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Will Britain ever just piss off and get on with Brexit? -mod warning in OP (21/12)

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    #9782
    Kidchameleon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,482 ✭✭✭Kidchameleon


    Deleted User wrote: »
    The irony being that Ireland has its blasphemy law, and the UK has the strictest online speech laws maybe anywhere in the world. Nothing to do with the EU.


    Absolutly, the UK's attitude to "hate speech" is disgraceful as is Irelands. The difference being that the UK will have the power to roll back when the current SJW paradaigm ends whereas Ireland will be stuck with the inevitable pan European regulations.


    https://techcrunch.com/2019/10/03/europes-top-court-sets-new-line-on-policing-illegal-speech-online/


    Honorable mention also to the draconian EU "copyright directive"


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    #9783
    Igotadose
    Registered Users Posts: 13,589 ✭✭✭✭Igotadose


    Deleted User wrote: »
    The irony being that Ireland had its blasphemy law, and the UK has the strictest online speech laws maybe anywhere in the world. Nothing to do with the EU.

    FYP


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    #9784
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,341 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    Absolutly, the UK's attitude to "hate speech" is disgraceful as is Irelands. The difference being that the UK will have the power to roll back when the current SJW paradaigm ends whereas Ireland will be stuck with the inevitable pan European regulations.


    https://techcrunch.com/2019/10/03/europes-top-court-sets-new-line-on-policing-illegal-speech-online/


    Honorable mention also to the draconian EU "copyright directive"

    UK hate speech laws have nothing to to with the EU and they were brought in by a Conservative government in 1986.

    You fuckers are absolutely clueless.

    You have this ridiculous bogey man in your head and it EU shaped and you mistakenly apply it to every ill that pops into your little minds. It's astonishing really.


  • Options
    #9785
    Kidchameleon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,482 ✭✭✭Kidchameleon


    Tony EH wrote: »
    UK hate speech laws have nothing to to with the EU


    Who said otherwise?


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    #9786
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,341 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    Who said otherwise?

    Then why bring it up on a thread about Brexit, as if leaving the EU has anything to do with UK hate speech laws. :rolleyes:


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    #9787
    timetogo1
    Registered Users Posts: 862 ✭✭✭timetogo1


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    Who said otherwise?

    Literally posted 18 minutes ago.
    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    The difference being that the UK will have the power to roll back when the current SJW paradaigm ends whereas Ireland will be stuck with the inevitable pan European regulations.

    If the UK can roll them back, why haven't they. The implication was that its something to do with Brexit.

    I can't really tell what you mean anymore anymore, this thread has gone nonsensical. You post some rubbish, it's liked by the two or three geniuses and then it's their turn. Rinse, repeat.


  • Options
    #9788
    Kidchameleon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,482 ✭✭✭Kidchameleon


    timetogo1 wrote: »
    If the UK can roll them back, why haven't they.
    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    the UK will have the power to roll back when the current SJW paradaigm ends whereas Ireland will be stuck with the inevitable pan European regulations."


    In future, actually read the posts you are responding to. Tnx.


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    #9789
    timetogo1
    Registered Users Posts: 862 ✭✭✭timetogo1


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    In future, actually read the posts you are responding to. Tnx.

    I try but some are so inane. Tnx.
    Did you not understand what I meant when I used the word implication?


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    #9790
    Kidchameleon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,482 ✭✭✭Kidchameleon


    Tony EH wrote: »
    Then why bring it up on a thread about Brexit, as if leaving the EU has anything to do with UK hate speech laws. :rolleyes:


    Again, sovereignty.


    Ireland will not be able to dictate its own hate speech laws as part of the EU (in my opinion) whilst the UK will as an independent nation. If you read the citation I provided (you obviously didnt) you would see that the EU are trying to bring in pan European "hate speech" laws.


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    #9791
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,341 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    Again, sovereignty.

    Bollocks.

    The UK hate speech laws were brought in before the EU even existed, by a Thatcher government no less. You tried to bring it into a conversation about Brexit, as if the EU were responsible, and made a fool of yourself.


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    #9792
    Del Griffith
    Registered Users Posts: 1,215 ✭✭✭Del Griffith


    Tony EH wrote: »
    Bollocks.

    The UK hate speech laws were brought in before the EU even existed, by a Thatcher government no less. You tried to bring it into a conversation about Brexit, as if the EU were responsible, and made a fool of yourself.

    You really do have it backwards. Read the post ffs.


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    #9793
    theological
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,831 ✭✭✭theological


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    How do you know that it isn't anything to do with Brexit?

    The person making the claim that it is about Brexit needs to substiate this. In the press coverage I've seen even in the Guardian it seems to be about their owners wanting to save £2.5bn in costs for electric cars.

    Can you back up your claim?
    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    Adding a layer of economic uncertainty seems unlikely to improve their lot, no?

    Facebook are purveyors of intangible services who are highly mobile. They're not investing all that much as they can move away easily should they need to.

    Why is there economic uncertainty? The three and a half years of dithering in parliament by hard remainers which you avidly supported.

    That time could have been used to negotiate trade terms with the EU.

    In other news Sajid Javid said the UK will not needlessly diverge from the EU rule book unless there is good reason to do so.
    “We are leaving the EU, the single market and the customs union,” Javid said. “And we are doing that so that we can have control of our rules and laws.”

    But pressed in a question and answer session as to how ministers would act in practice, Javid said: “We won’t diverge just for the sake of it”.

    Earlier in the speech, he said the government would “always protect the interests of British businesses” as the country left the EU. “And we’ll maintain high standards – not because we are told to, but because we want to. It’s what the British people want.”

    I like the last statement. The UK should have high standards because it wants them for British people not because the EU demand it of them.

    I agree with this approach. Alignment where it is helpful and divergence when it isn't. Perhaps that makes me softer on the Brexit spectrum but it is important to think carefully about the negotiations ahead first before deviating too much.


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    #9794
    Igotadose
    Registered Users Posts: 13,589 ✭✭✭✭Igotadose


    theological wrote: »

    Why is there economic uncertainty? The three and a half years of dithering in parliament by hard remainers which you avidly supported.
    Uhh. ERG opposed the WA. Were they hard remainers?
    That time could have been used to negotiate trade terms with the EU.
    Life is rife with disappointments. S'ok, Boris's crack team will sort it out
    In other news Sajid Javid said the UK will not needlessly diverge from the EU rule book unless there is good reason to do so.
    Sajid Javid saying things... Funny, he said something 180 degrees out of phase with this not all that long ago. But he's on the crack team, definitely someone business leaders can have confidence in.


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    #9795
    Kidchameleon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,482 ✭✭✭Kidchameleon


    Tony EH wrote: »
    Bollocks.

    The UK hate speech laws were brought in before the EU even existed, by a Thatcher government no less. You tried to bring it into a conversation about Brexit, as if the EU were responsible, and made a fool of yourself.


    I said that both the UK and Ireland's current stance on "hate speech" are not good. I said that with the incoming EU "hate speech" laws, the UK will not be effected but Ireland will. I said that when the SJW era ends, the UK will be able to roll back on its "hate speech" laws whilst Ireland will not have that option on account of being in the EU. I cited EU documentation regarding the incoming "hate speech" laws. At no point did I blame the EU for the UK's "hate speech" laws. All of my posts are there for everyone to see. You are embarrassing yourself, not the other way around.


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    #9796
    theological
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,831 ✭✭✭theological


    Igotadose wrote: »
    Uhh. ERG opposed the WA. Were they hard remainers?

    Interesting that you ignore that most of the house who opposed it weren't the ERG. More importantly you also ignore the ridiculous shenanigans of forcing extensions and holding the government to ransom with the Fixed Term Parliament Act because they were too chicken to have an election until the Lib Dems put pressure on them.

    Emily Thornberry still says having an election was a bad idea!

    How forgetful you are.


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    #9797
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,341 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    I said that both the UK and Ireland's current stance on "hate speech" are not good. I said that with the incoming EU "hate speech" laws, the UK will not be effected but Ireland will. I said that when the SJW era ends, the UK will be able to roll back on its "hate speech" laws whilst Ireland will not have that option on account of being in the EU. I cited EU documentation regarding the incoming "hate speech" laws. At no point did I blame the EU for the UK's "hate speech" laws. All of my posts are there for everyone to see. You are embarrassing yourself, not the other way around.

    The implication in your original post was clear...
    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    Absolutly, the UK's attitude to "hate speech" is disgraceful as is Irelands. The difference being that the UK will have the power to roll back when the current SJW paradaigm ends whereas Ireland will be stuck with the inevitable pan European regulations.

    The bolded part is an inference that outside factors are responsible for the UK hate speech laws, as opposed to the UK government themselves.

    Whereas the second bolded part suggests that Ireland won't because it is part of the EU.


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    #9798
    First Up
    Registered Users Posts: 14,822 ✭✭✭✭First Up


    theological wrote:
    I like the last statement. The UK should have high standards because it wants them for British people not because the EU demand it of them.


    Then it will be interesting to see how they respond when the US demands they lower them.


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    #9799
    Kidchameleon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,482 ✭✭✭Kidchameleon


    Tony EH wrote: »
    The implication in your original post was clear...

    The bolded part is an inference that outside factors are responsible for the UK hate speech laws, as opposed to the UK government themselves.

    Whereas the second bolded part suggests that Ireland won't because it is part of the EU.

    For the last time, I cited information about the INCOMING laws that Ireland will be stuck with and the UK will not. I'm really not getting what is so hard to understand. Please read over the last few pages of the thread.

    For the record, I am well aware that the UK is responsible for its current "hate speech" regulations. BTW, YOU bolded the part of my post where I said "Ireland will be stuck with the inevitable pan European regulations" I said nothing about the the EU being responsible the the current UK "hate speech" laws. You can go on and on the I inferred it, but the contrary is in black and white* in my posts.

    *or whatever color your text is


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    #9800
    cryptocurrency
    Registered Users Posts: 1,614 ✭✭✭cryptocurrency


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    Death by a 1000 cuts.

    Car industry jobs, get used to it.


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    #9801
    cryptocurrency
    Registered Users Posts: 1,614 ✭✭✭cryptocurrency


    French getting their knickers in a twist about Irish taxation again at Davos, what will we do without this tax income? Is there a post-tax harmonisation strategy?

    Should have been a question in the leaders debate. Can't focus on Agri, Leo wants everyone Vegan.


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    #9802
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,934 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    theological wrote: »
    The person making the claim that it is about Brexit needs to substiate this. In the press coverage I've seen even in the Guardian it seems to be about their owners wanting to save £2.5bn in costs for electric cars.

    Can you back up your claim?

    I didn't make a claim. I just don't buy that Brexit is not playing a role in the decision-making processes of large employers.

    Incidentally, you never provided a single specific and tangible benefit of Brexit to the working classes of this country.
    theological wrote: »
    Why is there economic uncertainty? The three and a half years of dithering in parliament by hard remainers which you avidly supported.

    That time could have been used to negotiate trade terms with the EU.

    In other news Sajid Javid said the UK will not needlessly diverge from the EU rule book unless there is good reason to do so.

    I like the last statement. The UK should have high standards because it wants them for British people not because the EU demand it of them.

    I agree with this approach. Alignment where it is helpful and divergence when it isn't. Perhaps that makes me softer on the Brexit spectrum but it is important to think carefully about the negotiations ahead first before deviating too much.

    Are Boris Johnson and Jacob Rees-Mogg remainers? They voted against the original Withdrawal bill as well. Why only blame the democratically elected remain side?

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



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    #9803
    theological
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,831 ✭✭✭theological


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    I didn't make a claim. I just don't buy that Brexit is not playing a role in the decision-making processes of large employers.

    Incidentally, you never provided a single specific and tangible benefit of Brexit to the working classes of this country.

    I've posted several on this thread already.

    Back to Jaguar Land Rover. It isn't reasonable to speculate that it could be because of Brexit when it was provided in a program of cutbacks for funding development of electric vehicles.

    The 500 job cuts come as a plan to cut 4,500 jobs globally. That figure is courtesy of the BBC. I guess the other 4,000 job losses are because of Brexit too?

    Empty assumptions are empty assumptions.
    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    Are Boris Johnson and Jacob Rees-Mogg remainers? They voted against the original Withdrawal bill as well. Why only blame the democratically elected remain side?

    I've got nothing to add on top of this post.

    You avidly supported all of these time wasting shenanigans over in the other forum.


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    #9804
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,934 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    theological wrote: »
    Empty assumptions are empty assumptions.

    This cuts both ways I'm afraid.
    theological wrote: »
    I've got nothing to add on top of this post.

    You avidly supported all of these time wasting shenanigans over in the other forum.

    So did the ERG but they get a pass. And don't give me this concern for the Union. Time has shown how hollow that facade was.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



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    #9805
    davedanon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,062 ✭✭✭davedanon


    Ian Dunt is another top-notch Brexit commentator, along with Chris Grey and our own Tony Connelly. Even if I was an ardent Brexiter, such as our Brexit Bros on here, I think this would stop me in my tracks. This is just devastating. And, if you actually read it all, kids, it lays it all out. Just how incompetent these people really are. They. Have.No. Clue.

    https://www.politics.co.uk/blogs/2020/01/23/brexit-2020-everything-you-need-to-know-about-johnson-s-trad


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    #9806
    cryptocurrency
    Registered Users Posts: 1,614 ✭✭✭cryptocurrency


    davedanon wrote: »
    Ian Dunt is another top-notch Brexit commentator, along with Chris Grey and our own Tony Connelly. Even if I was an ardent Brexiter, such as our Brexit Bros on here, I think this would stop me in my tracks. This is just devastating. And, if you actually read it all, kids, it lays it all out. Just how incompetent these people really are. They. Have.No. Clue.

    https://www.politics.co.uk/blogs/2020/01/23/brexit-2020-everything-you-need-to-know-about-johnson-s-trad

    I have learned a good while back that anyone who feels the need to make strong introductions to the commentators credentials in their links to over labour a point that they like is normally not a credible person.

    Jumped-up baldy. Editor of http://Politics.co.uk. Host on
    RemainiacsCast
    . Author of Brexit: What The Hell Happens Now? New book, How To Be A Liberal, comes out 2020.     Twitter Bio, searchs on him also bring up James O'Brien of LBC a lot. Do you know what that means? what it says? about both your refering to these people as top notch?

    Get back on the tracks


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    #9807
    davedanon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,062 ✭✭✭davedanon


    cryptocurrency wrote: »
    I have learned a good while back that anyone who feels the need to make strong introductions to the commentators credentials in their links to over labour a point that they like is normally not a credible person.


    ".....I'm afraid to read this in case it destroys my worldview which I am determined to cling to in spite of all evidence to the contrary."

    Fixed that for you!


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    #9808
    cryptocurrency
    Registered Users Posts: 1,614 ✭✭✭cryptocurrency


    davedanon wrote: »
    ".....I'm afraid to read this in case it destroys my worldview which I am determined to cling to in spite of all evidence to the contrary."

    Fixed that for you!

    Ian Dunt, Guardian blogger, former pinknews writer who spent most of his career writing for the eroticreview has only recently reinvented himself as a political editor for this website.

    Hardly a seasoned journalist with inside knowledge.


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    #9809
    fly_agaric
    Registered Users Posts: 4,935 ✭✭✭fly_agaric


    cryptocurrency wrote: »
    I have learned a good while back that anyone who feels the need to make strong introductions to the commentators credentials in their links to over labour a point that they like is normally not a credible person.

    Jumped-up baldy. Editor of http://Politics.co.uk. Host on
    RemainiacsCast
    . Author of Brexit: What The Hell Happens Now? New book, How To Be A Liberal, comes out 2020.     Twitter Bio, searchs on him also bring up James O'Brien of LBC a lot. Do you know what that means? what it says? about both your refering to these people as top notch?

    Get back on the tracks

    It can be an appeal to authority.

    However, IMO it is a far more grevious sin to post (copy-paste) unattributed articles or other content and make the reader play back-search to find out where they come from.

    It's a good thing you don't do that sort of thing here!


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    #9810
    Professor Moriarty
    Registered Users Posts: 14,375 ✭✭✭✭Professor Moriarty


    davedanon wrote: »
    Ian Dunt is another top-notch Brexit commentator, along with Chris Grey and our own Tony Connelly. Even if I was an ardent Brexiter, such as our Brexit Bros on here, I think this would stop me in my tracks. This is just devastating. And, if you actually read it all, kids, it lays it all out. Just how incompetent these people really are. They. Have.No. Clue.

    https://www.politics.co.uk/blogs/2020/01/23/brexit-2020-everything-you-need-to-know-about-johnson-s-trad

    That's excellent. Except the bit where Ireland is a tax haven. But it's still excellent.


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    #9811
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 17,378 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I don't particularly like the style of the article in that question format but it is effective. My understanding of a couple of things is better now.


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