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Antifa [Mod Warning on post #1 - updated 08/08/19]

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    #4412
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    Ironicname wrote: »
    On a side note, it the word "grifter" popular now on the "liberal" side these days. I thought it was just some annoying pricks that used it on this site but seeing more people who would be modern "liberals" using it.

    It's even more annoying than the word snowflake.

    (Cue people calling me "triggered"... Ugh... I hate certain aspects ofthe modern lexicon)
    It's normal in politics today to weaponize words. It might be disingenuous and lazy, but it is effective.

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



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    #4413
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,470 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    Ironicname wrote: »
    On a side note, it the word "grifter" popular now on the "liberal" side these days. I thought it was just some annoying pricks that used it on this site but seeing more people who would be modern "liberals" using it.

    It's even more annoying than the word snowflake.

    (Cue people calling me "triggered"... Ugh... I hate certain aspects ofthe modern lexicon)

    if you can think of a better word for these people then let us hear it.


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    #4414
    Ironicname
    Registered Users Posts: 1,177 ✭✭✭Ironicname


    ohnonotgmail wrote:
    if you can think of a better word for these people then let us hear it.

    They are all different people with different outlooks. What unites most of the ones I see mentioned here erroneously as grifters are they are conservative

    Steven Crowder - Conservative Entertainer.
    Ben Shapiro - Conservative Political Analyst
    Alex Jones - entertaining nutjob who is right more often than you think.

    I could go on but I have no doubt that you don't really care and asked that question hypothetically for the sake of it.


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    #4415
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,470 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    Ironicname wrote: »
    They are all different people with different outlooks. What unites most of the ones I see mentioned here erroneously as grifters are they are conservative

    Steven Crowder - Conservative Entertainer.
    Ben Shapiro - Conservative Political Analyst
    Alex Jones - entertaining nutjob who is right more often than you think.

    I could go on but I have no doubt that you don't really care and asked that question hypothetically for the sake of it.

    Alex Jones is a total grifter. Its all about the money for him.


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    #4416
    Ironicname
    Registered Users Posts: 1,177 ✭✭✭Ironicname


    ohnonotgmail wrote:
    Alex Jones is a total grifter. Its all about the money for him.

    I assume you consider Vox and their writers grifters too then?


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    #4417
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,470 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    Ironicname wrote: »
    I assume you consider Vox and their writers grifters too then?

    do they shill products or ask their readers to donate to gofundmes? You really need to look up what the word grifter means. you seem very confused.


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    #4418
    SexBobomb
    Registered Users Posts: 442 ✭✭SexBobomb


    ohnonotgmail wrote: »
    do they shill products or ask their readers to donate to gofundmes? You really need to look up what the word grifter means. you seem very confused.

    Yes


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    #4419
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,470 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    SexBobomb wrote: »
    Yes

    so they sell a shirt with their name on it. It is not the sole reason for their existence.


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    #4420
    Kimsang
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,170 ✭✭✭Kimsang


    ohnonotgmail wrote: »
    do they shill products or ask their readers to donate to gofundmes? You really need to look up what the word grifter means. you seem very confused.

    Grifter: someone who engages in small or petty-scale swindling.

    So what would you call Christine Blasey Ford who engaged in huge scale political swindling? Grifter seems too light.

    https://ie.gofundme.com/help-christine-blasey-ford


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    #4421
    batgoat
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,423 ✭✭✭batgoat


    Kimsang wrote: »
    Grifter: someone who engages in small or petty-scale swindling.

    So what would you call Christine Blasey Ford who engaged in huge scale political swindling? Grifter seems too light.

    https://ie.gofundme.com/help-christine-blasey-ford
    The same Blasey Ford who still needs a security detail because going public actively put her in danger? That isn't cheap, not sure if she's been able to even go back to lecturing.


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    #4422
    SexBobomb
    Registered Users Posts: 442 ✭✭SexBobomb


    ohnonotgmail wrote: »
    so they sell a shirt with their name on it. It is not the sole reason for their existence.

    Ben Shapiro isn't selling products, Candace Owens isn't, Crowder sells a newsletter and access to extra content as far as I know, mostly to keep the lights on and continue as independent media, surely you don't just want millionaires and big corporations providing your news for you ?? Lots of newspapers have a pay wall are they all liars and "grifters" (uugh) as well ? You keep changing the definition


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    #4423
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    batgoat wrote: »
    The same Blasey Ford who still needs a security detail because going public actively put her in danger? That isn't cheap, not sure if she's been able to even go back to lecturing.
    That has to be an astounding security team for $1 million.

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



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    #4424
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 21,440 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    notobtuse wrote: »
    It's normal in politics today to weaponize words. It might be disingenuous and lazy, but it is effective.

    Like calling Antifa Fascists?

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




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    #4425
    Ironicname
    Registered Users Posts: 1,177 ✭✭✭Ironicname


    ohnonotgmail wrote:
    do they shill products or ask their readers to donate to gofundmes? You really need to look up what the word grifter means. you seem very confused.

    Perhaps you should look up the word. Unless you have a different definition than has been explained above.

    And I am a little confused. Confused because you seem to be insisting that being a grifter doesn't apply to those whose ideas you support.

    It'd be much easier for you to admit that it, much like the word fascist, is used by mostly "the left" as an insult to people whose politics or ideas they dislike.

    Shapiro/Crowder:. Grifters because they ask their readership for donations and sell t-shirts/mugs etc

    Vox/vice/guardian: not grifters although they ask their readership for donations and sell t/shirts/mugs etc.

    Proud Boys: Fascists because they are a group that oppose Antifa or any other group shutting down conservative voices on campuses, they promote western culture as the best in the world and have certain questionable members who engage in violence

    Antifa: not fascists because they are a group that oppose their definition of Fascism by any group, promote leftist values and communist/Marxist views and have protest (often violently) against anyone holding opposing views. They have certain questionable members who engage in violence.


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    #4426
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,013 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    notobtuse wrote: »
    It's normal in politics today to weaponize words. It might be disingenuous and lazy, but it is effective.

    Goebbels was skilled in it. We call it propaganda. Being happening since time began. Blame minorities. Label minorities certain names to disassociate broader society from them. Accuse and condemn others for doing what you yourself do etc. Sound familiar?


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    #4427
    SexBobomb
    Registered Users Posts: 442 ✭✭SexBobomb


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    Goebbels was skilled in it. We call it propaganda. Being happening since time began. Blame minorities. Label minorities certain names to disassociate broader society from them. Accuse and condemn others for doing what you yourself do etc. Sound familiar?

    Yeah I agree, like calling conservatives fascists and racists. And vice versa.


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    #4428
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    Brian? wrote: »
    Like calling Antifa Fascists?
    Yes… just as much as the label is applied to those they claim to oppose.

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



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    #4429
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,013 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    SexBobomb wrote: »
    Yeah I agree, like calling conservatives fascists and racists. And vice versa.

    No. Calling somebody something based on their action and views is as clear and honest as you can get.
    Scaremongering and lying is very different.


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    #4430
    Ironicname
    Registered Users Posts: 1,177 ✭✭✭Ironicname


    Matt Barrett wrote:
    Scaremongering and lying is very different.

    Yeah...like calling trump and the proud boys fascists and racists...


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    #4431
    SexBobomb
    Registered Users Posts: 442 ✭✭SexBobomb


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    No. Calling somebody something based on their action and views is as clear and honest as you can get.
    Scaremongering and lying is very different.

    Beating up journalists and people who have different political views to yours as well as shutting down speeches on college campuses because you dont agree with them sounds like fascistic behaviour to me.
    Oh and the whole Trump is a Russian agent story, that wasn't lying or scaremongering of course


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    #4432
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,013 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    Ironicname wrote: »
    Yeah...like calling trump and the proud boys fascists and racists...

    Exactly.

    Calling Mexicans rapists and murderers with the defence, well some are is the same as calling Republican senators closet gays and people who pay for their mistresses to have abortions, well some do.


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    #4433
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,013 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    SexBobomb wrote: »
    Beating up journalists and people who have different political views to yours as well as shutting down speeches on college campuses because you dont agree with them sounds like fascistic behaviour to me.
    Oh and the whole Trump is a Russian agent story, that wasn't lying or scaremongering of course

    I disagree with such tactics.

    Trump jnr met with an agent representing the Putin government to discuss dirt on Clinton also we know Russia has interfered online.


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    #4434
    SexBobomb
    Registered Users Posts: 442 ✭✭SexBobomb


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    I disagree with such tactics.

    Trump jnr met with an agent representing the Putin government to discuss dirt on Clinton also we know Russia has interfered online.

    Interfering in an election is a jailable offence and theres plenty of support to get Trump out of office, why hasn't anything happened ? Im not even a Trump guy just cant stand the double standards at play.


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    #4435
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    I disagree with such tactics.

    Trump jnr met with an agent representing the Putin government to discuss dirt on Clinton also we know Russia has interfered online.
    Whereas Clinton actually funneled money to Russian agents in order to come up with a fake dossier intended to take down here political opponent and then lawfully elected president?

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



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    #4436
    Ironicname
    Registered Users Posts: 1,177 ✭✭✭Ironicname


    Matt Barrett wrote:
    I disagree with such tactics.

    Your tactics are just repeating lies then?

    (Before you ask, it's the inference that trump was talking about all Mexicans when it was clear as day he was taking about Mexican illegal immigrants)


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    #4437
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,013 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    SexBobomb wrote: »
    Interfering in an election is a jailable offence and theres plenty of support to get Trump out of office, why hasn't anything happened ? Im not even a Trump guy just cant stand the double standards at play.

    You can't indite a sitting President. He'll likely get hit with obstruction should he lose next term.


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    #4438
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,013 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    notobtuse wrote: »
    Whereas Clinton actually funneled money to Russian agents in order to come up with a fake dossier intended to take down here political opponent and then lawfully elected president?

    Really? Link? Also, So what?


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    #4439
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,013 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    Ironicname wrote: »
    Your tactics are just repeating lies then?

    (Before you ask, it's the inference that trump was talking about all Mexicans when it was clear as day he was taking about Mexican illegal immigrants)

    You are telling yarns. Show one lie never mind lies?
    So was I. It makes absolutely no difference. Mexican immigrants are due the same respect and any other Mexican I would have thought.


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    #4440
    Ironicname
    Registered Users Posts: 1,177 ✭✭✭Ironicname


    The irony is, that if Antifa and certain posters here focussed on the stuff trump actually was doing wrong rather than misrepresenting quotes, making up scenarios and flat out lying, there'd be a good chance he would be dead in the water come 2020.

    Instead, all they are doing is making people sick of hearing their ****e and ruining any shred of credibility they might have had.

    They are trump's biggest chance and ally when it comes to his campaign


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    #4441
    SexBobomb
    Registered Users Posts: 442 ✭✭SexBobomb


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    You can't indite a sitting President. He'll likely get hit with obstruction should he lose next term.

    He can be impeached though can't he ? Why haven't they impeached him if they have enough to charge him in relation to rigging an election with Russia ?


This discussion has been closed.
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