Will Britain ever just piss off and get on with Brexit? -mod warning in OP (21/12)

ohnonotgmail

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Well, they were happy to sit on the 'sideline' after schooling FG on 'special status' for NI.

To me that was a sizeable political masterstroke, nationalists and a fair share of Unionists business people and farmers are now looking to Dublin as their voice of support. While the DUP can only resort to bitter insults and repudiation.

It is important that they stick to what they are best at.

FrancieBrady

Danzy wrote: »

It is, their delighted though. Really pulls the legs out from the "we're all Britain, all have a say." stuff and in a very public way.

The core problem with the UK is exposed now. It is totally England centric.

Danzy

FrancieBrady wrote: »

The core problem with the UK is exposed now. It is totally England centric.

It is called the Bank of England still for a reason.

That said politics in Britain for a long time gave a lot of effort to pretending otherwise, even if still not acting in a meaningful way.

Now even the bluest of Tories could care less if Scotland or the North disappeared in to the sea and quite a few will quiver with excitement at the prospect.

cameramonkey

If the SF turned up to vote down the government it would be painted by the Brexiteers as an IRA invasion of the democratic system, what they didnt do with the armalite they did with the ballot box.

There would be a huge swing towards the British nationalism thus the Shinners would be blamed for strengthening the right.

The lads up North can recognises a **** show when the see one. The Brits are tearing themselves apart, leave them at it, stay well clear. The union is in good hands at the moment as far as the army council are concerned.

seamus

PM - not democratically appointed
Queen - not democratically appointed
Parliament - democratically appointed

The first is conspiring with the second to remove power from the third so that they can force through political changes to the benefit of the oligarchs and political incumbents.

This is "starting a dictatorship for dummies", and how nobody can see this is beyond me. It might not actually be Boris's intention, but it's the road they're going down.

Assuming all goes to plan, next up will be an "Emergency Powers Act 2020", which in the face of widespread food and medicine shortages, job losses, riots, rising crime and seperatism brewing in Scotland and Northern Ireland, will aim to suspend the devolved parliaments, delay any elections, allow for imprisonment without trial, blanket deportations and make political dissent a crime.

If you're not British and living in Britain, it's time to leave.

If you are British, it's time to take to the streets.

ohnonotgmail

seamus wrote: »

PM - not democratically appointed
Queen - not democratically appointed
Parliament - democratically appointed

The first is conspiring with the second to remove power from the third so that they can force through political changes to the benefit of the oligarchs and political incumbents.

This is "starting a dictatorship for dummies", and how nobody can see this is beyond me. It might not actually be Boris's intention, but it's the road they're going down.

Assuming all goes to plan, next up will be an "Emergency Powers Act 2020", which in the face of widespread food and medicine shortages, job losses, riots, rising crime and seperatism brewing in Scotland and Northern Ireland, will aim to suspend the devolved parliaments, delay any elections, allow for imprisonment without trial, blanket deportations and make political dissent a crime.

If you're not British and living in Britain, it's time to leave.

If you are British, it's time to take to the streets.

To be fair there is no conspiring on the part of the queen. she acts on the advice of her ministers. If she didnt she might end up like the last british monarch to ignore parliament.

cameramonkey

seamus wrote: »

If you are British, it's time to take to the streets.

Will they though? Not the done thing really.

Danzy

cameramonkey wrote: »

If the SF turned up to vote down the government it would be painted by the Brexiteers as an IRA invasion of the democratic system, what they didnt do with the armalite they did with the ballot box.

There would be a huge swing towards the British nationalism thus the Shinners would be blamed for strengthening the right.

The lads up North can recognises a **** show when the see one. The Brits are tearing themselves apart, leave them at it, stay well clear. The union is in good hands at the moment as far as the army council are concerned.

Oh ah up the BoJo.

quokula

seamus wrote: »

PM - not democratically appointed
Queen - not democratically appointed
Parliament - democratically appointed

The first is conspiring with the second to remove power from the third so that they can force through political changes to the benefit of the oligarchs and political incumbents.

This is "starting a dictatorship for dummies", and how nobody can see this is beyond me. It might not actually be Boris's intention, but it's the road they're going down.

Assuming all goes to plan, next up will be an "Emergency Powers Act 2020", which in the face of widespread food and medicine shortages, job losses, riots, rising crime and seperatism brewing in Scotland and Northern Ireland, will aim to suspend the devolved parliaments, delay any elections, allow for imprisonment without trial, blanket deportations and make political dissent a crime.

If you're not British and living in Britain, it's time to leave.

If you are British, it's time to take to the streets.

He's not exactly conspiring with the Queen, she's nothing but a figurehead who carries out the instructions of the prime minister. It's like complaining the pen he used to sign the paperwork wasn't democratically elected.

Not that it isn't a complete ****show, but the focus should be on what Boris is doing, not a sideshow about the monarchy which is pretty irrelevant.

ohnonotgmail

cameramonkey wrote: »

Will they though? Not the done thing really.

Not the done thing at all. Expect some pretty emphatic coughing and harrumphing though.

seamus

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

To be fair there is no conspiring on the part of the queen. she acts on the advice of her ministers. If she didnt she might end up like the last british monarch to ignore parliament.

She might still end up faced with an angry mob in the courtyard of Buckingham Palace if she allows this to go on. She still has a choice, pomp and ceremony aside.

I'm being perhaps a little alarmist, but if no-deal Brexit goes ahead, all bets are off. The UK economy is ****ed, and when the revolt eventually does come, be it 5 or 10 years later, the institutions that allowed it to happen will be first against the wall.

ohnonotgmail

seamus wrote: »

She might still end up faced with an angry mob in the courtyard of Buckingham Palace if she allows this to go on.

I'm being perhaps a little alarmist, but if no-deal Brexit goes ahead, all bets are off. The UK economy is ****ed, and when the revolt eventually does come, be it 5 or 10 years later, the institutions that allowed it to happen will be first against the wall.

I dont think you are being massively alarmist at all but your ire is misplaced. this is all on johnson and whoever is behind him.

Danzy

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

I dont think you are being massively alarmist at all but your ire is misplaced. this is all on johnson and whoever is behind him.

Johnson is quite a centrist Tory at heart, public persona aside.

His opposition to the EU is also a show, a job.

It was his way of getting the job.

What he does now.

ohnonotgmail

Danzy wrote: »

Johnson is quite a centrist Tory at heart, public persona aside.

His opposition to the EU is also a show, a job.

It was his way of getting the job.

What he does now.

he is doing exactly what his backers want. He is not a man known for his principles.

InTheShadows

seamus wrote: »

PM - not democratically appointed
Queen - not democratically appointed
Parliament - democratically appointed

The first is conspiring with the second to remove power from the third so that they can force through political changes to the benefit of the oligarchs and political incumbents.

This is "starting a dictatorship for dummies", and how nobody can see this is beyond me. It might not actually be Boris's intention, but it's the road they're going down.

Assuming all goes to plan, next up will be an "Emergency Powers Act 2020", which in the face of widespread food and medicine shortages, job losses, riots, rising crime and seperatism brewing in Scotland and Northern Ireland, will aim to suspend the devolved parliaments, delay any elections, allow for imprisonment without trial, blanket deportations and make political dissent a crime.

If you're not British and living in Britain, it's time to leave.

If you are British, it's time to take to the streets.

Brexit - Democratically voted for by the UK electorate

The UK will be fine.

ohnonotgmail

InTheShadows wrote: »

Brexit - Democratically voted for by the UK electorate

parliament has already voted against a no deal brexit. what is democratic about proroging parliament so parliament cannot block what it has already voted against multiple times? Democracy in the UK exists in parliament. Parliament is sovereign.

FrancieBrady

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

parliament has already voted against a no deal brexit..

They can stand on their heads shouting NO to No Deal all day long. The fact is it means fook all.

There is either A Deal...or it is No Deal. There is no avoiding it (unless by extension or by dropping some red lines or the DUP) or voting against it. They can vote against it until the cows come home for all the difference that makes.

ohnonotgmail

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

parliament has already voted against a no deal brexit. what is democratic about proroging parliament so parliament cannot block what it has already voted against multiple times? Democracy in the UK exists in parliament. Parliament is sovereign.

they have voted against no deal and they have voted against the deal.

it is time for parliament to piss, or get off the pot.

Danzy

Aegir wrote: »

they have voted against no deal and they have voted against the deal.

it is time for parliament to piss, or get off the pot.

Parliament has voted to back every position and to oppose every position.

Sometimes in the same week.

Stop moaning ffs

Scottish independence just hit a massive jackpot with Davidson stepping down I reckon.

Danzy

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

Scottish independence just hit a massive jackpot with Davidson stepping down I reckon.

She is getting her resignation out of the way before the tories cease to exist in Scotland.

No pointing in leading a defunct party.

When you see what happened to Scottish Labour, and realize that they still have a better structure on the ground.

Unless she broke off and made her own Scottish Tory party, a non branch office affair. A Scottish Conservative party whose focus was Scotland only.

That last bit is wishful thinking.

suicide_circus

well if its hardship for the UK (and probably ourselves) at least it'll bring an increased vibrancy to the arts

joseywhales

I really dislike Joe Swinson.

Her party represents 14/650 of the people, yet she is writing letters to the queen and talking about "opposition party leaders", not to be outdone by the actual leader of the opposition.

Her party is the most remain mainstream party outside of SNP.

Labour represents 247/650 of the people.
The official leader of the opposition JC, proposes a vote of no confidence, the most likely scenario to weaken the possibility of brexit on October 31st
Joe Swinson(whose party represents 2% of parliament) immediately tries to scupper an action that would help fulfill her party's goals and the people she represents because she doesn't want to be upstaged by a man who represents 38% of parliament.

She is literally willing to risk everything her party stands for as diehard remainers for her own selfish political gain....there's literally no hope, these people cannot be saved. I don't care if you are pro remain or pro brexit or anti corbyn or pro corbyn, surely nobody can respect Joe Swinson after that. If no deal happens, look no further.

Eric Cartman

I honestly don't think theres a deal that you could get a majority to agree on in parliment, theyve led it here where 'no deal' the 'unavailable option' is very available. Its now up for those who said no to every option to find a very very quick way to see consensus or else the farage barage gets their brexit.

splinter65

Anyone who genuinely fell for Johnson’s bumbling Tory boy buffoon clown act will have to wake up and smell the roses now.

Stop moaning ffs

In case we forget the DUP were rabidly against the GFA when it was signed in context they see Their goal to destroy it in sight. Just watch this. One of their members losing her mind to news crews upon it being signed.
With this in mind you can kind of understand their seemingly illogical stance now as NI is about to get hammered worst of all by brexit. They want that hard border. They want the violence back.
This is them. Watch

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KEq3c0nbkkg

Spanish Eyes

splinter65 wrote: »

Anyone who genuinely fell for Johnson’s bumbling Tory boy buffoon clown act will have to wake up and smell the roses now.

Eh sorry, he is the ventriloquist dummy from Dominic Cummings.

Johnson is in over his head, so needs people to tell him what to do :P

But let us see what happens now. There is a process going on now, step by step.

joseywhales

Haha that is hilarious

Kermit.de.frog

Should we be preparing "welcome centers" for those who may want to flee the unstable regime next door?

Is there any chance, any chance at all, of that pathetic excuse of a leader of the British Labour party being replaced by a remain supporter with a clear Remain agenda in the next week of two?

Corbyn will be remembered as the biggest ally the Tories ever had. What a legacy.