Will Britain ever just piss off and get on with Brexit? -mod warning in OP (21/12)

Motley Crue

To answer the original posters question, Get Ready for Brexit....

....Don't know what that means, how I should prepare, whether I should be stockpiling food, obtaining personal protection or just checking the T&C's of my mobile contract....

But prepare!

McMurphy

Any truth in the rumours that the DUP were meeting 3 X senior members of the UDA - and would be taking a stance based on their concerns being addressed?

Not the majority of the people in the north, the majority of the political party's, the business and farming sector, etc etc etc.

They're going to listen to loyalist paramilitaries.

Allinall

Johnny Dogs wrote: »

Any truth in the rumours that the DUP were meeting 3 X senior members of the UDA - and would be taking a stance based on their concerns being addressed?

Not the majority of the people in the north, the majority of the political party's, the business and farming sector, etc etc etc.

They're going to listen to loyalist paramilitaries.

No idea where that rumour came from. But it's probably true.

I also suspect SF have been in touch with their balaclava'd cousins taking guidance on their stance, and future actions.

it's the way things work in a dysfunctional place like NI.

FrancieBrady

Aegir wrote: »

Of course, but some people (if the cap fits and all that) just love to get upset about anything and everything the British do. Those people may have enoughchips on their shoulders already.



Of course.

Here is a tough one for you though, do you think I have a right to criticise Ireland and its government?

How long have you been on Boards? :D

The government and aspects of Ireland get heavily criticised all over this site by everybody, in fact it is so prevalent a visiting alien would be forgiven for thinking that is what this site exists for. And you don't need citizenship papers to do it.

But if somebody criticises aspects of Britain, or actions by Britain that have an affect on Ireland, they are anti British or have a 'chip' on their shoulder according to you.

Not very mature behaviour by you to be honest and transparent as hell that you are suffering from a post colonial 'we know best' syndrome of sorts.

8-10

cryptocurrency wrote: »

NI while flexible will not sign up to a backstop or a deal that takes the control outside the NI borders.

Are you talking about the DUP here or NI as a whole? Because I think you mean DUP who don't speak for the majority.

Fairest thing is to have a NI-only referendum on it

26000 Elephants

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Yeah that would have been shameful. Pity the remain side are literally doing it now though...

You have literally no understanding of the concept of Hypocracy, do you?

realdanbreen

I see where some loyalists are threatening to set off bombs down south, Limerick etc, if the brexit deal is not to their liking. It seems a bit weird to be contemplating bombing Limerick if they feel sold out by the British government! Also whatever about the reasoning/possibility republicans had about bombing Britain out of Ireland it is ludicrous for loyalists to think that if Britain ditches them they can bomb the Brits back into Ireland.

Donnielighto

Aegir wrote: »

Of course, but some people (if the cap fits and all that) just love to get upset about anything and everything the British do. Those people may have enoughchips on their shoulders already.



Of course.

Here is a tough one for you though, do you think I have a right to criticise Ireland and its government?

Nobody here has suggested that don't k is where you got it. Also the chip thing started because someone thinks it's laughable that humans would be chipped by default in Ireland. You dont think that's a bit much and still stand by your response?

SeaBreezes

More Brexit lighter moments..

Troll level: Expert (listen to the end)

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ZRc0by2vZ7k

Donnielighto

Donnielighto wrote: »

Nobody here has suggested that don't k is where you got it. Also the chip thing started because someone thinks it's laughable that humans would be chipped by default in Ireland. You dont think that's a bit much and still stand by your response?

you think my comment was serious?

FrancieBrady

FrancieBrady wrote: »

How long have you been on Boards? :D

The government and aspects of Ireland get heavily criticised all over this site by everybody, in fact it is so prevalent a visiting alien would be forgiven for thinking that is what this site exists for. And you don't need citizenship papers to do it.

But if somebody criticises aspects of Britain, or actions by Britain that have an affect on Ireland, they are anti British or have a 'chip' on their shoulder according to you.

Not very mature behaviour by you to be honest and transparent as hell that you are suffering from a post colonial 'we know best' syndrome of sorts.

how's the warship Francis?

BarryD2

realdanbreen wrote: »

I see where some loyalists are threatening to set off bombs down south, Limerick etc, if the brexit deal is not to their liking. It seems a bit weird to be contemplating bombing Limerick if they feel sold out by the British government!

Not that daft - they're just following the lines already given 1) by republicans saying that border posts would be potential targets and 2) the Brexiteers threatening riots on the streets if Brexit is not 'delivered'. So from their perspective, why not just join in the madness, they haven't gone away you know.

FrancieBrady

Aegir wrote: »

how's the warship Francis?

Keep up the police work Aegir, I'm sure you will be suitably rewarded in some future New Year Honours list.

Donnielighto

Aegir wrote: »

you think my comment was serious?

To be quite honest it looked in line with your others posts. Now looks like past trolling or current back tracking based on the above.

threeball

20silkcut wrote: »

You could have a referendum to make everyone a multi millionaire and it would pass.

You could have a referendum to abolish tax and it would pass.

To paraphrase Jeremy clarkson you could have a referendum for every man to have a massive penis and it would pass.

I am sure the “will of the people” would be demonstrated. I am sure more than 17.4 million people would vote for each of those proposals.
Implementing the results of any of these hypothetical referendums is the problem.

The solution is you don’t put stupid questions to the public in a referendum.
It all goes back to one David Cameron.
He could have kicked this question down the road into eternity.

The problem is that Cameron had the english superiority complex just like BoJo and Mogg and all the rest. He believed that by threatening the EU back in the day that they too would cave and allow special status for the UK within the EU regarding emigration etc. but instead ended up having to follow through on his referendum threat because the EU didn't cave. 4yrs later we're back to them threatening the EU and still believing that they'll cave because thats what they do. Surrender monkeys, two world wars and all that.

marieholmfan

threeball wrote: »

The problem is that Cameron had the english superiority complex just like BoJo and Mogg and all the rest. He believed that by threatening the EU back in the day that they too would cave and allow special status for the UK within the EU regarding emigration etc. but instead ended up having to follow through on his referendum threat because the EU didn't cave. 4yrs later we're back to them threatening the EU and still believing that they'll cave because thats what they do. Surrender monkeys, two world wars and all that.

Unfortunately we will fold in the end. Varadkar has nothing in common with Pearse or Casement.

26000 Elephants

To be fair, the EU over played their hand with Cameron. Some of his ideas were reasonable and if the EU had handled it better Cameron could have easily batted away the need for a referendum for another generation. But they backed him into a corner, forcing him to take an enormous gamble which backfired.

threeball

marieholmfan wrote: »

Unfortunately we will fold in the end. Varadkar has nothing in common with Pearse or Casement.

We won't fold because we can't, its not up to us as the main impediment is the protection of the single market. So maybe you might tell me if Barnier has something in common with Pearse or Casement.

26000 Elephants

marieholmfan wrote: »

Unfortunately we will fold in the end. Varadkar has nothing in common with Pearse or Casement.

You clearly dont know your Casement.

threeball

26000 Elephants wrote: »

To be fair, the EU over played their card with Cameron. Some of his ideas were reasonable and if the EU had handled it better Cameron could have easily batted away the need for a referendum for another generation. But they backed him into a corner, forcing him to take an enormous gamble which backfired.

He was still looking for concessions that were not the norm within the EU, basically asking for special status which could never have been granted no matter how reasonable. Once he set the ball rolling he gave the loonies a platform and they ran with it. I think the recession galvanized for alot of wealthy people how much much can be made in times of chaos and they threw their weight behind it too and gave it the momentum to succeed.

marieholmfan

26000 Elephants wrote: »

You clearly dont know your Casement.

Casement was a proud British Patriot and earnest Home Ruler who exposed the horrors of the international rubber trade.


On learning / discovering that the leadership of the British Liberal Party has no true support for Irish Home Rule he became a Republican.


Then the British hanged him.
He was survived by a sister, brother and many beloved nieces and nephews.
He was unmarried.


THAT'S IT!

marieholmfan

threeball wrote: »

He was still looking for concessions that were not the norm within the EU, basically asking for special status which could never have been granted no matter how reasonable. Once he set the ball rolling he gave the loonies a platform and they ran with it. I think the recession galvanized for alot of wealthy people how much much can be made in times of chaos and they threw their weight behind it too and gave it the momentum to succeed.

What was he looking for?
I think a retroactive enabling of the 'emergency brake' on immigration should have been facilitated.

Balf

marieholmfan wrote: »

Unfortunately we will fold in the end. Varadkar has nothing in common with Pearse or Casement.

Because neither of them ever came out?

26000 Elephants

threeball wrote: »

He was still looking for concessions that were not the norm within the EU, basically asking for special status which could never have been granted no matter how reasonable. Once he set the ball rolling he gave the loonies a platform and they ran with it. I think the recession galvanized for alot of wealthy people how much much can be made in times of chaos and they threw their weight behind it too and gave it the momentum to succeed.

I never said that the EU should have conceded everything, merely that it should have been handled better. If someone comes to you with an issue they have, you dont slam the door in their face saying "like it, or lump it", you work with them to resolve it.

I readily agree that absolutely no minor concession would have satisfied the more extreme Gammons, but the referendum was such a tight run thing that a minor gesture from the EU would have at best avoided the vote, and at worst secured a remain victory.

SeaBreezes

threeball wrote: »

......I think the recession galvanized for alot of wealthy people how much much can be made in times of chaos .....

JRMs dad literally wrote the book on it...

..quote...

The Sovereign Individual: The Coming Economic Revolution and How to Survive and Prosper in It opened with a quote from Tom Stoppard’s play Arcadia: “The future is disorder.”

...quote...
The economy’s “losers”, as Rees-Mogg and Davidson called them, who “do not excel in problem-solving or possess globally marketable skills”, would turn to nationalism and bitter nostalgia. They would “seek to thwart the movement of capital and people across borders”.

[url]Https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/books/2018/nov/09/mystic-mogg-jacob-rees-mogg-willam-predicts-brexit-plans[/url]

FrancieBrady

26000 Elephants wrote: »

I never said that the EU should have conceded everything, merely that it should have been handled better. If someone comes to you with an issue they have, you dont slam the door in their face saying "like it, or lump it", you work with them to resolve it.

I readily agree that absolutely no minor concession would have satisfied the more extreme Gammons, but the referendum was such a tight run thing that a minor gesture from the EU would have at best avoided the vote, and at worst secured a remain victory.

Was the 'like it or lump it' thing not just more British and British press spinning of normal negotiations though?

threeball

marieholmfan wrote: »

What was he looking for?
I think a retroactive enabling of the 'emergency brake' on immigration should have been facilitated.

As I said he had some reasonable ideas but went about it wrong. He went with a threat and thats a bad place to start. If you are going to get anything done in the EU it needs to be through back channels. If they cave to one public threat then where do they go. Cameron should never had made his efforts public until he knew what that likely outcome was.

J Mysterio

Aegir wrote: »

Of course, but some people (if the cap fits and all that) just love to get upset about anything and everything the British do. Those people may have enoughchips on their shoulders already.

Good. The reason I am asking is that it seems maybe you don't take criticism of the 'motherland' very well. You should understand that in the Brexit threads, people are mostly discussing Brexit. And, as Brexit is a British idea, naturally Britain and British people will be criticised for that. If that upsets you, Brexit threads might not be for you.

Aegir wrote:

Here is a tough one for you though, do you think I have a right to criticise Ireland and its government?

Yes, of course. But in the context of Brexit, what criticisms might you have?

26000 Elephants

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Was the 'like it or lump it' thing not just more British and British press spinning of normal negotiations though?

That was certainly an element of it, but Merkel and Hollande played an neccessarily harsh form of Hardball. I think if the Jillet Jaune thing had happened a few years earlier, it would have heightened their understanding of how tricky the situation was for Cameron.

FrancieBrady

26000 Elephants wrote: »

That was certainly an element of it, but Merkel and Macron played an neccessarily harsh form of Hardball. I think if the Jillet Jaune thing had happened a few years earlier, it would have heightened their understanding of how tricky the situation was for Cameron.

What made it tricky for Cameron was his fairly spineless campaign to remain. The onus was on him to win that campaign and he failed spectacularly in so many ways.