History has taught us that that kind of carry on typically does not end well.

Danzy

He wants the Dems to rally around AOC and her squad, rather than been cut adrift as Pelosi was aiming for.

Electorally they are toxic nation wide, even among Democrats, tytying them close to the party and vice versa and getting them lots of airtime makes sense.

It is cynical but he knows how they'll react and is using that to damage the Dems long term, his completely focused on 2020.

His job is to keep the Squad in the limelight and on the news, make them the face of the Dems.

If he does that he'll win and do long term damage to the Democrats.

relax carry on

Jesus, Trump's twitter dumps are particularly bad at the moment. He's doubling and trebling down on his racist rhetoric.

It's almost as if he'd cause civil unrest just to keep out of the jail he so richly deserves. I'm astounded at anyone trying to justify/translate his behaviour. How is he still President?

FartyBlartFast

peddlelies wrote: »

FartyBlartFast wrote: »

Thats probably because as per Nazi concentration camp survivors, these children are being thrown into concentration camps.

That sentence/logic doesn't make any sense. Believe what you want, you're not going to change my opinion on the matter.

As per your own criteria, you are now mocking Holocaust survivors. Classy.

And the sentence makes perfect sense. People who survived concentration camps (both in the US and in flbloody Auschwitz) are saying these children are being put are concentration camps.

So do you support putting children in these concentration camps, or are you claiming survivors of the Holocaust are liars?