Antifa [Mod Warning on post #1 - updated 08/08/19]

Brian?

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The belief that anyone that Antifa deem as fascist are fair game for violent attacks.

That is categorically not what I believe.

I have said many, many time in this thread I believe violence is wrong in all circumstances. I would appreciate an apology.

This isn’t faux outrage. I keep saying violence is wrong and people keep accusing me of supporting violence. It’s infuriating.

Brian?

Brian? wrote: »

That is categorically not what I believe.

I have said many, many time in this thread I believe violence is wrong in all circumstances. I would appreciate an apology.

This isn’t faux outrage. I keep saying violence is wrong and people keep accusing me of supporting violence. It’s infuriating.

I unreservedly apologise Brian. I did think I was responding to another poster. It was not my intention to accuse you.

Brian?

Brian? wrote: »

But in my example they wouldn’t be. Right? Can you acknowledge that.

In no circumstances are groups like the Proud Boys decent and moral. Even if they eliminated the violence they would still hold views that are worth protesting. Would you agree?

If Antifa eliminated the violence, their core message of anti fascism is inherently good. Would you agree?

I do agree that being anti-fascist is inherently good. I just don't think that Antifa are antifascist. I think they are anti-whoever-they-disagree-with and as such, mislabel vast groups of people.

I would be hesitant to call any group created as a joke by a comedian as moral and decent, but the current incarnation of Proud Boys don't strike me as a group which warrant protesting. I would be open to correction if (outside of a few idiots who claim to represent them acting violently) there was evidence that their ethos was egregious.

20Cent

We have a proud boy type group with Gemma O Doherty and her lot outside Google at the moment. They are being laughed at. That's the preferred strategy.

Anto Lynch

20Cent wrote: »

We have a proud boy type group with Gemma O Doherty and her lot outside Google at the moment. They are being laughed at. That's the preferred strategy.

Are they juiced to the gills and wearing Fred Perry polos?

20Cent

20Cent wrote: »

We have a proud boy type group with Gemma O Doherty and her lot outside Google at the moment. They are being laughed at. That's the preferred strategy.

In what way (apart from the fact that you don't like them) are they comparable?

20Cent

Deleted User wrote: »

In what way (apart from the fact that you don't like them) are they comparable?

Anti Women's rights, anti immigrant, anti gay/trans etc

Seanachai

20Cent wrote: »

This antifa sums it up.

They were mighty men and women who fought genuine fascists, I have relatives that fought in WWII and also fought against Franco. Antifa reserve the right to label me as a fascist because of my views on immigration though, if I was in town during a rally, my appearance would probably be excuse enough for them to try and belt me. If an authoritarian regime take over I'll be sleeping in the hills with a hunting rifle fighting them, Irish people don't have the desire for fascism and no amount of meetings or rallies will gain any traction.

Anto Lynch

20Cent wrote: »

Anti Women's rights, anti immigrant, anti gay/trans etc

Sounds like the lads down in the galway mosque.

20Cent

Seanachai wrote: »

They were mighty men and women who fought genuine fascists, I have relatives that fought in WWII and also fought against Franco. Antifa reserve the right to label me as a fascist because of my views on immigration though, if I was in town during a rally, my appearance would probably be excuse enough for them to try and belt me. If an authoritarian regime take over I'll be sleeping in the hills with a hunting rifle fighting them, Irish people don't have the desire for fascism and no amount of meetings or rallies will gain any traction.

Well done fighting in WWII and against Franco. You must be very old now.

20Cent

20Cent wrote: »

Anti Women's rights, anti immigrant, anti gay/trans etc

Absolutely untrue from what I can see.

Anti illegal immigration, supporters (not enforcers) of traditional gender roles and nothing I can see that supports being anti-gay or trans.

In fact, there seems to be quite a large number of ethnic minorities in this supposed white supremist group.

20Cent

20Cent wrote: »

Well done fighting in WWII and against Franco. You must be very old now.

You seem to have a trend of reading what you want instead of reading what is there.

SexBobomb

Seanachai wrote: »

They were mighty men and women who fought genuine fascists, I have relatives that fought in WWII and also fought against Franco.

20Cent wrote: »

Well done fighting in WWII and against Franco. You must be very old now.

??

Seanachai

20Cent wrote: »

Anti Women's rights, anti immigrant, anti gay/trans etc

I'm not a big fan of the proud boys, but I can understand why they came about. I'd say if you actually sat down with some of them it'd be more accurate to say that they're anti fourth wave feminism, anti unchecked immigration and anti promoting ten year old kids in drag dancing in clubs. I'm sure they have friends and relatives who are immigrants or have immigrant parents, LGBT siblings and friends etc

If Antifa were behaving the same way here that they are in the US, there would be what you'd call regular fellas out on the streets too. If it was in my neck of the woods there'd be mammies and grannies belting them with brush handles.

20Cent

Can a freedom lover explain to me why they are so anti immigration.

Freedom everyone do what they want.
Except you, you can't live here, you were born there so you have to stay there.

It's idiotic.

Anto Lynch

20Cent wrote: »

Can a freedom lover explain to me why they are so anti immigration.

Freedom everyone do what they want.
Except you, you can't live here, you were born there so you have to stay there.

It's idiotic.

Who wants no immigration at all? Ive rarely seen anyone call for a shutdown on ALL immigration.

20Cent

20Cent wrote: »

Can a freedom lover explain to me why they are so anti immigration.

Freedom everyone do what they want.
Except you, you can't live here, you were born there so you have to stay there.

It's idiotic.

Illegal immigration is what people are against. Not immigration. It's because there needs to be rules. Some beliefs and practices are not compatible to every country and their way of life.

Complete freedom is anarchy and no right minded person wants that.

Seanachai

20Cent wrote: »

Can a freedom lover explain to me why they are so anti immigration.

Freedom everyone do what they want.
Except you, you can't live here, you were born there so you have to stay there.

It's idiotic.

It's that leading phrase again, 'anti-immigration', I and millions of others who are anti mass immigration are not automatically anti migrant. With all the best will in the world a nation can only accommodate so many people and at certain times less than others.

SexBobomb

SexBobomb wrote: »

??

He said his relatives fought. It's blatantly obvious.

SexBobomb

20Cent wrote: »

Can a freedom lover explain to me why they are so anti immigration.

Freedom everyone do what they want.
Except you, you can't live here, you were born there so you have to stay there.

It's idiotic.

ILLEGAL immigration is what people have a problem with.

20Cent

Proud boy trying to rip up a lgbtq sign.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFGa1YWIMII

Seanachai

20Cent wrote: »

Well done fighting in WWII and against Franco. You must be very old now.

You don't believe that somebody can embody the honourable traits of their ancestors. That we're just solo acts?

SexBobomb

20Cent wrote: »

Proud boy trying to rip up a lgbtq sign.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFGa1YWIMII

20Cent wrote: »

Protip:

Stop watching this stupid nonsense.

They are grifters.

:pac:

20Cent

Deleted User wrote: »

He said his relatives fought. It's blatantly obvious.

Was just making a joke about how proud people are of stuff others did.
The proud boys say west is the best and that they created the best civilisation.
Like they had anything to do with it.

Seanachai

20Cent wrote: »

Proud boy trying to rip up a lgbtq sign.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFGa1YWIMII

Pretty futile attempt alright, the sign isn't specifically relating to LGBT though, it's referring to resistance to a 'fascist America'. In any case he could very well be homophobic, we have no way of knowing which part of the sign has maddened him. Him venting on the sign doesn't necessarily reflect the ethos of the movement.

Seanachai

20Cent wrote: »

Was just making a joke about how proud people are of stuff others did.
The proud boys say west is the best and that they created the best civilisation.
Like they had anything to do with it.

I got that, see above

20Cent

20Cent wrote: »

Was just making a joke about how proud people are of stuff others did.
The proud boys say west is the best and that they created the best civilisation.
Like they had anything to do with it.

Oh I'm sorry. Jokes are usually funny. That's why I got confused.

Personally I think western civilisation is the best and I think they are aware that they personally didn't create it but are just championing it.

Do you think there is a better culture?

Seanachai

Deleted User wrote: »

He said his relatives fought. It's blatantly obvious.

I think it's something to take pride in if you try and honour their memory, if you live like a blaggard and sit in the pub bragging about it then it is sad and pointless.

20Cent

Doug Stanhope on nationalism
Sums it up well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QsPDT5qHtZ4

20Cent

20Cent wrote: »

Doug Stanhope on nationalism
Sums it up well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QsPDT5qHtZ4

I cant watch that as I am in work.

Would you care to summarise what was said?