Antifa [Mod Warning on post #1 - updated 08/08/19]

Odhinn

rossie1977 wrote: »

Which of her proposals do you think is the most dangerous to the US as a whole?

Medicare for all. The Horror...........The Horror

rossie1977

rossie1977 wrote:

Which of her proposals do you think is the most dangerous to the US as a whole?

Abolishing ice probably.

Housing as a human right is pretty bizarre.

What women's rights is she looking to bring in? Is it positive discrimination? If so, then that's terrible

FartyBlartFast

notobtuse wrote: »

If you’re going to be pedantic then more can play that game.

No problem, here is how you give a direct answer. Take notes, and maybe try it sometime:

Where did trump stay they should go to other countries?

right here...

So interesting to see “Progressive” Democrat Congresswomen, who originally came from countries whose governments are a complete and total catastrophe, the worst, most corrupt and inept anywhere in the world (if they even have a functioning government at all), now loudly and viciously telling the people of the United States, the greatest and most powerful Nation on earth, how our government is to be run. Why don’t they go back and help fix the totally broken and crime infested places from which they came. Then come back and show us how it is done. These places need your help badly, you can’t leave fast enough. I’m sure that Nancy Pelosi would be very happy to quickly work out free travel arrangements!

Did he name any names of these members of Congress?

Indeed he has, at least two of them he has confirmed.

".....Congresswomen, who I truly believe, based on their actions, hate our Country. Get a list of the HORRIBLE things they have said. Omar is polling at 8%, Cortez at 21%."

Perhaps he simply meant they could take a break from Congress and go back to their cushy homes in DC in order to craft some work these other countries could use to improve their own conditions. If you're going to be pedantic be prepared to have it come back at you.

DC is outside of the USA now, is it? Are any of these representatives for DC? Did any of them grow up in DC?

What next? Maybe he was suggesting they go to their local Chinese restaurant and fix the till, because it's broken and people are getting away without paying their full bills, so it's full of crime too. I wouldn't put it past you at this rate.

Loving the irony in your username, though.

Eric Cartman

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

Trumps mother grew up in poverty in Scotland and couldn’t speak English only Scots Gaelic. His father was german.
His two wives are from the eastern bloc. His son and daughter are children of immigrants directly. As is he.



Him telling anyone to ‘go home’ is both racist and hilariously hypocritical


You realise that though right?

Wheb trump uses his heratige to win an argument / votes like AOC has regularly done trying to win latin votes , then we can talk

Outlaw Pete

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

Trumps mother grew up in poverty in Scotland and couldn’t speak English only Scots Gaelic. His father was german.
His two wives are from the eastern bloc. His son and daughter are children of immigrants directly. As is he.

Wait, I thought he was a racist..... but now you're pointing out he has married two non-nationals and his children are born of an immigrant?

I think you might be undermining your own arguments there.

Him telling anyone to ‘go home’ is both racist and hilariously hypocritical

You realise that though right?

There isn't an ounce of hypocrisy in what you cited, not an ounce.

See what you're doing is focusing solely on the 'Go back' bit as if Trump just heard there were some politicians who were immigrants, or born of immigrants, and told them to 'Go back to whence you came' for no other reason .... but that's far from what occurred. These people have spoken about the USA as if it has a fascist government, and treats those seeking asylum no better than Nazis treated jews....... THAT'S what fueled his comments and so you can't just call him a hypocrite based on the fact that he has immigrant parents, married a non-national and had children with them, that's absurd..... if anything he is in the perfect position to call these people out for what they said given that, as you point out, he has so much in common with them, but yet doesn't speak about the USA in the disgraceful manner in which they have done.

Stop moaning ffs

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Wheb trump uses his heratige to win an argument / votes like AOC has regularly done trying to win latin votes , then we can talk

He doesn’t use his heritage. He uses his skin colour. Daily.
He even got confused only last month about where his father was born and what nationality he was.
I don’t think AOC is trying to ‘win votes’. She’s not in the running for anything.
She’s just calling out his racism. Way to sidestep what I asked you though

Odhinn

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

Wait, I thought he was a racist..... but now you're pointing out he has married two non-nationals and his children are born of an immigrant?

I think you might be undermining your own arguments there.

.

As they're caucasians no, he isn't.

20Cent

Il Fascista wrote: »

Abolishing immigration enforcement alone is highly dangerous.

It doesn't say abolish immigration enforcement Il Fascista.

FartyBlartFast

20Cent wrote: »

Il Fascista wrote: »

Abolishing immigration enforcement alone is highly dangerous.

It doesn't say abolish immigration enforcement Il Fascista.

A lot of people forget that ICE only came into existence in 2003. If I am correct, that is primarily what they want disbanded.

It's hard to disagree when they are running concentration camps, and have outrageously racist Facebook pages with 9,800 members compared to 20,000 employees that their head is also a member of (before it got closed down).

Of course, that same head of ice who was in that group condemned it before it was public knowledge that she was also a part of it. Because like many Trump supporters, she wants you to know that she is totally not a racist and doesn't approve of the things she herself takes part in.

MrFresh

20Cent wrote: »

It doesn't say abolish immigration enforcement Il Fascista.

Be fair. They have to make a lot of stuff up to make a point. I imagine it's hard work.

Odhinn

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

See what you're doing is focusing solely on the 'Go back' bit as if Trump just heard there were some politicians who were immigrants, or born of immigrants, and told them to 'Go back to whence you came' for no other reason .... but that's far from what occurred. These people have spoken about the USA as if it has a fascist government, and treats those seeking asylum no better than Nazis treated jews....... THAT'S what fueled his comments and so you can't just call him a hypocrite based on the fact that he has immigrant parents, married a non-national and had children with them, that's absurd..... if anything he is in the perfect position to call these people out for what they said given that, as you point out, he has so much in common with them, but yet doesn't speak about the USA in the disgraceful manner in which they have done.

................so there's a list of opinions that Americans aren't allowed hold?


You realise that Trump constantly negatively referred to the current state of the USA in his election campaign and in his inaugaration speech?

one armed dwarf

People keep saying that these tweets are being taken out of context. They say it all the time with Trump. But what is the correct context then?

By specifically invoking the idea that these women come from other countries which are in a desperate state (3 out of 4 are American born), that they should go back and fix them before they're qualified to speak.

How is that not racist or at least xenophobic? What is the context that doesn't lead to the interpretation he made the tweet thinking of their skin colour (they can't be American because they are brown) or the place of birth of their parents?

Billy Mays

Former White House communications director Anthony Scaramucci has said that Trump's tweets were racist and unacceptable

Obviously he's taking them out of context aswell and the Boards.ie Donald Trump fan club know better

VicMackey1

This is an interview with a delusional antifa activist. It's a cnn interview so don't expect any hard-hitting questions to be asked. It is funny but it does show that antifa has no interest in peaceful protest.

Pa ElGrande

rossie1977 wrote: »

Which of her proposals do you think is the most dangerous to the US as a whole?

https://i1.wp.com/contemptor.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/hannity-ocasio-cortez.jpg

Practically all of it. It's based on an economic system with a proven record of failure. i.e. Socialism. Not defending the current system, they do have a massive social and corporate welfare system (especially the MIC) that will eventually meet its reckoning as well. They do have the freedom to implement much of that at state level, they don't because it will quickly cripple the individual states, why they think it will work at Federal level is beyond me. Individual states like Illinois have already pushed the self destruct button. The current system is not perfect, none ever are, but people keep pursing cradle to grave socialism as a panacea to all, well eventually the capital reserve gets eaten up and insolvency looms.

The current theory of how they intend to pay for all this is Modern Monetary Theory (MMT) or I prefer to call it the magic money theory. Expect to see MMT being pushed as part of monetary reform package over the next decade.

The twits who gave us zero/negative interest rate policy and quantitative easing are now retiring and the MMT crowd are pushing their nonsense into the vacuum.

Midlife

Pa ElGrande wrote: »

Practically all of it. It's based on an economic system with a proven record of failure. i.e. Socialism. Not defending the current system, they do have a massive social and corporate welfare system (especially the MIC) that will eventually meet its reckoning as well. They do have the freedom to implement much of that at state level, they don't because it will quickly cripple the individual states, why they think it will work at Federal level is beyond me. Individual states like Illinois have already pushed the self destruct button. The current system is not perfect, none ever are, but people keep pursing cradle to grave socialism as a panacea to all, well eventually the capital reserve gets eaten up and insolvency looms.

The current theory of how they intend to pay for all this is Modern Monetary Theory (MMT) or I prefer to call it the magic money theory. Expect to see MMT being pushed as part of monetary reform package over the next decade.

The twits who gave us zero/negative interest rate policy and quantitative easing are now retiring and the MMT crowd are pushing their nonsense into the vacuum.

Errr, is that not all you though. Her policies are more social leaning and you just filled in the rest.

What's wrong with tax the rich and support the middle and working class a bit more?

That works in lots of places.

Midlife

one armed dwarf wrote: »

People keep saying that these tweets are being taken out of context. They say it all the time with Trump. But what is the correct context then?

By specifically invoking the idea that these women come from other countries which are in a desperate state (3 out of 4 are American born), that they should go back and fix them before they're qualified to speak.

How is that not racist or at least xenophobic? What is the context that doesn't lead to the interpretation he made the tweet thinking of their skin colour (they can't be American because they are brown) or the place of birth of their parents?

Side by side with the birther thing, you'd have to be a clown at this stage to be denying the obvious.

Sweetemotion

Midlife wrote: »

What's wrong with tax the rich and support the middle and working class a bit more?

The rich just leave town and the tax is then put on the middle and working class.

Pa ElGrande

Midlife wrote: »

Errr, is that not all you though. Her policies are more social leaning and you just filled in the rest.

What's wrong with tax the rich and support the middle and working class a bit more?

That works in lots of places.

Cortez is just a pretty looking front woman for the Democratic Socialists of America.. The Socialists had a conference in Chicago a few weeks ago. Here are some of the points from an observer.

What’s clear from my observations at Socialism 2019 is that traditional Marxists have successfully melded their ideology with the identity politics and culture war issues that animate modern liberalism—despite still being quite far from the beliefs of the average citizen.
<Snip>
5. The Green Movement Is Red

It’s perhaps no surprise that an openly socialist member of Congress is pushing for the Green New Deal—which would essentially turn the U.S. into a command-and-control economy reminiscent of the Soviet Union.

Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez’s chief of staff Saikat Chakrabarti recently said, according to The Washington Post: “The interesting thing about the Green New Deal is it wasn’t originally a climate thing at all.”

“Do you guys think of it as a climate thing?” Chakrabarti asked Sam Ricketts, climate director for Washington Gov. Jay Inslee, who is running for president in the Democratic primary. “Because we really think of it as a how-do-you-change-the-entire-economy thing.”

Economic transformation barely disguised as a way to address environmental concerns appears to be the main point.

Pa ElGrande

Sweetemotion wrote: »

The rich just leave town and the tax is then put on the middle and working class.

Under our current system the rich become powerful, under Socialism the powerful become rich.

Midlife

Pa ElGrande wrote: »

Cortez is just a pretty looking front woman for the Democratic Socialists of America.. The Socialists had a conference in Chicago a few weeks ago. Here are some of the points from an observer.

Sorry, are you serious? Did you watch that youtube video?

kunst nugget

Pa ElGrande wrote: »

Midlife wrote: »

Errr, is that not all you though. Her policies are more social leaning and you just filled in the rest.

What's wrong with tax the rich and support the middle and working class a bit more?

That works in lots of places.

Cortez is just a pretty looking front woman for the Democratic Socialists of America.. The Socialists had a conference in Chicago a few weeks ago. Here are some of the points from an observer.

An article called 'I Went to a Socialism Conference. Here Are 6 Shocking Things I Learned.' gives out about clickbait communism...

Pa ElGrande

Midlife wrote: »

Sorry, are you serious? Did you watch that youtube video?

Yes and I watched the follow up to that as well. They are not hiding anything as he says the information is there in plain sight put out by the activists behind her.

The Late Late Show

America is clearly a mess today and it has become convenient to blame certain presidents and administrations for this, that and the other. Clearly, the April 9th 2018 to date regime in America is one of the worst if not THE worst ever. John Bolton especially is an odious guy with history of troublemaking going back years. But, as much as I dislike him and his regime, many of the problems were there all along. Sure, he has made some of the problems worse and sure he has reversed positive diplomacy but a lot of the mess that is modern America stems from an earlier time. Early (pre-9th April 2018) Trump, Obama, Bush 2, Clinton, Bush 1, Reagan, Carter, Ford, Nixon, Johnson, etc. You can go right back and see many of the same problems in these as you do in the Bolton regime. The Bolton regime may well be more obnoxious than anything leading American from 1933 to 8th April 2018 but it did not invent a lot of the problems.

Middle East wars involving America have been going on pretty much since Carter. Even before this, the cold war has been going on creating proxy wars in Latin America and Africa. If guys like Mike Pompeo are consumed by rabid anti-communism, they were raised on a diet of rabid anti-communist propaganda during the 1970s and 1980s ranging from government officials to Chuck blooming Norris. If there is an immigration crisis and a drug crisis in Central America, it was stoked by support for the likes of the Contras and sanctions against 'communist' Latin American countries.

The Bolton regime quit the Iran deal and it was wrong. But the US also broke their deals with Libya, Iraq and others too. The moral of the story is Republicans and Democrats alike have been building up to what we have today and plenty bad deeds were done under the name of respected presidents. For example, LBJ gets praise for his civil rights on one hand but also oversaw a government that committed war crimes in Vietnam.

Not defending America here but some people who assume America is goodie goodie have to realise it is a superpower just like the USSR was or the British Empire was. Superpowers do not become superpowers by being nice and America has hidden their nasty side well at times but like all superpowers, America can be BOTH a force for a greater good and a greater evil at the same time often.

VicMackey1

The democrats really need to go easy with the racist accusations, especially the likes of AOC. It seems that anyone that questions her agenda will be branded a racist. The party who created the kkk calling everyone else racists is pretty ironic.

Danzy

VicMackey1 wrote: »

The democrats really need to go easy with the racist accusations, especially the likes of AOC. It seems that anyone that questions her agenda will be branded a racist. The party who created the kkk calling everyone else racists is pretty ironic.

AOCs chief of staff was accused of singling out the only native American Congress woman for special abuse, by the house democrats twitter account no less.

alastair

VicMackey1 wrote: »

The democrats really need to go easy with the racist accusations, especially the likes of AOC. It seems that anyone that questions her agenda will be branded a racist. The party who created the kkk calling everyone else racists is pretty ironic.

It’s really not. There’s a racist in the Whitehouse. The GOP has been the go-to party for the KKK since the southern strategy kicked in - fifty years ago now. But Trump is hardly a discreet racist - never has been. This new nonsense is no more offensive than his birther nonsense before he was elected. He’s such low hanging fruit for anyone concerned with racism.

Pa ElGrande

The Late Late Show wrote: »

Not defending America here but some people who assume America is goodie goodie have to realise it is a superpower just like the USSR was or the British Empire was. Superpowers do not become superpowers by being nice and America has hidden their nasty side well at times but like all superpowers, America can be BOTH a force for a greater good and a greater evil at the same time often.

I can broadly agree with some of the things you have written above. America in the aftermath of World War II built the world as we know it today and generally for the better (Many countries economies were totally wrecked in the aftermath and look at them today) at a price to themselves. All empires are money losing entities in the long term and all go bankrupt to be replaced with a nascent superpower. In recent history both the Spanish and British empires went bust. The American administrations since the end of the cold war have decided they now want to reorder the theirs and the worlds affairs since the effects of those policies are now working against their interests and they have decided to flip the board so as to speak. We in Ireland are not isolated from this empire and also have to deal with the competing interests of France and Germany via the EU.



The Muslim Brotherhood as auxiliaries of the Pentagon
by Thierry Meyssan

The Turko-Irish El Mehdi El Hamid El Hamdi, known as « Mahdi Al-Harati », a CIA agent present in the Freedom Flotilla, kisses President Erdogan, who came to visit him in hospital. He would later become the number 2 of the Free Syrian Army.

source

Epstein and the Explosive Crisis of the Deep State
Charles Hugh Smith

The end of World War II was a critical juncture. The proper role of the U.S. in the postwar era was up for grabs, and over the course of a few years, the CIA and other intelligence agencies were established and the doctrine of containment of the Soviet Union became the dominant narrative, a narrative that held with remarkable consistency for four decades until the Soviet Union collapsed in 1991.

This collapse was another critical juncture, and debates over America's role in this "unipolar era" were finally settled in favor of the geopolitical-activist ideology of neoconservatism (Neocons).

This globalist ideology led to a variety of policy disasters and is now discredited in many circles, and has been under attack within the Deep State for some time. This is the divided Deep State I've written about for the past five years.

Is the Deep State Fracturing into Disunity? (March 14, 2014)

Is the Deep State at War--With Itself? (December 14, 2016)


The failures of Neocon globalism have ushered in another critical juncture. What is America's proper role in a multi-polar world that is fracturing across multiple faultlines? This critical juncture is a manifestation of a broader profound political disunity in America and many other nations.

The corporate media has obligingly portrayed this profound political disunity as a contest between "good globalism" and "bad populism," a clear attempt to smear all those who see the dark side of globalism as a threat to the nation and indeed the world. This bias reflects the continued dominance of the Neocon-globalist camp.

source

Midlife

Pa ElGrande wrote: »

Yes and I watched the follow up to that as well. They are not hiding anything as he says the information is there in plain sight put out by the activists behind her.

Wow, you are serious. Can you geniunly not see through those videos?

The half truths, the editing, the comments out of context??

Really? You're a grown up, right?

Eric Cartman

Pa ElGrande wrote: »

Under our current system the rich become powerful, under Socialism the powerful become rich.

Theres also the converse approach.
The idea in many peoples heads is that these charismatic, creative, business people would all be brought down to the level of everyone else under communism/ socialism. Not thrive as high level party officials, generals, corrupt black market traders or any other manor of thrive against adversity. Would they get their dream where denis o brien becomes a factory worker and waits in the bread line , not a chance