Will Britain ever just piss off and get on with Brexit? -mod warning in OP (21/12)

threeball

Aegir wrote: »

I'm sure some do, just like any leaders around the world do. most people wouldn't equate that to an "English Superiority complex" though.



sorry, what would you like me to say? that some irish posters took an ill advised comment and interpreted it in a way to cause maximum outrage?

oh the poor thing, is he OK?



Boris is a gob****e, we all know that, but I haven't heard him downplay what happened to Jo Cox.



and there it is, the ad homnem we all knew was coming.

**** off Brit, we don't want your type here.

See you're at it again. Deflecting the disgusting behavior of your politicians and then painting me as some kind of anti brit just because I point out that behavior and question you for ignoring it. You've done it consistently throughout the thread and again in that post.

Johnson mocked a politician in parliament who questioned his language that was inciting hatred and used Jo Cox as a reason to get Brexit done. An outrageous thing to claim when the woman had been murdered campaigning against Brexit.

You brush off Priti Patels comments but consistently bitch when someone critcises the absolute scumbags you have seen fit to elect.

The whole post sums up your pathetic attempts to justify the mess that your country has created and typically deflect the blame to the Irish or EU.

Donnielighto

Aegir wrote: »

I'm sure some do, just like any leaders around the world do. most people wouldn't equate that to an "English Superiority complex" though.

Most don't act like it publically at least. It a lack of respect and reasonableness.

sorry, what would you like me to say? that some irish posters took an ill advised comment and interpreted it in a way to cause maximum outrage?

don't downplay what she said, it would be ill advised of it was said about another country it showed a complete lack of awareness when she said it about Ireland.

oh the poor thing, is he OK?

the UK parliament pretends to be respectful and civilised, if that is the level of respect given to a parliment member by default then it's pretty reprehensible. Was there any mitigating reasons they'd be that childish in parliment.

Also what does go back to Skye mean, they don't think people from Skye should have input or something?

Boris is a gob****e, we all know that, but I haven't heard him downplay what happened to Jo Cox.

and there it is, the ad homnem we all knew was coming.

**** off Brit, we don't want your type here.

Whats the last line about?

threeball

threeball wrote: »

See you're at it again. Deflecting the disgusting behavior of your politicians and then painting me as some kind of anti brit just because I point out that behavior and question you for ignoring it. You've done it consistently throughout the thread and again in that post.

its not deflecting, it is a subtle way of telling you that you are getting all worked up and outraged for the sake of it. That is what happens on this forum and anyone who tries to explain tht is written off as deflecting.

threeball wrote: »

Johnson mocked a politician in parliament who questioned his language that was inciting hatred and used Jo Cox as a reason to get Brexit done. An outrageous thing to claim when the woman had been murdered campaigning against Brexit.

so how is that downplaying her murder? the country needs to unite and stop squabbling and upping the ante all the time. His comment wasn't particularly tasteful, but at no time did he downplay her murder.

threeball wrote: »

You brush off Priti Patels comments but consistently bitch when someone critcises the absolute scumbags you have seen fit to elect.

I'm not brushing off her comments, I am shrugging my shoulders at the people who blew them out of all proportion, as you have just done. Her comments were ill advised and quite rightly condemned by numerous politicians, but that gets ignored. Instead a politician saying that "This paper appears to show the government were well aware Ireland will face significant issues in a no-deal scenario. Why hasn't this point been pressed home during the negotiations? There is still time to go back to Brussels and get a better deal." gets interpreted as "OMFG, da Brits want to starve us again".

https://www.independent.ie/opinion/comment/eilis-ohanlon-brits-want-to-starve-the-irish-is-the-definition-of-fake-news-37607873.html

threeball wrote: »

The whole post sums up your pathetic attempts to justify the mess that your country has created and typically deflect the blame to the Irish or EU.

no, actually your post and your subsequent response are a perfect examnple of what I find frustrating about this forum. It is very difficult to discuss actual facts, because the majority seem to have formed their own opinions based on little more than their own prejudice and when challenegd, resort to things like you posted there.

threeball

Aegir wrote: »

its not deflecting, it is a subtle way of telling you that you are getting all worked up and outraged for the sake of it. That is what happens on this forum and anyone who tries to explain tht is written off as deflecting.



so how is that downplaying her murder? the country needs to unite and stop squabbling and upping the ante all the time. His comment wasn't particularly tasteful, but at no time did he downplay her murder.



I'm not brushing off her comments, I am shrugging my shoulders at the people who blew them out of all proportion, as you have just done. Her comments were ill advised and quite rightly condemned by numerous politicians, but that gets ignored. Instead a politician saying that "This paper appears to show the government were well aware Ireland will face significant issues in a no-deal scenario. Why hasn't this point been pressed home during the negotiations? There is still time to go back to Brussels and get a better deal." gets interpreted as "OMFG, da Brits want to starve us again".

https://www.independent.ie/opinion/comment/eilis-ohanlon-brits-want-to-starve-the-irish-is-the-definition-of-fake-news-37607873.html



no, actually your post and your subsequent response are a perfect examnple of what I find frustrating about this forum. It is very difficult to discuss actual facts, because the majority seem to have formed their own opinions based on little more than their own prejudice and when challenegd, resort to things like you posted there.

Plenty of facts and informed opinion on these pages. Its your own prejudices and preformed ideas that prevent them getting through.

Donnielighto

Aegir wrote: »

its not deflecting, it is a subtle way of telling you that you are getting all worked up and outraged for the sake of it. That is what happens on this forum and anyone who tries to explain tht is written off as deflecting.



so how is that downplaying her murder? the country needs to unite and stop squabbling and upping the ante all the time. His comment wasn't particularly tasteful, but at no time did he downplay her murder.



I'm not brushing off her comments, I am shrugging my shoulders at the people who blew them out of all proportion, as you have just done. Her comments were ill advised and quite rightly condemned by numerous politicians, but that gets ignored. Instead a politician saying that "This paper appears to show the government were well aware Ireland will face significant issues in a no-deal scenario. Why hasn't this point been pressed home during the negotiations? There is still time to go back to Brussels and get a better deal." gets interpreted as "OMFG, da Brits want to starve us again".

https://www.independent.ie/opinion/comment/eilis-ohanlon-brits-want-to-starve-the-irish-is-the-definition-of-fake-news-37607873.html



no, actually your post and your subsequent response are a perfect examnple of what I find frustrating about this forum. It is very difficult to discuss actual facts, because the majority seem to have formed their own opinions based on little more than their own prejudice and when challenegd, resort to things like you posted there.

No, read between the lines Patel was saying to use the threat food shortages to get a deal. It's still using food shortages as a threat, now there wouldn't be a famine or anything but it was idiotic to suggest and was rightfully pilloried. There could have been an orderly Brexit if the UK decided to plan the exit before putting itself on the course but the issues that had been highlighted from the start aren't being dealt with.

Genuinely the WA is the closest thing to Brexit and maintaining the GFA and there's been no solutions presented otherwise. Btw it isn't up to the EU to sort out the negotiations considering it's been done with the only obvious solution and the commons rejected it.

If the UK want to scrap the GFA they should have come out and been open about it.

Fyi I'm not some flag waving paddy, I don't want unification. This is the most free Europe has been ever been and I want the status quo in place, I'll admit that. We have a compromise peace that works and nearly eliminated support for armed groups in ROI and the north. It's pretty dodgy to run roughshod over that for populism without an alternative. It's hit and hope for the north from the Brexit supporters.

Donnielighto

Donnielighto wrote: »

No, read between the lines Patel was saying to use the threat food shortages to get a deal. It's still using food shortages as a threat, now there wouldn't be a famine or anything but it was idiotic to suggest and was rightfully pilloried.

so this talk about the British government wanting to starve the Irish is sensationalism?

Thank you.

Donnielighto wrote: »

Genuinely the WA is the closest thing to Brexit and maintaining the GFA and there's been no solutions presented otherwise. Btw it isn't up to the EU to sort out the negotiations considering it's been done with the only obvious solution and the commons rejected it.

If the UK want to scrap the GFA they should have come out and been open about it.

Fyi I'm not some flag waving paddy, I don't want unification. This is the most free Europe has been ever been and I want the status quo in place, I'll admit that. We have a compromise peace that works and nearly eliminated support for armed groups in ROI and the north. It's pretty dodgy to run roughshod over that for populism without an alternative. It's hit and hope for the north from the Brexit supporters.

I'm not a Brexit supporter and I would have signed the withdrawal agreement, so i'm not sure what purpose that last bit serves.

ohnonotgmail

Aegir wrote: »

so this talk about the British government wanting to starve the Irish is sensationalism?

Thank you.

Would you agree that even mentioning it as a bargaining chip was pretty stupid, particularly from the home secretary?

FrancieBrady

Looks like all the posturing and gimme cakeism of the UK has failed in the most embarrassing way. No other word for this but capitulation and selling out of Unionism.

The second PM to do it in 2 years.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/oct/15/boris-johnson-close-to-brexit-deal-after-border-concessions

Will the HOC rubber stamp it now or is the political war over, one wonders.

tigger123

A chink of light at the end of the tunnel it seems! Hurrah!

ohnonotgmail

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Looks like all the posturing and gimme cakeism of the UK has failed in the most embarrassing way. No other word for this but capitulation and selling out of Unionism.

The second PM to do it in 2 years.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/oct/15/boris-johnson-close-to-brexit-deal-after-border-concessions

Will the HOC rubber stamp it now or is the political war over, one wonders.

There is still nothing TO rubber stamp.

“It’s not the Irish who will make the deal. Yes, there are better atmospherics, but what matters is the content, and we have seen nothing yet. Whatever it is, we will want to look at it in very serious detail.”

Legal text had yet to be tabled by the British negotiators, Barnier told ministers in Luxembourg.

FrancieBrady

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

There is still nothing TO rubber stamp.

That's why I said 'Looks like...'

biko

Nigel Farage: Views of his YouTube videos have risen 460% in 30 days
YouTube observers say this reflects a more professional attitude towards the platform and its two billion monthly active users.

https://news.sky.com/story/nigel-farage-views-of-his-youtube-videos-have-risen-460-in-30-days-11836145?dcmp=snt-sf-twitter

26000 Elephants

biko wrote: »

Nigel Farage: Views of his YouTube videos have risen 460% in 30 days
YouTube observers say this reflects a more professional attitude towards the platform and its two billion monthly active users.

https://news.sky.com/story/nigel-farage-views-of-his-youtube-videos-have-risen-460-in-30-days-11836145?dcmp=snt-sf-twitter

You really cant argue with natural, organic growth like that. When you consider that their other social media platforms rely almost solely on automated accounts to drive traffic, its refreshing to see that people are engaging in such astonishingly large numbers on youtube.

No manipulation at all.

Donnielighto

Aegir wrote: »

so this talk about the British government wanting to starve the Irish is sensationalism?

Thank you.




I'm not a Brexit supporter and I would have signed the withdrawal agreement, so i'm not sure what purpose that last bit serves.

Not everyone who thinks that Patel's comments were idiotic agrees with way they were put forward but a strong reaction to them was fair no? Do you think mis informed is a fair description, I think you're going too far the other way.

The second part was to avoid being included in ad hominem against majority of posters as I'm not nationalist or anti British.

Donnielighto

26000 Elephants wrote: »

You really cant argue with natural, organic growth like that. When you consider that their other social media platforms rely almost solely on automated accounts to drive traffic, its refreshing to see that people are engaging in such astonishingly large numbers on youtube.

No manipulation at all.

It's a low base, he's got 35700 subs and 1.4 M views the percentages make it look bigger than it is. Probably snowballing due to FB sharing.

SeaBreezes

Brexit, the gift that keeps on giving..
This is Mary, who dislikes being called uninformed,

https://amp.lbc.co.uk/radio/presenters/james-obrien/james-obrien-call-john-bercow-of-treason-hangs-up/?__twitter_impression=true

26000 Elephants

3 minutes past midnight - deadline for a proposal from UK has passed - did they get one in on time :rolleyes::rolleyes:

FrancieBrady

26000 Elephants wrote: »

3 minutes past midnight - deadline for a proposal from UK has passed - did they get one in on time :rolleyes::rolleyes:

Talks to continue into the night.

Panthro

The North will be promised a big ball a sweet cashola if BJ is allowed to have a teeeny tiny border on the Irish Sea.

cryptocurrency

SeaBreezes wrote: »

Brexit, the gift that keeps on giving..
This is Mary, who dislikes being called uninformed,

https://amp.lbc.co.uk/radio/presenters/james-obrien/james-obrien-call-john-bercow-of-treason-hangs-up/?__twitter_impression=true

Stop quoting JOB. The show is a set up.

JOB never goes on other shows as he gets destroyed.

Padre_Pio

Panthro wrote: »

The North will be promised a big ball a sweet cashola if BJ is allowed to have a teeeny tiny border on the Irish Sea.

Win win for us then!

cryptocurrency

So is the DUP gonna be totally screwed or will there be a stormont vote? If the Stormont vote is in then the EU have not got there never ending backstop.

Danzy

cryptocurrency wrote: »

So is the DUP gonna be totally screwed or will there be a stormont vote? If the Stormont vote is in then the EU have not got there never ending backstop.

If Stormont had its way, the North would be locked in closer to the EU than even the EU may like.

FrancieBrady

cryptocurrency wrote: »

So is the DUP gonna be totally screwed or will there be a stormont vote? If the Stormont vote is in then the EU have not got there never ending backstop.

Because it will be an agreement between two parties, the UK and the EU...no, the DUP can never get out of it. There will be no veto for NI that has been ruled out emphatically.

cryptocurrency

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Because it will be an agreement between two parties, the UK and the EU...no, the DUP can never get out of it. There will be no veto for NI that has been ruled out emphatically.

Thought no DUP veto, but why not a stormont vote. That is actually fair.

NI is totally dependent on the UK, for jobs, trade and surplus funding. The need the least amount of barriers to trade there not to the south. Anything that makes the north different to the rest of the UK is royally screwing them.

FrancieBrady

cryptocurrency wrote: »

Thought no DUP veto, but why not a stormont vote. That is actually fair.

NI is totally dependent on the UK, for jobs, trade and surplus funding. The need the least amount of barriers to trade there not to the south. Anything that makes the north different to the rest of the UK is royally screwing them.

The north has been saved from disaster and from the British tbh. DUP might not agree, but that will be the facts of it.

Kermit.de.frog

https://twitter.com/JamieBrysonCPNI/status/1184231920051347456


Has anyone told Jamie to tell his associates that dole in the south is €203 per week?

They'd go for the hard cash.

Peregrinus

cryptocurrency wrote: »

Thought no DUP veto, but why not a stormont vote. That is actually fair.

NI is totally dependent on the UK, for jobs, trade and surplus funding. The need the least amount of barriers to trade there not to the south. Anything that makes the north different to the rest of the UK is royally screwing them.

Yes, but that means that it is within the power of GB to royally screw NI - a power which they appear minded to exercise. And since the UK is a sovereign state there is a limit to what either IRL or the EU can do about it.

I think you're right to say that NI needs the least amount of barriers to trade with GB, but since most NI/GB goes via Dublin that means a hard land border with IRL is worse for GB than a hard sea border - it will have less impact on their trade. So if the British force NI to choose between two evils, they will rationally choose the lesser evil. The only thing that can prevent that is if the British, out of what I can only think of as malice, do not allow NI even to choose the lesser evil, and instead insist on imposing a more harmful form of Brexit on NI, for no reason that I can see other than the pleasure of doing so.

cryptocurrency

FrancieBrady wrote: »

The north has been saved from disaster and from the British tbh. DUP might not agree, but that will be the facts of it.

How, if the UK diverge then the can leave NI behind in the EU. That isn't good for NI

26000 Elephants

cryptocurrency wrote: »

How, if the UK diverge then the can leave NI behind in the EU. That isn't good for NI

The majority in NI voted to remain, I'm sure they dont need you to tell then ""what's good for NI "