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Will Britain ever just piss off and get on with Brexit? -mod warning in OP (21/12)

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    #6302
    Padre_Pio
    Registered Users Posts: 5,226 ✭✭✭Padre_Pio


    Quantum Erasure wrote: »
    well, a full EU external border in the Irish Sea is obviously a non-runner,

    Why obviously ?


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    #6303
    Quantum Erasure
    Registered Users Posts: 8,574 ✭✭✭Quantum Erasure


    what UK government would allow it? theres no way it would pass a vote, no matter the make up of the parliament after a general election


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    #6304
    26000 Elephants
    Registered Users Posts: 3,152 ✭✭✭26000 Elephants


    FunLover18 wrote: »
    How did nobody think of these alternatives before??

    Moving the hard border infrastructure 5 miles from the border is genius level stuff. Nobody will see through that. And still a whole 30 days to go!!!

    Boris is not just a pretty face and a wandering hand.


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    #6305
    26000 Elephants
    Registered Users Posts: 3,152 ✭✭✭26000 Elephants


    Quantum Erasure wrote: »
    what UK government would allow it? theres no way it would pass a vote, no matter the make up of the parliament after a general election

    Don't be so sure about that.


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    #6306
    Padre_Pio
    Registered Users Posts: 5,226 ✭✭✭Padre_Pio


    Quantum Erasure wrote: »
    what UK government would allow it? theres no way it would pass a vote, no matter the make up of the parliament after a general election

    Right now they're not passing anything. They don't know what they want, but they don't want anything that's been offered.
    But do they want a no deal less than they want something so unpalatable as the backstop ?

    We'll find out soon hopefully.


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    #6307
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 69,257 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Padre_Pio wrote: »
    Right now they're not passing anything. They don't know what they want, but they don't want anything that's been offered.
    But do they want a no deal less than they want something so unpalatable as the backstop ?

    We'll find out soon hopefully.

    Sometimes you have to eat the unpalatable, because it is all there is. They have being sitting in front of an unchanging bowl of porridge for over a year now. It's just getting colder and stodgier, so the sooner they hold their noses and swallow, the better for them.


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    #6308
    VinLieger
    Registered Users Posts: 18,174 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    Quantum Erasure wrote: »
    what UK government would allow it? theres no way it would pass a vote, no matter the make up of the parliament after a general election


    Well considering it was exactly what the UK originally suggested when they thought up the NI only backstop id say its entirely possible it will happen. The only reason it got shot down was because the DUP stomped their feet and unfortunately due to Mays hamfisted election they could make the government do whatever they wanted


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    #6309
    threeball
    Registered Users Posts: 8,233 ✭✭✭threeball


    A wonderfully naive statement. Pretty much any UK government would because they don't give a toss about the north.


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    #6310
    ChikiChiki
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,950 ✭✭✭ChikiChiki


    Back of a fag box border proposal if ever I saw one. No idea is better than a bad idea.


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    #6311
    Quantum Erasure
    Registered Users Posts: 8,574 ✭✭✭Quantum Erasure


    threeball wrote: »
    A wonderfully naive statement..

    whats naive is presuming there will be no border checks on the island post-brexit


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    #6312
    Padre_Pio
    Registered Users Posts: 5,226 ✭✭✭Padre_Pio


    Quantum Erasure wrote: »
    whats naive is presuming there will be no border checks on the island post-brexit

    Sure we'll find out soon enough.

    Unless they ask for an extension on their extension :rolleyes:

    Incidentally, has anyone ever put together a list of all the people who've quit or gotten sacked since Brexit. Such a poison chalice. Two PM's have resigned, BJ looks set to be the shortest serving PM too if they're not out in 4 weeks.


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    #6313
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,857 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Quantum Erasure wrote: »
    what UK government would allow it? theres no way it would pass a vote, no matter the make up of the parliament after a general election

    Boris Johnson's Govt. is one off the top of my head.

    It'll readily pass in the Tory party, nevermind Westminster.


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    #6314
    Kermit.de.frog
    Registered Users Posts: 23,777 ✭✭✭✭Kermit.de.frog


    https://twitter.com/BorderIrish/status/1178764046193106944


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    #6315
    Kermit.de.frog
    Registered Users Posts: 23,777 ✭✭✭✭Kermit.de.frog


    https://twitter.com/ManAboutCouch/status/1178782576368128002


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    #6316
    Tea Shock
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 345 ✭✭Tea Shock


    Quantum Erasure wrote: »
    whats naive is presuming there will be no border checks on the island post-brexit

    Even more naive is the idea that the UK can continue to exist indefinitely without any trade deal with the EU


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    #6317
    droidman123
    Registered Users Posts: 5,537 ✭✭✭droidman123


    The british were once described as a nation of shopkeepers,i think its safe to say now that it can be changed to a nation of village idiots.their latest proposal for two borders defies all logic and is in fact contemptuous


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    #6318
    20silkcut
    Registered Users Posts: 2,590 ✭✭✭20silkcut


    Kermit.de.frog wrote: »
    https://twitter.com/BorderIrish/status/1178764046193106944

    Remember Boris came up with a new moniker for Britain if mays deal was passed. Ukni he called it.
    This new ribbon of a country he has created is surely Ukni.


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    #6319
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 69,257 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Kermit.de.frog wrote: »
    https://twitter.com/ManAboutCouch/status/1178782576368128002

    The proposal was for posts on 'both sides' of the border, so that map is wrong.

    Anyway they seem to have pivoted away from this this AM, (or Boris has anyhow)

    There is another secret plan apparently.


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    #6320
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,985 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    droidman123 wrote: »
    The british were once described as a nation of shopkeepers,i think its safe to say now that it can be changed to a nation of village idiots.their latest proposal for two borders defies all logic and is in fact contemptuous

    That's a little harsh. The current government has a mandate of just over 42% and Brexit was presented as all things to all men which was approved by nearly the slightest of majorities.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



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    #6321
    droidman123
    Registered Users Posts: 5,537 ✭✭✭droidman123


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    That's a little harsh. The current government has a mandate of just over 42% and Brexit was presented as all things to all men which was approved by nearly the slightest of majorities.

    True,but i,m sure ,napoleaon,i think it was,didnt mean literally every single person in britain was a shopkeeper


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    #6322
    Tea Shock
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 345 ✭✭Tea Shock


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    The proposal was for posts on 'both sides' of the border, so that map is wrong.

    Anyway they seem to have pivoted away from this this AM, (or Boris has anyhow)

    There is another secret plan apparently.

    After the ridicule expressed against him since last night, he's furiously writing his new ideas on the back of a fag box and will say there are the proposals they've been working on for weeks!

    But he's making it up as he goes along

    He isn't even interested in getting a deal!


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    #6323
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,470 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    Tea Shock wrote: »
    After the ridicule expressed against him since last night, he's furiously writing his new ideas on the back of a fag box and will say there are the proposals they've been working on for weeks!

    But he's making it up as he goes along

    He isn't even interested in getting a deal!

    Boris is the classic case of the kid doing his homework on the bus to school.


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    #6324
    Professor Moriarty
    Registered Users Posts: 14,375 ✭✭✭✭Professor Moriarty


    ohnonotgmail wrote: »
    Boris is the classic case of the kid doing his homework on the bus to school.

    But the dog ate it.


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    #6325
    First Up
    Registered Users Posts: 14,822 ✭✭✭✭First Up


    Tea Shock wrote: »
    After the ridicule expressed against him since last night, he's furiously writing his new ideas on the back of a fag box and will say there are the proposals they've been working on for weeks!

    But he's making it up as he goes along

    He isn't even interested in getting a deal!

    Oh I'd say he is desperately looking for a deal or some way out. I think it has now dawned on them that (a) their bluff and bluster strategy of threats has hit a brick wall and (b) the EU is a vastly more powerful and unified entity than they realised.

    The UK has never really moved on from the "Common Market". It never understood or embraced the deeper integration and interdependence that has happened in mainland Europe. That is partly explained by geography - its harder for islands - but they also lacked the political will to try (unlike Ireland which has done so spectacularly well.)

    At the moment the only way they can escape from the wreckage is to accept the Irish Sea quasi border (using the same techniques they've reportedly suggested for soft checks near the actual border.) That means ditching the DUP but if you only have one bullet left...….


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    #6326
    Calhoun
    Registered Users Posts: 7,447 ✭✭✭Calhoun


    Hilarious listening to the ex Irish diplomat Ray Basset on Sean O'Rourke being so concerned about the Tories . It's clear where his bread is buttered.


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    #6327
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 69,257 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Calhoun wrote: »
    Hilarious listening to the ex Irish diplomat Ray Basset on Sean O'Rourke being so concerned about the Tories . It's clear where his bread is buttered.

    He is unbelievable. Another of those Irish people constantly apologising to the British establishment for being a nuisance in his stances. .


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    #6328
    Tea Shock
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 345 ✭✭Tea Shock


    First Up wrote: »
    Oh I'd say he is desperately looking for a deal or some way out. I think it has now dawned on them that (a) their bluff and bluster strategy of threats has hit a brick wall and (b) the EU is a vastly more powerful and unified entity than they realised.

    The UK has never really moved on from the "Common Market". It never understood or embraced the deeper integration and interdependence that has happened in mainland Europe. That is partly explained by geography - its harder for islands - but they also lacked the political will to try (unlike Ireland which has done so spectacularly well.)

    At the moment the only way they can escape from the wreckage is to accept the Irish Sea quasi border (using the same techniques they've reportedly suggested for soft checks near the actual border.) That means ditching the DUP but if you only have one bullet left...….

    The conservatives and DUP combined are now 25 or so seats short of a majority - they haven't even got one bullet left!


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    #6329
    threeball
    Registered Users Posts: 8,233 ✭✭✭threeball


    Tea Shock wrote: »
    The conservatives and DUP combined are now 25 or so seats short of a majority - they haven't even got one bullet left!

    Exactly. The DUP are completely irrelevant at this point. They're like the old guard dog that keeps snarling and barking even though he hasn't a tooth in his head. The Tories should have ditched them weeks ago once the majority was lost then agree to a border in the Irish sea and get Brexit done. And I think they would have done but they are terrified of what Scotland will then do.


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    #6330
    First Up
    Registered Users Posts: 14,822 ✭✭✭✭First Up


    threeball wrote:
    Exactly. The DUP are completely irrelevant at this point. They're like the old guard dog that keeps snarling and barking even though he hasn't a tooth in his head. The Tories should have ditched them weeks ago once the majority was lost then agree to a border in the Irish sea and get Brexit done. And I think they would have done but they are terrified of what Scotland will then do.

    Their votes are irrelevant but it will still be a climb down for London to abandon them. (They will though.)

    They are dead right to be terrified about Scotland but its a case of putting the urgent ahead of the important.


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    #6331
    threeball
    Registered Users Posts: 8,233 ✭✭✭threeball


    First Up wrote: »
    Their votes are irrelevant but it will still be a climb down for London to abandon them. (They will though.)

    They are dead right to be terrified about Scotland but its a case of putting the urgent ahead of the important.

    Its a bigger climbdown and embarrassment if they don't leave on the 31st as promised. They know theres no other way. Waiting for the EU to cave has failed 3 times now.


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