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Will Britain ever just piss off and get on with Brexit? -mod warning in OP (21/12)

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    #3872
    is_that_so
    Registered Users Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    davedanon wrote: »
    The only way May could have taken them out in March would have been to crash out.

    But she obviously cared too much about the fate of her country to do that.
    And that she had signed a deal.


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    #3873
    gmisk
    Registered Users Posts: 33,177 ✭✭✭✭gmisk


    davedanon wrote: »
    The only way May could have taken them out in March would have been to crash out.

    But she obviously cared too much about the fate of her country to do that.
    I agree, I think she tried her best...how many times did she put the deal up for a vote?
    She strikes me as someone who is at least honest and decent.

    It was JRM and BJ along with the DUP that were so opposed to the backstop (i.e. pretty much the only workable option put forward so far).

    If you want to go back a bit further I think David Cameron needs to take a fair share of the blame!
    He swanned off pretty quickly when it was clear the sh#t was gonna hit the fan!


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    #3874
    screamer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,156 ✭✭✭screamer


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    Nope, 17.4 voted to leave. If she had of taken them out in March, this mess would not be ongoing.

    True, this mess wouldn’t but the mess of total breakdown of the UK would be the headlines of the day, along with the IMF coming to town to sort it out.

    Europe to the UK is like a complex tumour, intertwined with its vital organs which needs to be removed, but to do so may well mean death for it as a whole. Brexiteers are taking massive risks that that won’t happen or hoping for the best.


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    #3875
    InTheShadows
    Closed Accounts Posts: 727 ✭✭✭InTheShadows


    davedanon wrote: »
    17.4 million Brits that were misinformed, manipulated and lied to by a bunch of people who ran a fraudulent campaign.

    All politicians lie. You can't pick and choose, democracy is democracy.

    It's No Deal in a few weeks now without doubt.


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    #3876
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 69,264 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    InTheShadows wrote: »
    All politicians lie. You can't pick and choose, democracy is democracy.

    It's No Deal in a few weeks now without doubt.

    Last night was democratic, as far as I could see, as tonight will be.


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    #3877
    Irishmale0399
    Registered Users Posts: 3,249 ✭✭✭Irishmale0399


    davedanon wrote: »
    The only way May could have taken them out in March would have been to crash out.

    But she obviously cared too much about the fate of her country to do that.


    I actually felt sorry for the lady. She was hitting her head of a brick wall and was never going to win. She tried, she was let down and now we can see it is all happening again.......wish they would grow a pair and just go on the 31. Oct.


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    #3878
    davedanon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,062 ✭✭✭davedanon


    InTheShadows wrote: »
    All politicians lie. You can't pick and choose, democracy is democracy.

    It's No Deal in a few weeks now without doubt.


    Ah, the old 'they're all the same' argument. The Leave campaign was corrupt. That's not in doubt.

    They're putting through legislation as we speak, mate. How is it going to be no deal?


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    #3879
    MadYaker
    Registered Users Posts: 12,223 ✭✭✭✭MadYaker


    InTheShadows wrote: »
    All politicians lie. You can't pick and choose, democracy is democracy.

    It's No Deal in a few weeks now without doubt.

    The bill they're voting on tonight pretty much prevents a no deal exit on the 29th unless the EU refuse an extension. All the rebels + lib dems + labour will vote for it so it'll pass.


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    #3880
    coolbeans
    Registered Users Posts: 3,120 ✭✭✭coolbeans


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    May has nothing to be laughing about. She is a traitor and the very reason this mess is where its at


    This is from the guy who says the EU is undemocratic yet considers Putin, the leader of an anti-democratic, murderous, corrupt, journalist killing kleptocracy, a legend.
    Jog on son just jog on. Men going their own way are looking for a resident spoofer.


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    #3881
    gmisk
    Registered Users Posts: 33,177 ✭✭✭✭gmisk


    InTheShadows wrote: »
    All politicians lie. You can't pick and choose, democracy is democracy.

    It's No Deal in a few weeks now without doubt.
    Still plenty of doubt...have a look at the betting odds and where they are going, usually a good indicator.

    No deal Brexit?
    No - 4/11
    Yes - 9/4 (on odds checker)


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    #3882
    ToddyDoody
    Registered Users Posts: 4,417 ✭✭✭ToddyDoody


    briany wrote: »
    Aren't there a contingent of the Conservatives who've said they wouldn't accept the WA, with or without a backstop?

    Given all the focus on the border recently, I was thinking a national 'picnic on the border' would be a nice event to organise.

    BYOB.


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    #3883
    cnocbui
    Registered Users Posts: 20,090 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    ToddyDoody wrote: »
    Given all the focus on the border recently, I was thinking a national 'picnic on the border' would be a nice event to organise.

    BYOB.

    That should be BYOU. :rolleyes:


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    #3884
    quokula
    Registered Users Posts: 3,643 ✭✭✭quokula


    gmisk wrote: »
    I agree, I think she tried her best...how many times did she put the deal up for a vote?
    She strikes me as someone who is at least honest and decent.

    It was her red lines and refusal to compromise with anyone but the hard right of her party that meant parliament wouldn't vote for the deal. Some hardcore ERG would vote down everything, and some hardcore remainers would vote down everything, but there was a majority for a middle ground and the deal could have got through parliament if she'd compromised more with Labour and was willing to make a customs union a part of the political declaration along with commitments to workers rights and environmental regulations.

    Remember that while the media and the hard right were puffing their chest about the backstop being the problem, the majority of MPs who voted it down were actually not concerned with that part of the withdrawal agreement and were more concerned with what they called a "blind Brexit" - the fact it was an exit without any commitments for what the future would look like.

    And in general, between her squirming in PMQs and her go home vans, honest and decent are not words I'd use to describe Theresa May. Although she does look like a saint compared to her successor.


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    #3885
    Eric Cartman
    Registered Users Posts: 26,280 ✭✭✭✭Eric Cartman


    Is there any way to guarantee the EU won't provide an extension, is there any indications that they won't ?


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    #3886
    MadYaker
    Registered Users Posts: 12,223 ✭✭✭✭MadYaker


    Id be surprised if they refused the extension, especially if it's for an election. But who knows its all a bit confusing!


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    #3887
    First Up
    Registered Users Posts: 14,822 ✭✭✭✭First Up


    MadYaker wrote:
    Id be surprised if they refused the extension, especially if it's for an election. But who knows its all a bit confusing!


    It needs the approval of 27 countries and Macron has been loud in saying he won't.


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    #3888
    davedanon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,062 ✭✭✭davedanon


    I think that was a while back, and in different circumstances. They've said that an election would constitute good grounds for an extension. Macron will make noise maybe, but go along.


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    #3889
    Feisar
    Registered Users Posts: 6,674 ✭✭✭Feisar


    davedanon wrote: »
    17.4 million Brits that were misinformed, manipulated and lied to by a bunch of people who ran a fraudulent campaign.

    The easily duped have a vote! Lot to be said for a basic IQ test at polling stations.

    First they came for the socialists...



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    #3890
    Eric Cartman
    Registered Users Posts: 26,280 ✭✭✭✭Eric Cartman


    Feisar wrote: »
    The easily duped have a vote! Lot to be said for a basic IQ test at polling stations.

    NI and scotland would never get anyone elected ever again.


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    #3891
    knipex
    Registered Users Posts: 2,018 ✭✭✭knipex


    Eric Cartman wrote: »
    Is there any way to guarantee the EU won't provide an extension, is there any indications that they won't ?

    If its specifically for an election or a rerun of the referendum then there is a strong possibility that it will be granted. Far from guaranteed but a strong possibility.

    For any other reason in particular to negotiate a "New Deal" even Corbyn's version of a "New Deal" ..... not a chance.....


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    #3892
    ToddyDoody
    Registered Users Posts: 4,417 ✭✭✭ToddyDoody


    First Up wrote: »
    It needs the approval of 27 countries and Macron has been loud in saying he won't.

    Is this for the picnic on the border?


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    #3893
    Kidchameleon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,482 ✭✭✭Kidchameleon


    Deleted User wrote: »
    OK so tell me, given that they were repeatedly told by the Leave Campaign that there would be an exit deal.

    What deal should she have taken them out with, which covered all red lines?


    They were told repeatedly by the government that there will not necessarily be a deal. Article 50 itself does not state that thee must be a deal. The EU and the commission said this also.


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    #3894
    Kidchameleon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,482 ✭✭✭Kidchameleon


    davedanon wrote: »
    I didn't call anyone a traitor.


    Thats not the part of your post I was referring to. You asked my why I cared. Now, please tell me why you care and I will tell you why I care.


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    #3895
    Eric Cartman
    Registered Users Posts: 26,280 ✭✭✭✭Eric Cartman


    knipex wrote: »
    If its specifically for an election or a rerun of the referendum then there is a strong possibility that it will be granted. Far from guaranteed but a strong possibility.

    For any other reason in particular to negotiate a "New Deal" even Corbyn's version of a "New Deal" ..... not a chance.....

    so considering the last vote, lets say for example now, EU says no to an extension, no deal in place, but thats now 'illegal' or whatever. How does that go down ?


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    #3896
    Blueshoe
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,964 ✭✭✭Blueshoe


    seamus wrote: »
    Moggy is the worst example of humanity. He's trying to push an entire country under the bus in order to make himself wealthier.

    He's absolute scum and should be hanging in Trafalgar square, not relaxing in Westminster. He provides nothing of value to this planet and creates only misery and division.

    I like him. He knows what he wants and doesn't hide . He's a real life patriot.

    Doesn't mean I agree with his view but we could do with someone like him here.

    Varadkar and co are a pathetic bunch of cowards


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    #3897
    declanflynn
    Registered Users Posts: 1,159 ✭✭✭declanflynn


    Blueshoe wrote: »
    seamus wrote: »
    Moggy is the worst example of humanity. He's trying to push an entire country under the bus in order to make himself wealthier.

    He's absolute scum and should be hanging in Trafalgar square, not relaxing in Westminster. He provides nothing of value to this planet and creates only misery and division.

    I like him. He knows what he wants and doesn't hide . He's a real life patriot.

    Doesn't mean I agree with his view but we could do with someone like him here.

    Varadkar and co are a pathetic bunch of cowards
    The brits want to leave the EU but haven't the bottle to do it, I think that makes them the cowards


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    #3898
    declanflynn
    Registered Users Posts: 1,159 ✭✭✭declanflynn


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    davedanon wrote: »
    I didn't call anyone a traitor.


    Thats not the part of your post I was referring to. You asked my why I cared. Now, please tell me why you care and I will tell you why I care.
    Nobody cares about the brits, most of their MPs dont even care about the them that's why they are ignoring the will if the people


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    #3899
    davedanon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,062 ✭✭✭davedanon


    Blueshoe wrote:
    Doesn't mean I agree with his view but we could do with someone like him here.

    Blueshoe wrote:
    I like him. He knows what he wants and doesn't hide . He's a real life patriot.

    Blueshoe wrote:
    Varadkar and co are a pathetic bunch of cowards


    Pathetic stuff.


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    #3900
    Eric Cartman
    Registered Users Posts: 26,280 ✭✭✭✭Eric Cartman


    declanflynn wrote: »
    The brits want to leave the EU but haven't the bottle to do it, I think that makes them the cowards

    at this point it more seems that theres a considerable section of politicians trying to carry out the democratic will of the people and there are contrarians who will flip flop all over the place hoping that the entire thing will just be scrapped.


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    #3901
    davedanon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,062 ✭✭✭davedanon


    Kidchameleon wrote:
    Thats not the part of your post I was referring to. You asked my why I cared. Now, please tell me why you care and I will tell you why I care.


    But it's the part of your post that I was referring to. It just seemed a strange reaction, calling the prime minister of a neighbouring country a traitor, when all she did was try her best to implement the will of the people, as she saw it. Theresa May would no doubt surprised to find she'd aroused that much ire in a foreigner with little skin in the game.


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