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Will Britain ever just piss off and get on with Brexit? -mod warning in OP (21/12)

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    #2252
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users Posts: 20,393 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    ChikiChiki wrote: »
    Passed through it many times. ****hole is being kind. Very insular backwards thinking folk.

    I've lived in the North East of England and I think it's about the inequality within the UK. They resent london because it does t give a shut about them but it makes decisions on their behalf. I think the people in areas who voted brexit will be happier that the gap between them and London falls even if they're all poorer at the end,


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    #2253
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users Posts: 20,393 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    ILoveYourVibes wrote: »
    If he wants to leave with no deal he will have to suspend parliament. He has already sought legal advice on such a situation.

    There will be uproar in the uk.

    There would be uproar but that's the normal state of the UK right now. He would almost certainty get away with it without having to resign. I'd do it if I were him. Best chance of actually leaving which he kinda has to do.

    In any case, it will come down to what's agreed, or not, in the last few days before the deadline.


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    #2254
    InTheShadows
    Closed Accounts Posts: 727 ✭✭✭InTheShadows


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    I've lived in the North East of England and I think it's about the inequality within the UK. They resent london because it does t give a shut about them but it makes decisions on their behalf. I think the people in areas who voted brexit will be happier that the gap between them and London falls even if they're all poorer at the end,

    So many fantastic people in the North of England. I sincerely hope their democratic will isn't ignored and they have an exit from the EU in a few weeks.


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    #2255
    Peregrinus
    Registered Users Posts: 26,511 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    I've lived in the North East of England and I think it's about the inequality within the UK. They resent london because it does t give a shut about them but it makes decisions on their behalf. I think the people in areas who voted brexit will be happier that the gap between them and London falls even if they're all poorer at the end,
    The gap between them and London will not fall. It will rise.


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    #2256
    Peregrinus
    Registered Users Posts: 26,511 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    InTheShadows wrote: »
    So many fantastic people in the North of England. I sincerely hope their democratic will isn't ignored and they have an exit from the EU in a few weeks.
    You forgot to add ". . . on the terms they were promised when they voted for it."


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    #2257
    Stop moaning ffs
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,850 ✭✭✭Stop moaning ffs


    Lot of people here seem to know what exit or no deal people over there voted for. The people over there when asked don’t seem to know and can only answer ‘we voted to leave’. Yet cannot outline what’s that entails or what the consequences will be for them. And thy don’t seem to care. And around we go.


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    #2258
    shesty
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 6,913 Mod ✭✭✭✭shesty


    Well I think I saw yesterday that Boris was basically going around saying it was "all the EU's fault, they won't give us the deal we want".But Parliament doesn't want the various deal(s) that were struck anyway.The backstop is fading from the headlines to just become crash-out vs some sort of unspecified "deal" that nobody knows details of-probably because there are none.

    At this point I am beginning to get bewildered myself.(again), and I am back to thinking in terms of this thread title.

    The thought I managed on it this morning is that Trump's glee and enthusiastic supporting of the whole mess may hinder as opposed to help Johnson.I don't think anyone in Britain fancies the idea of Trump looking across the Atlantic and rubbing his hands together in glee.And unfortunately he is a loose cannon, whose statements can't be controlled by the Brits....interestingly I wonder could he end up undermining the whole thing.


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    #2259
    InTheShadows
    Closed Accounts Posts: 727 ✭✭✭InTheShadows


    Peregrinus wrote: »
    You forgot to add ". . . on the terms they were promised when they voted for it."

    Politicians make and break promises all the time.

    Should we rerun the last election because FG promised to help the early risers?

    You can't nit pick results to suit your agenda. You either have democracy or you don't.


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    #2260
    Professor Moriarty
    Registered Users Posts: 14,375 ✭✭✭✭Professor Moriarty


    InTheShadows wrote: »
    Politicians make and break promises all the time.

    Should we rerun the last election because FG promised to help the early risers?

    You can't nit pick results to suit your agenda. You either have democracy or you don't.

    You won't answer the question because you can't answer the question.


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    #2261
    InTheShadows
    Closed Accounts Posts: 727 ✭✭✭InTheShadows


    Professor Moriarty wrote: »
    You won't answer the question because you can't answer the question.

    It doesn't matter a jot what my answer is


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    #2262
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 39,923 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    InTheShadows wrote: »
    You can't nit pick results to suit your agenda. You either have democracy or you don't.
    Democracy huh?
    The referendum was massively compromised.
    There was no plan. People were asked a binary question but given nothing but lies and spin about what might happen if they were to leave.
    In addition, there was huge spending by unofficial sources on the leave campaign, some of which was used to mislead undecided voters.
    Whatever the referendum was, it was not completely democratic!


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    #2263
    InTheShadows
    Closed Accounts Posts: 727 ✭✭✭InTheShadows


    Seth Brundle wrote: »
    Democracy huh?
    The referendum was massively compromised.
    There was no plan. People were asked a binary question but given nothing but lies and spin about what might happen if they were to leave.
    In addition, there was huge spending by unofficial sources on the leave campaign, some of which was used to mislead undecided voters.
    Whatever the referendum was, it was not completely democratic!

    All elections are compromised with spin and lies. You think FG/FF etc... don't spend a fortune on PR with back handers from questionable sources to fund them?

    I'm sorry you can't have it both ways. Either you believe in the power of the ballot box or you don't.


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    #2264
    Professor Moriarty
    Registered Users Posts: 14,375 ✭✭✭✭Professor Moriarty


    InTheShadows wrote: »
    It doesn't matter a jot what my answer is

    It does. Because if you don't answer then your central point is meaningless.


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    #2265
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,470 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    InTheShadows wrote: »
    All elections are compromised with spin and lies. You think FG/FF etc... don't spend a fortune on PR with back handers from questionable sources to fund them?

    I'm sorry you can't have it both ways. Either you believe in the power of the ballot box or you don't.

    the only ballot box that matters is the one that elects parliament. Parliament is sovereign in the UK. any attempt to go around that is profoundly undemocratic.


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    #2266
    Laois_Man
    Registered Users Posts: 5,758 ✭✭✭Laois_Man


    InTheShadows wrote: »
    All elections are compromised with spin and lies. You think FG/FF etc... don't spend a fortune on PR with back handers from questionable sources to fund them?

    I'm sorry you can't have it both ways. Either you believe in the power of the ballot box or you don't.

    It was not an election - it was a referendum - and it would never have been legal in this country the way it was ran!

    Also, democracy allows the country to make a new decision or reaffirming it's last decision every 5 years at most. The probable general election in the UK this October/November will see them making that decision for the 3rd time in 4-years! Just as they had a second 'are you sure' referendum on joining the EEC in the 1970's - which leavers don't want anybody to mention!


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    #2267
    Stop moaning ffs
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,850 ✭✭✭Stop moaning ffs


    Laois_Man wrote: »
    It was not an election - it was a referendum - and it would never have been legal in this country the way it was ran!

    Also, democracy allows the country to make a new decision or reaffirming it's last decision every 5 years at most. The probable general election in the UK this October/November will see them making that decision for the 3rd time in 4-years! Just as they had a second 'are you sure' referendum on joining the EEC in 1975 - which leavers don't want anybody to mention!


    The No campaigns in both marriage equality and repeal had vast amounts of dark money from undeclared sources. And it was never looked into. Just saying.


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    #2268
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,470 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    Stop moaning ffs wrote: »
    The No campaigns in both marriage equality and repeal had vast amounts of dark money from undeclared sources. And it was never looked into. Just saying.

    and of course you have evidence to support that and made it available to the proper authorities?


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    #2269
    Stop moaning ffs
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,850 ✭✭✭Stop moaning ffs


    ohnonotgmail wrote: »
    and of course you have evidence to support that and made it available to the proper authorities?

    Were you not here for either ref? It was quite the hot topic at the time. Pro life ads on Facebook etc being paid for from anonymous companies based on the US being one example


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    #2270
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 69,221 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    ohnonotgmail wrote: »
    and of course you have evidence to support that and made it available to the proper authorities?

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/may/12/ireland-abortion-campaign-foreign-influence-facebook


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    #2271
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,470 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    Stop moaning ffs wrote: »
    The No campaigns in both marriage equality and repeal had vast amounts of dark money from undeclared sources. And it was never looked into. Just saying.
    Stop moaning ffs wrote: »
    Were you not here for either ref? It was quite the hot topic at the time. Pro life ads on Facebook etc being paid for from anonymous companies based on the US being one example

    Apologies, i read your post backwards. I read pro life as pro choice.


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    #2272
    Igotadose
    Registered Users Posts: 13,606 ✭✭✭✭Igotadose


    Laois_Man wrote: »
    It was not an election - it was a referendum - and it would never have been legal in this country the way it was ran!

    !

    FWIW you can find the clip on LBC of JRM saying it was an election, not a general election, and having the caller hang up on him. The gaslighting by the Brexiteers is pretty much their modus operandi. Lie. Repeat. Lie. Gaslight. Repeat. Repeat.


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    #2273
    Stop moaning ffs
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,850 ✭✭✭Stop moaning ffs


    ohnonotgmail wrote: »
    Apologies, i read your post backwards. I read pro life as pro choice.

    No worries. Mad thing is they were running focus groups on their ads and messaging months before. I attended one an got €50 for my time.
    They were out the gate something like four months before the ref with posters absolutely everywhere and long before Yes has even started. They had loads of American activists over an we all saw what they got up to and then the paid ads on Facebook.


    SIPO never investigated where all that money was coming from. Which is weird.


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    #2274
    Laois_Man
    Registered Users Posts: 5,758 ✭✭✭Laois_Man


    Stop moaning ffs wrote: »



    SIPO never investigated where all that money was coming from. Which is weird.

    If he money was from outside Ireland, what can they do about it?

    If it was from within Ireland, how is it illegal?


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    #2275
    Qelres.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 24 ✭Qelres.


    BJ is such a bullsh1tter

    I've never heard so much spin and waffle


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    #2276
    Stop moaning ffs
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,850 ✭✭✭Stop moaning ffs


    Laois_Man wrote: »
    If he money was from outside Ireland, what can they do about it?

    If it was from within Ireland, how is it illegal?

    That’s how they got around it I think. Meaning the NO campaign. If some foreign entity wants to pay fo thousands of posters that somehow isn’t actively campaigning in a ref which would be illegal if it were foreign people. So the money never went into no’s accounts. It was all paid for from outside. .

    One of the things that was brought up after that campaign rules and regulation needing tone reformed given what we’ve seen of outside interference online in all the big ones here an brexit and trumps campaign etc


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    #2277
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    InTheShadows wrote: »
    Politicians make and break promises all the time.

    Should we rerun the last election because FG promised to help the early risers?

    You can't nit pick results to suit your agenda. You either have democracy or you don't.

    Yeah, because a referendum really is a politician promise. Is this the level of pro leave discourse?


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    #2278
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    InTheShadows wrote: »
    All elections are compromised with spin and lies. You think FG/FF etc... don't spend a fortune on PR with back handers from questionable sources to fund them?

    I'm sorry you can't have it both ways. Either you believe in the power of the ballot box or you don't.

    It was not an election


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    #2279
    declanflynn
    Registered Users Posts: 1,159 ✭✭✭declanflynn


    InTheShadows wrote: »
    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    I've lived in the North East of England and I think it's about the inequality within the UK. They resent london because it does t give a shut about them but it makes decisions on their behalf. I think the people in areas who voted brexit will be happier that the gap between them and London falls even if they're all poorer at the end,

    So many fantastic people in the North of England. I sincerely hope their democratic will isn't ignored and they have an exit from the EU in a few weeks.
    Yep, could they not go dis evening or in the morning early?


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    #2280
    declanflynn
    Registered Users Posts: 1,159 ✭✭✭declanflynn


    The north of england is a right s... hole full of sum bags and drug addicts, fantastic people me elbow


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    #2281
    declanflynn
    Registered Users Posts: 1,159 ✭✭✭declanflynn


    ohnonotgmail wrote: »
    Stop moaning ffs wrote: »
    The No campaigns in both marriage equality and repeal had vast amounts of dark money from undeclared sources. And it was never looked into. Just saying.

    and of course you have evidence to support that and made it available to the proper authorities?
    Yeah while he was out for a pint with the proper authorities


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