Donald Trump Presidency discussion Thread VI

hotmail.com

DrumSteve wrote: »

Fox News are obsessed with her because she is the embodiment of what a lot of their audience despise.

You miss the point that the media doesn't care.. they just care about ratings. CNN has become a channel dedicated to Trump. Ironically enough, their ratings are dropping. Not because of the supposed bias,but because people are getting fed up with hearing about Trump.

Dog Man Star

peddlelies wrote: »

That's your opinion.

It's not my opinion. Roger Ailes was very explicit in his reasons for creating Fox News and it was not for ratings. You should educate yourself, before scattering your ill-founded opinions around like cheap confetti.

Leroy42

If that is true, then Trump has a major problem on his hands.

He was always a curiosity, the new thing, different. If people are simply bored of it then he has nothing to offer.

Dog Man Star

hotmail.com wrote: »

You miss the point that the media doesn't care.. they just care about ratings. CNN has become a channel dedicated to Trump. Ironically enough, their ratings are dropping. Not because of the supposed bias,but because people are getting fed up with hearing about Trump.

Wrong again. Fox News does not just "care about ratings". Fox news did not begin in 2015. Their m.o. is more that ratings. Stop stating facts based on nothing.

Dog Man Star

MrFresh wrote: »

A poor person who made something of themselves?

She's an outspoken, powerful, intelligent, charismatic non-white woman.

It's all their fears in one person.

She's also undoubtedly a future President and they know this too.

hotmail.com

Dog Man Star wrote:

Wrong again. Fox News does not just "care about ratings". Fox news did not begin in 2015. Their m.o. is more that ratings. Stop stating facts based on nothing.

Fox News leans towards Republicans, the others lean towards Democrats.. That's the deal, all sides benefit and make advertising revenue from that divide.

There's no real accountability or good journalism I can I see from the US media.

Trump is given so much coverage because he's a celebrity and an interesting figure.

serfboard

Quin_Dub wrote: »

I'd question how much of that "support" is down to the fact her opponent is the Fox News "Enemy du Jour" Alexandra Ocasio Cortez?

Are they really supporting her , or is it more that they truly hate AOC ?

Quin_Dub wrote: »

So why are Fox News so utterly obsessed with her?

The hatred of Fox News for AOC is something unusual alright. They obviously see her as a threat.

The question is why?

It's not because of her intelligence, her eloquence or her views - if that was the case they would apply the same level of hatred towards Bernie Sanders.

It's not because she holds these views and is female - or Elizabeth Warren would also get the same treatment.

To my mind, it's because she holds these views, is female, is young, is Hispanic and above all is good-looking - Fox News knows that good-looking females are a ratings winner, and a good-looking young articulate woman holding Democratic Socialist views, which the electorate broadly support, (such as Medicare For All), is a big threat to Republicans.

Gbear

Deleted User wrote: »

So maybe pay people more and import a bit less?

This is the trouble, people only want to accept one part of reality that suits an overall argument. Seeing people who were against globalisation now claim it as an unavoidable end state so they can criticise parts of "the Right" is very strange.

I'm not sure we should want to have people working in coal mines, or doing repetitive work in factories as the gold standard for the working class.

That's not to say drug abuse, crime and violence is a better alternative, or for that matter, low-paying service jobs, are the answer, but I don't think going backwards is the way forwards.

Whether or not his specific policies are the way to go, the kind of solutions proposed by the likes of Yang are probably inevitable, but as we become more and more a post-scarcity society, that doesn't need to be a bad thing.

If the market for consumer goods is destroyed by 3D printing, as well as the jobs that go with them, for example, then the approach of conservative (small c) politicians will naturally tend towards protectionism on behalf of their donors with ever more draconian and ultimately ineffective copyright and patent legislation (as we've seen in the digital media sphere).


The libertarian slant will be no IP protection and no state provision. The conservative slant will be lots of IP protection and no state provision.
The Democrats need to set themselves in opposition to the Republicans on this issue if they want to maintain a position of anti-corporatism, but if they do, they will have to figure out taxation, welfare provision and education systems that ensure that the lack of those manufacturing jobs doesn't continue to hurt the working class.

Dog Man Star

hotmail.com wrote: »

Fox News leans towards Republicans, the others lean towards Democrats.. That's the deal, all sides benefit and make advertising revenue from that divide.

There's no real accountability or good journalism I can I see from the US media.

Trump is given so much coverage because he's a celebrity and an interesting figure.

CNN's coverage is balanced. MSNBC is mostly balanced, with the exception of Morning Joe and Lawrence O'Donnell which is left leaning.
If Trump visits El Paso and insults their mayor and governor on the way home, CNN will report it. That does not make them biased. Important fact. Being impartial does not mean reporting good and bad. www.thehill.com think that endless factual negative articles about Trump can be offset by John Solomon, their regular conspiracy theorist. It doesn't work. It makes them look like a joke.

Fox News "leans towards Republicans" - utter nonsense. It is a propaganda channel.

""The Truth" is whatever people will believe" - Roger Ailes
"Obama's the one who never worked a day in his life. He never earned a penny that wasn't public money. How many fund-raisers does he attend every week? How often does he play basketball and golf? I wish I had that kind of time." - Roger Ailes
"You cover the bad news about America. You do. But you don't get up in the morning hating your country. And so, until somebody shows me lines at the border trying to get out, I think there's some good news." - Roger Ailes
"I want to elect the next president." - Roger Ailes

So, in case you don't realise from these quotes, Roger Ailes created Fox News in 1996 not for ratings, but for a total political agenda, one that continues to this day. Equating Fox News to any other news channel is false and should be discounted immediately as a false equivalency and a lie. If you don't know who Roger Ailes was, you have no contribution to make in this thread and should be banned. Or, you can postpone your comments, until you inform yourself.

Here's a book: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Loudest-Voice-Room-Brilliant-News/dp/0812992857
Here's a tv series: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt6821044/

I've read and watched both. When you do, you can draw some real comparisons between Roger Ailes and Trump. Both fat misogynistic ugly men, notorious for sexual harassment of their employees, both power hungry but without talent. Ailes's downfall was an ex-employee taking him to task. Trump's judgement will come too, and that judgement soon.

Mark and date these words: when Warren wins the November 2020 election with an 8% margin, Trump's exit from office in January 2021 will be to police. When, not if, when this happens, the US will be free again.

Water John

So the 8 patients in the hospital did not want to meet Trump. So they brought back 2 that had been discharged to meet him.
That is cringe worthy pathetic.

everlast75

Water John wrote: »

So the 8 patients in the hospital did not want to meet Trump. So they brought back 2 that had been discharged to meet him.
That is cringe worthy pathetic.

In general, they cannot rely on the truth.

It is propaganda, pure and simple.

They won't bring him out to the main thoroughfare as there are protestors, so he stays in the hospital and then makes a video of it to show how popular he is, when the truth is otherwise.

If you cannot rely on the truth to carry your argument, you know you are not on the right side of history

peddlelies

Dog Man Star wrote: »

MSNBC is mostly balanced, with the exception of Morning Joe and Lawrence O'Donnell which is left leaning.

I must tune into the likes of Joy Reid, Rachel Maddow, Chris Hayes and Chris "Obama gave me a thrill up my leg" Matthews more often so, given they're balanced. Definitely not towing the line for the Democrat party.

Hate Fox news all you want, I genuinely don't care, just know you're blinded by your own confirmation bias.

everlast75

peddlelies wrote: »

I must tune into the likes of Joy Reid, Rachel Maddow, Chris Hayes and Chris "Obama gave me a thrill up my leg" Matthews more often so, given they're balanced. Definitely not towing the line for the Democrat party.

Hate Fox news all you want, I genuinely don't care, just know you're blinded by your own confirmation bias.

Not if you can apply critical thinking, a skill sadly lost today to a lot of Trump supporters

peddlelies

everlast75 wrote: »

Not if you can apply critical thinking, a skill sadly lost today to a lot of Trump supporters

That's funny coming from the number one Russian collusion conspiracy theorist.

FrostyJack

peddlelies wrote:

That's funny coming from the number one Russian collusion conspiracy theorist.

That conspiracy where over 100 meetings took place between Russians and Trump associates all over the World? The one where said Trump associates lied about?

peddlelies

FrostyJack wrote: »

That conspiracy where over 100 meetings took place between Russians and Trump associates all over the World? The one where said Trump associates lied about?

You should tell Robert Mueller, he might do something about it. Perhaps he'll change his mind from charging zero Americans or associates of the Trump campaign with election interference or intentional malice.

Any Presidential campaign is going to have meetings and interactions with foreign diplomats or beneficiaries, the scope of those connected with a campaign doesn't exactly have a boundary. On the other hand some might engage with a foreign nation to dig up dirt or disrupt a campaign, much like the DNC did with the Ukrainians or hiring a foreign agent to write a fantasy novel.

everlast75

peddlelies wrote: »

You should tell Robert Mueller, he might do something about it. Perhaps he'll change his mind from charging zero Americans or associates of the Trump campaign with election interference.

Any Presidential campaign is going to have meetings and interactions with foreign diplomats or beneficiaries. On the other hand some might engage with a foreign nation to dig up dirt or disrupt a campaign, much like the DNC did with the Ukrainians or hiring a foreign agent to write a fantasy novel.

Either you haven't read the Mueller report or you have and don't think Trump did anything wrong.

Whichever it is - I can't help you

duploelabs

peddlelies wrote: »

You should tell Robert Mueller, he might do something about it. Perhaps he'll change his mind from charging zero Americans or associates of the Trump campaign with election interference or intentional malice.

Any Presidential campaign is going to have meetings and interactions with foreign diplomats or beneficiaries, the scope of those connected with a campaign doesn't exactly have a boundary. On the other hand some might engage with a foreign nation to dig up dirt or disrupt a campaign, much like the DNC did with the Ukrainians or hiring a foreign agent to write a fantasy novel.

There are two that the public (including you) know about, there are another 14 ongoing investigations where Mueller passed on to he relevent authorities that are yet to be completed
https://www.cnbc.com/2019/04/18/mueller-evidence-14-potential-crimes-only-two-publicly-known.html

PropJoe10

For the love of God:

There's literally no end to this man's narcissism. Boasting about his crowd sizes at the site of a human tragedy.

peddlelies

everlast75 wrote: »

Either you haven't read the Mueller report or you have and don't think Trump did anything wrong.

Whichever it is - I can't help you

I don't care what you perceive to be wrong. Nobody with the campaign was involved with the hacking and dissemination of emails, nobody was involved with the social media campaigns. There was no grand conspiracy, there was no plot between the Trump campaign and Russia to work together to win the election. Those are the only facts I care about.

Beyond those facts, do you want me to be surprised that Trump engaged in unethical behaviour over the two years he was labelled a Russian traitor? I know what he is and how rash he can be, forgive me if I could care less about the prevailing, face saving narratives.

relax carry on

PropJoe10 wrote: »

For the love of God:

There's literally no end to this man's narcissism. Boasting about his crowd sizes at the site of a human tragedy.

The utter unfitness of this narcissistic, racist conman for any position of authority is the bit that always gets me about this travesty of a presidency. The ceaseless willingness of his supporters and enablers to hide these facts from themselves in order to bask in the con Trump is selling, is just (to rob one of Trump's overused words) sad.

Outlaw Pete

PropJoe10 wrote: »

There's literally no end to this man's narcissism.

There's no end to CNN's nitpicking more like but then they know their audience.

There was lots of positive aspects of the El Paso visit that they could have focused on but given the disgusting narrative they'd been peddling all week about Trump being responsible for the shootings in some way, they had to find something negative and so good for them, great news reporting as usual.

Here's some uncut footage, giving lots of time to speak with people but I'm sure some of you can find something negative in it to moan about.

Russia Collusion was a non-runner so gotta find something I guess. Hey who knows, maybe he could be impeached for narcissism?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-Qnfs7QvL8

mcmoustache

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

There's no end to CNN's nitpicking more like but then they know their audience.

There was lots of positive aspects of the El Paso visit that they could have focused on but given the disgusting narrative they'd been peddling all week about Trump being responsible for the shootings in some way, they had to find something negative and so good for them, great news reporting as usual.

Here's some uncut footage, giving lots of time to speak with people but I'm sure some of you can find something negative in it to moan about.

Russia Collusion was a non-runner so gotta find something I guess. Hey who knows, maybe he could be impeached for narcissism?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-Qnfs7QvL8

Is this the one where he goes on about his crowd size? Or maybe the one where he shot a PR video in the hospital where the victims didn't want to talk to him?


Or is it the one where they brought back the discharged and orphaned baby was brought back for a photo op?


Or is it some fluff piece that you found in the sorts of places where people post FOX news stuff unironically?

Manic Moran

serfboard wrote: »

The hatred of Fox News for AOC is something unusual alright. They obviously see her as a threat.

The question is why?

It's not because of her intelligence, her eloquence or her views - if that was the case they would apply the same level of hatred towards Bernie Sanders.

It's not because she holds these views and is female - or Elizabeth Warren would also get the same treatment.

To my mind, it's because she holds these views, is female, is young, is Hispanic and above all is good-looking - Fox News knows that good-looking females are a ratings winner, and a good-looking young articulate woman holding Democratic Socialist views, which the electorate broadly support, (such as Medicare For All), is a big threat to Republicans.

Alternative option:

They don't fear her, but because she is both highly public (eg largest twitter following of any Congresscritter), and decidedly vocal about taking positions rather farther to the left, she is a perfect talking point for emphasizing to voters "This is what Democrats want and think" even if the Democrats in their area are far more moderate.

This is also why senior Democrats like Pelosi or Biden are dropping them down a peg or two. They know just as much as the Republicans (and Fox) that AOC's positions do not play particularly well where they need to win votes, and as much as they would like her not to be as visible in those places, the Republicans love her being visible. In other words, AOC is to Republicans as much of a weapon for them as Trump is for Democrats.

Outlaw Pete

Dog Man Star wrote: »

CNN's coverage is balanced. MSNBC is mostly balanced, with the exception of Morning Joe and Lawrence O'Donnell which is left leaning.

Would ya stop. MSNBC are a bunch of lying leftists. Second only to CNN when it comes to the level of far left propaganda.

Just the past week alone they had the following moron on saying Trump was lowering flags to half mast until Aug 8th only because H is the eight letter of the alphabet and H stands for Hitler.


https://twitter.com/B7AKE/status/1159200668919488518


And they also said this week that Trump talked of "exterminating Latinos":


https://twitter.com/JFNYC1/status/1158914229505859585

It's got to the stage now where these people believe their own lies and you can be damn sure a good chunk of their viewership believe them too, sadly.

Stallingrad

Is it true that none of the El Paso victims wanted to meet Trump? And after meeting the Ohio victims he came out talking about the love and respect for the presidency? Surreal.

FrostyJack

peddlelies wrote:

You should tell Robert Mueller, he might do something about it. Perhaps he'll change his mind from charging zero Americans or associates of the Trump campaign with election interference or intentional malice.

peddlelies wrote:

Any Presidential campaign is going to have meetings and interactions with foreign diplomats or beneficiaries, the scope of those connected with a campaign doesn't exactly have a boundary. On the other hand some might engage with a foreign nation to dig up dirt or disrupt a campaign, much like the DNC did with the Ukrainians or hiring a foreign agent to write a fantasy novel.

We know they were talking about reducing sanctions, which is illegal and we know they weaponised the release and timing of the DNC server emails, see Roger Stone. Do you think it was just a massive coincidence they came out at key times in the campaign? Only a few weeks ago Trump said live on tv he would take dirt on opponent from a foreign country which again is illegal. As for the dossier, it was provided by company not a state, the same way Trump's team used Cambridge Analytica. As you already know,but chose to lie about, most of the dossier has turned out to be verifiablely true. Things like the pee tape we can't prove unless Trump or the Kremlin come out and say it is, which isn't going to happen. Steele was interviewed by Trump's DOJ while he was in the UK and they said he was a credible source. When you add that to the list of credible work he has done in the past it provides a strong case not to be a "fantasy novel".

pixelburp

Stallingrad wrote: »

Is it true that none of the El Paso victims wanted to meet Trump? And after meeting the Ohio victims he came out talking about the love and respect for the presidency? Surreal.

Apparently none in the wards wanted to meet him, and they wheeled in some already discharged patients to meet him. No idea of the truth to this.

I've said it after every natural disaster and terrorist act; even the most hated or milquetoast president should find these total PR slam dunks. Formal compassion in the face of tragedy is easy to either fabricate or find naturally - yet Trump can't reach that low bar. Even if you subscribe to the "media is picking on poor Don", his inability to rise about it is a poor reflection on his impulse control.

duploelabs

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

Would ya stop. MSNBC are a bunch of lying leftists. Second only to CNN when it comes to the level of far left propaganda.

Just the past week alone they had the following moron on saying Trump was lowering flags to half mast until Aug 8th only because H is the eight letter of the alphabet and H stands for Hitler.

Well in September last year, when the administration was asked about the missing migrant children, they couldn't come up with a figure. When pressed Steven Miller said 1,488.
https://www.apnews.com/aad956b7281f4057aaac1ef4b5732f12

Dogwhistle or coincidence? So when it comes up with the lowering of the flags, it wouldn't surprise me that that was the case

MrFresh

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

Would ya stop. MSNBC are a bunch of lying leftists. Second only to CNN when it comes to the level of far left propaganda.

Just the past week alone they had the following moron on saying Trump was lowering flags to half mast until Aug 8th only because H is the eight letter of the alphabet and H stands for Hitler.


https://twitter.com/B7AKE/status/1159200668919488518


And they also said this week that Trump talked of "exterminating Latinos":


https://twitter.com/JFNYC1/status/1158914229505859585

It's got to the stage now where these people believe their own lies and you can be damn sure a good chunk of their viewership believe them too, sadly.

See these seem like some complete misrepresentations of what happened. In the first case, he didn't say Trump was doing it "only because" h was the eighth letter. He specifically said he wasn't implying it was a deliberate act by Trump. He's saying people read into these things and Trump has to be aware of this.


In the second one, the host was referencing what her guest had said. Despite this, she recognised it was a mistake and apologised afterwards.


When was Trump's last apology? When did a Fox host last apologise for using an inappropriate word?