Antifa [Mod Warning on post #1 - updated 08/08/19]

mad muffin

20Cent wrote: »

Can a freedom lover explain to me why they are so anti immigration.

Freedom everyone do what they want.
Except you, you can't live here, you were born there so you have to stay there.

It's idiotic.

I have no doubt that there are people who are anti immigration of people other than white. But the vast. Vast. Vast. Vast. As 99.999999% are not in favour of open un vetted mass immigration. There need to be an immigration plan. One that is sustainable. One that is vetted.

When I came to Ireland I needed to show my passport. I needed to provide finger prints. I needed to answer question.

It’s not unreasonable.

Anto Lynch

20Cent wrote: »

Doug Stanhope on nationalism
Sums it up well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QsPDT5qHtZ4

Im hurt that doug doesnt approve of me putting my homeland first above all else. I may just give up the whole nationalist thing after watching this.

20Cent

Deleted User wrote: »

I cant watch that as I am in work.

Would you care to summarise what was said?

He's making fun of people claiming to have won WWII today as if it has anything to do with them He also says if someone who can't speak the language arrives in your country and takes your job maybe you should upskill. Basically how stupid nationalism is.

Anto Lynch

20Cent wrote: »

He's making fun of people claiming to have won WWII today as if it has anything to do with them He also says if someone who can't speak the language arrives in your country and takes your job maybe you should upskill. Basically how stupid nationalism is.

Or maybe the immigrant should have upskilled and stayed at home. But then upskilling isnt an option for everyone.

20Cent

Anto Lynch wrote: »

Im hurt that doug doesnt approve of me putting my homeland first above all else. I may just give up the whole nationalist thing after watching this.

Great glad it helped.

20Cent

20Cent wrote: »

He's making fun of people claiming to have won WWII today as if it has anything to do with them He also says if someone who can't speak the language arrives in your country and takes your job maybe you should upskill. Basically how stupid nationalism is.

Oh right. I would have thought that being proud of the sacrifice of men and women to ensure our freedom from the tyranny of Nazis would be exactly what Antifa would be about... silly me.

So whats your view on immigration and integration?

Danzy

20Cent wrote: »

Can a freedom lover explain to me why they are so anti immigration.

Freedom everyone do what they want.
Except you, you can't live here, you were born there so you have to stay there.

It's idiotic.

Probably a left wing perspective on some economics.

20Cent

Deleted User wrote: »

Oh right. I would have thought that being proud of the sacrifice of men and women to ensure our freedom from the tyranny of Nazis would be exactly what Antifa would be about... silly me.

So whats your view on immigration and integration?

Why be proud about something someone else did? If you want to do something now how about fighting against current fascism.

20Cent

20Cent wrote: »

Why be proud about something someone else did? If you want to do something now how about fighting against current fascism.

Like you do? :pac: What do you do to fight fascism that makes you proud?

Are the proud boys fascists?

My daughter learned how to play a song on the piano the other day. Now, I personally didn't learn it and it wasn't a heroic achievement by her by any stretch of the imagination but I felt proud.

I can see why people might find pride in their ancestors heroic achievements.

Seanachai

20Cent wrote: »

He's making fun of people claiming to have won WWII today as if it has anything to do with them He also says if someone who can't speak the language arrives in your country and takes your job maybe you should upskill. Basically how stupid nationalism is.

Doug is very clever, he can also be funny from time to time. Saying you can't take pride in the legacy or achievements of your ancestors, provided you uphold their values is as idiotic as ultra-nationalism, taking credit is lame and is a different thing entirely.

Identifying with the broader culture of your nation is also a healthy thing and doesn't mean you're not an individual or you only care about your own nation.

Leaving aside the type of jingoism that surrounds military history nobody would dream of insulting a Maori person or a Navajo for them calling on the strength of their ancestors or taking pride in their struggle. It's an integral part of their identity and it's also a big part of our identity.

I could go into the part that the ancestors used to play in our psychology and spirituality and still do even in Irish Catholicism, but I don't think it would go down too well :rolleyes:

Seanachai

Anto Lynch wrote: »

Or maybe the immigrant should have upskilled and stayed at home. But then upskilling isnt an option for everyone.

FG use this a lot, 'Pull your socks up', we're all supposed to become coders

20Cent

Seanachai wrote: »

Doug is very clever, he can also be funny from time to time. Saying you can't take pride in the legacy or achievements of your ancestors, provided you uphold their values is as idiotic as ultra-nationalism, taking credit is lame and is a different thing entirely.

Identifying with the broader culture of your nation is also a healthy thing and doesn't mean you're not an individual or you only care about your own nation.

Leaving aside the type of jingoism that surrounds military history nobody would dream of insulting a Maori person or a Navajo for them calling on the strength of their ancestors or taking pride in their struggle. It's an integral part of their identity and it's also a big part of our identity.

I could go into the part that the ancestors used to play in our psychology and spirituality and still do even in Irish Catholicism, but I don't think it would go down too well :rolleyes:

Hes6talking about people who say stuff like if it wasn't for us the French would be speaking German now. Like the proud boys do.

Einstein was white so am I.
I discovered the theory of relativity.

20Cent

Anto Lynch wrote: »

Or maybe the immigrant should have upskilled and stayed at home. But then upskilling isnt an option for everyone.

If your home is on fire or if you will be killed if you stay there upskilling won't make much difference.

Anto Lynch

20Cent wrote: »

If your home is on fire or if you will be killed if you stay there upskilling won't make much difference.

Yeah that seems to be the go to excuse for many bogus asylum seekers "im being persecuted in my home country"

Absolutley impossible to disprove of course.

20Cent

20Cent wrote: »

Hes6talking about people who say stuff like if it wasn't for us the French would be speaking German now. Like the proud boys do.

Einstein was white so am I.
I discovered the theory of relativity.

There is a flaw in your reasoning.

When an American or English person uses the "if it wasn't for us, the X would be speaking German" it's usually as a response to someone criticising their country or nationality. So when they say "us" they mean their nationality/country, not the specific individuals.

That's why your Einstein comparison doesn't work. At all.

Seanachai

20Cent wrote: »

Hes6talking about people who say stuff like if it wasn't for us the French would be speaking German now. Like the proud boys do.

Einstein was white so am I.
I discovered the theory of relativity.

I get that, I think if you're made of the same stuff as those people and you live by their example you're entitled to a bit of pride, taking credit is daft though.

I've had conversations with people who believe that their family line or wider community has no influence on who they are, that they're completely self-made, which I think is denial on a grand scale. It doesn't hold up to research or science either.

Brian?

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I unreservedly apologise Brian. I did think I was responding to another poster. It was not my intention to accuse you.

Thanks. Appreciate it.

20Cent

Deleted User wrote: »

There is a flaw in your reasoning.

When an American or English person uses the "if it wasn't for us, the X would be speaking German" it's usually as a response to someone criticising their country or nationality. So when they say "us" they mean their nationality/country, not the specific individuals.

That's why your Einstein comparison doesn't work. At all.

So they are taking credit for something another person did because they are the same colour. Stolen valor it's called.

Have you read my book Ulysses?
Gets good reviews.

20Cent

20Cent wrote: »

So they are taking credit for something another person did because they are the same colour. Stolen valor it's called.

Have you read my book Ulysses?
Gets good reviews.

I've already explained it to you.

They aren't taking personal credit. Much like when people refer to Man Utd or Liverpool as "us" or "we", they don't actually take credit for the goings on during a match but through the support they have for the team, they feel emotionally tied/invested in them.

Stolen Valor is completely different.

The fact that you can't/won't differentiate between the two suggests you are either wilfully conflating them in order to deceive or mistakenly conflating the two through ignorance.

Brian?

Seanachai wrote: »

FG use this a lot, 'Pull your socks up', we're all supposed to become coders

I'm as left wing as they come and I believe people should upskill and do everything they can to make themselves more employable before claiming that foreigners are stealing their jobs.

In my previous job in Ireland, I hired a load of guys who were ex brick layers, carpenters, electricians, fitters and car mechanics who had lost their jobs during the crash. They went back to college and studied engineering and now have excellent paying permanent jobs. So it's not all about becoming coders, there are plenty of high tech jobs out there where skills are transferable.

Seanachai

Brian? wrote: »

I'm as left wing as they come and I believe people should upskill and do everything they can to make themselves more employable before claiming that foreigners are stealing their jobs.

In my previous job in Ireland, I hired a load of guys who were ex brick layers, carpenters, electricians, fitters and car mechanics who had lost their jobs during the crash. They went back to college and studied engineering and now have excellent paying permanent jobs. So it's not all about becoming coders, there are plenty of high tech jobs out there where skills are transferable.

I'm upskilling myself, but not everybody has the aptitude for it, my post was commenting on the pull up your socks retorts often given by FG ministers. We could generate thousands of low or semi-skilled jobs here if we invested in certain agricultural projects.

I worked in construction and I believe in workers rights for Irish born and migrants, I worked with foreign nationals who were crammed into houses, sometimes owned by the boss and treated like modern day slaves.

Walter Bishop

Brian? wrote: »

I'm as left wing as they come and I believe people should upskill and do everything they can to make themselves more employable before claiming that foreigners are stealing their jobs.

Yep this is it, you have people complaining that 'their' jobs are being stolen whilst doing nothing to actually make it their job in the first place.


For decades now people have been lapping up a diet of diversionary nonsense from corporations and the politicians who are in the pockets of these corporations - they cut your rights as workers and have demolished the collective bargaining power of the workforce by destroying unions, give themselves tax cuts and then tell you that it's the guy or girl coming from Poland to stack shelves in Tesco is the reason you haven't had an increase in real wages since the 1980s and yours is the first generation on target to be less healthy and less wealthy than the previous one.


"If you can convince the lowest white man he's better than the best colored man, he won't notice you're picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he'll empty his pockets for you." - Lyndon Johnson.

Seanachai

Walter Bishop wrote: »

Yep this is it, you have people complaining that 'their' jobs are being stolen whilst doing nothing to actually make it their job in the first place.


For decades now people have been lapping up a diet of diversionary nonsense from corporations and the politicians who are in the pockets of these corporations - they cut your rights as workers and have demolished the collective bargaining power of the workforce by destroying unions, give themselves tax cuts and then tell you that it's the guy or girl coming from Poland to stack shelves in Tesco is the reason you haven't had an increase in real wages since the 1980s and yours is the first generation on target to be less healthy and less wealthy than the previous one.


"If you can convince the lowest white man he's better than the best colored man, he won't notice you're picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he'll empty his pockets for you." - Lyndon Johnson.

I don't blame the workers for wanting to better themselves, escape some sort of a regime or even just wanting a change. The ruling class don't give a jot if somebody comes here and has to live in squalor, lie on a trolley in a hallway if they get sick, get stuck in a poverty trap etc. It works out great for them because they own the companies that hire them and rent the houses to them.

mad muffin

Walter Bishop wrote: »

Yep this is it, you have people complaining that 'their' jobs are being stolen whilst doing nothing to actually make it their job in the first place.


For decades now people have been lapping up a diet of diversionary nonsense from corporations and the politicians who are in the pockets of these corporations - they cut your rights as workers and have demolished the collective bargaining power of the workforce by destroying unions, give themselves tax cuts and then tell you that it's the guy or girl coming from Poland to stack shelves in Tesco is the reason you haven't had an increase in real wages since the 1980s and yours is the first generation on target to be less healthy and less wealthy than the previous one.


"If you can convince the lowest white man he's better than the best colored man, he won't notice you're picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he'll empty his pockets for you." - Lyndon Johnson.

A democrat. This is their MO. divide and conquer.

Walter Bishop

Walter Bishop wrote:

"If you can convince the lowest white man he's better than the best colored man, he won't notice you're picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he'll empty his pockets for you." - Lyndon Johnson.

"If you smeeeeeellll, what the rock is cooking" - Dwayne Johnson

About as relevant as your quote

Overheal

mad muffin wrote: »

[/B]


A democrat. This is their MO. divide and conquer.

Ironically, you’re such a proponent of mutualism and unity.

mad muffin

Overheal wrote: »

Ironically, you’re such a proponent of mutualism and unity.

Oh I’m sorry. Am I keeping you from posting a pic of a dog whistle somewhere in these forums?

Danzy

Seanachai wrote: »

I don't blame the workers for wanting to better themselves, escape some sort of a regime or even just wanting a change. The ruling class don't give a jot if somebody comes here and has to live in squalor, lie on a trolley in a hallway if they get sick, get stuck in a poverty trap etc. It works out great for them because they own the companies that hire them and rent the houses to them.

This is it, the current levels of migration are purely about neo liberalism, you can't have a neo Liberal economy with large on going migration inwards.

No more than one can sustain a Socialist orientated State, even a mild form with migration as is.

Saying a worker in Dublin is in the same class struggle and shared commonality with a worker in Delhi etc is great chat but on the ground, it isn't that way.

Il Fascista

mad muffin wrote: »

[/B]


A democrat. This is their MO. divide and conquer.

Another one of his quotes:

I’ll Have Those N*****s Voting Democratic for 200 Years

He seems like a typical modern democrat minus the politically correct filter.

20Cent

mad muffin wrote: »

[/B]


A democrat. This is their MO. divide and conquer.

Trump is so great at bringing people together.