Will Britain ever just piss off and get on with Brexit? -mod warning in OP (21/12)

knipex

blinding wrote: »

Apparently the Eu and the 26 Counties don’t want a No Deal . Surely if this is true then they must come up with a deal acceptable to Boris Johnson's government . It takes two sides to make a deal .

So your idea of a debate is to repeat the same thing over and over without addressing any od the points of comments raised by anyone else ??

blinding

knipex wrote: »

So all this to prevent free movement but the UK is going to leave one of its borders wide open for anyone to cross ??

All this for the UK to take back control but the UK is going to leave one of its borders wide open for anyone to bring anything they can get into the republic into the UK ?

Are you really that naive ? Or do you just think the rest of us are idiots..

Sure its not that easy to swim to Scotland . :eek:

It about the British People running their own Country , just like the Irish People wanted to run their own Country after 1916 . It really is weird that Irish People cannot see this .

Leo Varadkar is not running the 26 Counties . How could he be when he is on his knees in Brussel so much :eek:

Topgear on Dave

blinding wrote: »

How could he be when he is on his knees in Brussel so much :eek:

Nudge nudge wink wink we get you...

Peregrinus

blinding wrote: »

Apparently the Eu and the 26 Counties don’t want a No Deal . Surely if this is true then they must come up with a deal acceptable to Boris Johnson's government . It takes two sides to make a deal .

It's for Johnson's government to say what it wants. The UK position all along has been that the UK, not the EU, will bring forward alternative arrnagements to the backstop; they want to be in control of the process of developing them. The Jt Report provides for them to do this; this was at their insistence. And that is still the UK position. Keep up, blinding.

Stop moaning ffs

FrancieBrady wrote: »

They don't want the UK to leave at all, and they don't want a No deal.

However, what the loony fringe of Brexiteers didn't countenance in their nostalgic Empire day dreams is that the EU will do whatever is necessary to protect it's integrity and survival.

Which side do you want to see win there by the way?

Poster can’t say ireland. Only 26 counties.

Doesn’t remind you of someone else at all? Who refuses to even spell Irish or republican names ?

blinding

gmisk wrote: »

What is the border going to be then? How is it going to be solved? With this non existent technology? What is it? When will it be invented?
Whats the dig at Leo about? Bizarre
I am not sure the DUP would be exactly thrilled about that....and last I heard there votes were needed and they are very much in bed with BJ and JRM.

Nobody is putting up a hard border ; No One .

Britain is leaving the Eu .

The Eu does not want to make a deal acceptable to Boris Johnson’s government .

Obviously the Brits are going to let the Eu does as it pleases in the 26 Counties .

blinding

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

Nudge nudge wink wink we get you...

I mean politically on his knees in Brussels . I have no interest in what consenting adults do in the privacy of their own bedrooms . Also , so long as it does not frighten the horses .

gmisk

blinding wrote: »

Nobody is putting up a hard border ; No One .

Britain is leaving the Eu .

The Eu does not want to make a deal acceptable to Boris Johnson’s government .

Obviously the Brits are going to let the Eu does as it pleases in the 26 Counties .

ok.....but there has to be a border......Are you actually from Ireland/Northern Ireland?
You cant have goods, people etc just moving back and forth from one EU country to another non-EU country....do you not get it?

What deal would be acceptable to Boris Johnsons government? They dont seem to be coming up with any suggestions by the looks of it...the EU arent psychic!


Why do you keep talking about the 26 counties it is bizarre.

pauldla

blinding wrote: »

.....
It about the British People running their own Country , just like the Irish People wanted to run their own Country after 1916 . It really is weird that Irish People cannot see this .

......

If you cannot see the differences between Ireland's experience of being ruled from Westminster and Ireland's experience of participation in the EU, then I suggest you have very little knowledge of either.

blinding

Peregrinus wrote: »

It's for Johnson's government to say what it wants. The UK position all along has been that the UK, not the EU, will bring forward alternative arrnagements to the backstop; they want to be in control of the process of developing them. The Jt Report provides for them to do this; this was at their insistence. And that is still the UK position. Keep up, blinding.

It takes two to make a deal .

The Eu has to accept the Democratic Decision of the UK to leave .

The Eu has to stop listening to Re-moaners . Britain is leaving the Eu . Bye bye .

blinding

pauldla wrote: »

If you cannot see the differences between Ireland's experience of being ruled from Westminster and Ireland's experience of participation in the EU, then I suggest you have very little knowledge of either.

There was many Irish people in favour of being part of the UK throughout history . There were many Irish people on their knees to the Catholic Church Empire . Now the Irish People have moved their devotion to the Eu . Their is something in the Irish psyche about being on their knees to something or other .

downcow

is_that_so wrote: »

One can only consider changing one's mind if there is something worth exploring. To date there has been none.

Tell merkel and Macron that

gmisk

blinding wrote: »

It takes two to make a deal .

The Eu has to accept the Democratic Decision of the UK to leave .

The Eu has to stop listening to Re-moaners . Britain is leaving the Eu . Bye bye .

It does...but it seems like the EU are they only ones at the table currently.


It does....but it doesnt mean they have to compromise their positions and another member state.


Ok.....piss off...take a no deal then and to hell with consequences...
All the lovely things the UK will gain like errr blue passports...made in France/Poland.

blinding

gmisk wrote: »

ok.....but there has to be a border......Are you actually from Ireland/Northern Ireland?
You cant have goods, people etc just moving back and forth from one EU country to another non-EU country....do you not get it?

What deal would be acceptable to Boris Johnsons government? They dont seem to be coming up with any suggestions by the looks of it...the EU arent psychic!


Why do you keep talking about the 26 counties it is bizarre.

The 26 Counties is accurate and short .

The Eu in cohort with re-moaners are trying to subvert British democracy . They have not being and are not acting in good faith . What else would you expect from anti-democrats ?:eek:

downcow

FrancieBrady wrote: »

How have they 'moved positions'?

Merkel got Johnson to admit that it was a problem for him to solve. She toyed with him. He was a naive political lightweight in Berlin tbh.

Macron said the WA could be amended - he wasn't saying that over last 2 years

Panthro

blinding wrote: »

There was many Irish people in favour of being part of the UK throughout history . There were many Irish people on their knees to the Catholic Church Empire . Now the Irish People have moved their devotion to the Eu . Their is something in the Irish psyche about being on their knees to something or other .

We have a live one here

is_that_so

downcow wrote: »

Tell merkel and Macron that

They are only two out of 27.

pauldla

blinding wrote: »

There was many Irish people in favour of being part of the UK throughout history . There were many Irish people on their knees to the Catholic Church Empire . Now the Irish People have moved their devotion to the Eu . Their is something in the Irish psyche about being on their knees to something or other .

Whether your comment is true or not, it in no way addresses the point I made. Perhaps you should take a break from the keyboard for a short while, take a stroll, have a cup of tea...?

mrbrianj

blinding wrote: »

It takes two to make a deal .

The Eu has to accept the Democratic Decision of the UK to leave .

The Eu has to stop listening to Re-moaners . Britain is leaving the Eu . Bye bye .

This has been accepted by the EU. Now your turn to listen to the EU - Bye Bye.

The debate in the UK is different than the diplomatic level discussions - we know you are leaving, dont get confused with the UK's political internal fighting.

is_that_so

downcow wrote: »

Macron said the WA could be amended - he wasn't saying that over last 2 years

They've always been open to alternatives. The trouble is none of them are worth looking at. The last two years have been about May failing to get the deal past parliament. Telling BJ they are open to alternatives is no change of position.

gmisk

blinding wrote: »

The 26 Counties is accurate and short .

The Eu in cohort with re-moaners are trying to subvert British democracy . They have not being and are not acting in good faith . What else would you expect from anti-democrats ?:eek:

You could just call it ireland....


What a load of BS. The EU are not willing to sell Ireland down the river there is a huge difference. They also have provided and supported alternatives to a hard brexit, which have been repeatedly turned down by by parliament. What alternatives are BJ and JRM etc offering now?

The representatives in the EU are democratically elected....or did you miss the fact Ireland and the UK recently elected MEPs?

blinding

mrbrianj wrote: »

This has been accepted by the EU. Now your turn to listen to the EU - Bye Bye.

The Democray of the British people has not been respected by the Eu and Re-Moaners . They have to pretend the Eu Emperor is fully dressed .

Britain leaving will show the Eu is bollock naked :eek:

Pablo Escobar

blinding wrote: »

It takes two to make a deal .

The Eu has to accept the Democratic Decision of the UK to leave .

The Eu has to stop listening to Re-moaners . Britain is leaving the Eu . Bye bye .

The rest of the EU just want it done at this stage. The UK has become a basket case, not unlike the posts that you've been making. It's unfortunate that Ireland will be caught up in it, but TBH I just want it done now too. There's too much lunacy come from the uk side and it needs a root and stem approach now.

And Ireland will build a border if necessary.....we're not some rogue state.....

gmisk

blinding wrote: »

The Democray of the British people has not been respected by the Eu and Re-Moaners . They have to pretend the Eu Emperor is fully dressed .

Britain leaving will show the Eu is bollock naked :eek:

Do you know what...at this stage...just go...you literally cannot spell democracy never mind understand it.



Enjoy
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Yellowhammer

downcow

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

The EU is IMV prepared to look at things again if, and only if the UK comes up with a credible alternative to the Backstop.

UK hasn't come up with any great ideas on that front has it? EU is loyal to International Treaties, but the UK doesn't appear to care much.

I don't know what will happen, but if an election can happen somehow, given the constraints of the FTPA, and say the Tories get a decent working majority, maybe a border in the Irish Sea (ditch the DUP) and a NI special economic zone or something will work.

Time to crack on..... again.

The ulster unionists layed out what seemed like a solution the other day. I'll ttry to find the radio link. I felt it was all very reasonable.

In short (and i don't do it justice)
No border checks
It is illegal to transport goods across border without correct paperwork etc - therefore a crime - therefore people doing it are prosicuted heavly as deterrent
EU & Ire keep saying they need backstop as an insurance - so UK simply provide the insurance i.e. if goods arrive in the EU through the UK then UK pays compensation (thats what insurance is) and could be vice versa. That will motivate authorities to ensure it doesn't happen.

....But i know it is silly coming up with solutions as the border issue is Irelands insurance about keeping UK in a customs arrangement with them - a red herring

Blueshoe

Pablo Escobar wrote: »

The rest of the just want it done at this stage. The UK has become a basket case, not unlike the posts that you've been making. It's unfortunate that Ireland will be caught up in it, but TBH I just want it done now too. There's too much lunacy come from the uk side and it needs a root and stem approach now.

And Ireland will build a border if necessary.....we're not some rogue state.....

More like a banana outpost than a rogue state

mrbrianj

blinding wrote: »

The Democray of the British people has not been respected by the Eu and Re-Moaners . They have to pretend the Eu Emperor is fully dressed .

Britain leaving will show the Eu is bollock naked :eek:

How so on the EU's part? They accepted A50 and entered into discussion to agree a withdrawal agreement. everything to facilitate your leaving.

Whether the UK understood the implications for their own red lines is an other matter.

Its not the EU blocking the Uk leaving.

blinding

gmisk wrote: »

You could just call it ireland....


What a load of BS. The EU are not willing to sell Ireland down the river there is a huge difference. They also have provided and supported alternatives to a hard brexit, which have been repeatedly turned down by by parliament. What alternatives are BJ and JRM etc offering now?

The representatives in the EU are democratically elected....or did you miss the fact Ireland and the UK recently elected MEPs?

The 26 Counties is not Ireland .

The Eu parliament is a parody parliament . Would a real parliament have accepted Ursula von day Leyeun (?) pulled out of Merkel's arras .

Britain has two choices now ; Leave the Eu with No Deal = definitely out of the Eu = Tres Bien .

The Eu agrees a deal with the Uk . The Eu has not negotiated in good faith . Why would the Uk waste their time with them .

downcow

knipex wrote: »

So all this to prevent free movement but the UK is going to leave one of its borders wide open for anyone to cross ??

All this for the UK to take back control but the UK is going to leave one of its borders wide open for anyone to bring anything they can get into the republic into the UK ?

Are you really that naive ? Or do you just think the rest of us are idiots..

Red herring and spin.
the huge difference is that those from 26 countries can come into UK legally and work etc. The changes will mean they can't legally. and of course some people will fly under the radar but it would transforn numbers and the benifits they are due etc

gmisk

downcow wrote: »

The ulster unionists layed out what seemed like a solution the other day. I'll ttry to find the radio link. I felt it was all very reasonable.

In short (and i don't do it justice)
No border checks
It is illegal to transport goods across border without correct paperwork etc - therefore a crime - therefore people doing it are prosicuted heavly as deterrent
EU & Ire keep saying they need backstop as an insurance - so UK simply provide the insurance i.e. if goods arrive in the EU through the UK then UK pays compensation (thats what insurance is) and could be vice versa. That will motivate authorities to ensure it doesn't happen.

....But i know it is silly coming up with solutions as the border issue is Irelands insurance about keeping UK in a customs arrangement with them - a red herring

So basically operate a countries border on a trust basis?.......I cant see that back firing at all....